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Posted: 9/22/2015 4:05:54 PM EDT
[#1]
Green and sustainable as presented by the leftists are not feasible.
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Posted: 9/22/2015 4:07:39 PM EDT
[#2]
Quoted:
It's like we live in this upside-down land where everything that's a bad idea is embraced by the liberals. Yep. It is rooted in their core beliefs. |
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Posted: 9/22/2015 4:08:39 PM EDT
[#3]
This would have nothing to do with a certain very large German car manufacturer who have been installing software to fool emissions standards in the US would it?
You know...the same company that has seen its market value drop by 23% in two days after emissions standards testing threw a spanner in the works. |
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Posted: 9/22/2015 4:10:20 PM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Green and sustainable as presented by the leftists are not feasible. Maybe in 20-30 years. Maybe. |
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Posted: 9/22/2015 4:11:30 PM EDT
[#5]
No shit.
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Posted: 9/22/2015 4:11:34 PM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
This would have nothing to do with a certain very large German car manufacturer who have been installing software to fool emissions standards in the US would it? You know...the same company that has seen its market value drop by 23% in two days after emissions standards testing threw a spanner in the works. Probably not since they are talking power generations and costs...not emissions from vehicles. |
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Posted: 9/22/2015 4:11:35 PM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Maybe in 20-30 years. Maybe. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Green and sustainable as presented by the leftists are not feasible. Maybe in 20-30 years. Maybe. Probably not. If we were serious about carbon neutral nukes are the way forward. Breeders, baby! |
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Posted: 9/22/2015 4:12:49 PM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Green and sustainable as presented by the leftists are not feasible. But if all the humans die, then the planet will be green! |
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Posted: 9/22/2015 4:14:20 PM EDT
[#9]
Putting solar fields in the middle of Bavarian forests seemed like a stupid not so ecofriendly move, but when I read it was to supplement the nuclear facilities going off line I gave up......Germans are the smartest idiots.
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Posted: 9/22/2015 4:17:37 PM EDT
[#10]
No, liberals are not right about anything.
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Posted: 9/22/2015 4:18:33 PM EDT
[#11]
Economically?
"Liberal economics" is pretty much an albatross. |
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Posted: 9/22/2015 4:20:12 PM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Maybe in 20-30 years. Maybe. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Green and sustainable as presented by the leftists are not feasible. Maybe in 20-30 years. Maybe. If energy storage was easier and cheaper, solar would be ready now. |
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Posted: 9/22/2015 4:20:50 PM EDT
[#13]
 |
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Posted: 9/22/2015 4:22:14 PM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Command economy is retarded whether it's a fascist or a socialist doing the commanding. |
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Posted: 9/22/2015 4:24:17 PM EDT
[#15]
Germany was doing great until they stopped supporting nuclear energy.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nuclear_power_phase-out |
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Posted: 9/22/2015 4:24:33 PM EDT
[#16]
nothing else for it, the only solution is that the country perform mass suicides, nothing else will satisfy.
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Posted: 9/22/2015 4:26:05 PM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
If energy storage was easier and cheaper, solar would be ready now. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Green and sustainable as presented by the leftists are not feasible. Maybe in 20-30 years. Maybe. If energy storage was easier and cheaper, solar would be ready now. Enter Elon Musk. Can't wait to see what the next few years will be like for battery tech. |
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Posted: 9/22/2015 4:26:20 PM EDT
[#18]
I'm positive most green energy is financially inefficient.
When you factor in the energy required for production, manufacturing, transportation, maintenance costs, there is no way green energy sources are more efficient than traditional sources; thus, making green energy less green than traditional energy sources. |
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Posted: 9/22/2015 4:27:15 PM EDT
[#19]
Quoted:
http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/09/08/bavaria-energy-idUSL5N11A3G220150908 The German state of Bavaria willpress the federal government to reduce supports for renewableenergy, a high-ranking local policymaker said on Tuesday,calling the cost of green power a threat to economic growth. "We have to step on the brakes of electricity costs.Germany's energy transition must not become a decisivedisadvantage and a risk to our welfare," said Ilse Aigner,deputy prime minister of the south-western German state andminister for energy. Are liberals ever right about.....anything? It's like we live in this upside-down land where everything that's a bad idea is embraced by the liberals. That's what happens when the dumb masses subscribe to the Broken Window Fallacy. |
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Posted: 9/22/2015 4:28:03 PM EDT
[#20]
They're a group of misfits, failures, and losers, out to ruin everything for everyone else out of spite.
