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Posted: 4/19/2014 7:19:04 PM EDT
[#1]
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They mostly did under Stalin. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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When the USSR "ended" did all the people responsible for the bad policies vanish? They mostly did under Stalin. So things only went up after 1953? |
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Posted: 4/19/2014 7:19:57 PM EDT
[#2]
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Posted: 4/19/2014 7:24:20 PM EDT
[#3]
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Any Bubba with a printer under the influence of vodka could come up with something like that to discredit the other side. It was, and still is, my opinion that this whole conflagration was set ablaze by the industrial grade hubris of the ass klowns that are currently infesting Washington D.C.. Putin took advantage of the power vacuum in his own backyard. He saw that the US was going to a 1940 level military and took advantage of 0bama/US 's weakness. It is the natural order of things that a hungry dog will grab a juicy bone and for nationalist leaders to expand their country's borders at the expense of weaker neighbors. Many posters in this thread should stop upping their post count and read Sun Tzu's 'Art of War' instead to gain some insight. It isn't a far jump from seeing the US arming a drug cartel in Mexico that sews its victims' face on soccer balls & green lighting their routes into the US and running a Fast&Furious style operation in Indiana to fuel street violence in Chicago to support anti-2A legislation for me to believe that the US was arming a neo-Nazi 'Maidan' militia to cause shit in Putin's backyard to attempt to draw the US voter's attention away from the 0bamaKare rollout fiasco and assist the anti-Assad Arab Spring radical Islamists. Narcissists do not like 30% approval numbers and weak leaders in charge of a super power are incredibly dangerous if/when they irrationally strike out. Guess this makes me a Putin fan-boiz to some but their opinion is what it is. News Update: Ukraine is cutting off the water supply to Crimea. They had video of pro-Russian demonstrators in the Donestk area being loaded handcuffed and blindfolded onto Ukrainian Hind helicopters. Any Russian male aged 16 to 60 is now barred from entering Ukraine unless going to a funeral. A full 90% of the news was about the Easter celebration. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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It's almost like that there's a "third side" trying to escalate the crisis into a civil war. Originally Said By Napoleon Bonaparte
Never ascribe to malice that which is adequately explained by incompetence. It was, and still is, my opinion that this whole conflagration was set ablaze by the industrial grade hubris of the ass klowns that are currently infesting Washington D.C.. Putin took advantage of the power vacuum in his own backyard. He saw that the US was going to a 1940 level military and took advantage of 0bama/US 's weakness. It is the natural order of things that a hungry dog will grab a juicy bone and for nationalist leaders to expand their country's borders at the expense of weaker neighbors. Many posters in this thread should stop upping their post count and read Sun Tzu's 'Art of War' instead to gain some insight. It isn't a far jump from seeing the US arming a drug cartel in Mexico that sews its victims' face on soccer balls & green lighting their routes into the US and running a Fast&Furious style operation in Indiana to fuel street violence in Chicago to support anti-2A legislation for me to believe that the US was arming a neo-Nazi 'Maidan' militia to cause shit in Putin's backyard to attempt to draw the US voter's attention away from the 0bamaKare rollout fiasco and assist the anti-Assad Arab Spring radical Islamists. Narcissists do not like 30% approval numbers and weak leaders in charge of a super power are incredibly dangerous if/when they irrationally strike out. Guess this makes me a Putin fan-boiz to some but their opinion is what it is. News Update: Ukraine is cutting off the water supply to Crimea. They had video of pro-Russian demonstrators in the Donestk area being loaded handcuffed and blindfolded onto Ukrainian Hind helicopters. Any Russian male aged 16 to 60 is now barred from entering Ukraine unless going to a funeral. A full 90% of the news was about the Easter celebration. Agree. The level of incompetence and corruption in DC has never been so high. I also do not believe (much) in coincidences. Mostly when dealing with international politics. A drunkard would have printed those pamphlets? Perfectly possible. However, we also know that the new Ukrainian "government" allied with radical extremists in order to achieve its goals. The current US administration was involved. That NPR's article mentioned Kerry "making more noise than anyone else" about those pamphlets than local Jewish Ukrainians weren't paying much attention to, if at all. Napoleon is right, but there are too many "coincidences" there. I agree with you. |
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Posted: 4/19/2014 7:25:00 PM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
They mostly did under Stalin. Quote HistoryQuoted:
[b]Quoted:[/
When the USSR "ended" did all the people responsible for the bad policies vanish? They mostly did under Stalin. The USSR ended with Stalin? Who knew? |
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Posted: 4/19/2014 7:25:29 PM EDT
[#5]
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Stalin is a reformer? Really? Quote HistoryQuoted:
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When the USSR "ended" did all the people responsible for the bad policies vanish? They mostly did under Stalin. Stalin is a reformer? Really? If you do not mind, what's your definition of "reformer"? |
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Posted: 4/19/2014 7:27:26 PM EDT
[#6]
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What does this have to do with the illegal annexation of the Crimea and the current blatantly Russian subsidized and prompted separatist movements in Eastern Ukraine? What was that about propagandists and diversion, again? Quote HistoryQuoted:
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No, I'm saying Soviet registration ended with the end of the USSR. So, rephrasing the question. Are Jewish still being registered or persecuted? That article I posted has testimonies about this topic. Do you have any against it? What does this have to do with the illegal annexation of the Crimea and the current blatantly Russian subsidized and prompted separatist movements in Eastern Ukraine? What was that about propagandists and diversion, again? 
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Posted: 4/19/2014 7:47:23 PM EDT
[#7]
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The USSR ended with Stalin? Who knew? Quote HistoryQuoted:
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When the USSR "ended" did all the people responsible for the bad policies vanish? They mostly did under Stalin. The USSR ended with Stalin? Who knew? No you said the people responsible for the bad policies of the USSR not the country itself. The bulk of them (not quite all) vanished under Stalin as he purged the other party members long before the country itself vanished. |
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Posted: 4/19/2014 8:53:20 PM EDT
[#8]
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It appear subtleness does not work with you. So, are you are aware of George Orwell and his book 1984 and how the State needs an "enemy" even if completely fabricated in order to divert its subjects' attention to other issues? Interestingly the point of contention between several of us. USSR was the enemy and it crumbled. Terrorism, 9/11 and Al Qaeda presented the opportunity for the "replacement" enemy. Now, since its not the interest of the turd and his administration to keep chasing his brethren he needs someone else. Guess who is the next in line? The Chinese do not seem willing to "cooperate" as much as Putin does. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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I understand the fact they can be dangerous, but their instability limits their opportunity/ability to act out. I juat can't stand the abject fear people have for the PRC. I'm with you there. You should always be watching them and keeping them in check, but let's not act like they're about to take over the whole world as if their country doesn't have problems to address. They can be a threat, but they're not suddenly better than everyone else and could easily take over the Pacific if they wanted to. A threat we should watch? Absolutely. Something that needs to be brought up every day as if we're counting down the doomsday clock? I don't think so. Russia is still a bigger fear than China is at this point but people have moved on from the Russian nightmares and moved on to the next mysterious nation that's growing...Fear of the unknown. It seems to boil down to what George Orwell wrote about in "1984". USSR was the "great enemy" until it crumbled. Then came the "war on terror". Now someone wants to fabricate another one and the lemmings will follow. Yeah, it's all a complete fabrication. My Russians din't to nuthin! It appear subtleness does not work with you. So, are you are aware of George Orwell and his book 1984 and how the State needs an "enemy" even if completely fabricated in order to divert its subjects' attention to other issues? Interestingly the point of contention between several of us. USSR was the enemy and it crumbled. Terrorism, 9/11 and Al Qaeda presented the opportunity for the "replacement" enemy. Now, since its not the interest of the turd and his administration to keep chasing his brethren he needs someone else. Guess who is the next in line? The Chinese do not seem willing to "cooperate" as much as Putin does. So, are you aware that George Orwell was a writer of fiction stories, right? He was also a socialist. |
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Posted: 4/19/2014 8:58:25 PM EDT
[#9]
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Stalin? Really? Jewish and how many others he slaughtered? Remember I mentioned post the 60/70s. After Stalin. That sick pervert would kill his own mother. 
