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Posted: 3/20/2017 4:18:09 PM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Yeah it's like a $6k difference. Too close to not do this. And when I add the data center to the Fanuc we're $4k difference. Morris is not making much on the machine. Even on 14" slab our machine had settled some and a few tweaks brought it right back to where it needed to be. ( MC4-VAE-HS) |
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Posted: 3/20/2017 6:08:14 PM EDT
[#2]
Morris got the PO today for the Okuma... so my search is over. They included 2 year warranty, but I didn't ask about re-checking level - I may still ask if that is an option...
I've got to clean up the area, actually would really like to epoxy the floor in the machine shop - but they're shipping end of month so I am not sure I'll have time. Both Kitamura's sold too. The same guy who bought the 3xi on eBay also wants the 4 that is damaged. $20k for the pair. Good deal for both of us. |
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Posted: 3/20/2017 6:49:28 PM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Morris got the PO today for the Okuma... so my search is over. They included 2 year warranty, but I didn't ask about re-checking level - I may still ask if that is an option... I've got to clean up the area, actually would really like to epoxy the floor in the machine shop - but they're shipping end of month so I am not sure I'll have time. Both Kitamura's sold too. The same guy who bought the 3xi on eBay also wants the 4 that is damaged. $20k for the pair. Good deal for both of us. Nicely done. Go get your lube list and get fluids coming. There are only a few sources for that grease. 100 amp service for 220v, that spindle lights up fuckin quick so in rush current is serious. I found a dying breaker for my bus bar when mine got installed. Needs about 55 gals of coolant, good clean air. Have Josh set it up, I think it was Josh....one of the Techs, good guy. Then have one of the Bills stop by and setup the Renishaw, actually if it was a demo machine its probably all setup. |
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Posted: 3/20/2017 6:56:35 PM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Oh and he sticks the landing!!! Nicely done. Go get your lube list and get fluids coming. There are only a few sources for that grease. I can get you in contact with a lubricant engineer for fluids and greases. |
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Posted: 3/20/2017 6:59:23 PM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
PM me. I can get you in contact with a lubricant engineer for fluids and greases. ETA: THK AFJ. It is mineral oil based. |
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Posted: 3/20/2017 10:15:09 PM EDT
[#6]
What do you recommend for a good coolant? Steel/aluminum general purpose... I don't like the stuff I had been using in the Kiti - it's a greenish color and smells fucking horrible.
I am happy as shit to have a machine that is not going to dump way oil into my coolant anymore. That shit is a cesspool. I like that clear stuff that smells good.... don't know the name brand though. My bolster plates from the Kiti are really nice - I forget the name brand. The counter sunk holes are different for the table t-slots. Think I'd be better off selling them or just counter boring the mount holes for the Okuma table in them? I've got a box full of 60x Kiti pull studs to sell off now too lol.. I gotta do some research on epoxy floor coating - would be sweet to epoxy the area where the machine shop will be now... |
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Posted: 3/20/2017 10:32:34 PM EDT
[#7]
Lots of people swear by qualichem. I use hocut 795B. I'm pretty happy with it. Works great for tapping in all materials. It has a ton of oil in it, no rust problems at all. You saw the finish in aluminum, I have one machine that I've been having a smell problem with. It doesn't run everyday so I think that's part of the problem.
I try to run it between 6 and 8%, we check all the time with refractometers. The sump in the 560 hasnt been changed outright in over a year, just checked and maintained. The lathes have hydrobars on them so they can't go as long. We do skim the lathe sumps constantly. |
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Posted: 3/20/2017 11:10:31 PM EDT
[#8]
Blaser swisslube isn't bad. The only thing I have against Hangsterfer is the non foaming options are limited and expensive. Then again, that was 7 or 8 years ago do maybe they got their shit together.
