Sounds like the cops should have arrested the guy for pointing a gun at the repo guy and the repo guy should have grabbed the truck after he was taken away.

i’m going with you on dis

There were there to interview/arrest the guy but him pointing a gun at them escalated things

I'm not sure why the cops couldn't knock on the guys door .

bad shoot.

I guess the cops forget to record the part where they tried to contact him, at least they recorded part where they acted like armed guards for the repo guy.

Was any investigation done between the call and second repo attempt or did they implicitly trust the info the guy gave them?

I’m not sure why the truck owner would think it’s ok to point a pistol at someone

You know the answer.

I'm guessing that is exactly why cops got fired and charged.

maybe the cops should of knocked on the door and asked him instead of murdering him

Obviously guilty.

The only thing remotely criminal here, was the repo guy trespassing on the owner's property.
The only reason that is remotely an issue, is because the repo guy was lousy at his job.

The Cops should have told the repo guy, that it was a good thing for him, that he left the property when he was told to, and left the vehicle owner alone.

Jay

LOL, yes.

Fuck me...yeah. That was just an execution

A couple of sociopath cops right there.

If I had a dollar for every time someone who was suspended or had a warrant for unpaid fines said right to my face "I paid that" and didn't I would have retired years ago as a rich man.  
Like it or not if the police challenge you and order you to drop your weapon and you move in any direction you will be shot at.  

As for cops should have knocked on the door.  I probably would have done that but many of todays officers don't want to talk to people.  Radio call for man with a gun results in instantly going up with guns out.  David

Maybe if the cops had knocked on the mans door none of this would have happened ,and that was one hell of a mag dump .

The fact that you were lied to previously by other people has no correlation to whether this guy was lying or not.  

That would've been lots more reasonable than ambushing and killing the guy.  

If they were there to talk to him they would've rung the doorbell, loudly announced their presence, and had a police car parked with the lights on.  
Instead they parked around the corner and positioned themselves out of sight of the front door, both done for the express purpose of concealing their presence which is against the rules and why they were all fired.  They shot the guy before they even finished yelling at him - he never knew the cops were there.  
Your repeated misstatement of facts implies you are too lazy to read or are intentionally lying.  Which is it?

Never thought I would agree with the NAACP, but that's what the local NAACP guy said.  He was reasonable, articulate, and used facts to support his position.  

Fuck those cops and double fuck the cop who killed the guy.  With cops like that guy we don't need criminals.

Even if he wasn't paid up, it was a bad shoot.
Cops have no business getting involved in repo's.

The closest the Cop's should get involved in repo's, is if the lien holder gets a court order, a Writ, here, it's Superior Court, for the Sheriff to take possession of the vehicle, and even then, there are things the Sheriff can and can not do, to take the vehicle, and repo guys are not involved with that.

Repo guys are as bad as bounty hunters.

Jay

Using the repo guy to bait the suspect out seems a rather illegal use of a proxy non-governmental agent to do government business. If the alegation was reasonably credible, then the police were justified to take action unilaterally, without using non-LE in the process. Bad tactic.

What if it was a delivery driver that had been threatened with a gun? Would it still be a bad move for the police to set up and catch the guy that's threatening the delivery driver?

Those cops should not have been playing private debt police.

The cop effectively did not identify himself.

The deadee was lawfully (apparently) armed on his own property.

The cop murdered someone while aiding auto theft.

Kind of some dumb tactics all around, guess they were there just for protection of the tow guy….which clearly was needed.  Maybe that is all he wanted, I didn’t watch all the videos or hear what was discussed regarding what he wanted done, but he doesn’t get to determine tactics…

What they should have done was try to contact and arrest the suspect who had already pointed a gun at the tow driver (a pretty serious crime anywhere typically).  Phone call, loud hail, cars as cover, etc.  

So trying to minimize it, for their concern, the tow driver’s concern, or the suspect’s concern, whichever, instead lead to a shooting.  Oops.

As far as the dipshit pointing a gun at the tow driver?  Tow driver could have shot him the first time himself, before the police were there.  

Police don’t have to always give a verbal warning and wait for compliance, just when it is reasonable.  It isn’t very reasonable to wait around while someone else has a gun pointed at them (tow driver), nor if it gets pointed at you (police).  

So good shoot most likely, but dumb approach to the initial call.

Not sure how it is a policy violation in most places, much less murder.

Good example of how doing something kind of half assed (bandaid approach) often makes things worse in the end.  Plus they were armed with handguns, knowing the suspect also had a handgun.  WTF- use the correct tools.  Another one in the not the best idea category…

Things/tactics they could have done differently?  Plenty.  Still might have ended up shooting him though, but likely not. Still- had he not been so fast out the door headed towards the tow driver, pointing a gun at the tow driver and police, they would have had more time before needing to engage, and he would have had more time to process what was happening.  

Anyhow that is all I will say from the little I saw.  It did go down fast, which is why a better setup where everything could have been slowed down would have been better.  Hell just announcing who they were when he started to exit the house, instead of waiting to see what he was going to do/say first would have been a lot better.  Ultimately he chose to think act like a dumbass.  Now if you told me that the dead guy called the police himself earlier, saying he had chased off someone trying to steal his truck, and then he called 911 again before coming out the second time, well that might change what I think of his intentions quite a bit.  But I don’t see anything like that mentioned, so my assumption is that he chose to play big boy games with a gun, without realizing the other side had called in help.

