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Posted: 3/25/2024 2:16:00 PM EDT
[#1]
There's just not that much difference between .410 and .429
I wanted a lower recoil load then I would just run a lighter .44 mag. |
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Posted: 3/25/2024 2:24:07 PM EDT
[#2]
The 210Gn .41Mag performed better on deer than the 240Gn 44Mag. 300Gn 44M JHP going mainstream changed things
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Posted: 3/25/2024 2:28:48 PM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Glock63: Because it has no advantage whatsoever over 44 mag Have you compared the trajectory of a 210Gn 41M to a 240Gn 44Mag? |
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Posted: 3/25/2024 2:35:10 PM EDT
[#4]
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Posted: 3/25/2024 2:47:42 PM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Clarinath: Because everything a 41 mag can do a 10mm can do better... /media/mediaFiles/sharedAlbum/CD5B1B69-9216-403B-9358-C05A3A07987F-482.gif Lol, that's not even close to being true. 10mm can just nip at the heels of 357 mags |
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Posted: 3/25/2024 2:59:50 PM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Unlubed: I would wager realistically it could replace all three of those and weigh less than .44... And you would win that wager but the cost of that conversion was too high. Needed a .41 Special companion round for the smaller revolvers. That didn’t happen. So, it was the odd man out to die quicker than the .40S&W. |
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TX, USA
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Posted: 3/25/2024 3:13:01 PM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Curmudgeon762: This. Been looking for many years Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Curmudgeon762: Originally Posted By sakohntr: When I find a 41 mag lever gun, it's going home with me. This. Been looking for many years I’m pretty sure Henry makes one. I suppose I could be wrong though… |
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Posted: 3/25/2024 3:15:44 PM EDT
[#8]
Originally Posted By Unlubed: .357 is a wee tiny bit bitchy. Like it can drink a lot but then later pukes in the flowers. .44 Mag is like the smoking hot chick that everyone wanted in high-school but by the time you got it you where 24 and everyone else had already been there and yeah it's strong but only because it has to lift its own fat. .41 mag though, my God. #blessed |
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Posted: 3/25/2024 6:22:57 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By StevenH: Have you compared the trajectory of a 210Gn 41M to a 240Gn 44Mag? Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By StevenH: Originally Posted By Glock63: Because it has no advantage whatsoever over 44 mag Have you compared the trajectory of a 210Gn 41M to a 240Gn 44Mag? Apples to apples (I didn't run these myself, but do load for both - link ) ".429" 210 grain JHP/SWC at 1500 fps velocity, .75 sight height, 50 yard zero 0 to 200 yard trajectory: Range Velocity Impact 0 1500 -0.75 25 1392 0.19 50 1300 0 75 1218 -1.47 100 1149 -4.43 125 1092 -9.02 150 1045 -15.44 175 1005 -23.86 200 971 -34.42 .410" 210 grain JHP/SWC at 1500 fps velocity, .75 sight height, 50 yard zero 0 to 200 yard trajectory: Range Velocity Impact 0 1500 -0.75 25 1401 0.18 50 1315 0 75 1238 -1.44 100 1171 -4.3 125 1115 -8.75 150 1068 -14.95 175 1028 -23.06 200 994 -33.24 |
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Posted: 3/25/2024 6:29:17 PM EDT
[#10]
I'm doing my best to make revolvers great again.
