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Posted: 1/25/2015 2:32:18 AM EDT

I have a real good buddy I used to work with. Due to drinking issues and lack of sobriety, he was fired. He's the kind of guy that you root for because he's such a great guy when sober but alcoholism has been a problem for him throught his life. Now he wants to get a job at my new employer and wants a reccommendation. I have only talked to him on the phone and I'm not sure if he's clean or not. We drive company vehicles and I don't want to put the company at risk. I really do want to help my buddy because he's good at what he does but again he's had several relapses. Thoughts on how to proceed? He's been blowing up my phone lately and desperately needs a job.

Posted: 1/25/2015 2:36:27 AM EDT

[#1]

I wouldn't do it. I would also tell him why I wouldn't do it.

Posted: 1/25/2015 2:38:36 AM EDT

[#2]

Tell him he can put you down if you want.

Tell your employer your concerns if you like your job.

I've had academy classmates apply at my agency before and I am truthful about how they were and who they are.

Posted: 1/25/2015 2:38:52 AM EDT

[#3]

Ask if they have a position for a friend who could relapse drinking. He's otherwise good help. Then you did what you could.

Posted: 1/25/2015 2:38:58 AM EDT

[#4]

You know the likely outcome. Don't do it.

Posted: 1/25/2015 2:43:43 AM EDT

[#5]

My recommendation means something. If I were to recommend this person I would be brutally honest and preferably off the record. If they still hire him, that's not on you.

Posted: 1/25/2015 2:47:26 AM EDT

[#6]

Nope, I wouldn't ruin MY reputation recommending a drunk, friend or not. You WILL get the blame if he screws up and if you don't disclose his drinking and it comes out due to some incident you can kiss your rep for honesty goodbye.

Posted: 1/25/2015 2:52:41 AM EDT

[#7]

Quoted:

I have a real good buddy I used to work with. Due to drinking issues and lack of sobriety, he was fired. He's the kind of guy that you root for because he's such a great guy when sober but alcoholism has been a problem for him throught his life. Now he wants to get a job at my new employer and wants a reccommendation. I have only talked to him on the phone and I'm not sure if he's clean or not. We drive company vehicles and I don't want to put the company at risk. I really do want to help my buddy because he's good at what he does but again he's had several relapses. Thoughts on how to proceed? He's been blowing up my phone lately and desperately needs a job.

View Quote

Give him one chance. Only one. Let him know that's where you are at

off the bat and if he fucks up he's gone.

Posted: 1/25/2015 2:56:17 AM EDT

[#8]

Tell him yes..

Then tell the boss NO WAY you don't know the guy.

Posted: 1/25/2015 2:56:31 AM EDT

[#9]

most functional alcoholics I know are fantastic workers

sounds off, but they are

if he can leave his problems at home and not bring them to work

so be it

if not

sorry bud

Posted: 1/25/2015 2:59:51 AM EDT

[#10]

Quote History

Quoted:

My recommendation means something. If I were to recommend this person I would be brutally honest and preferably off the record. If they still hire him, that's not on you.

View Quote

This. I'd lay it out and tell him to apply for a job. If he gets denied, well, I tried but they must have contacted someone else you worked for. Sorry.

Posted: 1/25/2015 3:01:02 AM EDT

[#11]

Quote History

Quoted:

most functional alcoholics I know are fantastic workers

sounds off, but they are

if he can leave his problems at home and not bring them to work

so be it

if not

sorry bud

View Quote

This too. Some of the best workers I've met hit the bottle as soon as they get home. It all depends on if he can leave it at home and if there is on call time.

Posted: 1/25/2015 3:03:36 AM EDT

[#12]

Quote History

Quoted:
I wouldn't do it. I would also tell him why I wouldn't do it.

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This.

He's really hurting for a job, and maybe he's clean and sober. Still, you can't take that chance with your job.

Be honest with your friend.

Posted: 1/25/2015 3:13:14 AM EDT

[#13]

It's not your job to get him a job. He can put on his big boy pants and go get one himself like everyone else.

Posted: 1/25/2015 3:15:12 AM EDT

[#14]

Quote History

Quoted:

This too. Some of the best workers I've met hit the bottle as soon as they get home. It all depends on if he can leave it at home and if there is on call time.