Their numbers are growing because more people are failures since they are not being raised properly anymore. |
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Posted: 9/22/2015 4:29:02 PM EDT
[#21]
Quoted:
http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/09/08/bavaria-energy-idUSL5N11A3G220150908 The German state of Bavaria willpress the federal government to reduce supports for renewableenergy, a high-ranking local policymaker said on Tuesday,calling the cost of green power a threat to economic growth. "We have to step on the brakes of electricity costs.Germany's energy transition must not become a decisivedisadvantage and a risk to our welfare," said Ilse Aigner,deputy prime minister of the south-western German state andminister for energy. Are liberals ever right about.....anything? It's like we live in this upside-down land where everything that's a bad idea is embraced by the liberals. obviously you have no feelings, and are self centered. |
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Posted: 9/22/2015 4:30:51 PM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
This would have nothing to do with a certain very large German car manufacturer who have been installing software to fool emissions standards in the US would it? You know...the same company that has seen its market value drop by 23% in two days after emissions standards testing threw a spanner in the works. No, it has to do with ignorant, cost ignoring policies from ignorant leftist. Txl |
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Posted: 9/22/2015 4:32:36 PM EDT
[#23]
crippling liberal bullshit would work if everyone else everywhere did it too! Everyone else just needs to get onboard and destroy their economies too / give up their freedoms / drink the koolaid / insert bullshit here.
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Posted: 9/22/2015 4:34:24 PM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
No, it has to do with ignorant, cost ignoring policies from ignorant leftist. Txl Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
This would have nothing to do with a certain very large German car manufacturer who have been installing software to fool emissions standards in the US would it? You know...the same company that has seen its market value drop by 23% in two days after emissions standards testing threw a spanner in the works. No, it has to do with ignorant, cost ignoring policies from ignorant leftist. Txl But but Polar bears and stuff. 
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Posted: 9/22/2015 4:35:19 PM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
No, it has to do with ignorant, cost ignoring policies from ignorant leftist. Txl Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
This would have nothing to do with a certain very large German car manufacturer who have been installing software to fool emissions standards in the US would it? You know...the same company that has seen its market value drop by 23% in two days after emissions standards testing threw a spanner in the works. No, it has to do with ignorant, cost ignoring policies from ignorant leftist. Txl It's just taxpayer money. Not real money. 
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Posted: 9/22/2015 4:36:18 PM EDT
[#26]
It's like we live in this upside-down land where everything that's a bad idea is embraced by the liberals. When you realize that the "true believers" in liberalism want to eliminate 90% or more of the planet's human population every idea they propose makes perfect sense. |
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Posted: 9/22/2015 4:37:59 PM EDT
[#27]
There is a role for the government in the economy of a country.
Capitalism is very efficient at producing goods but it does not regulate itself very well. For example, in past decades the factories in the northeast dumped millions of tons of waste oil and toxic chemicals all over the place. So you'll be walking in a beautiful woods and be in a toxic waste dump at the same time. If Sherwin Williams had a factory upstream of a lake, the lake is now literally too poisonous to swim in. Obviously, the government has to set environmental regulations or else the whole country will turn into a toxic waste dump. Some of you guys are real strong in hatin' on hippies and not so strong on common sense, so this idea will seem like real hippy commie talk to you. There are plenty of other places where the government should have a role, like pure food regulations or making sure that drugs are tested Faggy commie bullshit like that Personally, I have no problem with the government setting smog and efficiency standards for automobiles. Because I think we have a moral obligation to not take a massive shit on the global ecology We already live in a paradise of comfort and wealth, so surely we can spare some effort to not ruin the environment |
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Posted: 9/22/2015 4:38:04 PM EDT
[#28]
Wait, Germany paid 52 billion euros in fossil fuel subsidies in 2010.
http://www.dw.com/en/fossil-fuel-subsidies-outstrip-renewables-funding-by-billions/a-17465775 |
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Posted: 9/22/2015 4:41:14 PM EDT
[#29]
They should probably be more worried about all the parasites they invited that are mowing their way across Europe.
