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Posted: 1/15/2017 9:59:50 PM EDT
[#1]
Sounds good to me.
Good luck getting even most conservatives on board with that plan, tho. |
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Posted: 1/15/2017 10:00:25 PM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Lol. One termer for sure. Just look at Obamacare. The Dems won. No one is talking about just repealing it. It's repeal and replace. We have given in to the need for the government to provide healthcare. And you want to even look at Social Security. This. Gimme gimme gimme. You can't close pandora's box. It will collapse and there will be blood |
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Posted: 1/15/2017 10:00:40 PM EDT
[#3]
I see a bunch of babbies have already whined about how much they've contributed. They can take everything I've paid in, and piss it down the drown. I don't care about getting back what "I'm entitled too".
I think at the very least, they should take the average age people die, add a standard deviation to it, and then let people cash out at that age; that is if we keep social security. I would be perfectly fine with this. |
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Posted: 1/15/2017 10:00:40 PM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
LOL....Good luck with that. You would be better served fixing SSDI. That is where the abuse really is and it's something that is "fixable". Yep. SSDI is the program with people drawing massive amounts of money while not contributing a thing. Its the Millennials' primary source of income though, since they game the system to use it as a fill-in for their coveted Bernie Sanders "guaranteed minimal income". |
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Posted: 1/15/2017 10:00:50 PM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You understand that no one in Congress will vote for that? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Three replies and so suggestions? And that sir, is my whole point. Everybody bitches, everybody cries like a rat eating an onion, everybody hate baby boomers, but nobody will push do do anything concrete about it. If they want it gone then fucking do something about it. |
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Posted: 1/15/2017 10:00:57 PM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I've been paying into social security at the rate of 15% of every paycheck since 1988. If you want to shut it down, great, then give me back all my money, with compounded interest over the past 26 years, say, 8%. 
All that you'd want in a return over twice the Dow increase over the same time. See OP, this is why you can't remove it. People are irrational. |
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Posted: 1/15/2017 10:01:00 PM EDT
[#7]
I think Social Security would have to come last. SSDI first, Medicare Next, Medicaid, THEN social security. Maybe some tweaks earlier, like eliminating survivor benefits. Maybe some additional taxes on the boomer payouts.
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Posted: 1/15/2017 10:01:11 PM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I'd put a tiered system in its stead. Let's give some arbitrary numbers: Those eligible to draw social security to about 50 years old, system stays the same with the option for anyone in this group to enter the hybrid group next. 35-49 a hybrid system in which you can choose to have the money that would have been put towards your social security into a public sector 401(k) or any other investment plan. 18-34 your choice on investment opportunity with the money you are no longer paying towards social security Throw in some sort of voucher given for every year you've put money towards social security. To explain the obvious: SS is a pyramid scheme where the young pay for the old. There is no "savings account" or "your money". The old are supposed to die off before or soon after they collect. There is supposed to be more young than old. We're about to have a buttload of fairly healthy boomers want to retire at 65 and live another 25 years. That's on the shoulders of the next generation, and the boomer generation is HUGE. Who is paying for the 50+ in your system? |
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Posted: 1/15/2017 10:01:19 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
This. Pay me back and then shut it down. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
First thing is you and your buddies are gonna have to pay me back the max contribution to SS that was confiscated and given to you guys for the last 20 years, plus interest. After that, I don't care, as I am made whole. This. Pay me back and then shut it down. |
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Posted: 1/15/2017 10:01:25 PM EDT
[#10]
I am 45 and I am fine with never seeing a dime from it,but open up the limit that I can contribute to my 401k.