Quote HistoryQuoted:
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http://www.berdichev.org/fotosjewsinrussianempire/image-094.gif http://www.berdichev.org/fotosjewsinrussianempire/image-100.jpg http://www.berdichev.org/fotosjewsinrussianempire/image-095.gif http://www.berdichev.org/fotosjewsinrussianempire/image-101.jpg http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC139050/ For Stalin, whose deeds easily matched those of Hitler and whose deceits had been evident throughout his life, the Doctors' Plot and intended show trial were meant to cleanse the Soviet Union of “foreign,” “cosmopolitan,” and “Zionist” (read Jewish) elements. In fact, it was the only one of Stalin's show trials that did not come off—only because he died just before the spectacle was to begin. ... The show trial was meant to initiate a carefully constructed plan in which almost all of the Soviet Union's two million Jews, nearly all of whom were survivors of the Holocaust, were to be transported to the Gulag—in cattle cars. ... Stalin had long manifested his hatred not only of Jews but, by extension, of Jewish nationalism (Zionism). Though using somewhat derivative terminology, his slander of both was expressed in the same spirit as the omnipresent anti-Semitism of the Tsarist period in which Stalin grew up. At that time the notorious Tsarist police forgery The Protocols of the Elders of Zion was widely circulated in Russia and beyond ... But Stalin's special hatred was reserved for Jewish doctors. Although in the last decades of Tsarist rule Jews were restricted from owning land and excluded from most other professions, they had indeed entered medicine in numbers far out of proportion to their small percentage in the overall population.6 So when Stalin decided to resolve the Soviet Union's “Jewish problem,” it made perfect sense to open the campaign with a show trial against a group of (mainly Jewish) doctors who were often branded “Zionists” or agents of the “Joint” (an international Jewish charitable organisation). ... A propaganda offensive accompanied the plans to deport—“for their own good”—the Jewish population. One million copies of a pamphlet were prepared for distribution—its title: “Why Jews Must Be Resettled from the Industrial Regions of the Country.” The deportation was purportedly “in response” to a carefully orchestrated letter prepared for Pravda and signed by many terrified Soviet Jewish leaders, imploring “The Father of all the Peoples” to deport the Jews for their own protection. It appealed to “the government of the USSR, and to Comrade Stalin personally, to save the Jewish population from possible violence in the wake of the revelations about the doctor-poisoners . . . of Jewish origin . . . We, as leading figures among loyal Soviet Jewry, totally reject American and Zionist propaganda claiming that there is anti-Semitism in the Soviet Union.” Stalin? Really? Jewish and how many others he slaughtered? Remember I mentioned post the 60/70s. After Stalin. That sick pervert would kill his own mother.
Stalin died in 1953. And the anti-jew shit continued until the USSR collapsed. I guess you didn't look up refusenik. |
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Posted: 4/19/2014 9:22:37 PM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
No you said the people responsible for the bad policies of the USSR not the country itself. The bulk of them (not quite all) vanished under Stalin as he purged the other party members long before the country itself vanished. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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When the USSR "ended" did all the people responsible for the bad policies vanish? They mostly did under Stalin. The USSR ended with Stalin? Who knew? No you said the people responsible for the bad policies of the USSR not the country itself. The bulk of them (not quite all) vanished under Stalin as he purged the other party members long before the country itself vanished. Bullshit. |
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Posted: 4/19/2014 10:29:27 PM EDT
[#11]
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No you said the people responsible for the bad policies of the USSR not the country itself. The bulk of them (not quite all) vanished under Stalin as he purged the other party members long before the country itself vanished. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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[b]Quoted:[/
When the USSR "ended" did all the people responsible for the bad policies vanish? They mostly did under Stalin. The USSR ended with Stalin? Who knew? No you said the people responsible for the bad policies of the USSR not the country itself. The bulk of them (not quite all) vanished under Stalin as he purged the other party members long before the country itself vanished. wow... You just make stuff up, huh?
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Posted: 4/19/2014 10:33:04 PM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
They mostly did under Stalin. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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When the USSR "ended" did all the people responsible for the bad policies vanish? They mostly did under Stalin. Wut? |
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Posted: 4/19/2014 10:36:20 PM EDT
[#13]
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Wut? Quote HistoryQuoted:
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When the USSR "ended" did all the people responsible for the bad policies vanish? They mostly did under Stalin. Wut? The West covered up the fact that after Stalin, the USSR was run by bros that just wanted to chill. Was more like a Polit-bro running the Rodina....or should I say Bro-dina. |
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Posted: 4/19/2014 10:38:42 PM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The West covered up the fact that after Stalin, the USSR was run by bros that just wanted to chill. Was more like a Polit-bro running the Rodina....or should I say Bro-dina. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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[b]Quoted:[/
When the USSR "ended" did all the people responsible for the bad policies vanish? They mostly did under Stalin. Wut? The West covered up the fact that after Stalin, the USSR was run by bros that just wanted to chill. Was more like a Polit-bro running the Rodina....or should I say Bro-dina. Guess being in West Germany was just a paid vacation, after all. 
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Posted: 4/19/2014 11:30:42 PM EDT
[#15]
Now for ever-forward marching glorious people's news!