I'm in 38 special, 357 Magnum, 45 Colt, 45 ACP on moon clips, 11mm French, 410 gauge...and 22 lr. As cool as .41 Magnum is, I'll cheer you on, but I won't spend my money...I just can't do another caliber. |
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Posted: 3/25/2024 6:33:36 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Glock63]
[#11]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By StevenH: The 210Gn .41Mag performed better on deer than the 240Gn 44Mag. 300Gn 44M JHP going mainstream changed things In what way did it perform better? The answer is it doesn't. The trajectory difference within handgun hunting range is negligible, to put it mildly. We are taking an inch, give or take, at 100 yards. |
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NC, USA
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Posted: 3/25/2024 6:45:14 PM EDT
[#12]
probably already been said -- it's the .40 cal of revolvers. |
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Posted: 3/25/2024 6:56:38 PM EDT
[Last Edit: azjogol]
[#13]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By sakohntr: When I find a 41 mag lever gun, it's going home with me. Now that you mention it..... yeah, I would do the same, even though it means adding a new caliber to the harem. BTW... going to have to see if they even make a modern day lever in that caliber. Something tells me it's going to be vintage and expensive if one was made. ETA: Well Son of a Gun!!! I would have thought the .41 was too outdated for companies. Clearly I live under a rock. |
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Posted: 3/25/2024 7:06:09 PM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Jayne_Cobb: The ballistic niche of 16 gauge, within the market share of revolvers. Crap, that's me.  Then Hello brother from another mother! |
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Posted: 3/25/2024 7:07:17 PM EDT
[#15]
Because it has no inexpensive parent cartridge.
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Posted: 3/25/2024 7:12:44 PM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Seven-Shooter: Because it has no inexpensive parent cartridge. What’s the inexpensive parent for 44 mag? |
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TX, USA
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Posted: 3/25/2024 7:26:23 PM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By ALASKANFIRE: What's the inexpensive parent for 44 mag? |
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Posted: 3/25/2024 7:34:08 PM EDT
[#18]
Consumer-based capitalism is the reason the 41 mag isn't more common. It never gained the wide-spread popularity needed to sustain it in the marketplace. Two few people wanted to buy them. The reasons really don't matter; it's the fact that people just didn't buy them in numbers needed for them to be competitive in the marketplace that they are not common today.
Are there better handguns to carry on the hip in bear/cougar county than a single-action .41 magnum? Absolutely. Is a single-action .41 magnum very capable of dropping a bear or a cougar? Absolutely. So why would I rather have a single-action .41 magnum than a 10mm or a .44 mag (I now carry a .357 mag revolver in the wild)? Personal preference. As an expression of freedom. Because I like the cartridge and I like single-action revolvers. To each their own, I always say. |
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Posted: 3/25/2024 7:36:07 PM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By StevenH: The 210Gn .41Mag performed better on deer than the 240Gn 44Mag. 300Gn 44M JHP going mainstream changed things alot of Bear Guides back in the 80's and 90's swore that the .41 mags out performed .44 mags in real world gunplay with bears. they always mentioned Penetration. I imagine now with the custom shops like Garrett and Buffalo Bore and Underwood(SP) thats changed. |
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NC, USA
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Posted: 3/25/2024 7:41:01 PM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By azjogol: Now that you mention it..... yeah, I would do the same, even though it means adding a new caliber to the harem. BTW... going to have to see if they even make a modern day lever in that caliber. Something tells me it's going to be vintage and expensive if one was made. ETA: Well Son of a Gun!!! I would have thought the .41 was too outdated for companies. Clearly I live under a rock. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By azjogol: Originally Posted By sakohntr: When I find a 41 mag lever gun, it's going home with me. Now that you mention it..... yeah, I would do the same, even though it means adding a new caliber to the harem. BTW... going to have to see if they even make a modern day lever in that caliber. Something tells me it's going to be vintage and expensive if one was made. ETA: Well Son of a Gun!!! I would have thought the .41 was too outdated for companies. Clearly I live under a rock. Marlin made a .41 in their 1894 for awhile in the 80’s when I was a kid. I’d think they’d be the black sheep sitting in a dealers case, but there again, shooters collect odd stuff. |
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Posted: 3/25/2024 7:49:51 PM EDT
[#21]
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Posted: 3/25/2024 7:54:25 PM EDT
[#22]
Originally Posted By 03RN: Smaller hole means it weighs more. .45 colt for the win! https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/433221/IMG_20240101_112654_jpg-3168488.JPG This; has every good thing about every other pistol caliber. |
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VT, USA
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Posted: 3/25/2024 7:58:52 PM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 03RN: Let's make America great again. America was once a bastion of masculine stoicism when the m19 was the preeminent police and carry gun. Add in the men among men who did rough work outside and they carried N frames. Amen. |
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Posted: 3/25/2024 8:19:27 PM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Windustsearch: My wife has a Winchester .44 mag carbine. That thing is kind of a little animal. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Windustsearch: Originally Posted By Chaingun: Agree, .357 covers the bases I might be getting a Ruger .44 mag rifle, I've got a Ruger 1894P. It's a fun little gun w/ max loads. Stouter recoil than you'd expect from a pistol cartridge.