Still kind of a fucked up situation.  Doesn’t make it murder though.  I seriously doubt they intended for it to go down like that…


Ultimately- if the tow driver had a legit repo, and the police believed it was legit, and that the prior reported incident was true (obviously it was, since the same thing happened again), then the tow driver has legal grounds to be there, police have the right to defend him and themselves.  

The fact that I see no mention of the suspect’s lack of prior criminal history tells me that there likely was some of note.  His decision making sure sucked.  

Bad night for everyone.

FIFY

Yes, because using the driver in the apprehension effort puts him or her at risk. Bad tactic. If the suspect poses the threat as described, then they should be detained before they can do it to anyone else again.

Well, I can see the point of them claiming the cops didn’t give him time to comply.  On the other hand, guy’s running after someone with a weapon, how much time can you really give him to see how deadly serious he is?

Doesn’t matter if the repo was legit or not.  Guy was indicating he’s prepared to murder over the situation.  If you chase after someone with a gun for any reason, in front of cops, don’t be surprised if you get shot.

Because if they went there to arrest him for agg assault they would use their lights and probably sirens instead of baiting a trap and executing an L shaped ambush.

I have an uncle who is a felon because he helped someone recover property that was subject to an ownership dispute. Don't see why the same rule shouldn’t apply to police.

Laying in wait and executing an L shaped ambush in support of a repossession and shooting almost a dozen safety shots into the ambushee isn’t reasonable.

This argument boggles me... if he's paid up, it's car theft. Plain amd simple.

This is on par with the "just let thiefs get away with it... you've got insurance to cover it" argument.

The officers intentionally created the situation which may negatively effect their ability to defend their actions.

Is it valid if it's paid up?

Not strictly speaking true. If someone fumbled the paperwork and the driver is acting in good faith with valid paperwork he may not be in the wrong. By the same token if the owner believes he’s paid up and was told he wasn’t in risk of repossession his actions in treating the driver as a thief would be reasonable.

Mag dump

The other thread led me to an interesting thought. If a court decides that they were there to assist in the warrantless taking of property without probable cause their presence in the curtillage might have been unlawful, and you have no right to defend yourself where you are not legally present.

Then why are the cops hanging around the repo man instead of knocking on the guy's door to try and investigate what happened?

As far as the cops know, there's only been a report of someone brandishing a gun. They have no other evidence that happened.  Not saying the repo man lied, but from a neutral perspective the cops would have reasonable suspicion to try and detain but not probable cause to arrest.

The officer was charged with murder so I’m guessing the prosecutors theory is that they weren’t there engaged in a legitimate law enforcement function.

I’m not sure what a leaded body cam is, but that guy is a leaded debtor now.

I believe this was mishandled but I am not a LEO so take this for what it is worth.

The repo guy goes there to repo the car. The vehicle owner comes out with a gun. The repo guy leaves and calls the police.

IMO the police should have gone to the vehicle owner's home without the repo guy and talked to the guy.

To the people that say the cops set up an ambush - I agree it looks that way but my guess it was not set up like that on purpose.

From behind cover, Police, get on the ground, your dead.

Bad shoot.

So the truck with it's lights on in the driveway is the dead guys truck or??

Repo or not, running outside waiving a pistol around is a great way to get shot by just about anybody.   Some random dude could be walking down the sidewalk and see that guy as a crazy mofo and have a reasonable fear of immediate harm and/or death - and be justified in shooting the bastard.

Same for the cops.   You wave a gun around, you take your chances.  

As for everything else, unfortunately that's what lawyers are for.

It's nearly 2:00 a.m. if the clock running in the lower right corner is correct. Is this a good time to try a repo? With that being said, point a gun at a LEO and you forfeit any pretense of being the good guy.

There was a long thread about weapons mounted lights a couple weeks ago.  Morons putting bright lights on their pistols and using them to check out bumps in the night.

Well, look where a weapon mounted light got this perp.  The minute he lit the repo man up, he was ADW, and shootable.

That remains to be seen. The officer has been charged with murder after all.

Why didn’t the cops talk to the guy before repo man came back?  They could have made their presence know and attempt to deescalate the situation.  They choose to lie in wait and ambush the guy….absolutely didn’t need to go down like that.  

This is Alabama.  Perhaps maybe there’s more to this story like the repo man is officer assassin’s cousin or something.

I think they are taught that by policy.  Like if one ossifer shoots, everybody shoots, because that proves all ossifers were in fear and just wanted to go home safe.  

Full mag dump achieves three things:

1) Proves ossifer in fear for his life and wants to go home safe

2) Converts mag change from tactical to emergency.

3) Makes sure of terminal lead poisoning

But the moron with the weapons mounted light is DEAD.

I don't disagree with you, I just don't think its worth killing or being killed over. Lots of unreasonable things in this world I wont risk my life for. Some I will.

The presence of police officers doesn't really seem to have a de-escalation effect on the black community.  It's more likely to stimulate aggressive action.  

If the perp knew the po-po was there, it's more likely that he would come out with an Evil Black Rifle, shooting first and everything that moves.

so shining a flashlight at someone is now a death sentence? I go outside with a flashlight but without a gun all the time.

Because there was a report of an armed perp.  They knock on the door and he answers, they could get hurt.  That's SWAT stuff.