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Posted: 3/21/2017 12:07:54 AM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Lots of people swear by qualichem. I use hocut 795B. I'm pretty happy with it. Works great for tapping in all materials. It has a ton of oil in it, no rust problems at all. You saw the finish in aluminum, I have one machine that I've been having a smell problem with. It doesn't run everyday so I think that's part of the problem. I try to run it between 6 and 8%, we check all the time with refractometers. The sump in the 560 hasnt been changed outright in over a year, just checked and maintained. The lathes have hydrobars on them so they can't go as long. We do skim the lathe sumps constantly. |
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Posted: 3/21/2017 12:17:54 AM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Ok yea I've heard Qualichem name out there - I'll check into it... I wont be using the machine every day so I'll need to keep an eye on it. I have a fish tank bubbler in the kiti lol - it works though. |
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Posted: 3/21/2017 12:35:24 AM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
What do you recommend for a good coolant? Steel/aluminum general purpose... I don't like the stuff I had been using in the Kiti - it's a greenish color and smells fucking horrible. I am happy as shit to have a machine that is not going to dump way oil into my coolant anymore. That shit is a cesspool. I like that clear stuff that smells good.... don't know the name brand though. My bolster plates from the Kiti are really nice - I forget the name brand. The counter sunk holes are different for the table t-slots. Think I'd be better off selling them or just counter boring the mount holes for the Okuma table in them? I've got a box full of 60x Kiti pull studs to sell off now too lol.. I gotta do some research on epoxy floor coating - would be sweet to epoxy the area where the machine shop will be now... |
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Posted: 3/21/2017 12:49:11 AM EDT
[#12]
I am a big fan of the qualichem products.
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Posted: 3/21/2017 1:00:53 AM EDT
[#13]
Zebra Coelescer.
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Posted: 3/21/2017 5:02:51 AM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Zebra Coelescer. |
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Posted: 3/21/2017 6:10:08 AM EDT
[#15]
We use Trim SC230. I don't notice any issues with it and we're have one machine that sits for months at a time. The water evaporates, coolant seems to stay so I just add water.
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Posted: 3/21/2017 6:50:13 AM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
We use Trim SC230. I don't notice any issues with it and we're have one machine that sits for months at a time. The water evaporates, coolant seems to stay so I just add water. |
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Posted: 3/21/2017 7:23:15 AM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
That can actually lead to problems with the coolant not mixing correctly in many (most?) cases. Add in .5-1% to make sure it emulsifies properly. |
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Posted: 3/21/2017 7:26:37 AM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Blaser swisslube isn't bad. The only thing I have against Hangsterfer is the non foaming options are limited and expensive. Then again, that was 7 or 8 years ago do maybe they got their shit together. Every time I get tired of being oily, I got stick my head in our old Haas SL10 and take a whiff. Grateful for another 30 days at least. Repeat as necessary. |
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Posted: 3/22/2017 12:01:38 AM EDT
[#19]
Ok so I got all my Kitamura pull studs off - probably going to ebay them...
Need the Okuma style.. None of the documentation I've seen so far have the dimensions - anyone have a link to the spec sheet on them? |
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Posted: 3/22/2017 4:21:51 PM EDT
[#20]
They may have different types machine specific.
Did you get through the tool coolant option, and if so was it DIN style through the flange or CAT style via hollow pull stud? Might be able to get the specs from Kennametal web site. |
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Posted: 3/22/2017 11:40:00 PM EDT
[#21]
Yeah I got thru spindle coolant.. Morris quoted "Velocity" pull studs at like $28 each
However comparing the drawing of them to others like at Maritool etc - they are slightly different... |
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Posted: 3/22/2017 11:57:41 PM EDT
[#22]
Quoted:
2000 vintage Kitamura Mycenter4. Machine has kind of been a PITA for me since I've gotten it. I've since also purchased a smaller Mycenter 3xi. Both have pallet changers. Anyway - my spindle smoked today on the My4. I don't know yet what happened for sure, my guess a lubrication problem. We did have a power failure today for 2 hours where the shop power went out, but I don't see how that could have caused a mechanical failure.. However there were no oil alarms present when it happened. It was running a small endmill engraving aluminum at 10krpm.. lower bearings just fucking melted... it's a goner. I am pretty sick of dealing with this machine - so - in your opinion, would you repair it, or would you look for something else - maybe a new machine? I'd get rid of this, my My3 and my CNC turning center - trade in or sell as-is to put toward a good new machine. Maybe a Haas VF3 or something a bit less expensive. I don't run high volume production. I do run steel a lot, but I don't need to run it at 4000ipm either... So i might be able to live with linear ways. Both Kiti's are boxed way machines... Both Kit's are going to need an X ballscrew soon...and now the My4 spindle is toast... Fix it or get rid of all that bullshit for a new machine that runs? You're a machinist??? Install new bearings... What have you to lose???? |
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Posted: 3/23/2017 12:07:05 AM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Yeah I got thru spindle coolant.. Morris quoted "Velocity" pull studs at like $28 each
However comparing the drawing of them to others like at Maritool etc - they are slightly different... |
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Posted: 3/23/2017 12:22:14 AM EDT
[#24]
Do not use blaser coolant. 20 years ago it was good, but not so much now. That stuff gets funky after a couple of days. Qualichem is the current favorite, though not cheap. I know what kind of lube you need but I forgot what it's called, DTE light by Mobil I think. It's super thin, almost has the viscosity of water.