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Posted: 1/15/2017 10:01:36 PM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
LOL....Good luck with that. You would be better served fixing SSDI. That is where the abuse really is and it's something that is "fixable". For a start no more SSDI approvals till the system has a top to bottom review. Hire contractor companies to follow current SSDI recipients around (like insurance companies do) to see if they are disabled and revoke their status if they are faking it....Easy. |
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Posted: 1/15/2017 10:02:07 PM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
First thing is you and your buddies are gonna have to pay me back the max contribution to SS that was confiscated and given to you guys for the last 20 years, plus interest. After that, I don't care, as I am made whole. Rightly or wrongly a number of court cases have firmly established that you don't have that sort of claim to the "social security trust fund" 
Now perhaps a system should exist where you have that sort of claim. But at as it stands now your income was taxed and the receipts doled out to assuage likely voters. http://www.heritage.org/research/reports/2004/09/misleading-the-public-how-the-social-security-trust-fund-really-works |
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Posted: 1/15/2017 10:02:08 PM EDT
[#13]
Social Security isn't going anywhere. Don't be naïve.
One thing that the elderly are good at doing is voting, and besides, if you took away Social Security your welfare rolls would just skyrocket, only now you wouldn't have ANY Social Security taxes coming in. It's all a matter of which pocket you take the money from. |
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Posted: 1/15/2017 10:02:12 PM EDT
[#14]
I am 38 and am not planning my retirement around SS or even my Guard pension (USAF). The bill is going to come due for this country, and she will not be able to pay. Not saying it doesn't suck: it is just math. I say the sooner we reset to a more sound system, the less painful it will ultimately be.
Plan accordingly. |
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Posted: 1/15/2017 10:02:15 PM EDT
[#15]
Hey OP, pass that shit to the left.
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Posted: 1/15/2017 10:02:18 PM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted:In before the buttsore baby boomers. Cut me a check for every dime I put into it with some sort of reasonable market tied interest rate and I'm good. 12.4% of my pay for the last 30-years of paying in plus interest ... figure a quarter million and I'm good ... I save that much myself every five years.
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Posted: 1/15/2017 10:02:22 PM EDT
[#17]
wtf is up with ARFCOM and double posting issues.
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Posted: 1/15/2017 10:02:39 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Baby boomers and the 'greatest' gen made insane entitlement programs that there was no way to really fund long term. I don't think you know how SS works. It was funded. In fact, those who've paid into SS would have been better off investing in an average 401K. Instead they were involuntarily taxed by the government, so the government could be kind enough to give some, or most of it back, eventually, if you don't die. But the crooked politicians spent it, instead of investing it and giving it back, like they should have. |
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Posted: 1/15/2017 10:03:19 PM EDT
[#19]
Shut it down all you want as long as I get all my money back plus interest that they've been taking from me for the last 24 years.
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Posted: 1/15/2017 10:04:04 PM EDT
[#20]
Create a new currency just for social security payments and inflate the shit out of it.
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Posted: 1/15/2017 10:04:20 PM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Disability is a huge clusterfuck http://apps.npr.org/unfit-for-work/ |
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Posted: 1/15/2017 10:04:32 PM EDT
[#22]
Lets not forget to abolish government enforced racism while we're at it like diversity initiatives and affirmative action....that ought to make heads explode.
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Posted: 1/15/2017 10:04:53 PM EDT
[#23]
I'm a Trump man and this is ridiculous. SS isn't going anywhere.
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Posted: 1/15/2017 10:05:07 PM EDT
[#24]
How about welfare and section 8 housing first
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Posted: 1/15/2017 10:05:27 PM EDT
[#25]
Make it optional. It will die on its own.
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Posted: 1/15/2017 10:05:36 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I'm 24. I vote shut it down. Give people under 30 nothing back from what they've paid in. Under 40 give them 30%. Under 50 50%. Under 60 70% and let the other keep it. Not those exact numbers but it obviously needs to go and I'd appreciate just not paying in for the rest of my life. I like this plan!!! Actually, maybe it would be better to allow continuance should be based on demonstrated (documented) yearly contribution to social security with reasonable interest. |
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Posted: 1/15/2017 10:06:15 PM EDT
[#27]
Don't freaking touch SS until welfare is gone and done. Also cut back on useless government organizations/manpower/spending and a myriad of other things. SS should go, but it's a ways down the list...