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Posted: 3/25/2024 8:21:53 PM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Clarinath: Because everything a 41 mag can do a 10mm can do better... /media/mediaFiles/sharedAlbum/CD5B1B69-9216-403B-9358-C05A3A07987F-482.gif |
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KY, USA
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Posted: 3/25/2024 8:23:39 PM EDT
[#26]
This thread has evolved beyond my knowledge. I know I started it but I'm in learning mode now. Continue on folks.
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Posted: 3/25/2024 8:25:10 PM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By jhereg: I've got a Ruger 1894P. It's a fun little gun w/ max loads. Stouter recoil than you'd expect from a pistol cartridge.Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By jhereg: Originally Posted By Windustsearch: Originally Posted By Chaingun: Agree, .357 covers the bases I might be getting a Ruger .44 mag rifle, I've got a Ruger 1894P. It's a fun little gun w/ max loads. Stouter recoil than you'd expect from a pistol cartridge. |
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ID, USA
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Posted: 3/25/2024 8:28:04 PM EDT
[#28]
Because we have 10mm.
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Posted: 3/25/2024 9:34:16 PM EDT
[Last Edit: wideglidejoe]
[#29]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By PR361: One of the 58’s was heavily modified before I found it. It has a bobbed hammer (DAO), converted to round butt, and the right side of the trigger guard has been “scalloped”, making it more convenient to lay your trigger finger straight alongside the trigger. I’d love to see some photos. I have an SAPD marked model 58. https://imgur.com/a/1ZK4gH1 I’ve only posted pics once when trying to re-home a rescued dog. Can someone tell this old man how to post pics correctly? Link above is to Imgur.com https://i.imgur.com/qnkboeQ.jpeg |
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Posted: 3/25/2024 10:54:54 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By wspe1: Because we have 10mm. Lol, weak sauce compared to the .41 |
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Posted: 3/25/2024 11:00:07 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By dSmith45: It WAS .44 S&W Special. Now special ammo is more than magnum. However, like op with the .41 mag if I found a good condition S&W 624 4" I would set my ass on fire from the friction of getting my wallet out to buy it. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By dSmith45: Originally Posted By ALASKANFIRE: What's the inexpensive parent for 44 mag? When was Special cheaper than Magnum? I honestly don't think I ever remember that being the case. |
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Posted: 3/25/2024 11:47:57 PM EDT
[Last Edit: wideglidejoe]
[#32]
“SAPD marked .41”, is that San Antonio or San Angelo?
Ada, OK PD carried .41 mags for a while, I grew up near there. One of the 58’s that I have was carried by a Creek County, OK deputy. I’ve owned (past & presently) N frame Smiths with 3”, 4”, 6” & 8 3/8” barrels, and I feel (for me) that the 4” Model 58 has the best balance for close work and good at the range. But the 8 3/8” Model 57 has put plenty of venison in my freezer. |
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Posted: 3/25/2024 11:48:19 PM EDT
[Last Edit: wideglidejoe]
[#33]
Deleted due to dbl post.
