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Posted: 7/29/2014 7:39:45 PM EDT
Don't know why I'm asking in GD but I'm in the mood for some entertainment and it'll get the most exposure, so....
I'm in the market for a high end optic for my "go to" general purpose rifle. It gets dragged around with me hunting and hiking and generally gets beat to shit so it needs to be essentially "bulletproof." I was in the Block II scene for a while and have had my eye on the Elcan for a while up until the VCOG came around. I've owned and used ACOGs for a while now and have loved their general simplicity and ruggedness, so the VCOG seems pretty appealing. I also like the fact it can be had with a calibrated reticle for 77gr ammo. So what should I do oh wise one's of General Discussion? I briefly looked at a S&B Short Dot 1-4x but the Elcan and VCOG seem like they'll be more rugged. I really dont like the ARMs mounts on the Elcan but they can be upgraded to the MkII levers pretty cheaply so not a deal breaker. If you feel I should go with something other than these 2, comment with your suggestions. ETA: Ordered the last FDE Elcan DSG had in stock. Can't wait to get my hands on this puppy. I figured I've wanted one for so long that I'd regret not having tried it out. Resale is good too so if I don't like it, no harm no foul. ETA2: Thanks everybody for the help! 
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Posted: 7/29/2014 7:42:29 PM EDT
[#1]
This is afrcom, the only correct answer is both.
On a serious note, I'd go with the Elcan only because it has been around longer and proven more than the VCOG, and it is the only one I have any experience with. |
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Posted: 7/29/2014 7:48:13 PM EDT
[#2]
I thought the Elcan would be a badass sight, but I've heard complaints about them. I don't remember what the issues were now besides weight (and price).
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Posted: 7/29/2014 7:49:32 PM EDT
[#3]
Elcan
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Posted: 7/29/2014 7:50:49 PM EDT
[#4]
I voted elcan. The vcog is nice w the extra magnification though.
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Posted: 7/29/2014 7:52:22 PM EDT
[#5]
I voted VCOG, because of the extra magnification and the use of an AA battery.
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Posted: 7/29/2014 7:53:05 PM EDT
[#6]
Well the VCOG is about 5 ounces heavier than the S/DR which is about five ounces heavier than a TA-11 with Dual Illuminated RMR at 15Oz/
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Posted: 7/29/2014 7:54:55 PM EDT
[#7]
VCOG.
That reminds me...need to see if LaRue's QD mount works with it.... |
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Posted: 7/29/2014 8:02:08 PM EDT
[#8]
If price is a concern, then fixed power ACOG is the solution.
Sounds like it's not, if you can swing an ELCAN. Lots of people like those, and it's a good choice, but... IMHO, the intermediate magnification range (say, from 3-6x) is FAR more useful than a 1x or 1.5x - and you can get that with a short and lightweight offset set of irons if you really need it, or else bolt a red dot to something. The real money would be a 3-6x (or even 3-8x, maybe 4-8x) compact, lightweight, and ruggedized optic. Let the low end be covered either with the ACOG "BAC" technique or get an offset dot/irons. That way you're not paying crazy money to try to smoosh two optics into one. If it were me, I'd just go fixed power right now. The 1-6 Vortex Razor HD is also really nice (but might not meet your ruggedization requirements), and its competitors with Leupold, S&B, etc. Those would probably work fine with some scope caps, but it's also understandable you'd want something pretty rugged without them, like the ACOG/ELCAN. I think you're going to have to compromise somewhere, as there is no perfect solution. |
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Posted: 7/29/2014 8:07:32 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
VCOG. That reminds me...need to see if LaRue's QD mount works with it.... From what I've read any ACOG mount should work with the VCOG. |
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Posted: 7/29/2014 8:18:22 PM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