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Posted: 9/22/2015 4:41:24 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
There is a role for the government in the economy of a country. Capitalism is very efficient at producing goods but it does not regulate itself very well. For example, in past decades the factories in the northeast dumped millions of tons of waste oil and toxic chemicals all over the place. So you'll be walking in a beautiful woods and be in a toxic waste dump at the same time. If Sherwin Williams had a factory upstream of a lake, the lake is now literally too poisonous to swim in. Obviously, the government has to set environmental regulations or else the whole country will turn into a toxic waste dump. Some of you guys are real strong in hatin' on hippies and not so strong on common sense, so this idea will seem like real hippy commie talk to you. There are plenty of other places where the government should have a role, like pure food regulations or making sure that drugs are tested Faggy commie bullshit like that Yes, if it weren't for the Federal government, we'd have people dumping toxic waste in our rivers. On purpose, even! 
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Posted: 9/22/2015 4:46:11 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
When you realize that the "true believers" in liberalism want to eliminate 90% or more of the planet's human population every idea they propose makes perfect sense. Quote HistoryQuoted:
It's like we live in this upside-down land where everything that's a bad idea is embraced by the liberals. When you realize that the "true believers" in liberalism want to eliminate 90% or more of the planet's human population every idea they propose makes perfect sense. gee, and they call us the violent ones. |
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Posted: 9/22/2015 4:48:59 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
If energy storage was easier and cheaper, solar would be ready now. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Green and sustainable as presented by the leftists are not feasible. Maybe in 20-30 years. Maybe. If energy storage was easier and cheaper, solar would be ready now. You would also need a rather large number of panels. And by the very nature it is a limited approach to energy. Only so much energy strikes a given square yard per day. Breeder reactors is a much more resasonable approach to energy production. Long term perhaps fusion is the answer. Solar is small thinking. |
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Posted: 9/22/2015 4:51:38 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Yes, if it weren't for the Federal government, we'd have people dumping toxic waste in our rivers. On purpose, even!
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
There is a role for the government in the economy of a country. Capitalism is very efficient at producing goods but it does not regulate itself very well. For example, in past decades the factories in the northeast dumped millions of tons of waste oil and toxic chemicals all over the place. So you'll be walking in a beautiful woods and be in a toxic waste dump at the same time. If Sherwin Williams had a factory upstream of a lake, the lake is now literally too poisonous to swim in. Obviously, the government has to set environmental regulations or else the whole country will turn into a toxic waste dump. Some of you guys are real strong in hatin' on hippies and not so strong on common sense, so this idea will seem like real hippy commie talk to you. There are plenty of other places where the government should have a role, like pure food regulations or making sure that drugs are tested Faggy commie bullshit like that Yes, if it weren't for the Federal government, we'd have people dumping toxic waste in our rivers. On purpose, even!
We need to report EPA to the feds. |
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Posted: 9/22/2015 4:53:58 PM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted: There is a role for the government in the economy of a country. Capitalism is very efficient at producing goods but it does not regulate itself very well. For example, in past decades the factories in the northeast dumped millions of tons of waste oil and toxic chemicals all over the place. So you'll be walking in a beautiful woods and be in a toxic waste dump at the same time. If Sherwin Williams had a factory upstream of a lake, the lake is now literally too poisonous to swim in. Obviously, the government has to set environmental regulations or else the whole country will turn into a toxic waste dump. Some of you guys are real strong in hatin' on hippies and not so strong on common sense, so this idea will seem like real hippy commie talk to you. There are plenty of other places where the government should have a role, like pure food regulations or making sure that drugs are tested Faggy commie bullshit like that This is the liberal fallacy argument that always comes up when talking about environmental regulations. "Conservatives want dirty air and dirty water, but liberals want clean air and clean water." Uh, no - we all want clean air and clean water. The difference is that liberals think that they can micromanage everything and just put even more rules in place, while conservatives think that there should obviously be some basic, fundamental regulations on what can / cannot / should / should not happen to the 'environment.' Conservatives want an efficient EPA that creates ACTUAL common sense regulations, liberals want a 4000 page book full of regulations, and clauses, and exemptions, and so on. For example - I don't think that the EPA should be regulating vehicle emissions at all, whereas liberals want yearly inspections and 400,000 government regulations about what type of sensor has to be where, and the interior dimensions of a catalytic converter, and if the catalytic converter can be painted or galvanized, and what type of welds the seams have to have, etc.. If I want to drive around in a car that gets 2 MPG, that's my business and not for the government to tell me that I can't. It's funny how liberals want to regulate everything EXCEPT those things that they believe most in. Abortions? NO REGULATIONS - ABORTIONS ON DEMAND! Vehicle emissions? WE NEED TO HAVE THE MOST STRINGENT VEHICLE EMISSIONS STANDARDS IN THE ENTIRE UNIVERSE! |