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Posted: 1/15/2017 10:06:18 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
First thing is you and your buddies are gonna have to pay me back the max contribution to SS that was confiscated and given to you guys for the last 20 years, plus interest. After that, I don't care, as I am made whole. |
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Posted: 1/15/2017 10:06:22 PM EDT
[#29]
I hope people realize that FICA funds have been dumped into the general fund since the Clinton administration and DO NOT EXIST IN A TRUST FUND!!!
How else do you think Slick Willie balanced the budget? That money is GONE... |
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Posted: 1/15/2017 10:06:25 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
no. not only no, but fuck no. as in, "vote from the rooftops no". i am forced -- under color of law -- to send you money, with the expectation that you give it back, and you don't? that's either fraud or felony theft, and you should expect a reaction to such criminal activity. how about we cancel all the existing pensions of government workers, perhaps that would be a different conversation? ar-jedi http://ziva.losdos.dyndns.org/public/stocks/SS-why-o-why-should-i-continue-to-pay-in.JPG Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
As unpalatable as it is, I would pass a law requiring means-testing everyone. If you have other financial resources, you get nothing until they are depleted. no. not only no, but fuck no. as in, "vote from the rooftops no". i am forced -- under color of law -- to send you money, with the expectation that you give it back, and you don't? that's either fraud or felony theft, and you should expect a reaction to such criminal activity. how about we cancel all the existing pensions of government workers, perhaps that would be a different conversation? ar-jedi http://ziva.losdos.dyndns.org/public/stocks/SS-why-o-why-should-i-continue-to-pay-in.JPG That's your fault for having that expectation. And it's neither fraud nor theft, it's a tax. |
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Posted: 1/15/2017 10:06:45 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
no. not only no, but fuck no. as in, "vote from the rooftops no". i am forced -- under color of law -- to send you money, with the expectation that you give it back, and you don't? that's either fraud or felony theft, and you should expect a reaction to such criminal activity. how about we cancel all the existing pensions of government workers, perhaps that would be a different conversation? ar-jedi http://ziva.losdos.dyndns.org/public/stocks/SS-why-o-why-should-i-continue-to-pay-in.JPG Hey, man, I'm right there with you. But OP wanted an answer and that's what I could come up with. 
Speaking of government workers . . . I'm on the town budget committee and all we've done is fight with the school board the last few months. Their health insurance is going up 14% and their portion remains at 5%. You better make some room up there on the rooftop for me. I'll bring a lot of ammo. 
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Posted: 1/15/2017 10:07:25 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Shut it down all you want as long as I get all my money back plus interest that they've been taking from me for the last 24 years. It isn't your money. You paid a tax. A tax that went into a "trust fund" that was reinvested into treasury bonds. Which is another way of saying the government gave the money it taxed from you to the treasury department to be earmarked for spending in the general budget. But fine. Let's pay you back. In dollars. I propose we pay everyone back, including interest. And print the money to do so. It'll cause massive inflation, but stocks in sound companies should inflate to match. So, no fucks given here. |
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Posted: 1/15/2017 10:07:52 PM EDT
[#33]
Want to make sure old people vote 100% democrat next election? That's how you do it.