If price is a concern, then fixed power ACOG is the solution. Sounds like it's not, if you can swing an ELCAN. Lots of people like those, and it's a good choice, but... IMHO, the intermediate magnification range (say, from 3-6x) is FAR more useful than a 1x or 1.5x - and you can get that with a short and lightweight offset set of irons if you really need it, or else bolt a red dot to something. The real money would be a 3-6x (or even 3-8x, maybe 4-8x) compact, lightweight, and ruggedized optic. Let the low end be covered either with the ACOG "BAC" technique or get an offset dot/irons. That way you're not paying crazy money to try to smoosh two optics into one. If it were me, I'd just go fixed power right now. The 1-6 Vortex Razor HD is also really nice (but might not meet your ruggedization requirements), and its competitors with Leupold, S&B, etc. Those would probably work fine with some scope caps, but it's also understandable you'd want something pretty rugged without them, like the ACOG/ELCAN. I think you're going to have to compromise somewhere, as there is no perfect solution. Yeah, price isn't too big of a concern. I can pick up the Elcan for around $1800 and the VCOG for around $2000, so relatively close in price. I also thought about going that route with a higher magnification and an offset secondary optic but for some reason it doesn't appeal to me. (I don't like the chin weld with a piggybacked MRDS on an ACOG and a 45 degree offset RDS lacks the ability for ambidextrous use.) I was a little bit skeptical of the usefulness of a tube type optic with a 1x setting for close in work, so I tried a Burris MTAC 1-4x which currently sits on the rifle my new optic will be going on. I am absolutely sold on it. I can acquire targets faster with it than with a straight 4x TA31F using BAC, and it's damn near as fast as an RDS for me. My only complaint about the MTAC was the relatively tight eye box which I've heard is the opposite case on the Elcan. Guess now that I think about it I haven't heard much about the eye box on the VCOG. Definitely something I'll have to look into. |
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Posted: 7/29/2014 8:21:06 PM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
If price is a concern, then fixed power ACOG is the solution. Sounds like it's not, if you can swing an ELCAN. Lots of people like those, and it's a good choice, but... IMHO, the intermediate magnification range (say, from 3-6x) is FAR more useful than a 1x or 1.5x - and you can get that with a short and lightweight offset set of irons if you really need it, or else bolt a red dot to something. The real money would be a 3-6x (or even 3-8x, maybe 4-8x) compact, lightweight, and ruggedized optic. Let the low end be covered either with the ACOG "BAC" technique or get an offset dot/irons. That way you're not paying crazy money to try to smoosh two optics into one. If it were me, I'd just go fixed power right now. The 1-6 Vortex Razor HD is also really nice (but might not meet your ruggedization requirements), and its competitors with Leupold, S&B, etc. Those would probably work fine with some scope caps, but it's also understandable you'd want something pretty rugged without them, like the ACOG/ELCAN. I think you're going to have to compromise somewhere, as there is no perfect solution. Yep. It's criminal that Trijicon made the V-COG have a battery powered reticle. Maybe they had their eyes on export sales? |
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Posted: 7/29/2014 8:22:18 PM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I voted VCOG, because of the extra magnification and the use of an AA battery. The extra magnification is nice but not a necessity for me. Any shot I will be taking with this thing can be accomplished with 4x for the most part although 6x would be nice for getting PID if needed. Usage of the AA battery is a definite plus. |
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Posted: 7/29/2014 8:26:56 PM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
If price is a concern, then fixed power ACOG is the solution. Sounds like it's not, if you can swing an ELCAN. Lots of people like those, and it's a good choice, but... IMHO, the intermediate magnification range (say, from 3-6x) is FAR more useful than a 1x or 1.5x - and you can get that with a short and lightweight offset set of irons if you really need it, or else bolt a red dot to something. The real money would be a 3-6x (or even 3-8x, maybe 4-8x) compact, lightweight, and ruggedized optic. Let the low end be covered either with the ACOG "BAC" technique or get an offset dot/irons. That way you're not paying crazy money to try to smoosh two optics into one. If it were me, I'd just go fixed power right now. The 1-6 Vortex Razor HD is also really nice (but might not meet your ruggedization requirements), and its competitors with Leupold, S&B, etc. Those would probably work fine with some scope caps, but it's also understandable you'd want something pretty rugged without them, like the ACOG/ELCAN. Yep. It's criminal that Trijicon made the V-COG have a battery powered reticle. Maybe they had their eyes on export sales? I think you're going to have to compromise somewhere, as there is no perfect solution. Yeah, as with everything I know I'll be making compromises somewhere. These two optics definitely fit the bill for what I'm looking to achieve, just got me wonderingwith the VCOG having just been released. I think I've only seen one member on here who has actually gotten one so reviews seem to be few and far between. |