Ukraine may hold presidential elections under state of emergency ...“From the legislative point of view, the results of the elections are determined irrespective of the number of polling stations or the number of electoral constituencies whether the elections were conducted,” he said. Magera stressed, however, that the upcoming voting “is very important because its outcome will eliminate all claims about the legitimacy of the Ukrainian authorities”... Gospodin Magera, care to place a bet on that? |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 12:40:33 AM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Stalin died in 1953. And the anti-jew shit continued until the USSR collapsed. I guess you didn't look up refusenik. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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http://www.berdichev.org/fotosjewsinrussianempire/image-094.gif http://www.berdichev.org/fotosjewsinrussianempire/image-100.jpg http://www.berdichev.org/fotosjewsinrussianempire/image-095.gif http://www.berdichev.org/fotosjewsinrussianempire/image-101.jpg http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC139050/ For Stalin, whose deeds easily matched those of Hitler and whose deceits had been evident throughout his life, the Doctors' Plot and intended show trial were meant to cleanse the Soviet Union of “foreign,” “cosmopolitan,” and “Zionist” (read Jewish) elements. In fact, it was the only one of Stalin's show trials that did not come off—only because he died just before the spectacle was to begin. ... The show trial was meant to initiate a carefully constructed plan in which almost all of the Soviet Union's two million Jews, nearly all of whom were survivors of the Holocaust, were to be transported to the Gulag—in cattle cars. ... Stalin had long manifested his hatred not only of Jews but, by extension, of Jewish nationalism (Zionism). Though using somewhat derivative terminology, his slander of both was expressed in the same spirit as the omnipresent anti-Semitism of the Tsarist period in which Stalin grew up. At that time the notorious Tsarist police forgery The Protocols of the Elders of Zion was widely circulated in Russia and beyond ... But Stalin's special hatred was reserved for Jewish doctors. Although in the last decades of Tsarist rule Jews were restricted from owning land and excluded from most other professions, they had indeed entered medicine in numbers far out of proportion to their small percentage in the overall population.6 So when Stalin decided to resolve the Soviet Union's “Jewish problem,” it made perfect sense to open the campaign with a show trial against a group of (mainly Jewish) doctors who were often branded “Zionists” or agents of the “Joint” (an international Jewish charitable organisation). ... A propaganda offensive accompanied the plans to deport—“for their own good”—the Jewish population. One million copies of a pamphlet were prepared for distribution—its title: “Why Jews Must Be Resettled from the Industrial Regions of the Country.” The deportation was purportedly “in response” to a carefully orchestrated letter prepared for Pravda and signed by many terrified Soviet Jewish leaders, imploring “The Father of all the Peoples” to deport the Jews for their own protection. It appealed to “the government of the USSR, and to Comrade Stalin personally, to save the Jewish population from possible violence in the wake of the revelations about the doctor-poisoners . . . of Jewish origin . . . We, as leading figures among loyal Soviet Jewry, totally reject American and Zionist propaganda claiming that there is anti-Semitism in the Soviet Union.” Stalin? Really? Jewish and how many others he slaughtered? Remember I mentioned post the 60/70s. After Stalin. That sick pervert would kill his own mother.
Stalin died in 1953. And the anti-jew shit continued until the USSR collapsed. I guess you didn't look up refusenik. I guess you haven't read my original post about this topic. By the way, thanks for helping my point. Again. 
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Posted: 4/20/2014 12:48:11 AM EDT
[#17]
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Now for ever-forward marching glorious people's news! Ukraine may hold presidential elections under state of emergency Gospodin Magera, care to place a bet on that? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Now for ever-forward marching glorious people's news! Ukraine may hold presidential elections under state of emergency ...“From the legislative point of view, the results of the elections are determined irrespective of the number of polling stations or the number of electoral constituencies whether the elections were conducted,” he said. Magera stressed, however, that the upcoming voting “is very important because its outcome will eliminate all claims about the legitimacy of the Ukrainian authorities”... Gospodin Magera, care to place a bet on that? Are they hiring the US democrats register voters and to count votes for them? Bets are the Ukrainian population will have a spike. By the way, from that article. CEC Chair Mikhail Okhendovsky stated the same position in early April. “It seems to me that there are no reasons to speak about a possible disruption of the elections except for two barely feasible possibilities - introduction of a state of emergency or a state of war,” he said, adding, “As for a state of emergency, I think our politicians will have enough wisdom not to take such a step during the electoral process.” So, are they not counting much on Putin's "invasion" or this guy is Baghdad Bob's cousin?
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Posted: 4/20/2014 4:51:10 AM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I guess you haven't read my original post about this topic. By the way, thanks for helping my point. Again.
Quote HistoryQuoted:
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http://www.berdichev.org/fotosjewsinrussianempire/image-094.gif http://www.berdichev.org/fotosjewsinrussianempire/image-100.jpg http://www.berdichev.org/fotosjewsinrussianempire/image-095.gif http://www.berdichev.org/fotosjewsinrussianempire/image-101.jpg http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC139050/ For Stalin, whose deeds easily matched those of Hitler and whose deceits had been evident throughout his life, the Doctors' Plot and intended show trial were meant to cleanse the Soviet Union of “foreign,” “cosmopolitan,” and “Zionist” (read Jewish) elements. In fact, it was the only one of Stalin's show trials that did not come off—only because he died just before the spectacle was to begin. ... The show trial was meant to initiate a carefully constructed plan in which almost all of the Soviet Union's two million Jews, nearly all of whom were survivors of the Holocaust, were to be transported to the Gulag—in cattle cars. ... Stalin had long manifested his hatred not only of Jews but, by extension, of Jewish nationalism (Zionism). Though using somewhat derivative terminology, his slander of both was expressed in the same spirit as the omnipresent anti-Semitism of the Tsarist period in which Stalin grew up. At that time the notorious Tsarist police forgery The Protocols of the Elders of Zion was widely circulated in Russia and beyond ... But Stalin's special hatred was reserved for Jewish doctors. Although in the last decades of Tsarist rule Jews were restricted from owning land and excluded from most other professions, they had indeed entered medicine in numbers far out of proportion to their small percentage in the overall population.6 So when Stalin decided to resolve the Soviet Union's “Jewish problem,” it made perfect sense to open the campaign with a show trial against a group of (mainly Jewish) doctors who were often branded “Zionists” or agents of the “Joint” (an international Jewish charitable organisation). ... A propaganda offensive accompanied the plans to deport—“for their own good”—the Jewish population. One million copies of a pamphlet were prepared for distribution—its title: “Why Jews Must Be Resettled from the Industrial Regions of the Country.” The deportation was purportedly “in response” to a carefully orchestrated letter prepared for Pravda and signed by many terrified Soviet Jewish leaders, imploring “The Father of all the Peoples” to deport the Jews for their own protection. It appealed to “the government of the USSR, and to Comrade Stalin personally, to save the Jewish population from possible violence in the wake of the revelations about the doctor-poisoners . . . of Jewish origin . . . We, as leading figures among loyal Soviet Jewry, totally reject American and Zionist propaganda claiming that there is anti-Semitism in the Soviet Union.” Stalin? Really? Jewish and how many others he slaughtered? Remember I mentioned post the 60/70s. After Stalin. That sick pervert would kill his own mother.
Stalin died in 1953. And the anti-jew shit continued until the USSR collapsed. I guess you didn't look up refusenik. I guess you haven't read my original post about this topic. By the way, thanks for helping my point. Again.
WTF? You have been denying there was any jewish persecution under first Russia and then after Stalin died. I didn't prove your bullshit point in any way. I proved your lies to be lies. Do they supply you agitators with drugs as well? You're becoming a caricature of a useful idiot. |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 11:06:15 AM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
WTF? You have been denying there was any jewish persecution under first Russia and then after Stalin died. I didn't prove your bullshit point in any way. I proved your lies to be lies. Do they supply you agitators with drugs as well? You're becoming a caricature of a useful idiot. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Stalin? Really? Jewish and how many others he slaughtered? Remember I mentioned post the 60/70s. After Stalin. That sick pervert would kill his own mother.
Stalin died in 1953. And the anti-jew shit continued until the USSR collapsed. I guess you didn't look up refusenik. I guess you haven't read my original post about this topic. By the way, thanks for helping my point. Again.