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Posted: 3/23/2017 12:42:57 AM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You're a machinist??? Install new bearings... What have you to lose????
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Posted: 3/23/2017 1:05:47 AM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Do not use blaser coolant. 20 years ago it was good, but not so much now. That stuff gets funky after a couple of days. Qualichem is the current favorite, though not cheap. I know what kind of lube you need but I forgot what it's called, DTE light by Mobil I think. It's super thin, almost has the viscosity of water. |
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Posted: 3/24/2017 2:37:21 AM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
You're a machinist??? Install new bearings... What have you to lose???? Even if the spindle is brought back to 100% OEM spec - the rest of the machine is... old |
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Posted: 3/24/2017 7:30:13 AM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Obviously someone has never actually priced the cost of a real machine tools Spindle bearing set. Plus possibly 20hrs of install time, XX hrs of run in time, then if protcol requires it resetting the final bearing preload. One of our turning centers this required 4 days before machine was released back for production. Even if the spindle is brought back to 100% OEM spec - the rest of the machine is... old 
I rebuild lots of fussy things. But I don't rebuild spindles. |
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Posted: 3/24/2017 10:43:39 AM EDT
[#29]
Bridgeport spindles sure. 10-15k spindles no thanks.
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Posted: 3/24/2017 10:51:39 AM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Bridgeport spindles sure. 10-15k spindles no thanks. |
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Posted: 3/24/2017 10:59:24 AM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
No kidding. Not to mention that most major machine tool builders build their spindles in a clean room. |
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Posted: 3/24/2017 11:09:31 AM EDT
[#32]
What a bunch of bearing Pussies!
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Posted: 3/25/2017 12:05:43 AM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Obviously someone has never actually priced the cost of a real machine tools Spindle bearing set. Plus possibly 20hrs of install time, XX hrs of run in time, then if protcol requires it resetting the final bearing preload. One of our turning centers this required 4 days before machine was released back for production. Even if the spindle is brought back to 100% OEM spec - the rest of the machine is... old Electric drops going in Monday-Wed for the new Genos, and a new drop for my Hwacheon turning center that I am fixing currently lol.. But I am pumped for the machine delivery! |
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Posted: 3/25/2017 10:35:14 AM EDT
[#34]
MaxKool Ultra 414 Best stuff ever. Light odor, great cutting capabilities. I would look into Schaeffer for your other needs too.
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Posted: 3/25/2017 4:47:15 PM EDT
[#35]
We had a dozen HWACHEON HI-ECO 10's setup in 4 machining cells of 3 turning centers and a Stabli Puma robot. First machine would do the datum end, second the non-datum end and the 3rd would do body profile between centers. Those machines ran 20/24 or 23/24 and just kept pumping out good parts. In 4 years the only part I know of requiring replacement on the HI-ECO 10's was an air pressure sensor switch, and I'm not even sure if that was a Hwacheeon part, or related to the robot interface.