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Posted: 7/29/2014 8:31:47 PM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Yeah, as with everything I know I'll be making compromises somewhere. These two optics definitely fit the bill for what I'm looking to achieve, just got me wonderingwith the VCOG having just been released. I think I've only seen one member on here who has actually gotten one so reviews seem to be few and far between. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
If price is a concern, then fixed power ACOG is the solution. Sounds like it's not, if you can swing an ELCAN. Lots of people like those, and it's a good choice, but... IMHO, the intermediate magnification range (say, from 3-6x) is FAR more useful than a 1x or 1.5x - and you can get that with a short and lightweight offset set of irons if you really need it, or else bolt a red dot to something. The real money would be a 3-6x (or even 3-8x, maybe 4-8x) compact, lightweight, and ruggedized optic. Let the low end be covered either with the ACOG "BAC" technique or get an offset dot/irons. That way you're not paying crazy money to try to smoosh two optics into one. If it were me, I'd just go fixed power right now. The 1-6 Vortex Razor HD is also really nice (but might not meet your ruggedization requirements), and its competitors with Leupold, S&B, etc. Those would probably work fine with some scope caps, but it's also understandable you'd want something pretty rugged without them, like the ACOG/ELCAN. Yep. It's criminal that Trijicon made the V-COG have a battery powered reticle. Maybe they had their eyes on export sales? I think you're going to have to compromise somewhere, as there is no perfect solution. Yeah, as with everything I know I'll be making compromises somewhere. These two optics definitely fit the bill for what I'm looking to achieve, just got me wonderingwith the VCOG having just been released. I think I've only seen one member on here who has actually gotten one so reviews seem to be few and far between. I wouldn't want to be an early V-COG adopter..... the last time the made a variable scope people had problems with moisture getting inside their Accu-Points. I am a huge Trijicon fan, but we are talking about $2k here..... |
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Posted: 7/29/2014 8:34:32 PM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I wouldn't want to be an early V-COG adopter..... the last time the made a variable scope people had problems with moisture getting inside their Accu-Points. I am a huge Trijicon fan, but we are talking about $2k here..... Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
If price is a concern, then fixed power ACOG is the solution. Sounds like it's not, if you can swing an ELCAN. Lots of people like those, and it's a good choice, but... IMHO, the intermediate magnification range (say, from 3-6x) is FAR more useful than a 1x or 1.5x - and you can get that with a short and lightweight offset set of irons if you really need it, or else bolt a red dot to something. The real money would be a 3-6x (or even 3-8x, maybe 4-8x) compact, lightweight, and ruggedized optic. Let the low end be covered either with the ACOG "BAC" technique or get an offset dot/irons. That way you're not paying crazy money to try to smoosh two optics into one. If it were me, I'd just go fixed power right now. The 1-6 Vortex Razor HD is also really nice (but might not meet your ruggedization requirements), and its competitors with Leupold, S&B, etc. Those would probably work fine with some scope caps, but it's also understandable you'd want something pretty rugged without them, like the ACOG/ELCAN. Yep. It's criminal that Trijicon made the V-COG have a battery powered reticle. Maybe they had their eyes on export sales? I think you're going to have to compromise somewhere, as there is no perfect solution. Yeah, as with everything I know I'll be making compromises somewhere. These two optics definitely fit the bill for what I'm looking to achieve, just got me wonderingwith the VCOG having just been released. I think I've only seen one member on here who has actually gotten one so reviews seem to be few and far between. I wouldn't want to be an early V-COG adopter..... the last time the made a variable scope people had problems with moisture getting inside their Accu-Points. I am a huge Trijicon fan, but we are talking about $2k here..... Pat Rogers has a T&E model, apparently it's been doing well in EAG classes, including in at least one shoothouse class: LF.net thread |
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Posted: 7/29/2014 8:37:17 PM EDT
[#16]
Fixed power ACOG.
The Elcan is big, heavy, overly complicated and if it ever breaks will be hard to get repaired. |
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Posted: 7/29/2014 8:38:18 PM EDT
[#17]
Leupold MK6
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Posted: 7/29/2014 8:40:36 PM EDT
[#18]
VCOG doesn't have zero shift issues.