WTF? You have been denying there was any jewish persecution under first Russia and then after Stalin died. I didn't prove your bullshit point in any way. I proved your lies to be lies. Do they supply you agitators with drugs as well? You're becoming a caricature of a useful idiot. Are you really serious? My initial post on this topic was about Ukraine and those stupid pamphlets. Local Jewish Ukrainians denying any persecutions and actually surprised the western media was making so much noise about it and your hero Kerry leading the troupe with the most noise. (quite interesting by the way) Of course, you ignored. You and others came with Stalin and USSR-time stuff as examples, which I did not deny, but had a few comments. Stalin was not a good example, since he would kill anything he suspected or would further his agenda. The USSR so-called persecution about not letting them emigrate wasn't also a very strong one since they did not want anyone leaving. How many died trying to defect that place? Is it a big surprise they would also hold the Jewish, even though they voted for the creation of Israel? I even recall one of your troupe asking what it had to do with Crimea's invasion and Russia's attempt to take eastern Ukraine. So, suddenly it was no longer related to Ukraine?. You guys have been behaving like Baghdad Bob at its best. Are you guys serious or just having fun? |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 1:06:41 PM EDT
[#20]
Can we PLEASE use this thread for updates on what is a pretty fucking serious situation and keep the fucking sideshows to a minimum? Is that too much to ask for? When this thing first started this thread was a tremendous resource for updates. But as time went on, every visit meant wading through more and more bullshit posted by the same two or three guys to finds bits and pieces of good info that was sandwiched between the stacks of shit. In other words, a handful of you have RUINED an otherwise good thread with your own fucked-up political ramblings and insistence on posting nonsense for no other purpose other than to start arguments. If you guys (and you know who you are) wish to start your own thread glorifying Mother Russia and to slurp Putin's juices, then by all means go ahead. But leave that shit out of this thread. This is primarily an American site with America loving members. You aren't going to convince very many people here to oppose the interests of our own country and give that support to Russia. You know that. So that means you're just trolling and baiting in a purposeful attempt to derail the thread. And your schtick is wearing damn thin.
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Posted: 4/20/2014 1:26:35 PM EDT
[#21]
OK, here's a fresh news story to get this thread back on track.
Ukraine unrest: Russian outrage at fatal Sloviansk shooting The Russians are claiming one thing, the Ukrainians something else. Regardless, I'm not going to attempt to analyze this. I think most of us are capable of taking the info provided and forming our own opinions. But one thing is for sure, this incident could be a catalyst for even more Russian incursions and violence. |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 1:29:48 PM EDT
[#22]
I got caught up on the Vice News series last night.
Updates 22-27. There was a recurring theme of heavy drinking among the occupying protestors in the eastern cities.  
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Posted: 4/20/2014 1:30:12 PM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Can we PLEASE use this thread for updates on what is a pretty fucking serious situation and keep the fucking sideshows to a minimum? Is that too much to ask for? When this thing first started this thread was a tremendous resource for updates. But as time went on, every visit meant wading through more and more bullshit posted by the same two or three guys to finds bits and pieces of good info that was sandwiched between the stacks of shit. In other words, a handful of you have RUINED an otherwise good thread with your own fucked-up political ramblings and insistence on posting nonsense for no other purpose other than to start arguments. If you guys (and you know who you are) wish to start your own thread glorifying Mother Russia and to slurp Putin's juices, then by all means go ahead. But leave that shit out of this thread. This is primarily an American site with America loving members. You aren't going to convince very many people here to oppose the interests of our own country and give that support to Russia. You know that. So that means you're just trolling and baiting in a purposeful attempt to derail the thread. And your schtick is wearing damn thin. This thread is pretty much irreparably fucked, and we may as well just start a new one once this conflict enters the next stage. Odds are that one will be ruined as well. Blood is thicker than water, and obviously some folks here will entertain all sorts of mental gymnastics in defense of their Russian brethren. Unfortunately russophiles are sort of like women in that whenever they get pissy they drag up all sorts of completely irrelevant shit from the past to argue about. |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 4:48:32 PM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Can we PLEASE use this thread for updates on what is a pretty fucking serious situation and keep the fucking sideshows to a minimum? Is that too much to ask for? When this thing first started this thread was a tremendous resource for updates. But as time went on, every visit meant wading through more and more bullshit posted by the same two or three guys to finds bits and pieces of good info that was sandwiched between the stacks of shit. In other words, a handful of you have RUINED an otherwise good thread with your own fucked-up political ramblings and insistence on posting nonsense for no other purpose other than to start arguments. If you guys (and you know who you are) wish to start your own thread glorifying Mother Russia and to slurp Putin's juices, then by all means go ahead. But leave that shit out of this thread. This is primarily an American site with America loving members. You aren't going to convince very many people here to oppose the interests of our own country and give that support to Russia. You know that. So that means you're just trolling and baiting in a purposeful attempt to derail the thread. And your schtick is wearing damn thin. Not everyone shares your intrests or opinion on these subject matters, it's what a disscussion is for. I can understand you wanting this thread to cater to updates and keep on topic but you soil your own logic and cede the high ground by making homosexual accusations and petty shots at other posters. |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 5:29:02 PM EDT
[#25]
http://finance.yahoo.com/news/ukrainian-pm-t-stop-russia-184800479.html
“In the last four years, the former president, together with the Russian supporters…dismantled Ukrainian military and security forces,” Yatsenyuk said. “We need to be in a very good shape in order to stop Russia. And for this shape we need to get real support from our western partners.”