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Quoted:

Quoted:
most functional alcoholics I know are fantastic workers

sounds off, but they are

if he can leave his problems at home and not bring them to work

so be it

if not

sorry bud

This too. Some of the best workers I've met hit the bottle as soon as they get home. It all depends on if he can leave it at home and if there is on call time.

OP says the guy was fired because of it from his previous job. So, I'm guessing he can't leave it at home.

Posted: 1/25/2015 3:15:52 AM EDT

[#15]

No way.
Don't put your (your family's?) livelihood at risk for an unstable person.

Posted: 1/25/2015 3:16:29 AM EDT

[#16]

Quote History

Quoted:

OP says the guy was fired because of it from his previous job. So, I'm guessing he can't leave it at home.

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Quoted:

Quoted:
most functional alcoholics I know are fantastic workers

sounds off, but they are

if he can leave his problems at home and not bring them to work

so be it

if not

sorry bud

This too. Some of the best workers I've met hit the bottle as soon as they get home. It all depends on if he can leave it at home and if there is on call time.

OP says the guy was fired because of it from his previous job. So, I'm guessing he can't leave it at home.

Correct. They allowed him FML leave to go to rehab and held his job. He came back and screwed up again and they said adios.

Posted: 1/25/2015 3:21:23 AM EDT

[#17]

Quote History

Quoted:
Correct. They allowed him FML leave to go to rehab and held his job. He came back and screwed up again and they said adios.

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Quote History

Quoted:

Quoted:

most functional alcoholics I know are fantastic workers

sounds off, but they are

if he can leave his problems at home and not bring them to work

so be it

if not

sorry bud

This too. Some of the best workers I've met hit the bottle as soon as they get home. It all depends on if he can leave it at home and if there is on call time.

OP says the guy was fired because of it from his previous job. So, I'm guessing he can't leave it at home.

Correct. They allowed him FML leave to go to rehab and held his job. He came back and screwed up again and they said adios.

I retract my previous statement

Posted: 1/25/2015 3:35:43 AM EDT

[#18]

Quoted:
I have a real good buddy I used to work with. Due to drinking issues and lack of sobriety, he was fired. He's the kind of guy that you root for because he's such a great guy when sober but alcoholism has been a problem for him throught his life. Now he wants to get a job at my new employer and wants a reccommendation. I have only talked to him on the phone and I'm not sure if he's clean or not. We drive company vehicles and I don't want to put the company at risk. I really do want to help my buddy because he's good at what he does but again he's had several relapses. Thoughts on how to proceed? He's been blowing up my phone lately and desperately needs a job.

View Quote

Tell him. Tell him why. Help him get a job somewhere else.

Get him help.

Posted: 1/25/2015 3:42:15 AM EDT

[#19]

Don't do it man. I am in a very similar spot with my brother. He is a good person but can't control his alcohol. I was using him for work for a few weeks and then he stopped calling or texting about work and actually blew a job off that we were doing together. It was a Monday and I had paid him Friday and I think he drunk it up all weekend. I know other contractor's and a few my brother has worked for and they ask me from time to time what my brother is doing and if he is hire able and I tell them honestly and it's NO. I wish my brother would get his shit together but going on 40 and he still acts like we are stuck in early 20's drinking days.

Posted: 1/25/2015 3:44:10 AM EDT

[#20]

Quote History

Quoted:

Nope, I wouldn't ruin MY reputation recommending a drunk, friend or not. You WILL get the blame if he screws up and if you don't disclose his drinking and it comes out due to some incident you can kiss your rep for honesty goodbye.

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Posted: 1/25/2015 3:50:52 AM EDT

[#21]

Quote History

Quoted:
They allowed him FML leave to go to rehab and held his job. He came back and screwed up again and they said adios.

View Quote

Honestly, I had been thinking that you might give him a chance.
But that shows what he does with a chance. So, not only no, but Hell No.
Especially since it sounds like you're pretty new there yourself.

Posted: 1/25/2015 4:34:54 AM EDT

[#22]

I was in a similar boat as you (several years ago). I had a close friend (as in, went to school together, went to boot camp together, hung out together when we got out), super awesome dude when he was sober. He would clean up for a while and sure as shit be back on the dope in a week or so.

It must have been a day or so after one of his benders, he stops by my employment wanting me to put him to work. I had just landed a management position and was raising a young family. I loved that dude like he was my brother and I turned him away. I finally realized (after years of helping him) that no matter what I said or did he wasn't going to change. The only thing that was going to happen is that he was going to drag me down with his bullshit like he did with everyone else that was close to him......