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Posted: 7/29/2014 8:45:48 PM EDT
[#19]
I'd be willing to take the gamble on the VCOG. I bet it's awesome and you'll be the first kid on the block with one.
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Posted: 7/29/2014 8:47:18 PM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I wouldn't want to be an early V-COG adopter..... the last time the made a variable scope people had problems with moisture getting inside their Accu-Points. I am a huge Trijicon fan, but we are talking about $2k here..... Accu-Points are also hunting scope, not built to the same rigors as the tactical line. I have a 1-4 Accupoint and love it though. The glass is very clear and FOV wide. |
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Posted: 7/29/2014 8:52:07 PM EDT
[#21]
Primary Arms 1-6x scope
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Posted: 7/29/2014 8:53:15 PM EDT
[#22]
I still love my TR24 as a general purpose scope. Bright illumination, no batteries and light. No BDC though so if you're going to be slinging lead over 300Y+, it's doable but tougher.
Having said that, if you still want to put 22oz+ on your rifle, there's no reason to choose the ELCAN over the VCOG, especially since their price is so close. The SpectreDR should really be priced in the $1000-$1500 range, given the competition. |
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Posted: 7/29/2014 8:55:04 PM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I still love my TR24 as a general purpose scope. Bright illumination, no batteries and light. No BDC though so if you're going to be slinging lead over 300Y+, it's doable but tougher. Having said that, if you still want to put 22oz+ on your rifle, there's no reason to choose the ELCAN over the VCOG, especially since their price is so close. The SpectreDR should really be priced in the $1000-$1500 range, given the competition. I'd agree with this. |
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Posted: 7/29/2014 9:01:16 PM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Fixed power ACOG. The Elcan is big, heavy, overly complicated and if it ever breaks will be hard to get repaired. The overcomplicated factor is one of the big detractors to the Elcan for me. The external adjustments I've read can trap moisture and in freezing conditions expand to shift zero. Not a big deal for me down here in FL but if I get orders to a northern tier base or AK it becomes an issue. ETA: While a fixed power ACOG works well even at close ranges, I've been spoiled after using a low power variable.even though it was a cheaper model. BAC does work, just in my case I feel a optic that has magnification as well as 1x is superior. I'm willing to eat the added cost as well as the slight increase in weight to gain that feature. The rifle is already relatively LW as is so it shouldn't prove to be too big of a deal. |
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Posted: 7/29/2014 9:02:18 PM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
VCOG doesn't have zero shift issues. From all the problems I've read about it seems the zero shift was fixed in the 2nd and 3rd gen models. |
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Posted: 7/29/2014 9:04:28 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Leupold MK6 What are the general thoughts on these for hard usage? Ive seen a few on .mil rifles but of course if it breaks it is easily replaced. Not so easy for an out of pocket personally owned optic. |
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Posted: 7/29/2014 9:07:04 PM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
http://goo.gl/lJQLyVVCOG. That reminds me...need to see if LaRue's QD mount works with it.... I don't like the chin weld with a piggybacked MRDS on an ACOG and a 45 degree offset RDS lacks the ability for ambidextrous use also. 
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Posted: 7/29/2014 9:13:17 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
What are the general thoughts on these for hard usage? Ive seen a few on .mil rifles but of course if it breaks it is easily replaced. Not so easy for an out of pocket personally owned optic. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Leupold MK6 What are the general thoughts on these for hard usage? Ive seen a few on .mil rifles but of course if it breaks it is easily replaced. Not so easy for an out of pocket personally owned optic. Does Leupold fix their stuff no questions asked? I'm pretty sure they do. Vortex does for sure. Broke a turret clean off of a viper and the were awesome getting it fixed for me. I would look in to the razer HDII 1-6 |
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Posted: 7/29/2014 9:18:56 PM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Does Leupold fix their stuff no questions asked? I'm pretty sure they do. Vortex does for sure. Broke a turret clean off of a viper and the were awesome getting it fixed for me. I would look in to the razer HDII 1-6 Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Leupold MK6 What are the general thoughts on these for hard usage? Ive seen a few on .mil rifles but of course if it breaks it is easily replaced. Not so easy for an out of pocket personally owned optic. Does Leupold fix their stuff no questions asked? I'm pretty sure they do. Vortex does for sure. Broke a turret clean off of a viper and the were awesome getting it fixed for me. I would look in to the razer HDII 1-6 I've just browsed a few sites looking at the Razor 1-6x. Can that scope only be had with the Jerry Miculek reticle? Doesn't seem very appealing to me. |
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Posted: 7/29/2014 9:21:49 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I don't like the chin weld with a piggybacked MRDS on an ACOG and a 45 degree offset RDS lacks the ability for ambidextrous use also. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
http://goo.gl/lJQLyVVCOG. That reminds me...need to see if LaRue's QD mount works with it.... I don't like the chin weld with a piggybacked MRDS on an ACOG and a 45 degree offset RDS lacks the ability for ambidextrous use also. Huh?  Are you just quoting random people?