Elsewhere in the shop was 9 Haas lathes set up the same way. The Haas were significantly slower (even being newer machines) and often down for repairs. Also there were 3 HAAS VMC's They broke down less often but when they failed they went big time. 8 Mazak's - Reliable as the sun rise, just seemed to be very temperature sensitive. 6 Okuma Turning centers (1 dual turret) - My favorites. Lots of other equipment and misc CNC machines, stamping presses etc. Was a great job - I loved it! Obama killed it. Now its all down in Emplame, Sonora, Mexico I had a crew of 14 machine operators on day shift working 4 x 10hr shifts. My crew put out more good parts in 1 shift than the MX plant does in 1 week. ( running 2x 50hr shifts ) Who ever tries to tell me the US can't be competitive, I say B$, I have been to the foreign factories and most have trouble matching our quality at our productivity levels. Edit: Enjoy your new toy. Okuma does have a few quirks - like work coordinates are G15 H## vrs g54-g59 and tool heights are G56 H## vrs G43 or G44 - Note some oddities can be adjusted via parameters, others are just a fact of Okuma life. Oh BTW be sure to cancel G41|G42 with G40 before an M6 - or strange things can happen - like tool changer arm moving before machine is at proper Z height... |
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Posted: 3/25/2017 11:53:22 PM EDT
[#36]
Unrelated but related - have any of you had luck using a standard ER32 collet for rigid taping versus an ERT32 "tap" collet w/ the square hole?
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Posted: 3/26/2017 5:13:59 AM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Unrelated but related - have any of you had luck using a standard ER32 collet for rigid taping versus an ERT32 "tap" collet w/ the square hole? |
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Posted: 3/26/2017 8:44:52 AM EDT
[#38]
We use the standard ER32. Have noticed it's worth ordering the taps that OSGs website recommends too, if you have a couple days for them to come in. We're good about not thinking ahead since we inventory so much of everything.
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Posted: 3/26/2017 8:53:46 AM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Unrelated but related - have any of you had luck using a standard ER32 collet for rigid taping versus an ERT32 "tap" collet w/ the square hole? |
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Posted: 3/26/2017 4:15:01 PM EDT
[#40]
I forgot I had this. Here's a time lapse of our MCR going in.
[youtube]https://youtu.be/W251NRFp8ic[/youtube] |
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Posted: 4/1/2017 7:42:25 PM EDT
[#41]
Official machine arrival is this wed. I wish I had the extra ching to clean up the machining area - I wanted to get like 1250 sq ft epoxied, but it wasn't in the budget. I had a new 200a service panel put in which was needed, and am having a rigger set it, along with some new tooling...so floor took the back burner. I'm pumped though!
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Posted: 4/1/2017 11:44:39 PM EDT
[#42]
You can always do the epoxy yourself. I have good luck with Garon products.
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Posted: 4/2/2017 8:36:05 PM EDT
[#43]
Yeah I am going to actually. I was sick all weekend so I won't make it before the machine delivers, but I'll coat around it. The floor in there sucks.
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Posted: 4/5/2017 1:28:08 PM EDT
[#44]
My current situation
 Attached File Attached FileThis machine will break your wine glass  Attached File |
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Posted: 4/5/2017 2:24:41 PM EDT
[#45]
lol
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Posted: 4/5/2017 2:37:46 PM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
My current situation https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/326230/20170405-103253-181474.JPG https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/326230/20170405-112911-181475.JPG This machine will break your wine glass https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/326230/20170405-123012-181477.JPG Leave plenty of room behind it, need space to get the chip conveyor wrestled in there, and to be able to service it. Oil res for the spindle is on the back along with some filters and ther service points. ETA: looks like maybe they moved some components around....is that the spindle chiller in the center of the back side? Mine is spun 90 degrees and is on the left side as you look at the machine. It appears they continue to make improvements, or at least changes. I bet you have the one piece magazine door too....mine has been flawless but its a complicated mechanism. |
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Posted: 4/6/2017 12:34:32 AM EDT
[#47]
I ran out of time and money to coat the floor - I had a new 200a sub panel installed, transformer etc. Wiped out my spare cash, still need some for some new tooling... maybe I can do it in a few months, just have to coat around the machine. Chip conveyor coming tomorrow morning. Might be working on a deal for a chipblaster 1000psi. Not 100% on that yet.
 Attached File Attached File |
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Posted: 4/6/2017 1:39:45 PM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I ran out of time and money to coat the floor - I had a new 200a sub panel installed, transformer etc. Wiped out my spare cash, still need some for some new tooling... maybe I can do it in a few months, just have to coat around the machine. Chip conveyor coming tomorrow morning. Might be working on a deal for a chipblaster 1000psi. Not 100% on that yet. https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/326230/20170405-160840-181869.JPG https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/326230/20170405-172119-181870.JPG
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