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Posted: 9/22/2015 4:54:13 PM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
There is a role for the government in the economy of a country. Capitalism is very efficient at producing goods but it does not regulate itself very well. For example, in past decades the factories in the northeast dumped millions of tons of waste oil and toxic chemicals all over the place. So you'll be walking in a beautiful woods and be in a toxic waste dump at the same time. If Sherwin Williams had a factory upstream of a lake, the lake is now literally too poisonous to swim in. Obviously, the government has to set environmental regulations or else the whole country will turn into a toxic waste dump. Some of you guys are real strong in hatin' on hippies and not so strong on common sense, so this idea will seem like real hippy commie talk to you. There are plenty of other places where the government should have a role, like pure food regulations or making sure that drugs are tested Faggy commie bullshit like that Personally, I have no problem with the government setting smog and efficiency standards for automobiles. Because I think we have a moral obligation to not take a massive shit on the global ecology We already live in a paradise of comfort and wealth, so surely we can spare some effort to not ruin the environment bro, do you even mission creep? |
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Posted: 9/22/2015 4:56:21 PM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Yes, if it weren't for the Federal government, we'd have people dumping toxic waste in our rivers. On purpose, even!
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
There is a role for the government in the economy of a country. Capitalism is very efficient at producing goods but it does not regulate itself very well. For example, in past decades the factories in the northeast dumped millions of tons of waste oil and toxic chemicals all over the place. So you'll be walking in a beautiful woods and be in a toxic waste dump at the same time. If Sherwin Williams had a factory upstream of a lake, the lake is now literally too poisonous to swim in. Obviously, the government has to set environmental regulations or else the whole country will turn into a toxic waste dump. Some of you guys are real strong in hatin' on hippies and not so strong on common sense, so this idea will seem like real hippy commie talk to you. There are plenty of other places where the government should have a role, like pure food regulations or making sure that drugs are tested Faggy commie bullshit like that Yes, if it weren't for the Federal government, we'd have people dumping toxic waste in our rivers. On purpose, even!
So what uber-retarded avenue is this thread going to take? Are you guys going to say that toxic waste superfund sites don't exist? Or are you going to say that toxic waste isn't toxic? Or that factories didn't dump the waste? Or that the citizens of the USA weren't fucked over by the people that dumped the waste? There are $100s of billions worth of toxic waste sites to clean up. Here's a map of superfund toxic waste cleanup sites in the USA: 
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Posted: 9/22/2015 5:00:02 PM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
So what uber-retarded avenue is this thread going to take? Are you guys going to say that toxic waste superfund sites don't exist? Or are you going to say that toxic waste isn't toxic? Or that factories didn't dump the waste? Or that the citizens of the USA weren't fucked over by the people that dumped the waste? There are $100s of billions worth of toxic waste sites to clean up. Here's a map of superfund toxic waste cleanup sites in the USA: https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/91/Superfund_sites.svg Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
There is a role for the government in the economy of a country. Capitalism is very efficient at producing goods but it does not regulate itself very well. For example, in past decades the factories in the northeast dumped millions of tons of waste oil and toxic chemicals all over the place. So you'll be walking in a beautiful woods and be in a toxic waste dump at the same time. If Sherwin Williams had a factory upstream of a lake, the lake is now literally too poisonous to swim in. Obviously, the government has to set environmental regulations or else the whole country will turn into a toxic waste dump. Some of you guys are real strong in hatin' on hippies and not so strong on common sense, so this idea will seem like real hippy commie talk to you. There are plenty of other places where the government should have a role, like pure food regulations or making sure that drugs are tested Faggy commie bullshit like that Yes, if it weren't for the Federal government, we'd have people dumping toxic waste in our rivers. On purpose, even!