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Posted: 7/29/2014 9:23:31 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Huh? Are you just quoting random people?
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
http://goo.gl/lJQLyVVCOG. That reminds me...need to see if LaRue's QD mount works with it.... I don't like the chin weld with a piggybacked MRDS on an ACOG and a 45 degree offset RDS lacks the ability for ambidextrous use also. Huh? Are you just quoting random people?
He's confusing the VCOG with the ACOG ECOS. |
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Posted: 7/29/2014 9:29:50 PM EDT
[#32]
The Elcan is supposed to have bad zero shift on 1x.
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Posted: 7/29/2014 9:39:10 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
He's confusing the VCOG with the ACOG ECOS. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
http://goo.gl/lJQLyVVCOG. That reminds me...need to see if LaRue's QD mount works with it.... I don't like the chin weld with a piggybacked MRDS on an ACOG and a 45 degree offset RDS lacks the ability for ambidextrous use also. Huh? Are you just quoting random people?
He's confusing the VCOG with the ACOG ECOS. Ahhh makes more sense now. 
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Posted: 7/29/2014 9:40:32 PM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The Elcan is supposed to have bad zero shift on 1x. Can anyone confirm or deny this? It's been mentioned a few times now but everything I've seen says this issue was fixed in the newer generations. |
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Posted: 7/29/2014 9:49:17 PM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The Elcan is supposed to have bad zero shift on 1x. But doesn't. |
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Posted: 7/29/2014 9:59:49 PM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Accu-Points are also hunting scope, not built to the same rigors as the tactical line. I have a 1-4 Accupoint and love it though. The glass is very clear and FOV wide. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
I wouldn't want to be an early V-COG adopter..... the last time the made a variable scope people had problems with moisture getting inside their Accu-Points. I am a huge Trijicon fan, but we are talking about $2k here..... Accu-Points are also hunting scope, not built to the same rigors as the tactical line. I have a 1-4 Accupoint and love it though. The glass is very clear and FOV wide. Yeah, but for the price they command there is no excuse for as many failures as have happened. It's not like they are a hell of a lot cheaper than an ACOG that doesn't have those problems. Even ACOGs (which I am totally gay for) have their problems. I saw two TA31F' RCO's this weekend that had blurry lead stadia on the right side of the view. One of my own Reflex's ate it's objective lens and had to go back. I just wouldn't want to be a beta tester on this one. When it comes to toys, and it's time to spend, I spend. But I wouldn't want to be the guinea pig on a $2000 scope that has pretty much only been handled by people that were given factory specials. Trijicon makes good glass, but they aren't immune to design and assembly problems. I'd hold off a bit. I kind of wish Browe would make an alternative being that they are half way there with their 4x32 combat scopes. |
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Posted: 7/29/2014 10:01:40 PM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The overcomplicated factor is one of the big detractors to the Elcan for me. The external adjustments I've read can trap moisture and in freezing conditions expand to shift zero. Not a big deal for me down here in FL but if I get orders to a northern tier base or AK it becomes an issue. ETA: While a fixed power ACOG works well even at close ranges, I've been spoiled after using a low power variable.even though it was a cheaper model. BAC does work, just in my case I feel a optic that has magnification as well as 1x is superior. I'm willing to eat the added cost as well as the slight increase in weight to gain that feature. The rifle is already relatively LW as is so it shouldn't prove to be too big of a deal. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Fixed power ACOG. The Elcan is big, heavy, overly complicated and if it ever breaks will be hard to get repaired. The overcomplicated factor is one of the big detractors to the Elcan for me. The external adjustments I've read can trap moisture and in freezing conditions expand to shift zero. Not a big deal for me down here in FL but if I get orders to a northern tier base or AK it becomes an issue. ETA: While a fixed power ACOG works well even at close ranges, I've been spoiled after using a low power variable.even though it was a cheaper model. BAC does work, just in my case I feel a optic that has magnification as well as 1x is superior. I'm willing to eat the added cost as well as the slight increase in weight to gain that feature. The rifle is already relatively LW as is so it shouldn't prove to be too big of a deal. It's cool your COC will let you put personally owned optics on your weapon, I understand it's a no-no for a lot of units. |