Despite multiple attempts by Gregory to do so, Yatsenyuk refused to be led into asking specifically for weaponry – the sort of aid that would be freighted with far more political significance than the non-lethal support that has been provided so far. However, it was hard to read Yatsenyuk’s request as not including modern weapons. “We need a strong and solid state. We need financial and economic support. We need to overhaul the Ukrainian military,” he repeated. “We need to modernize our security and military forces. We need real support.” |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 5:37:53 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
...This is primarily an American site with America loving members. You aren't going to convince very many people here to oppose the interests of our own country and give that support to Russia. You know that. So that means you're just trolling and baiting in a purposeful attempt to derail the thread. And your schtick is wearing damn thin. Quote HistoryQuoted:
...This is primarily an American site with America loving members. You aren't going to convince very many people here to oppose the interests of our own country and give that support to Russia. You know that. So that means you're just trolling and baiting in a purposeful attempt to derail the thread. And your schtick is wearing damn thin. Ukraine is not an American interest. American interests get American military deployments, permanent or otherwise. Ukraine gets neither. And I can't imagine the level of stupidity this thread would rise to if it became an echo chamber for some of our members who learned all they need to know about Russia from watching Red Dawn, and probably only had the haziest idea where or what Ukraine was before all this hubbub. Maybe if the people who just run through the thread and reply with personal attacks to every post of certain other posters would stop, things would clear up some? Not glorious, nor people's, but it is news: Practice for a Russian Invasion: Ukrainian Civilians Take Up Arms ...Their unit is called the group of "Three Hundreds," and it is comprised of dozens of civilian defense leagues that were formed during the insurgency on the Maidan, Kiev's Independence Square. Their ideal is that of the national partisan and they have organized in order to defend the Ukrainian state... Insurgency, eh? ...In terms of their numbers, right-wing groups were only a minority during the Maidan protests, but they formed the backbone of the revolt against the Yanukovych government. When initially peaceful protests turned violent, it was right-wing groups who defended the barricades, threw Molotov cocktails and carried firearms... ...The Right Sector, one of the most important groups on the Maidan, is among the latter. At its core are followers who are clearly right-wing extremists, but it has also since become a rallying point for the discontented... Tsk tsk. Ze Germans need to spend more time in this thread, where they would learn that the Right Sector was nothing but a fringe group, and contributed nothing to the peaceful overthrow of the government. And were actually controlled by the FSB. Neat article. Ukraine is going to be the gift that keeps on giving on many slow news days to come, I bet. |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 5:46:39 PM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Ukraine is not an American interest. American interests get American military deployments, permanent or otherwise. Ukraine gets neither. And I can't imagine the level of stupidity this thread would rise to if it became an echo chamber for some of our members who learned all they need to know about Russia from watching Red Dawn, and probably only had the haziest idea where or what Ukraine was before all this hubbub. Maybe if the people who just run through the thread and reply with personal attacks to every post of certain other posters would stop, things would clear up some? Not glorious, nor people's, but it is news: Practice for a Russian Invasion: Ukrainian Civilians Take Up Arms Insurgency, eh? Tsk tsk. Ze Germans need to spend more time in this thread, where they would learn that the Right Sector was nothing but a fringe group, and contributed nothing to the peaceful overthrow of the government. And were actually controlled by the FSB. Neat article. Ukraine is going to be the gift that keeps on giving on many slow news days to come, I bet. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
...This is primarily an American site with America loving members. You aren't going to convince very many people here to oppose the interests of our own country and give that support to Russia. You know that. So that means you're just trolling and baiting in a purposeful attempt to derail the thread. And your schtick is wearing damn thin. Ukraine is not an American interest. American interests get American military deployments, permanent or otherwise. Ukraine gets neither. And I can't imagine the level of stupidity this thread would rise to if it became an echo chamber for some of our members who learned all they need to know about Russia from watching Red Dawn, and probably only had the haziest idea where or what Ukraine was before all this hubbub. Maybe if the people who just run through the thread and reply with personal attacks to every post of certain other posters would stop, things would clear up some? Not glorious, nor people's, but it is news: Practice for a Russian Invasion: Ukrainian Civilians Take Up Arms ...Their unit is called the group of "Three Hundreds," and it is comprised of dozens of civilian defense leagues that were formed during the insurgency on the Maidan, Kiev's Independence Square. Their ideal is that of the national partisan and they have organized in order to defend the Ukrainian state... Insurgency, eh? ...In terms of their numbers, right-wing groups were only a minority during the Maidan protests, but they formed the backbone of the revolt against the Yanukovych government. When initially peaceful protests turned violent, it was right-wing groups who defended the barricades, threw Molotov cocktails and carried firearms... ...The Right Sector, one of the most important groups on the Maidan, is among the latter. At its core are followers who are clearly right-wing extremists, but it has also since become a rallying point for the discontented... Tsk tsk. Ze Germans need to spend more time in this thread, where they would learn that the Right Sector was nothing but a fringe group, and contributed nothing to the peaceful overthrow of the government. And were actually controlled by the FSB. Neat article. Ukraine is going to be the gift that keeps on giving on many slow news days to come, I bet. Maybe if people weren't parroting Russian propaganda verbatim, they wouldn't get attacked. People can disagree over whether assisting Ukraine is in America's interests; it another thing entirely to be intentionally playing into Russia's narrative on the Ukraine invasion and toeing Moscow's line on the matter; that is going to generate the responses/attacks you are seeing, not disagreements over US interests. |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 5:56:54 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Not everyone shares your intrests or opinion on these subject matters, it's what a disscussion is for. I can understand you wanting this thread to cater to updates and keep on topic but you soil your own logic and cede the high ground by making homosexual accusations and petty shots at other posters. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Can we PLEASE use this thread for updates on what is a pretty fucking serious situation and keep the fucking sideshows to a minimum? Is that too much to ask for? When this thing first started this thread was a tremendous resource for updates. But as time went on, every visit meant wading through more and more bullshit posted by the same two or three guys to finds bits and pieces of good info that was sandwiched between the stacks of shit. In other words, a handful of you have RUINED an otherwise good thread with your own fucked-up political ramblings and insistence on posting nonsense for no other purpose other than to start arguments. If you guys (and you know who you are) wish to start your own thread glorifying Mother Russia and to slurp Putin's juices, then by all means go ahead. But leave that shit out of this thread. This is primarily an American site with America loving members. You aren't going to convince very many people here to oppose the interests of our own country and give that support to Russia. You know that. So that means you're just trolling and baiting in a purposeful attempt to derail the thread. And your schtick is wearing damn thin. Not everyone shares your intrests or opinion on these subject matters, it's what a disscussion is for. I can understand you wanting this thread to cater to updates and keep on topic but you soil your own logic and cede the high ground by making homosexual accusations and petty shots at other posters. Then why not start your own thread? Go ahead. Create your topic. Set the tone of the thread and discuss whatever you want to your heart's content. Take a pro-Russian stance. Take an anti-Russian stance. I don't care. And I promise you'll be free of any comments from me because I'll stay out of that thread like I wish you would stay out of this one. That said, I know you won't take the high road and do that because this isn't about a real discussion. You are simply a troll and trolls seek attention. That is why you are here. You could easily start your own thread where you, Rossi and maybe even Tomislav (though I must say in his defense that he has mellowed as this thread progressed) could rub one out to fantasies about Putin, if that is what you wish to do. But that thread would likely be a very lonely place as outside of you three, I am not seeing very many people here who share your views. And as I previously said, trolls are all about attention. So I suspect you'll remain in this thread, polluting it with your pro-Russian, anti-American bullshit until it either gets locked or people just stop contributing because they don't like wadding through rivers of garbage to find a few nuggets of useful info here and there. And I suppose that has been your goal all along, to prevent any thread that reflects badly on old Pootie Poot from continuing. Ah well, keep at it. I'm sure the Kremlin appreciates your efforts. 