Well, a week or so later and I never heard back from him (I figured he was on the shit again)... then a few more weeks go by.... then a few weeks go by... His family filed a missing persons report, finally almost a year goes by and some hunters find his body in the woods......

I heard later that he was on a bender and got lost in the woods. Of course I as well as everyone close to him blamed ourselves, the whole if only I said this or done this differently thinking.... It's just a cold hard fact that this type of self destructive behavior can lead down this path. Absolutely nothing will change for someone with a drug or alcohol dependency until they are ready to make the changes themselves.

My advice is this; unless you (and your employer) are ready to deal with all of the bullshit that comes along with someone with an addiction then don't hire him. Like I said I was in a similar boat years ago, that was my decision then and that would be my decision today.

Posted: 1/25/2015 4:43:53 AM EDT

[#23]

Nope, true friends don't put you in a position like. Ultimately you have to look out for yourself and do what you think is in your best interest even when it tough.

Posted: 1/25/2015 4:50:58 AM EDT

[#24]

I am just a worthless liar
I am just an imbecile
I will only complicate you
Trust in me and fall as well
I will find a center in you
I will chew it up and leave
I will work to elevate you
Just enough to bring you down.

Posted: 1/25/2015 5:50:08 AM EDT

[#25]

Hes not a friend, dont surround yourself with people you cant trust.

Posted: 1/25/2015 7:51:21 AM EDT

[#26]

Most addicts are otherwise trustworthy, hook him up.

I keed, I keed.

He will fuck you like a prom date?

Posted: 1/25/2015 7:51:50 AM EDT

[#27]

Quoted:
I have a real good buddy I used to work with. Due to drinking issues and lack of sobriety, he was fired. He's the kind of guy that you root for because he's such a great guy when sober but alcoholism has been a problem for him throught his life. Now he wants to get a job at my new employer and wants a reccommendation. I have only talked to him on the phone and I'm not sure if he's clean or not. We drive company vehicles and I don't want to put the company at risk. I really do want to help my buddy because he's good at what he does but again he's had several relapses. Thoughts on how to proceed? He's been blowing up my phone lately and desperately needs a job.

View Quote

I believe you have already answered your own question.

Posted: 1/25/2015 7:54:26 AM EDT

[#28]

Quote History

Quoted:
I wouldn't do it. I would also tell him why I wouldn't do it.

View Quote

Posted: 1/25/2015 7:55:32 AM EDT

[#29]

Quote History

Quoted:
I am just a worthless liar
I am just an imbecile
I will only complicate you
Trust in me and fall as well
I will find a center in you
I will chew it up and leave
I will work to elevate you
Just enough to bring you down.

View Quote

<3 Tool

Posted: 1/25/2015 8:00:48 AM EDT

[#30]

I think you forgot one sentence at the end of your post OP.

"How do I tell him no?"

Posted: 1/25/2015 8:06:30 AM EDT

[#31]

The best predictor of future performance is past performance.

Posted: 1/25/2015 8:12:29 AM EDT

[#32]

Quote History

Quoted:
I wouldn't do it. I would also tell him why I wouldn't do it.

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Posted: 1/25/2015 8:41:39 AM EDT

[#33]

It would be hard for me to give a recommendation for an alcoholic, even a good friend.

Posted: 1/25/2015 9:22:41 AM EDT

[#34]

No man, you cannot recommend and still be an honest person.
Your employer is trusting you to answer honestly.
If you lie, and he gets in and then fucks up (like a DWI accident), then your employer will be held responsible.

Truth wins.

Posted: 1/25/2015 9:23:25 AM EDT

[#35]

Quoted:
I have a real good buddy I used to work with. Due to drinking issues and lack of sobriety, he was fired. He's the kind of guy that you root for because he's such a great guy when sober but alcoholism has been a problem for him throught his life. Now he wants to get a job at my new employer and wants a reccommendation. I have only talked to him on the phone and I'm not sure if he's clean or not. We drive company vehicles and I don't want to put the company at risk. I really do want to help my buddy because he's good at what he does but again he's had several relapses. Thoughts on how to proceed? He's been blowing up my phone lately and desperately needs a job.

