This thread reminds me of why I got out of wrenching. I worked in 5 dealers over 6 years (that's how you get a raise and why tool boxes have wheels).



Long hours and unpredictable pay tied up with asshole service advisors and fucking warranty work sucked the life out of me.

I graduated UTI in 2005 and it did little to prepare me for working in a dealership.



 

I went to Ivy Tech and have a AAP in  AST.  Had ASE cert in 6 areas, plus AC certification etc...

I worked for 3 different dealerships from 1998-2001. I was really good, The times I worked flat rate I was at around 110%, and at the one dealership that was hourly with bonuses, I was outdoing the tech's that had been there for 25 yrs with 105-110%. It just came natural to me...

I got tired of being wore out, sore and dirty So now I work for the Man making twice what I would have as a tech.

Don't worry though there are going to be plenty of "others" available to fix shit here for $1.50 hr. pretty soon.  

One of the fleet services I worked for hired Haitians and Cubans.   The Haitians didn't know which end of the screwdriver to use.  The Cubans.....they were old school and don't have the computer stuff down but for pure mechanical stuff they are good.

This. It's shit work, hard work. shit pay. and incompetant managers putting master mechanics to do low menial work, and training un certified, unskilled low page workers to do their job then send him home with little to no hours.

After reading the replies from some of the techs in this thread it's no surprise kids don't want to go to school for it. It sounds like it sucks.

Nailed it ^^

Nothing like giving the new guy all the gravy while all the master tech's get is warranty work...

Young kids don't want to do physical work. They want to sit behind a computer all day. They don't want to spend thousands of dollars on quality tools. The list goes on and on.

I build airplanes for a living and wrench on cars in my spare time for extra cash. Because of the high dealership rates, I can beat them by 50% on labor and sometimes 70% on parts. That's big money to the average Joe. I just did the front hubs, axle seals and pinion seal on my friends GMC Yukon and savEd him $800 on parts alone. Parts were made the same place GM gets them from. China

The only job where the more you know the less you make.

Imho, the consumer unwilling to pay whats required to have a quality technician employed,  the mindset of both most people entering the field and the average consumer that the technician is little more then a high school drop out, and wish to pay accordingly. The big chain stores with low prices and even lower quality work enforces this mindset significantly,  those places will hire anyone they don't give a crap, lifetime brakes $99 when I can often not even get oem quality parts for that price.

Couple this with the ever increasing technology and complicatiin and you have a great recipes for a field of out dated technicians and no one entering the field.. which leads us where we are today, I'm backed up two weeks and having to work 12 hr days, I can't get close to catching up. The average technician coming in to look for work is in their 50s, or absolutely doesn't know anything about cars. We're still getting the drop out druggie type looking for work. Sure pal, explain to me how to diagnose that MOST network on the A6 then ill look at your resume.







If you buy a technician their tools, they'll abuse and lose them. And no, most technicians dont have 100k in tools. I could outfit a pretty fucking nice place for $100k. 15 years in automotive repair, if, and a big if.. if I have $20k in my tools personal I'd be surprised.

The shop tools are where the big money is. Trust me on that one, when I updated my scanner last summer to the latest greatest factory tool I was in about $10k after subscription costs $3k per year.

People pitch a fit when its $180 to replace the brake pads.

Im a uti graduate,  I'll tell you whats right and wrong with uti.

The technical education is excellent,  the do a great job in teaching the theory of the engineering.. if you go and make the most of it you will get a great education, particularly if you take one of the factory training classes like BMW, MB, Audi, VW. It is cruical you to take one of these and step into a higher line then just going to work on toyotas.

Now, the bad part. They oversell you on what your going to make, with promises of $100k a year, and telling you your going to leave knowing everything and more.
In reality thats not even close to the truth.  You will be ahead of joe bob off the street. But don't plan on walking in and knowing everything and making big money.. in my opinion at this point you should be shadowing a master tech for 6 months, then closely watched for about 2 years before set out into the world of flat rate.

Is UTI worth it? If you plan on learning as much as you can, taking advantage of everything they offer, and entering the workforce with realistic expectations then yes its worth it.

Mechanical/technical jobs in general are hurting for employees. Schools are concentrating so much on business and tech degrees, and nobody wants to manual labor any more....skilled manual labor.

Shortage of plumbers too.

Metro-males don't like getting dirty

People will line up for it if the pay is right.

http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_1_5/1889691_Hundreds_of_men_sleeping_on_a_Queens_street_for_a_chance_at_Plumber's_Union_Aprenticeship_program

Real electricians are hard to find too.