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Posted: 4/20/2014 5:59:44 PM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Can we PLEASE use this thread for updates on what is a pretty fucking serious situation and keep the fucking sideshows to a minimum? Is that too much to ask for? When this thing first started this thread was a tremendous resource for updates. But as time went on, every visit meant wading through more and more bullshit posted by the same two or three guys to finds bits and pieces of good info that was sandwiched between the stacks of shit. In other words, a handful of you have RUINED an otherwise good thread with your own fucked-up political ramblings and insistence on posting nonsense for no other purpose other than to start arguments. If you guys (and you know who you are) wish to start your own thread glorifying Mother Russia and to slurp Putin's juices, then by all means go ahead. But leave that shit out of this thread. This is primarily an American site with America loving members. You aren't going to convince very many people here to oppose the interests of our own country and give that support to Russia. You know that. So that means you're just trolling and baiting in a purposeful attempt to derail the thread. And your schtick is wearing damn thin. This a arfcom "like" 
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Posted: 4/20/2014 6:09:27 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Then why not start your own thread? Go ahead. Create your topic. Set the tone of the thread and discuss whatever you want to your heart's content. Take a pro-Russian stance. Take an anti-Russian stance. I don't care. And I promise you'll be free of any comments from me because I'll stay out of that thread like I wish you would stay out of this one. That said, I know you won't take the high road and do that because this isn't about a real discussion. You are simply a troll and trolls seek attention. That is why you are here. You could easily start your own thread where you, Rossi and maybe even Tomislav (though I must say in his defense that he has mellowed as this thread progressed) could rub one out to fantasies about Putin, if that is what you wish to do. But that thread would likely be a very lonely place as outside of you three, I am not seeing very many people here who share your views. And as I previously said, trolls are all about attention. So I suspect you'll remain in this thread, polluting it with your pro-Russian, anti-American bullshit until it either gets locked or people just stop contributing because they don't like wadding through rivers of garbage to find a few nuggets of useful info here and there. And I suppose that has been your goal all along, to prevent any thread that reflects badly on old Pootie Poot from continuing. Ah well, keep at it. I'm sure the Kremlin appreciates your efforts. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Can we PLEASE use this thread for updates on what is a pretty fucking serious situation and keep the fucking sideshows to a minimum? Is that too much to ask for? When this thing first started this thread was a tremendous resource for updates. But as time went on, every visit meant wading through more and more bullshit posted by the same two or three guys to finds bits and pieces of good info that was sandwiched between the stacks of shit. In other words, a handful of you have RUINED an otherwise good thread with your own fucked-up political ramblings and insistence on posting nonsense for no other purpose other than to start arguments. If you guys (and you know who you are) wish to start your own thread glorifying Mother Russia and to slurp Putin's juices, then by all means go ahead. But leave that shit out of this thread. This is primarily an American site with America loving members. You aren't going to convince very many people here to oppose the interests of our own country and give that support to Russia. You know that. So that means you're just trolling and baiting in a purposeful attempt to derail the thread. And your schtick is wearing damn thin. Not everyone shares your intrests or opinion on these subject matters, it's what a disscussion is for. I can understand you wanting this thread to cater to updates and keep on topic but you soil your own logic and cede the high ground by making homosexual accusations and petty shots at other posters. Then why not start your own thread? Go ahead. Create your topic. Set the tone of the thread and discuss whatever you want to your heart's content. Take a pro-Russian stance. Take an anti-Russian stance. I don't care. And I promise you'll be free of any comments from me because I'll stay out of that thread like I wish you would stay out of this one. That said, I know you won't take the high road and do that because this isn't about a real discussion. You are simply a troll and trolls seek attention. That is why you are here. You could easily start your own thread where you, Rossi and maybe even Tomislav (though I must say in his defense that he has mellowed as this thread progressed) could rub one out to fantasies about Putin, if that is what you wish to do. But that thread would likely be a very lonely place as outside of you three, I am not seeing very many people here who share your views. And as I previously said, trolls are all about attention. So I suspect you'll remain in this thread, polluting it with your pro-Russian, anti-American bullshit until it either gets locked or people just stop contributing because they don't like wadding through rivers of garbage to find a few nuggets of useful info here and there. And I suppose that has been your goal all along, to prevent any thread that reflects badly on old Pootie Poot from continuing. Ah well, keep at it. I'm sure the Kremlin appreciates your efforts. It seems like you are the one who wants to start his own thread, control other people's opinions(not very American I must say) and continue to derail this thread with crude gay humor. |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 6:10:11 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Then why not start your own thread? Go ahead. Create your topic. Set the tone of the thread and discuss whatever you want to your heart's content. Take a pro-Russian stance. Take an anti-Russian stance. I don't care. And I promise you'll be free of any comments from me because I'll stay out of that thread like I wish you would stay out of this one. That said, I know you won't take the high road and do that because this isn't about a real discussion. You are simply a troll and trolls seek attention. That is why you are here. You could easily start your own thread where you, Rossi and maybe even Tomislav (though I must say in his defense that he has mellowed as this thread progressed) could rub one out to fantasies about Putin, if that is what you wish to do. But that thread would likely be a very lonely place as outside of you three, I am not seeing very many people here who share your views. And as I previously said, trolls are all about attention. So I suspect you'll remain in this thread, polluting it with your pro-Russian, anti-American bullshit until it either gets locked or people just stop contributing because they don't like wadding through rivers of garbage to find a few nuggets of useful info here and there. And I suppose that has been your goal all along, to prevent any thread that reflects badly on old Pootie Poot from continuing. Ah well, keep at it. I'm sure the Kremlin appreciates your efforts. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Can we PLEASE use this thread for updates on what is a pretty fucking serious situation and keep the fucking sideshows to a minimum? Is that too much to ask for? When this thing first started this thread was a tremendous resource for updates. But as time went on, every visit meant wading through more and more bullshit posted by the same two or three guys to finds bits and pieces of good info that was sandwiched between the stacks of shit. In other words, a handful of you have RUINED an otherwise good thread with your own fucked-up political ramblings and insistence on posting nonsense for no other purpose other than to start arguments. If you guys (and you know who you are) wish to start your own thread glorifying Mother Russia and to slurp Putin's juices, then by all means go ahead. But leave that shit out of this thread. This is primarily an American site with America loving members. You aren't going to convince very many people here to oppose the interests of our own country and give that support to Russia. You know that. So that means you're just trolling and baiting in a purposeful attempt to derail the thread. And your schtick is wearing damn thin. Not everyone shares your intrests or opinion on these subject matters, it's what a disscussion is for. I can understand you wanting this thread to cater to updates and keep on topic but you soil your own logic and cede the high ground by making homosexual accusations and petty shots at other posters. Then why not start your own thread? Go ahead. Create your topic. Set the tone of the thread and discuss whatever you want to your heart's content. Take a pro-Russian stance. Take an anti-Russian stance. I don't care. And I promise you'll be free of any comments from me because I'll stay out of that thread like I wish you would stay out of this one. That said, I know you won't take the high road and do that because this isn't about a real discussion. You are simply a troll and trolls seek attention. That is why you are here. You could easily start your own thread where you, Rossi and maybe even Tomislav (though I must say in his defense that he has mellowed as this thread progressed) could rub one out to fantasies about Putin, if that is what you wish to do. But that thread would likely be a very lonely place as outside of you three, I am not seeing very many people here who share your views. And as I previously said, trolls are all about attention. So I suspect you'll remain in this thread, polluting it with your pro-Russian, anti-American bullshit until it either gets locked or people just stop contributing because they don't like wadding through rivers of garbage to find a few nuggets of useful info here and there. And I suppose that has been your goal all along, to prevent any thread that reflects badly on old Pootie Poot from continuing. Ah well, keep at it. I'm sure the Kremlin appreciates your efforts. Fascinating. A self-declared American who wants to censor what he does not agree with. So, the posts in this thread are fine as long as they meet your, and yours only, "standards" of what is "truth" and what you decide is "Russian propaganda", which should be banned. Just trying to understand. 