View Quote

I would help a real good friend who needed a job. Tell him you will recommend him but make sure he understands he must be sober when at work.

Posted: 1/25/2015 9:29:47 AM EDT

[#36]

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Quoted:

Quoted:

I wouldn't do it. I would also tell him why I wouldn't do it.

THIS.

He's welcome to apply anywhere he wants to - based on his own merit/history.

Borrowing against your good reputation for a "recommendation" is a very bad idea,

and a "friend" would not ask that of you.

Posted: 1/25/2015 9:30:12 AM EDT

[#37]

He. Is. Going. To. Fuck. You.

Posted: 1/25/2015 9:30:56 AM EDT

[#38]

Quoted:
I have a real good buddy I used to work with. Due to drinking issues and lack of sobriety, he was fired. He's the kind of guy that you root for because he's such a great guy when sober but alcoholism has been a problem for him throught his life. Now he wants to get a job at my new employer and wants a reccommendation. I have only talked to him on the phone and I'm not sure if he's clean or not. We drive company vehicles and I don't want to put the company at risk. I really do want to help my buddy because he's good at what he does but again he's had several relapses. Thoughts on how to proceed? He's been blowing up my phone lately and desperately needs a job.

View Quote

Are you willing to put your credibility on the line at work for the guy knowing he has been fired at least once for his drinking? You know he's a drunk and and a fuckup at work. No way in hell I would go out on a limb to help a guy like that.

Posted: 1/25/2015 9:33:39 AM EDT

[#39]

Arfcom consensus equals NO.

Posted: 1/25/2015 9:40:54 AM EDT

[#40]

Quoted:
I have a real good buddy I used to work with. Due to drinking issues and lack of sobriety, he was fired. He's the kind of guy that you root for because he's such a great guy when sober but alcoholism has been a problem for him throught his life. Now he wants to get a job at my new employer and wants a reccommendation. I have only talked to him on the phone and I'm not sure if he's clean or not. We drive company vehicles and I don't want to put the company at risk. I really do want to help my buddy because he's good at what he does but again he's had several relapses. Thoughts on how to proceed? He's been blowing up my phone lately and desperately needs a job.

View Quote

Tell your friend that you will recommend him but you're going to tell them exactly what you just told us.

Posted: 1/25/2015 9:43:07 AM EDT

[#41]

I really don't understand why decisions like this are hard from some people.

Posted: 1/25/2015 9:45:29 AM EDT

[#42]

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Quoted:
I wouldn't do it. I would also tell him why I wouldn't do it.

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This.

Im tired of hiring fuckhead employees because people vouch for them. I have fired some pretty good employees for it in the past.

I had one that swore up and down his son was a hard worker and would do a great job as a shop guy. The dad had been a good worker for the 4 years he was with us. I hired him and he only lasted two weeks. Laziest guy ive ever seen. When i approached the dad about it he was like "oh yeah, he doesnt do anything, never has". "You cant get an ounce of work out of him".

We let him park his camper rent free in our rv park. Had to evict him to get him to leave. I looked in the trash one night and he was knocking back a case of beer every day it appeared.

His son ended up suing me for 125k for oppressing his civil rights, workplace discrimination, and wrongful termination. He also turned us into the dot and epa for violations that werent true. I beat everything but it cost my partner and i 45k in legal fees.

I had it documented so i fired the dad for lying to me and exposing us to that kind of risk so he turned around and sued us for wrongful termination and sexism in the workplace. He also turned us in 6 more times for the same epa violation and i had to spend another 35k in testing and legal help to prove i didnt do anything.

Tldr: to make a long story short, dont screw you employer please.

Posted: 1/25/2015 9:47:52 AM EDT

[#43]

When he gets a dui and can no longer drive for the company, or has several cases of brown bottle flu, the company will look back at you.

Posted: 1/25/2015 9:51:35 AM EDT

[#44]

Quote History

Quoted:
I wouldn't do it. I would also tell him why I wouldn't do it.

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This.

If he's really your friend, be honest with him and let him know that his personal problems make it impossible for you to give him a good recommendation to your employer.

Posted: 1/25/2015 10:02:04 AM EDT

[#45]

Quote History

Quoted:

This.

Im tired of hiring fuckhead employees because people vouch for them. I have fired some pretty good employees for it in the past.