You can find plenty of licensed electricians.  But to find real electricians who can really trouble shoot and understand what is going on is rare.

I'd bet the low pay is the top factor; coupled with the current generation of special snowflakes who look down on anything to do with getting your hands dirty.  
We struggle to find young machinists (actual manual machinists who can make a part and not just push a green button) and we pay pretty well with good benefits.

Good techs go where the money is, diesel, aviation, fleet, marine, own shop etc...

Maybe its just a US thing? I have a family memeber who is a
Tech at benz and he drives an s class and makes around $130k or more a year with
All the usual perks and benefits

I prepare my kids for life by reminding them daily that someone with their qualifications would have no difficulty finding a top-flight job in the food-service or housekeeping industries.

try making trucks simple to work on again so that guys can fix their own at home

I don't know that to be true. Son #1 was a diesel tech and got screwed left, right, and center just the same.

The dealership wants to hire a ASE certified mechanic for $12.00 per hour and then charge the customer $95.00 per hour for service work.

When I was growing up we all had to work on our cars we bought with our own money weekly to keep them running right.
Some of my friends had a knack for it and when that direction after high school.

Today for the most part kids dont buy or work on cars.

How many of today's kids could push 6000 lbs of Detroit steel a mile (up hill both ways in the snow) home when some part breaks?

I'm not qualified to work on an electric can opener. But I'd try real hard if someone brought me a broken one.



 

Sounds like what you hear in aviation as well, "There's a shortage of pilots".
What they mean to say is, "There's a shortage of experienced mechanics".

It wrecks your body.



I did it working for my dad's shop then opened my own shop.



I said fuck it and sold the shop and went back to school and got my EE degree.



Now I drill water wells

The people asking about trade schools such as UTI and others? In the collision repair industry, some of the shit UTI spits out literally does not know the difference between 80 grit and 180 grit sandpaper. They have not grasped the simple fucking basics yet they walk through my door with ICAR certificates for Advanced Steering and Suspension and zap the nut off the top of a strut on the floor. They can't prep a brand new plastic bumper for paint.There is a great opportunity to learn at these schools but if you know nothing going in, you probably won't know much more coming out. My advise is to get a job in the field that you want to go to school for. Even if it's sweeping floors, get in and get a feel for the business and what all goes on in the real world. Pay attention to everything and jump in to help whenever you can. Learn as much as you can so when you head off to school it will all make sense. Pay more attention to setting a vehicle up on the frame rack and making the necessary pulls and less attention to laying out flames with fine line.

there's a lot of truth here

You can work on anything made at home. Don't confuse your refusal to learn the skillset with any real, actual difficulty of the job. The information is available for free online- shop manuals, diagnostic guides. Diagnostic scanners are a dime a dozen.

I hope that's just a bad joke, because it damn sure isn't the truth. I'm a one-semester college flunky and do this shit for a living, started at age 17. Used to wrench, now it's programming. I learned ECM programming from doing wrenchwork.

The "difficulties" bullshit is just that- bullshit.

Just as the millenials are lazy and don't want physical labor, the old-timers refuse to learn new skills and are going extinct from it.

Make no mistake, one is just as pathetic as the other.

working on euro cars pays much better then any other lines.

but its much harder work, and requires better skills.

just like anything else in life, the more you put into it the more you get out.

Oh no, that's not true! If only it weren't for that there damn pesky technology, we could all make a livin' screwin' and turnin' on carbs and points...you know, the way god intended Effort and learning is for faggots!

My dad is the master/head tech at a local BMW dealership, he pulls about 100K a year, (working 60-70 hour weeks), he spends the rest of his waking hours complaining about UTI grads.

I used to bitch about working at my employer till I got a taste of life outside.  I realized quickly how blessed I am to be in the position I'm in now, but I do agree with cda97 that our field is already feeling the pinch in getting qualified people to come out and work commercial aircraft, yet all we hear about is the "looming pilot shortage."

Of course qualified and competent are two different things.  Then there's also dealing with pilots that will sometimes make your head spin.

My dad was a mechanic for years.  Owned his own business for 20 years before selling and going to work for a dealer.  His biggest thing was you could get paid a lower hourly rate or a higher book rate.  That's part of the problem.  Most dealers now only pay book rate.  The book says it should take 3 hours you get paid 3 hours.  If it takes you 4 hours you still get paid 3 hours.  When it comes to warranty work the time constraints have both the dealer and the mech doing the work losing money.  The book says warranty takes 2 hours.  That's assuming all the tools and parts are right in front of you, nothing is rusted or broken, a bathroom break is not needed.