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Posted: 7/29/2014 10:03:37 PM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The Elcan is supposed to have bad zero shift on 1x. I think I remember reading about that-you can be zero'd for 1x or 6x but not both. |
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Posted: 7/29/2014 10:07:18 PM EDT
[#39]
The cons on the Elcan:
- There is a zero shift from 4x to 1x. Most people say that it doesn't matter much, as 1x is the close quarters setting anyway. When I searched a long time ago, I found numbers about it but decided it wasn't enough to make the scope a non starter for me. - It is heavy. - The rain sights on top are often broken on used units, so I don't think they stand up to all hard uses. - The ARMS mounts have been known to break quite a bit. A lot of people HATE the fact that Elcan doesn't make a unit with a different mounting solution. - If it ever breaks, shipping to Canada will be very difficult for repair purposes. All that said... I still want the SpecterDR 1-4x on my AUG. I haven't searched much into the VCOG. |
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Posted: 7/29/2014 11:22:20 PM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Yeah, but for the price they command there is no excuse for as many failures as have happened. It's not like they are a hell of a lot cheaper than an ACOG that doesn't have those problems. Even ACOGs (which I am totally gay for) have their problems. I saw two TA31F' RCO's this weekend that had blurry lead stadia on the right side of the view. One of my own Reflex's ate it's objective lens and had to go back. I just wouldn't want to be a beta tester on this one. When it comes to toys, and it's time to spend, I spend. But I wouldn't want to be the guinea pig on a $2000 scope that has pretty much only been handled by people that were given factory specials. Trijicon makes good glass, but they aren't immune to design and assembly problems. I'd hold off a bit. I kind of wish Browe would make an alternative being that they are half way there with their 4x32 combat scopes. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
I wouldn't want to be an early V-COG adopter..... the last time the made a variable scope people had problems with moisture getting inside their Accu-Points. I am a huge Trijicon fan, but we are talking about $2k here..... Accu-Points are also hunting scope, not built to the same rigors as the tactical line. I have a 1-4 Accupoint and love it though. The glass is very clear and FOV wide. Yeah, but for the price they command there is no excuse for as many failures as have happened. It's not like they are a hell of a lot cheaper than an ACOG that doesn't have those problems. Even ACOGs (which I am totally gay for) have their problems. I saw two TA31F' RCO's this weekend that had blurry lead stadia on the right side of the view. One of my own Reflex's ate it's objective lens and had to go back. I just wouldn't want to be a beta tester on this one. When it comes to toys, and it's time to spend, I spend. But I wouldn't want to be the guinea pig on a $2000 scope that has pretty much only been handled by people that were given factory specials. Trijicon makes good glass, but they aren't immune to design and assembly problems. I'd hold off a bit. I kind of wish Browe would make an alternative being that they are half way there with their 4x32 combat scopes. From what I've read about the RCO model ACOGs the stadia lines will be blurry on one side, something to do with how they're manufactured. I do agree with your reluctance to be the guinea pig though. Not so sure I want to do that myself. |
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Posted: 7/29/2014 11:24:41 PM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
It's cool your COC will let you put personally owned optics on your weapon, I understand it's a no-no for a lot of units. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Fixed power ACOG. The Elcan is big, heavy, overly complicated and if it ever breaks will be hard to get repaired. The overcomplicated factor is one of the big detractors to the Elcan for me. The external adjustments I've read can trap moisture and in freezing conditions expand to shift zero. Not a big deal for me down here in FL but if I get orders to a northern tier base or AK it becomes an issue. ETA: While a fixed power ACOG works well even at close ranges, I've been spoiled after using a low power variable.even though it was a cheaper model. BAC does work, just in my case I feel a optic that has magnification as well as 1x is superior. I'm willing to eat the added cost as well as the slight increase in weight to gain that feature. The rifle is already relatively LW as is so it shouldn't prove to be too big of a deal. It's cool your COC will let you put personally owned optics on your weapon, I understand it's a no-no for a lot of units. Hah, I wish I could use a personally owned optic on my duty rifle stateside. This is for a personal rifle that I take outdoors quite frequently, usually out in the woods hunting or hiking, not on a square range. Cold weather seems like it could prove problematic in my case. |
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Posted: 7/30/2014 7:42:22 AM EDT
[#42]
Early morning bumpski for some more opinions.