I had one that swore up and down his son was a hard worker and would do a great job as a shop guy. The dad had been a good worker for the 4 years he was with us. I hired him and he only lasted two weeks. Laziest guy ive ever seen. When i approached the dad about it he was like "oh yeah, he doesnt do anything, never has". "You cant get an ounce of work out of him".

We let him park his camper rent free in our rv park. Had to evict him to get him to leave. I looked in the trash one night and he was knocking back a case of beer every day it appeared.

His son ended up suing me for 125k for oppressing his civil rights, workplace discrimination, and wrongful termination. He also turned us into the dot and epa for violations that werent true. I beat everything but it cost my partner and i 45k in legal fees.

I had it documented so i fired the dad for lying to me and exposing us to that kind of risk so he turned around and sued us for wrongful termination and sexism in the workplace. He also turned us in 6 more times for the same epa violation and i had to spend another 35k in testing and legal help to prove i didnt do anything.

Tldr: to make a long story short, dont screw you employer please.

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Quote History

Quoted:

Quoted:
I wouldn't do it. I would also tell him why I wouldn't do it.

This.

Im tired of hiring fuckhead employees because people vouch for them. I have fired some pretty good employees for it in the past.

I had one that swore up and down his son was a hard worker and would do a great job as a shop guy. The dad had been a good worker for the 4 years he was with us. I hired him and he only lasted two weeks. Laziest guy ive ever seen. When i approached the dad about it he was like "oh yeah, he doesnt do anything, never has". "You cant get an ounce of work out of him".

We let him park his camper rent free in our rv park. Had to evict him to get him to leave. I looked in the trash one night and he was knocking back a case of beer every day it appeared.

His son ended up suing me for 125k for oppressing his civil rights, workplace discrimination, and wrongful termination. He also turned us into the dot and epa for violations that werent true. I beat everything but it cost my partner and i 45k in legal fees.

I had it documented so i fired the dad for lying to me and exposing us to that kind of risk so he turned around and sued us for wrongful termination and sexism in the workplace. He also turned us in 6 more times for the same epa violation and i had to spend another 35k in testing and legal help to prove i didnt do anything.

Tldr: to make a long story short, dont screw you employer please.

Didn't counter sue for slander or false accusations? I'd have made it a full time hobby to make that clowns life hell.

Posted: 1/25/2015 10:04:38 AM EDT

[#46]

Dont stick your neck out when you know its likely to be cut.

Posted: 1/25/2015 10:08:12 AM EDT

[#47]

Quote History

Quoted:

Didn't counter sue for slander or false accusations? I'd have made it a full time hobby to make that clowns life hell.

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Quote History

Quoted:

Quoted:
I wouldn't do it. I would also tell him why I wouldn't do it.

This.

Im tired of hiring fuckhead employees because people vouch for them. I have fired some pretty good employees for it in the past.

I had one that swore up and down his son was a hard worker and would do a great job as a shop guy. The dad had been a good worker for the 4 years he was with us. I hired him and he only lasted two weeks. Laziest guy ive ever seen. When i approached the dad about it he was like "oh yeah, he doesnt do anything, never has". "You cant get an ounce of work out of him".

We let him park his camper rent free in our rv park. Had to evict him to get him to leave. I looked in the trash one night and he was knocking back a case of beer every day it appeared.

His son ended up suing me for 125k for oppressing his civil rights, workplace discrimination, and wrongful termination. He also turned us into the dot and epa for violations that werent true. I beat everything but it cost my partner and i 45k in legal fees.

I had it documented so i fired the dad for lying to me and exposing us to that kind of risk so he turned around and sued us for wrongful termination and sexism in the workplace. He also turned us in 6 more times for the same epa violation and i had to spend another 35k in testing and legal help to prove i didnt do anything.

Tldr: to make a long story short, dont screw you employer please.

Didn't counter sue for slander or false accusations? I'd have made it a full time hobby to make that clowns life hell.

Why? Do you really think they have the money? LoL (the fired employee that is)

Posted: 1/25/2015 10:08:43 AM EDT

[#48]

When I clicked this I was thinking you were the employer.

If that was the case then I would say give him one try, but don't feel bad about firing him at the first fuck up.

If it is your employer working hiring off your recommendation though I would say pass. Either that or tell the boss exactly what you just put in the OP. If they choose to hire him after that it is their problem.

I would never tell someone to recommend a person for a position if they thought for a second that person couldn't perform.