I didn't read all 4 pages to see if this was brought up or not.  But from what I've seen A:. The money's not there unless you are over the top good which comes from years of experience and B: Wrenching on your own vehicle in the driveway is no longer feasible due to the sheer amount of specialized tools needed.

ETA: My dad was a MOPAR 5 star certified master mechanic he left to work as a machinist for Norfolk Southern for better pay and benefits

It's never interested me one bit and the 'service adviser' scam artist bullshit always sets a negative tone and is why I avoid dealerships for anything but warranty work.

brought to you by the same people who can't belive it cost $100 just to tell you whats wrong with your car..

"your gonna charge me to plug in that computer"

I still get all those because no one else knows how or refuses to do it.

 

Heavy Diesel tech here, 30 years on the job, 5 days a week, flat 60k a year with good benefits. However I can pick up 15 to 20k working side job repairs. It is rough on your body, but every one I went to school with is now lazy and fat with their desk jobs and air conditioning . I'm in the best shape of my life at 49.

I am going on 20 years turning wrenches.  ASE certification is the biggest, most worthless racket in the industry.  When I was in school i took a bunch of them, all it took to pass was to get their practice tests and memorize them.  90 percent of the questions on the actual tests were from the practice ones.  The testing room was full of people just like me, still in school with no real world knowledge, but they passed them and thought they were special.  People are idiots and believe that ase cert makes their techs smart and know what they are doing.  It means they can read.  I saw so many useless morons pass those test that I wouldnt let work on my bicycle,  but they are working in your local dealerships, and they look down at the small shop tech who has been doing it for 30 plus years.

I quickly decided that working on cars sucked after school and went in to farm equipment.  Farmers are soooo much better to deal with than the public and their stupid cars.  I now work on construction equipment for 80k a year.  There is a huge shortage in the equipment world and the pay is generally very good.  Auto techs these days are an embarrassment to the industry.  Most have no idea how to actually troubleshoot a problem, they hook a computer to it and just do what the computer tells them to do.  Saw a tech convince a customer who brought their car in because it was running rough and had no power.  Well, the computer couldnt really come up with a reason so the tech told the customer he needed a new motor.  Got the new long block, swapped all the parts over and installed and the car ran exactly the same.  Turned out to be a bad crank sensor i believe.  They never told the customer and still charged him for the new sensor.  About 6 months later the customer was talking to another tech who was a buddy of his and found out what they did.  He sued them and got alll his money back.  

The industry isnt all bad and it is a needed industry but the bad guys are ruining it for everyone.   If the trade schools keep graduating ase certified idiots who think they shit gold it will continue to go downhill.  

Worthless ase certified punks who went to a 6 month school and passed a few tests who think  they are better than a guy who spent four years in college and got a degree and has been doing it for 20 years.  I laugh at the guys who ask if I am ase in interviews, they dont like it when I tell them it means nothing in the real world.    Good grief, the guys at jiffy lube are ase certified lube techs, what the hell does that even mean?  What kind of test was that?

This is good information. My son is a junior in high school and is taking auto tech in his second semester... it's something he's showing an interest in and I'm looking for areas I can kind of push him towards that he can have as a career, he's interested in, and won't require a college degree. Mechanic is one area but from reading your posts, it looks like it's not really the place to send him towards... maybe diesel or marine mechanic...

He's also shown an interest in auto body repair... I know for the foreseeable future there's still going to be a need to be able to paint a car and fix collision damage... but I don't know if that's what he should do for a career.

Y'all are giving some good food for thought.

Shit work for shit pay sums it up.  I bet you'd be lucky to make 40k a year around here and you got to buy tools.  I'd guess a lot of those jobs would also want you to have a $50k tech degree too.

You ever know a mechanic that didn't have back problems?

I apprenticed under a Master Porsche Mechanic for two years before going out on my own and still decided it wasn't a carrer I could do for too many years.



 

Some part of it is the college and IT culture.

Why go make $40k a year busting knuckles (for 60 hours a week) when you can make $45k starting as a help desk dude sitting in the A/C for 40 hours a week?

There is a serious shortage of skilled labor, like Mechanics, HVAC, Plumbers, etc. Eventually that shortage will reach critical mass, and the demand will re-balance the pay.

Hell I started at my dad's Porsche shop at age 12 mopping the floors with solvent, dusting parts shelves and scrubbing the mechanics wash sink.



By the age of 21 I already completed a two year apprenticeship under a factory trained Porsche Master Mechanic and then went and did another 18 months under a Ferrari Master Mechanic.



I got tired of working on cars for other people that really couldn't afford to maintain them.  I left the industry.