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Posted: 4/20/2014 6:21:06 PM EDT
[#32]
Linky
"Two groups apparently made up of separatists and pro-government loyalists clashed at the checkpoint near the town of Slavyansk, with the Ukrainian government saying one person had been killed and Russian state media reporting five dead" 
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Posted: 4/20/2014 6:21:51 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
...Maybe if people weren't parroting Russian propaganda verbatim, they wouldn't get attacked. People can disagree over whether assisting Ukraine is in America's interests; it another thing entirely to be intentionally playing into Russia's narrative on the Ukraine invasion and toeing Moscow's line on the matter; that is going to generate the responses/attacks you are seeing, not disagreements over US interests. Quote HistoryQuoted:
...Maybe if people weren't parroting Russian propaganda verbatim, they wouldn't get attacked. People can disagree over whether assisting Ukraine is in America's interests; it another thing entirely to be intentionally playing into Russia's narrative on the Ukraine invasion and toeing Moscow's line on the matter; that is going to generate the responses/attacks you are seeing, not disagreements over US interests. Well, personally, I don't have a problem with it either way. Thread space is free; use it! The missing plane thread is still going at 200+ pages, and there is a tad less actual news in that one than in this one. Just trying to give C_H some ideas, is all. As for glorious people's news? I've got much glorious people's news, and fortunately for you all, I share according to my abilities! Ukraine Should Lead Disarmament of Irregular Military Groups – OSCE Secretary General ...MOSCOW, April 18 (RIA Novosti) – The disarmament of irregular militant groups in Ukraine is a task for the authorities in Kiev, OSCE Secretary General Lamberto Zannier told RIA Novosti Friday, outlining a roadmap devised at talks in Geneva on Thursday. “It should be done by the Ukrainians. It’s a law and order issue, and the relevant Ukrainian institutions should do it,” he said, explaining that the objective is complicated and “has to be part of a broader process where the central part is dialogue.” Zannier's assessment of Thursday's meeting on the crisis in Ukraine was "really positive."... Wonder what the OSCE definition of 'irregular militant groups' is? Right Sector included, or just the Little Green Men of the East? Can't imagine Ukrainian politicians going after various Ukie groups before the elections too hard, but it does present them with something of a problem if they don't. |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 6:36:55 PM EDT
[#34]
Requesting you start a separate thread in which to post your Russian propaganda isn't censorship. Such a thread would put your views, however twisted they may be, on an equal level of this or any other thread here. So lets not get overly dramatic here.
However, as has already been noted, it is not a discussion you three guys are seeking. You're just here to troll. Trolls don't start threads they know nobody wants to read or reply to because that doesn't give them the attention they seek. Instead, they insert themselves into popular threads they dislike and do everything possible to derail them, like in this one. I made the suggestion for starting a new thread just as a way to gauge your true interest in having a meaningful discussion, in case my initial opinion of you are your objectives was inaccurate. But your reaction has proved my initial assessment was spot on. What I offered you was a way to save face, to have an out, to take the high road. Now everyone here can truly see you for what you are. And if they had any doubts to begin with, now they have none. Congrats on your new status. Maybe someday you can even achieve Dave_A status if you are really good. |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 7:16:40 PM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
However, as has already been noted, it is not a discussion you three guys are seeking... Incorrect. YOU are the one who is quite literally not seeking a discussion. Feel free to use the 'Ignore' function for people whose posts you don't want to read. And if you think someone is crossing the line, there is that handy 'Report' button, right there. |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 7:22:40 PM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Well, personally, I don't have a problem with it either way. Thread space is free; use it! The missing plane thread is still going at 200+ pages, and there is a tad less actual news in that one than in this one. Just trying to give C_H some ideas, is all. As for glorious people's news? I've got much glorious people's news, and fortunately for you all, I share according to my abilities! Ukraine Should Lead Disarmament of Irregular Military Groups – OSCE Secretary General Wonder what the OSCE definition of 'irregular militant groups' is? Right Sector included, or just the Little Green Men of the East? Can't imagine Ukrainian politicians going after various Ukie groups before the elections too hard, but it does present them with something of a problem if they don't. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
...Maybe if people weren't parroting Russian propaganda verbatim, they wouldn't get attacked. People can disagree over whether assisting Ukraine is in America's interests; it another thing entirely to be intentionally playing into Russia's narrative on the Ukraine invasion and toeing Moscow's line on the matter; that is going to generate the responses/attacks you are seeing, not disagreements over US interests. Well, personally, I don't have a problem with it either way. Thread space is free; use it! The missing plane thread is still going at 200+ pages, and there is a tad less actual news in that one than in this one. Just trying to give C_H some ideas, is all. As for glorious people's news? I've got much glorious people's news, and fortunately for you all, I share according to my abilities! Ukraine Should Lead Disarmament of Irregular Military Groups – OSCE Secretary General ...MOSCOW, April 18 (RIA Novosti) – The disarmament of irregular militant groups in Ukraine is a task for the authorities in Kiev, OSCE Secretary General Lamberto Zannier told RIA Novosti Friday, outlining a roadmap devised at talks in Geneva on Thursday. “It should be done by the Ukrainians. It’s a law and order issue, and the relevant Ukrainian institutions should do it,” he said, explaining that the objective is complicated and “has to be part of a broader process where the central part is dialogue.” Zannier's assessment of Thursday's meeting on the crisis in Ukraine was "really positive."... Wonder what the OSCE definition of 'irregular militant groups' is? Right Sector included, or just the Little Green Men of the East? Can't imagine Ukrainian politicians going after various Ukie groups before the elections too hard, but it does present them with something of a problem if they don't. Some 100 pages ago in this very thread several people were mocking the Maidan movement because the new government was trying to disarm those groups - spinning it as a gun rights issue and trying to paint the interim government as having essentially stabbed those people in the back. I could have sworn you were one of them. |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 7:40:23 PM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Incorrect. YOU are the one who is quite literally not seeking a discussion. Feel free to use the 'Ignore' function for people whose posts you don't want to read. And if you think someone is crossing the line, there is that handy 'Report' button, right there. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
However, as has already been noted, it is not a discussion you three guys are seeking... Incorrect. YOU are the one who is quite literally not seeking a discussion. Feel free to use the 'Ignore' function for people whose posts you don't want to read. And if you think someone is crossing the line, there is that handy 'Report' button, right there. Nothing you have posted in this thread can be remotely called discussion. Discussing something involves putting forth one's own thoughts. You are merely parroting Russian propaganda. And I would consider using the ignore function in your case, but I'll think I'll refrain for the time being. It is nice to know what the enemy is thinking. In that regard, you are a great source. |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 8:11:54 PM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Well, personally, I don't have a problem with it either way. Thread space is free; use it! The missing plane thread is still going at 200+ pages, and there is a tad less actual news in that one than in this one. Just trying to give C_H some ideas, is all. As for glorious people's news? I've got much glorious people's news, and fortunately for you all, I share according to my abilities! Ukraine Should Lead Disarmament of Irregular Military Groups – OSCE Secretary General Wonder what the OSCE definition of 'irregular militant groups' is? Right Sector included, or just the Little Green Men of the East? Can't imagine Ukrainian politicians going after various Ukie groups before the elections too hard, but it does present them with something of a problem if they don't. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
...Maybe if people weren't parroting Russian propaganda verbatim, they wouldn't get attacked. People can disagree over whether assisting Ukraine is in America's interests; it another thing entirely to be intentionally playing into Russia's narrative on the Ukraine invasion and toeing Moscow's line on the matter; that is going to generate the responses/attacks you are seeing, not disagreements over US interests. Well, personally, I don't have a problem with it either way. Thread space is free; use it! The missing plane thread is still going at 200+ pages, and there is a tad less actual news in that one than in this one. Just trying to give C_H some ideas, is all. As for glorious people's news? I've got much glorious people's news, and fortunately for you all, I share according to my abilities! Ukraine Should Lead Disarmament of Irregular Military Groups – OSCE Secretary General ...MOSCOW, April 18 (RIA Novosti) – The disarmament of irregular militant groups in Ukraine is a task for the authorities in Kiev, OSCE Secretary General Lamberto Zannier told RIA Novosti Friday, outlining a roadmap devised at talks in Geneva on Thursday. “It should be done by the Ukrainians. It’s a law and order issue, and the relevant Ukrainian institutions should do it,” he said, explaining that the objective is complicated and “has to be part of a broader process where the central part is dialogue.” Zannier's assessment of Thursday's meeting on the crisis in Ukraine was "really positive."... Wonder what the OSCE definition of 'irregular militant groups' is? Right Sector included, or just the Little Green Men of the East? Can't imagine Ukrainian politicians going after various Ukie groups before the elections too hard, but it does present them with something of a problem if they don't. Your continuous over-exaggeration of the importance of Right Sector being a fine example of toeing Moscow's line.