So what uber-retarded avenue is this thread going to take? Are you guys going to say that toxic waste superfund sites don't exist? Or are you going to say that toxic waste isn't toxic? Or that factories didn't dump the waste? Or that the citizens of the USA weren't fucked over by the people that dumped the waste? There are $100s of billions worth of toxic waste sites to clean up. Here's a map of superfund toxic waste cleanup sites in the USA: https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/91/Superfund_sites.svg Your reflexes were not fast enough. You did not catch it. |
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Posted: 9/22/2015 5:01:14 PM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Enter Elon Musk. Can't wait to see what the next few years will be like for battery tech. Quote HistoryQuoted:
If energy storage was easier and cheaper, solar would be ready now. Enter Elon Musk. Can't wait to see what the next few years will be like for battery tech. You are going to need more than just efficient energy storage. You are going to need photovoltaic solar cells that are MUCH more efficient than they are now (approx. 20%). In a place like here in AZ, that equates to an energy production rate of about 20 watts per square meter (and that is about as good as it's going to get ANYWHERE in the US--people in Michigan are going to have a tougher time!). A fossil fuel plant, by comparison, can range in power density anywhere from 100 to 1000 watts/sq. meter, including the area used for mining of fossil fuels. What this means is that we could COVER the state of AZ in solar cells and still not be able to replace much of our current energy sources. |
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Posted: 9/22/2015 5:02:35 PM EDT
[#39]
Quoted:
http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/09/08/bavaria-energy-idUSL5N11A3G220150908 The German state of Bavaria willpress the federal government to reduce supports for renewableenergy, a high-ranking local policymaker said on Tuesday,calling the cost of green power a threat to economic growth. "We have to step on the brakes of electricity costs.Germany's energy transition must not become a decisivedisadvantage and a risk to our welfare," said Ilse Aigner,deputy prime minister of the south-western German state andminister for energy. Are liberals ever right about.....anything? It's like we live in this upside-down land where everything that's a bad idea is embraced by the liberals. french socialists used already-obsolescing american nuclear tech to build their grid. ~80% of their energy is nuclear, and they've never had a major safety incident. they also smacked down greenpeace. so those guys were right about something, at least. |
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Posted: 9/22/2015 5:05:16 PM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
This would have nothing to do with a certain very large German car manufacturer who have been installing software to fool emissions standards in the US would it? You know...the same company that has seen its market value drop by 23% in two days after emissions standards testing threw a spanner in the works. Maybe they could write some software to enable German homeowners to slow down the little wheels on their meters. I read an article several years ago about the growing number of Germans who were being disconnected for failure to pay up. I imagine it gets pretty nippy in Mecklenburg-Vorpommern and Schleswig-Holstein in the winter. 
The State should furnish free unicorn farts for those who can't afford heat. |
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Posted: 9/22/2015 5:06:34 PM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You are going to need more than just efficient energy storage. You are going to need photovoltaic solar cells that are MUCH more efficient than they are now (approx. 20%). In a place like here in AZ, that equates to an energy production rate of about 20 watts per square meter (and that is about as good as it's going to get ANYWHERE in the US--people in Michigan are going to have a tougher time!). A fossil fuel plant, by comparison, can range in power density anywhere from 100 to 1000 watts/sq. meter, including the area used for mining of fossil fuels. What this means is that we could COVER the state of AZ in solar cells and still not be able to replace much of our current energy sources. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
If energy storage was easier and cheaper, solar would be ready now. Enter Elon Musk. Can't wait to see what the next few years will be like for battery tech. You are going to need more than just efficient energy storage. You are going to need photovoltaic solar cells that are MUCH more efficient than they are now (approx. 20%). In a place like here in AZ, that equates to an energy production rate of about 20 watts per square meter (and that is about as good as it's going to get ANYWHERE in the US--people in Michigan are going to have a tougher time!). A fossil fuel plant, by comparison, can range in power density anywhere from 100 to 1000 watts/sq. meter, including the area used for mining of fossil fuels. What this means is that we could COVER the state of AZ in solar cells and still not be able to replace much of our current energy sources. key concept, and this is where a lot of people go wrong. alterns will never be able to replace high-density energy generation--they will only be able to supplement it. |
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Posted: 9/22/2015 5:07:13 PM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