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Posted: 3/26/2024 12:17:11 AM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By ALASKANFIRE: What's the inexpensive parent for 44 mag? Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By ALASKANFIRE: Originally Posted By Seven-Shooter: Because it has no inexpensive parent cartridge. What's the inexpensive parent for 44 mag? Dirty Harry probably has as much to do with the .44 winning out as anything, never saw a .41 in movies. I just never saw a use for it myself. 357 for two legged targets, 44 for four. Ain't many three legged targets out there I reckon. |
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Posted: 3/26/2024 12:19:32 AM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By wideglidejoe: https://imgur.com/a/1ZK4gH1 I've only posted pics once when trying to re-home a rescued dog. Can someone tell this old man how to post pics correctly? Link above is to Imgur.com https://i.imgur.com/qnkboeQ.jpeg Here you go -  
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Posted: 3/26/2024 12:28:46 AM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By sywagon: Here you go - https://i.imgur.com/2oX18Yr.jpeg https://i.imgur.com/qnkboeQ.jpeg Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By sywagon: Originally Posted By wideglidejoe: https://imgur.com/a/1ZK4gH1 I've only posted pics once when trying to re-home a rescued dog. Can someone tell this old man how to post pics correctly? Link above is to Imgur.com https://i.imgur.com/qnkboeQ.jpeg Here you go - https://i.imgur.com/2oX18Yr.jpeg https://i.imgur.com/qnkboeQ.jpeg That's hot |
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Posted: 3/26/2024 12:59:33 AM EDT
[#37]
I’ve got a box of .41 Long Colt.
Can’t afford the gun that shots it though. |
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Posted: 3/26/2024 1:05:14 AM EDT
[Last Edit: HammerHammer]
[#38]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By OKnativeson: alot of Bear Guides back in the 80's and 90's swore that the .41 mags out performed .44 mags in real world gunplay with bears. they always mentioned Penetration. I imagine now with the custom shops like Garrett and Buffalo Bore and Underwood(SP) thats changed. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By OKnativeson: Originally Posted By StevenH: The 210Gn .41Mag performed better on deer than the 240Gn 44Mag. 300Gn 44M JHP going mainstream changed things alot of Bear Guides back in the 80's and 90's swore that the .41 mags out performed .44 mags in real world gunplay with bears. they always mentioned Penetration. I imagine now with the custom shops like Garrett and Buffalo Bore and Underwood(SP) thats changed. A sizable number of people I know in Wyoming carry a .41 Mag for bear protection and swear that is the best choice. I do know one guy who killed a griz with one point blank. He still got gnawed on but the bear died and he did not. Then again, a different neighbor killed one DRT a few years ago with some 20ga birdshot… Sometimes you get lucky. I think there’s some merit to the argument because .41 undeniably has less recoil than .44 and is therefore more controllable but it still delivers respectable muzzle energy. I don’t think it’s a “better” round than .44 in terms of terminal ballistics but it’s definitely still comparable. I have both and carry them interchangeably because I don’t think it matters that much. |
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OH, USA
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Posted: 3/26/2024 1:13:23 AM EDT
[#39]
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CA, USA
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Posted: 3/26/2024 2:02:57 AM EDT
[#40]
Because Harry Callahan(aka Dirty Harry) had a S&W 29 44 Rem Mag, had he had a S&W Model 57 .41 Rem Mag, things would be very different today. But keep in mind that Harry shot 44Rem Spls through his M29. In the movie they actually used a .45LC revolver because it had a bigger bore.
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Posted: 3/26/2024 2:11:59 AM EDT
[Last Edit: akguy1985]
[#41]
I had a S&W model 58. I should have kept it. It did go to a good home though an elderly retired Tulsa PD officer that was looking for one. Apparently TPD issued them and then stopped, saying they were "too powerful".
 Attached File Attached File |
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Posted: 3/26/2024 8:30:42 AM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By warlord: Because Harry Callahan(aka Dirty Harry) had a S&W 29 44 Rem Mag, had he had a S&W Model 57 .41 Rem Mag, things would be very different today. But keep in mind that Harry shot 44Rem Spls through his M29. In the movie they actually used a .45LC revolver because it had a bigger bore. I've heard they used .41s in sevetal scenes because they looked just like a .44 and were easier to get at the time. |
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Posted: 3/26/2024 9:00:45 AM EDT
[#43]
Thank you sywagon!