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Posted: 1/15/2017 10:08:52 PM EDT
[#34]
Quoted:
No bitching, no crying, no nothing but concrete and specific action as to shut it down. baby boomers (that's me) are getting old and dying, you Gen xs and .milns are going to run the next generation. How you going to do it? All on it now: finish it out. All not on it yet: gone. Continue to tax it at the rate necessary to fund existing recipients, then end it. |
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Posted: 1/15/2017 10:09:12 PM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Want to make sure old people vote 100% democrat next election? That's how you do it. SS reform pain is coming eventually, like it or not. It is unsustainable and everyone knows it. Everyone wants to be fiscally conservative until it's time to do fiscally conservative shit. |
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Posted: 1/15/2017 10:09:15 PM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Cut me a check for every dime I put into it with some sort of reasonable market tied interest rate and I'm good. 12.4% of my pay for the last 30-years of paying in plus interest ... figure a quarter million and I'm good ... I save that much myself every five years. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:In before the buttsore baby boomers. Cut me a check for every dime I put into it with some sort of reasonable market tied interest rate and I'm good. 12.4% of my pay for the last 30-years of paying in plus interest ... figure a quarter million and I'm good ... I save that much myself every five years.  Attached File |
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Posted: 1/15/2017 10:09:41 PM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The fuckheads with their "Gimme back what I paid in" bullshit are the reason nothing will ever get done. Total fucking pyramid scheme. So we're fuckheads because we want the money back that was By that logic, theft victims should expect none of their property back. How about you pony up for a membership here? Apparently I've been giving you a free ride since 2008. ETA: I'm not collecting SS. |
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Posted: 1/15/2017 10:10:42 PM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
All on it now: finish it out. All not on it yet: gone. Continue to tax it at the rate necessary to fund existing recipients, then end it. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
No bitching, no crying, no nothing but concrete and specific action as to shut it down. baby boomers (that's me) are getting old and dying, you Gen xs and .milns are going to run the next generation. How you going to do it? All on it now: finish it out. All not on it yet: gone. Continue to tax it at the rate necessary to fund existing recipients, then end it. And the folks that just paid 12.4% to allow you to retire are the ones that should take it in the shorts? How kind of you. |
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Posted: 1/15/2017 10:10:58 PM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
So we're fuckheads because we want the money back that was By that logic, theft victims should expect none of their property back. How about you pony up for a membership here? Apparently I've been giving you a free ride since 2008. Can you think of a way to get your money back that doesn't involve stealing from someone else the way you were stolen from? If so, let's hear it. |
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Posted: 1/15/2017 10:11:03 PM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Shut it down. Repay everyone whose been involuntary taken from and let them invest it however they want, that is the American way. It is no person's responsibility to manipulate the life of another, regardless of the intentions, that is not American. It was just another way for the government to get control of another aspect of the people's lives, illegal and incomprehensible in America, should have never been allowed. Those that pushed it should have been tarred and feathered, same with those that pushed the income tax and the federal reserve and fiat currencies, et al. These are all instruments of the government's attempted total control over the populace. Then drain the swamp, shut down every useless government agency, administration, council etc., etc. The IRS needs to be abolished and every official investigated and charged if found guilty, every agency needs to be bleached. Your newsletter, may I subscribe? |
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Posted: 1/15/2017 10:11:40 PM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I see a bunch of babbies have already whined about how much they've contributed. They can take everything I've paid in, and piss it down the drown. I don't care about getting back what "I'm entitled too". I think at the very least, they should take the average age people die, add a standard deviation to it, and then let people cash out at that age; that is if we keep social security. I would be perfectly fine with this. The original Social Security program was set up exactly like that. Unless you outlived the average life expectancy, you got nothing. These days, not so much, the average person is drawing SS for 15-20 years. |
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Posted: 1/15/2017 10:12:24 PM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