french socialists used already-obsolescing american nuclear tech to build their grid. ~80% of their energy is nuclear, and they've never had a major safety incident. they also smacked down greenpeace. so those guys were right about something, at least. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/09/08/bavaria-energy-idUSL5N11A3G220150908 The German state of Bavaria willpress the federal government to reduce supports for renewableenergy, a high-ranking local policymaker said on Tuesday,calling the cost of green power a threat to economic growth. "We have to step on the brakes of electricity costs.Germany's energy transition must not become a decisivedisadvantage and a risk to our welfare," said Ilse Aigner,deputy prime minister of the south-western German state andminister for energy. Are liberals ever right about.....anything? It's like we live in this upside-down land where everything that's a bad idea is embraced by the liberals. french socialists used already-obsolescing american nuclear tech to build their grid. ~80% of their energy is nuclear, and they've never had a major safety incident. they also smacked down greenpeace. so those guys were right about something, at least. The French get two things right often: Energy and nationalism |
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Posted: 9/22/2015 5:08:26 PM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
This is the liberal fallacy argument that always comes up when talking about environmental regulations. "Conservatives want dirty air and dirty water, but liberals want clean air and clean water." Uh, no - we all want clean air and clean water. The difference is that liberals think that they can micromanage everything and just put even more rules in place, while conservatives think that there should obviously be some basic, fundamental regulations on what can / cannot / should / should not happen to the 'environment.' Conservatives want an efficient EPA that creates ACTUAL common sense regulations, liberals want a 4000 page book full of regulations, and clauses, and exemptions, and so on. For example - I don't think that the EPA should be regulating vehicle emissions at all, whereas liberals want yearly inspections and 400,000 government regulations about what type of sensor has to be where, and the interior dimensions of a catalytic converter, and if the catalytic converter can be painted or galvanized, and what type of welds the seams have to have, etc.. If I want to drive around in a car that gets 2 MPG, that's my business and not for the government to tell me that I can't. It's funny how liberals want to regulate everything EXCEPT those things that they believe most in. Abortions? NO REGULATIONS - ABORTIONS ON DEMAND! Vehicle emissions? WE NEED TO HAVE THE MOST STRINGENT VEHICLE EMISSIONS STANDARDS IN THE ENTIRE UNIVERSE! Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
There is a role for the government in the economy of a country. Capitalism is very efficient at producing goods but it does not regulate itself very well. For example, in past decades the factories in the northeast dumped millions of tons of waste oil and toxic chemicals all over the place. So you'll be walking in a beautiful woods and be in a toxic waste dump at the same time. If Sherwin Williams had a factory upstream of a lake, the lake is now literally too poisonous to swim in. Obviously, the government has to set environmental regulations or else the whole country will turn into a toxic waste dump. Some of you guys are real strong in hatin' on hippies and not so strong on common sense, so this idea will seem like real hippy commie talk to you. There are plenty of other places where the government should have a role, like pure food regulations or making sure that drugs are tested Faggy commie bullshit like that This is the liberal fallacy argument that always comes up when talking about environmental regulations. "Conservatives want dirty air and dirty water, but liberals want clean air and clean water." Uh, no - we all want clean air and clean water. The difference is that liberals think that they can micromanage everything and just put even more rules in place, while conservatives think that there should obviously be some basic, fundamental regulations on what can / cannot / should / should not happen to the 'environment.' Conservatives want an efficient EPA that creates ACTUAL common sense regulations, liberals want a 4000 page book full of regulations, and clauses, and exemptions, and so on. For example - I don't think that the EPA should be regulating vehicle emissions at all, whereas liberals want yearly inspections and 400,000 government regulations about what type of sensor has to be where, and the interior dimensions of a catalytic converter, and if the catalytic converter can be painted or galvanized, and what type of welds the seams have to have, etc.. If I want to drive around in a car that gets 2 MPG, that's my business and not for the government to tell me that I can't. It's funny how liberals want to regulate everything EXCEPT those things that they believe most in. Abortions? NO REGULATIONS - ABORTIONS ON DEMAND! Vehicle emissions? WE NEED TO HAVE THE MOST STRINGENT VEHICLE EMISSIONS STANDARDS IN THE ENTIRE UNIVERSE! I'm not a liberal and I've never voted for a democrat. I do want to live in a pure environment and not ruin the environment for future generations. I know that's a commie, faggy, hippy idea but I just cannot help myself. There are places in the northeast that are so polluted that it's illegal to build houses there. It used to be a beautiful prairie, then a factory was built, and now even the dust blowing around in the air is toxic. As an example, there is a beautiful estuary near the Vietnam-era agent orange plant, it's one of the most polluted places on the entire planet. I think that the people running the plant committed a horrible crime on the people living in that region and the future generations. I'm sorry that I enraged everyone by promoting abortions and communism or whatever the fuck your dunce-o-rama essay is saying. |
