Right on, I can dig that.

As a major LOTR geek, the Hobbit was a massive letdown. That's coming from someone who regards the Fellowship of the Ring as his favorite movie. It was filled with literary inaccuracies (Azog, Thranduil) and stuff that was just made up (Tauriel, sandworms of Dune). I hate the treatment they gave Radagast (crazy, RABBITS, etc) and dislike some rather simple things (dwarves? Without beards?!).

The biggest thing as far as structure though, was Azog and the chase scenes. The only reason to have Azog alive at all is to give the story a main antagonist, a driving force that presses the party onward. The only reason they need a main antagonist like that is because the movies dragged on too long. They made a nine hour saga, and then decided they needed more material. So they added chase scenes everywhere. They resurrected a dead orc chieftain to provide chase scenes so that they could make a nine hour story more interesting, when they really needed to cut a bunch of material.

Pisses me off.

That said, theres already at least one fan edit of the Hobbit trilogy. It cuts the nine hour runtime down to about four and a half by stripping out anything not in the books. Legolas? Mostly gone. Tauriel? Gone. White Council/Dol Guldur? Gone. Chase scenes? Heavily edited. Useless scenes in Lake town? Gone. Etc.I haven't gotten around to watching it, but I really need to see if it improves things as much as I hope.

Eta: this is probably a thread where several people can ID where my screen name comes from off the top of their heads.

I'm a purist but appreciated the LOTR films despite the flaws.  I recognize how rare it is to do such books justice on film.

I appreciate Jane Austin's Pride and Prejudice.  I enjoy the Keira Knightly version.  We just watched the 1940 Greer Garson and Laurence Olivier and enjoyed it.  There's even an LDS version that came out several years ago.  The best, of course, is the BBC/A&E version that's about 6 hours long.  I can appreciate all these versions for the reason that they all try to stay faithful to the basic characters and premise of the story, despite taking liberties with the pacing of events, the styles, etc.

What bothered me with The Hobbit films, in summary, was how nearly every single character and motive was turned upside down.  Wise characters were portrayed as foolish.  The noble and peace loving were portrayed as petty and willfully violent.  Likewise the most dangerous and powerful were portrayed as incompetent and weakened.  So it becomes a parody of the story instead.

Thank God Christopher Tolkien refuses to let PJ even come near the Silmarillion.

I'll keep my eyes out for that.  I was hoping somebody would attempt to fix it.

One was......ok.  Not what I was expecting.  Radagast and his rabbit sleigh was particularly bothersome, he was portrayed as an imbecile.

Two was.... worse.  Even further from the book than One.  Watched it at home on DVD.

Three was.... Godawful.  I watched it mainly just to finish the series, but really didn't look forward to it.  It lived up to my expectations at that point.

That's actually pretty accurate to the book, IIRC.  Gollum's past is covered elsewhere, not in the Hobbit.

Forerunner of the Stoors is how I believe Gandalf described him.  Hobbit like.

He was not a Hobbit.  He was similar to a Hobbit at least according to LOTR.

C'mon man you're reaching.

Gollum has been alone in the dark for a mighty long time, and doesn't remember much of his old life...

Not to mention he's crazier than a stuck elevator full of Ron Paul fanatics.

By the time Bilbo meets him, Gollum is consumed by 2 things.  Food, and the Ring.

There's mention in the book that Gollum gets angry during the riddle game because the riddles bring up old memories.

Watch the animated version from 1977 and pay close attention to the scene where the guys are fishing. That explains why Gollum is what he is, without reading.

He was a Hobbit. Like it or leave it he wasn't a human, nor Orc, nor Elf nor troll or dwarf. It's pretty simple.

I'm not sure why it's even challenged.

Wow, harsh crowd.

I thought the Hobbit trilogy wasn't bad but nowhere near as good as the LOTR trilogy.

This is one of those things that separates the mere fans from those who've probably spent too much time immersed in the Tolkien world.

Gollum was apparently a Stoor.  In some ancient fictional Middle Earth time, the Hobbit race was divided into three tribes: Stoors, Harfoots, and Fallohides.  

The Harfoots were the most common, were the first to migrate into Arnor and become known as halflings to the Dunedain.  They tended to have no beards, wore no footwear, and lived in holes they called smials.  They tended to be more settled and less adventurous and had a bit darker complexion.

The Stoors were broader and resembled men a bit more.  Tended to have beards, preferred flat lands and riversides, used boats and could swim, and sometimes wore boots in muddy weather.

The Fallohides tended to be fairer skinned and haired, no beards or footwear like the Harfoots, had friendly relations with the elves, and were more adventurous than the others.

Over time the Stoors and Fallohides followed the Harfoot migration to Arnor.  Parts of the Stoor tribe settled more in the Westfarthing Eastfarthing and Southfarthing of the Shire lands.  The Fallohides settled among the Harfoots and tended to be their leaders.  Over time the three tribes intermingled until by Bilbo's day they were more or less a single tribe with some families or regions showing varying traits to one degree or another of the original tribes.  The Took clan, for example, had a greater amount of Fallohide influence which in turn is seen in Bilbo from his Took clan mother.

So was Gollum a Hobbit?  Yes.  Would his Stoor tribe of that time look a little different than the hobbits of the Shire in Bilbo's day?  Yeah, a little.  Still, similar enough.

Loved the LOTR movies, but so far the Hobbit movies I've seen, the first two, have been shit.

In before the ATF bans Hobbits for being armor piercing.

The original story was a hilarious book full of humor and good writing. The movies were more like the LotR saga, which is not my favorite because it is boring as fuck.

Sir, if there is ever a campfire, I'll bring the beer. Well said.