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Posted: 7/30/2014 7:44:18 AM EDT
[#43]
MK6 1-6. Like mine a lot.
 I love Trijicon stuff, but the VCOG is pricier, heavier, and I don't like the reticle as much. |
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Posted: 7/30/2014 7:50:39 AM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted: What are the general thoughts on these for hard usage? Ive seen a few on .mil rifles but of course if it breaks it is easily replaced. Not so easy for an out of pocket personally owned optic. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Leupold MK6 What are the general thoughts on these for hard usage? Ive seen a few on .mil rifles but of course if it breaks it is easily replaced. Not so easy for an out of pocket personally owned optic. Mine has seen a lot of abuse with no issues. Seems very rugged.
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Posted: 7/30/2014 8:13:42 AM EDT
[#45]
my vote is for
 sorry about the use of a crappy weapon to mount the Elcan on
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Posted: 7/30/2014 8:32:09 AM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
MK6 1-6. Like mine a lot. http://oi57.tinypic.com/2d1uwd5.jpg I love Trijicon stuff, but the VCOG is pricier, heavier, and I don't like the reticle as much. Well, I think I can add another possible choice to the list after this post and your last post. I will agree with the sentiment on the VCOG price as well. Seems a little ridiculous. |
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Posted: 7/30/2014 8:32:59 AM EDT
[#47]
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my vote is for https://fbcdn-sphotos-g-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xpa1/v/t1.0-9/1960097_10202649241166049_721860935_n.jpg?oh=4685c17a33dd07b990ffd034a3af177c&oe=54499A17&__gda__=1414665676_e08523ae21f4380763374d4b5bc2e5fc sorry about the use of a crappy weapon to mount the Elcan on Damn you! I'd kill to pick up a SCAR-H! |
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Posted: 7/30/2014 9:06:13 AM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Damn you! I'd kill to pick up a SCAR-H! Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: my vote is for https://fbcdn-sphotos-g-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xpa1/v/t1.0-9/1960097_10202649241166049_721860935_n.jpg?oh=4685c17a33dd07b990ffd034a3af177c&oe=54499A17&__gda__=1414665676_e08523ae21f4380763374d4b5bc2e5fc sorry about the use of a crappy weapon to mount the Elcan on Damn you! I'd kill to pick up a SCAR-H! |
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Posted: 7/30/2014 9:16:31 AM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Well, I think I can add another possible choice to the list after this post and your last post. The reticle is really nice. The BDC is PERFECT for M855 out of a 16in barrel.  |
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Posted: 7/30/2014 4:42:19 PM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
you have a tank, don't you get a big discount on them and the elcans? Quote HistoryQuoted:
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my vote is for https://fbcdn-sphotos-g-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xpa1/v/t1.0-9/1960097_10202649241166049_721860935_n.jpg?oh=4685c17a33dd07b990ffd034a3af177c&oe=54499A17&__gda__=1414665676_e08523ae21f4380763374d4b5bc2e5fc sorry about the use of a crappy weapon to mount the Elcan on Damn you! I'd kill to pick up a SCAR-H! Hmmm, I'm intrigued now. That $1800 price for the Elcan is a "military discounted" price from a certain vendor who does really good military discounts. I was not aware of a military discount on FN products, though. Have any details on that? |
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