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Posted: 9/22/2015 5:10:58 PM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You are going to need more than just efficient energy storage. You are going to need photovoltaic solar cells that are MUCH more efficient than they are now (approx. 20%). In a place like here in AZ, that equates to an energy production rate of about 20 watts per square meter (and that is about as good as it's going to get ANYWHERE in the US--people in Michigan are going to have a tougher time!). A fossil fuel plant, by comparison, can range in power density anywhere from 100 to 1000 watts/sq. meter, including the area used for mining of fossil fuels. What this means is that we could COVER the state of AZ in solar cells and still not be able to replace much of our current energy sources. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: If energy storage was easier and cheaper, solar would be ready now. Enter Elon Musk. Can't wait to see what the next few years will be like for battery tech. You are going to need more than just efficient energy storage. You are going to need photovoltaic solar cells that are MUCH more efficient than they are now (approx. 20%). In a place like here in AZ, that equates to an energy production rate of about 20 watts per square meter (and that is about as good as it's going to get ANYWHERE in the US--people in Michigan are going to have a tougher time!). A fossil fuel plant, by comparison, can range in power density anywhere from 100 to 1000 watts/sq. meter, including the area used for mining of fossil fuels. What this means is that we could COVER the state of AZ in solar cells and still not be able to replace much of our current energy sources. |
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Posted: 9/22/2015 5:18:00 PM EDT
[#45]
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I am getting better than 150 watts per square meter in ALASKA. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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If energy storage was easier and cheaper, solar would be ready now. Enter Elon Musk. Can't wait to see what the next few years will be like for battery tech. You are going to need more than just efficient energy storage. You are going to need photovoltaic solar cells that are MUCH more efficient than they are now (approx. 20%). In a place like here in AZ, that equates to an energy production rate of about 20 watts per square meter (and that is about as good as it's going to get ANYWHERE in the US--people in Michigan are going to have a tougher time!). A fossil fuel plant, by comparison, can range in power density anywhere from 100 to 1000 watts/sq. meter, including the area used for mining of fossil fuels. What this means is that we could COVER the state of AZ in solar cells and still not be able to replace much of our current energy sources. Shhhh your going to ruin his sumg correctness. |
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Posted: 9/22/2015 5:18:27 PM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
key concept, and this is where a lot of people go wrong. alterns will never be able to replace high-density energy generation--they will only be able to supplement it. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
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If energy storage was easier and cheaper, solar would be ready now. Enter Elon Musk. Can't wait to see what the next few years will be like for battery tech. You are going to need more than just efficient energy storage. You are going to need photovoltaic solar cells that are MUCH more efficient than they are now (approx. 20%). In a place like here in AZ, that equates to an energy production rate of about 20 watts per square meter (and that is about as good as it's going to get ANYWHERE in the US--people in Michigan are going to have a tougher time!). A fossil fuel plant, by comparison, can range in power density anywhere from 100 to 1000 watts/sq. meter, including the area used for mining of fossil fuels. What this means is that we could COVER the state of AZ in solar cells and still not be able to replace much of our current energy sources. key concept, and this is where a lot of people go wrong. alterns will never be able to replace high-density energy generation--they will only be able to supplement it. And there is no point in adding something that can't get the job done. |
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Posted: 9/22/2015 5:22:03 PM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
There is a role for the government in the economy of a country. Capitalism is very efficient at producing goods but it does not regulate itself very well. For example, in past decades the factories in the northeast dumped millions of tons of waste oil and toxic chemicals all over the place. So you'll be walking in a beautiful woods and be in a toxic waste dump at the same time. If Sherwin Williams had a factory upstream of a lake, the lake is now literally too poisonous to swim in. Obviously, the government has to set environmental regulations or else the whole country will turn into a toxic waste dump. Some of you guys are real strong in hatin' on hippies and not so strong on common sense, so this idea will seem like real hippy commie talk to you. There are plenty of other places where the government should have a role, like pure food regulations or making sure that drugs are tested Faggy commie bullshit like that Personally, I have no problem with the government setting smog and efficiency standards for automobiles. Because I think we have a moral obligation to not take a massive shit on the global ecology We already live in a paradise of comfort and wealth, so surely we can spare some effort to not ruin the environment You don't know the definition of capitalism, and you're a statist.