It isn't your money. You paid a tax. A tax that went into a "trust fund" that was reinvested into treasury bonds. Which is another way of saying the government gave the money it taxed from you to the treasury department to be earmarked for spending in the general budget. But fine. Let's pay you back. In dollars. I propose we pay everyone back, including interest. And print the money to do so. It'll cause massive inflation, but stocks in sound companies should inflate to match. So, no fucks given here. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Shut it down all you want as long as I get all my money back plus interest that they've been taking from me for the last 24 years. It isn't your money. You paid a tax. A tax that went into a "trust fund" that was reinvested into treasury bonds. Which is another way of saying the government gave the money it taxed from you to the treasury department to be earmarked for spending in the general budget. But fine. Let's pay you back. In dollars. I propose we pay everyone back, including interest. And print the money to do so. It'll cause massive inflation, but stocks in sound companies should inflate to match. So, no fucks given here. Trillions. As in tens of trillions of dollars. Would make quantitative easing look like pocket change. |
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Posted: 1/15/2017 10:13:09 PM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Continue to tax it at the rate necessary to fund existing recipients, then end it. But according to the butthurt in this thread, the existing recipients are just getting back what they paid in. Why do we need to continue taxing young people to pay them? |
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Posted: 1/15/2017 10:13:54 PM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
So we're fuckheads because we want the money back that was By that logic, theft victims should expect none of their property back. How about you pony up for a membership here? Apparently I've been giving you a free ride since 2008. ETA: I'm not collecting SS. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
The fuckheads with their "Gimme back what I paid in" bullshit are the reason nothing will ever get done. Total fucking pyramid scheme. So we're fuckheads because we want the money back that was By that logic, theft victims should expect none of their property back. How about you pony up for a membership here? Apparently I've been giving you a free ride since 2008. ETA: I'm not collecting SS. Actually by your logic if you have something stolen from you it's morally acceptable to steal it from your neighbor's kids so you are made hole. Lawdog indeed. |
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Posted: 1/15/2017 10:15:18 PM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryQuote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:In before the buttsore baby boomers. Cut me a check for every dime I put into it with some sort of reasonable market tied interest rate and I'm good. 12.4% of my pay for the last 30-years of paying in plus interest ... figure a quarter million and I'm good ... I save that much myself every five years. https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/66085/74752836-126760.JPG A forum full of small government conservatives threatening to "vote from the rooftops" if their nation-bankrupting entitlement program is threatened. |
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Posted: 1/15/2017 10:15:57 PM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
But according to the butthurt in this thread, the existing recipients are just getting back what they paid in. Why do we need to continue taxing young people to pay them? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Continue to tax it at the rate necessary to fund existing recipients, then end it. But according to the butthurt in this thread, the existing recipients are just getting back what they paid in. Why do we need to continue taxing young people to pay them? Being realistic you are going to have to pay those at or near requirement (with a means test) a percentage of their SS payments. Oh, and people are going to have to get used to taking care of their elderly family members like we used to do before the government took over that family responsibility. |
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Posted: 1/15/2017 10:16:34 PM EDT
[#47]
Why not cut all federal government employee pensions to zero? You'd save billions and billions of dollars.
Just send a missive out, " tough shit employee, get your ass back to work, no more early retirements either, 67 or die.'' Oh, you paid into it? Well tough shit and suck it up, La-a needed new section 8 housing due to her 6th kidlet. |
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Posted: 1/15/2017 10:16:46 PM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
That's your fault for having that expectation. And it's neither fraud nor theft, it's a tax. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
As unpalatable as it is, I would pass a law requiring means-testing everyone. If you have other financial resources, you get nothing until they are depleted. no. not only no, but fuck no. as in, "vote from the rooftops no". i am forced -- under color of law -- to send you money, with the expectation that you give it back, and you don't? that's either fraud or felony theft, and you should expect a reaction to such criminal activity. how about we cancel all the existing pensions of government workers, perhaps that would be a different conversation? ar-jedi http://ziva.losdos.dyndns.org/public/stocks/SS-why-o-why-should-i-continue-to-pay-in.JPG That's your fault for having that expectation. And it's neither fraud nor theft, it's a tax. Right. 
Let me guess, you think Obamacare is a tax too? |
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Posted: 1/15/2017 10:16:58 PM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Can you think of a way to get your money back that doesn't involve stealing from someone else the way you were stolen from? If so, let's hear it. Sure, all the money that's given in foreign aid to countries that stab us in the back. Start by cutting the UN completely off. |
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Posted: 1/15/2017 10:17:30 PM EDT
[#50]
You wait until a second term, for starters.
Part of politics is timing. No need to go reaching until the low hanging fruit is picked. |
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