Shack357, I remember an article decades ago in a Shooting Times (?, I think?), that also mentioned the movie used a 57. My 58, I wish I knew the background and who did the work. The rounded butt, the bobbed hammer, and the scalloped trigger guard are all top notch work. The finish is a flat black satin finish, not sure what it is. It has an awesome DAO trigger pull, extremely smooth and light, but I’ve never had it fail to light a primer on factory ammo or hand loads. |
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Posted: 3/26/2024 9:01:21 AM EDT
[Last Edit: Gunnie357]
[#44]
The market was ruined for it when Remington screwed up the loadings it was supposed to have at inception. There were supposed to be two: one mild 200gr SWC for police/self-defense and a 210 full power for hunting. Think a special and a magnum loading in the same case. Remington released the full power loading initially, which ran hotter than it was supposed to. Then their police load, I think, was running like 1200fps instead of the 900 originally planned. I think that a lot of the 10mm is the same 41 comes from comparing the police loading of 41 with the original 10MM.
A 58 is on my short list. But thinking a blackhawk would be more obtainable. |
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Posted: 3/26/2024 10:36:29 AM EDT
[#45]
I like the .41. That said I also 16 gauges and the .300 H&H round.
I have two .41s. A mint 58 and a stainless 657 6”. That said I shoot my .44s the most. 240 lswc at 1000fps is almost magical. Lot of pop when it hits but low recoil. Adding another into the mix I’m a big fan of the .44 special. 240@900fps is very controllable in my two Taurus snub noses and they are good carry guns. Also have a S&w model 21 and a Bisley flat top. |
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Posted: 3/26/2024 10:48:52 AM EDT
[#46]
Originally Posted By konger: Marlin made a .41 in their 1894 for awhile in the 80’s when I was a kid. I’d think they’d be the black sheep sitting in a dealers case, but there again, shooters collect odd stuff. The .41 magnum Marlins are usually on GB in small numbers, and they go for $2k+ No side gate, no care. As soon as Henry makes a side gate .41, or as soon as Ruger Marlin or S&W make a .41, I'll order one. |
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FM, USA
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Posted: 3/26/2024 10:58:34 AM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By sakohntr: When I find a 41 mag lever gun, it's going home with me. Yes. While 357 is pretty solid in a 16"lever, 41mag would be neat. I'm only aware of Henry making one and it seems out of stock everywhere. A 16" big boy color case hardened 41, to match my 357 would be nice. |
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Posted: 3/26/2024 11:08:07 AM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By wideglidejoe: Thank you sywagon! Shack357, I remember an article decades ago in a Shooting Times (?, I think?), that also mentioned the movie used a 57. My 58, I wish I knew the background and who did the work. The rounded butt, the bobbed hammer, and the scalloped trigger guard are all top notch work. The finish is a flat black satin finish, not sure what it is. It has an awesome DAO trigger pull, extremely smooth and light, but I’ve never had it fail to light a primer on factory ammo or hand loads. I think that's where I read it too. Makes sense, Magnum's .45 was actually a 9mm too. The actors are playing someone they aren't, so why not the guns too? Put it in the credits. "Harry's model 29-played by a model 57."😂 |
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Posted: 3/27/2024 2:38:37 PM EDT
[#49]
A 10mm with moon clips would have made a great police gun in the 1940s.
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Posted: 3/27/2024 2:51:51 PM EDT
[#50]
Ammo and firearm availability is sparce. I own two S&W M57's, one Ruger Blackhawk and a Henry lever gun in this caliber. I have never purchased a single round from a store. Ten years ago I saw Remington 210 grain SP's for sale @ $66.00 per box of 50, I'll pass.
I load 215 grain SWC @ 960 fps for the handguns, the rifle gets 210 grain Remington SP's and a middle of the road charge of IMR-4227. Full power .41 Magnum is almost as unpleasant to fire as the .44 variety, my lead loads can be fired all day long if I want. |
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