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Posted: 9/22/2015 5:23:04 PM EDT
[#48]
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So what uber-retarded avenue is this thread going to take? Are you guys going to say that toxic waste superfund sites don't exist? Or are you going to say that toxic waste isn't toxic? Or that factories didn't dump the waste? Or that the citizens of the USA weren't fucked over by the people that dumped the waste? There are $100s of billions worth of toxic waste sites to clean up. Here's a map of superfund toxic waste cleanup sites in the USA: https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/91/Superfund_sites.svg Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
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There is a role for the government in the economy of a country. Capitalism is very efficient at producing goods but it does not regulate itself very well. For example, in past decades the factories in the northeast dumped millions of tons of waste oil and toxic chemicals all over the place. So you'll be walking in a beautiful woods and be in a toxic waste dump at the same time. If Sherwin Williams had a factory upstream of a lake, the lake is now literally too poisonous to swim in. Obviously, the government has to set environmental regulations or else the whole country will turn into a toxic waste dump. Some of you guys are real strong in hatin' on hippies and not so strong on common sense, so this idea will seem like real hippy commie talk to you. There are plenty of other places where the government should have a role, like pure food regulations or making sure that drugs are tested Faggy commie bullshit like that Yes, if it weren't for the Federal government, we'd have people dumping toxic waste in our rivers. On purpose, even!
So what uber-retarded avenue is this thread going to take? Are you guys going to say that toxic waste superfund sites don't exist? Or are you going to say that toxic waste isn't toxic? Or that factories didn't dump the waste? Or that the citizens of the USA weren't fucked over by the people that dumped the waste? There are $100s of billions worth of toxic waste sites to clean up. Here's a map of superfund toxic waste cleanup sites in the USA: https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/91/Superfund_sites.svg Your mistake is in assuming that toxic waste is a result of capitalism. |
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Posted: 9/22/2015 5:31:30 PM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted: So what uber-retarded avenue is this thread going to take? Are you guys going to say that toxic waste superfund sites don't exist? Or are you going to say that toxic waste isn't toxic? Or that factories didn't dump the waste? Or that the citizens of the USA weren't fucked over by the people that dumped the waste? There are $100s of billions worth of toxic waste sites to clean up. Here's a map of superfund toxic waste cleanup sites in the USA: https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/91/Superfund_sites.svg Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: There is a role for the government in the economy of a country. Capitalism is very efficient at producing goods but it does not regulate itself very well. For example, in past decades the factories in the northeast dumped millions of tons of waste oil and toxic chemicals all over the place. So you'll be walking in a beautiful woods and be in a toxic waste dump at the same time. If Sherwin Williams had a factory upstream of a lake, the lake is now literally too poisonous to swim in. Obviously, the government has to set environmental regulations or else the whole country will turn into a toxic waste dump. Some of you guys are real strong in hatin' on hippies and not so strong on common sense, so this idea will seem like real hippy commie talk to you. There are plenty of other places where the government should have a role, like pure food regulations or making sure that drugs are tested Faggy commie bullshit like that Yes, if it weren't for the Federal government, we'd have people dumping toxic waste in our rivers. On purpose, even! So what uber-retarded avenue is this thread going to take? Are you guys going to say that toxic waste superfund sites don't exist? Or are you going to say that toxic waste isn't toxic? Or that factories didn't dump the waste? Or that the citizens of the USA weren't fucked over by the people that dumped the waste? There are $100s of billions worth of toxic waste sites to clean up. Here's a map of superfund toxic waste cleanup sites in the USA: https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/91/Superfund_sites.svg By and large, it looks to suck to be in a liberal blue state. Problem? |
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Posted: 9/22/2015 5:42:59 PM EDT
[#50]
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If energy storage was easier and cheaper, solar would be ready now. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Green and sustainable as presented by the leftists are not feasible. Maybe in 20-30 years. Maybe. If energy storage was easier and cheaper, solar would be ready now. If unicorns were real, you could burn their poop and have unlimited, free energy. But they're not real. |
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