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Posted: 4/20/2014 8:30:40 PM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Your continuous over-exaggeration of the importance of Right Sector being a fine example of toeing Moscow's line. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
...Maybe if people weren't parroting Russian propaganda verbatim, they wouldn't get attacked. People can disagree over whether assisting Ukraine is in America's interests; it another thing entirely to be intentionally playing into Russia's narrative on the Ukraine invasion and toeing Moscow's line on the matter; that is going to generate the responses/attacks you are seeing, not disagreements over US interests. Well, personally, I don't have a problem with it either way. Thread space is free; use it! The missing plane thread is still going at 200+ pages, and there is a tad less actual news in that one than in this one. Just trying to give C_H some ideas, is all. As for glorious people's news? I've got much glorious people's news, and fortunately for you all, I share according to my abilities! Ukraine Should Lead Disarmament of Irregular Military Groups – OSCE Secretary General ...MOSCOW, April 18 (RIA Novosti) – The disarmament of irregular militant groups in Ukraine is a task for the authorities in Kiev, OSCE Secretary General Lamberto Zannier told RIA Novosti Friday, outlining a roadmap devised at talks in Geneva on Thursday. “It should be done by the Ukrainians. It’s a law and order issue, and the relevant Ukrainian institutions should do it,” he said, explaining that the objective is complicated and “has to be part of a broader process where the central part is dialogue.” Zannier's assessment of Thursday's meeting on the crisis in Ukraine was "really positive."... Wonder what the OSCE definition of 'irregular militant groups' is? Right Sector included, or just the Little Green Men of the East? Can't imagine Ukrainian politicians going after various Ukie groups before the elections too hard, but it does present them with something of a problem if they don't. Your continuous over-exaggeration of the importance of Right Sector being a fine example of toeing Moscow's line. They're out there. They're everywhere. 
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Posted: 4/20/2014 8:34:53 PM EDT
[#40]
My favorite is when the "the Nazis and NATO are oppressing us" shit pops up in the most random places - this from the website of a "mini zoo" in Don'etsk:
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Posted: 4/20/2014 8:43:32 PM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
My favorite is when the "the Nazis and NATO are oppressing us" shit pops up in the most random places - this from the website of a "mini zoo" in Don'etsk: https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Blrd08MCMAA88Wi.jpg:large Yeah, it is pretty comical when the Russians accuse anyone (much less NATO) of oppression, given their history. |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 8:50:19 PM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Yeah, it is pretty comical when the Russians accuse anyone (much less NATO) of oppression, given their history. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
My favorite is when the "the Nazis and NATO are oppressing us" shit pops up in the most random places - this from the website of a "mini zoo" in Don'etsk: https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Blrd08MCMAA88Wi.jpg:large Yeah, it is pretty comical when the Russians accuse anyone (much less NATO) of oppression, given their history. More likely useful idiots in this case. |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 9:05:02 PM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Some 100 pages ago in this very thread several people were mocking the Maidan movement because the new government was trying to disarm those groups - spinning it as a gun rights issue and trying to paint the interim government as having essentially stabbed those people in the back. I could have sworn you were one of them. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Some 100 pages ago in this very thread several people were mocking the Maidan movement because the new government was trying to disarm those groups - spinning it as a gun rights issue and trying to paint the interim government as having essentially stabbed those people in the back. I could have sworn you were one of them. Certainly. And I also recall that I pointed out the great irony in it. Not like it's a situation without historical precedent, you know. Once the more 'salt of the earth' brawler-types help get the new government in power, said governments often aren't exactly grateful. But in this case, I'm genuinely curious how Ukraine will respond to OSCE calls for paramilitary disarmament. Too far, they piss off the steely core of the protesters. Not enough (as in, just disarm ethnic Russians), and well, we can guess how that ends. Quoted:
Your continuous over-exaggeration of the importance of Right Sector being a fine example of toeing Moscow's line. You must have missed the Der Spiegel article I posted. Here you go: http://www.spiegel.de/international/europe/ukrainian-militias-prepare-for-possibility-of-russian-invasion-a-964628.html |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 9:37:25 PM EDT
[#44]
The Ukrainian government needs to not only allow the people to privately own firearms, they should encourage it. On the surface, I can see where government officials might be uneasy with doing so. If you have Russia demanding they disarm them and they don't, then something happens involving one of those groups, them boom, invasion time. OTOH, if Russia really wants to invade, all they need to do is shoot up some folks, blame it on right wing Ukrainian militia and go ahead and invade anyway. So forcing people to give up their weapons really solves nothing. And should push come to shove, it will be the common people who ultimately decide the fate of their nation. They need to be armed.
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Posted: 4/20/2014 9:55:04 PM EDT
[#45]
The new "cold war" apparently will be about who bankrupts his own country first. Total departure from Patton's "make the enemy soldier die for his country".
... Russia's economic development ministry has downgraded the country's forecast to less than 1% growth this year; an earlier estimate had been 2.5%. The World Bank projects that the Russian economy could shrink nearly 2% in 2014. That would cost Russia in the neighborhood of $30 billion in lost economic output. ... Russia's annexation of Crimea it is turning into a costly boondoggle. The Kremlin has already earmarked nearly $7 billion in economic aid for the peninsula this year, funds that will be spent on everything from infrastructure to beefed-up pensions for local residents. Even when balanced against anticipated gains from Crimea's energy resources and savings on naval basing arrangements, among other factors, that's a cost Russia's sluggish economy can ill afford. ... Who will win? Considering the turd's "free-for-all" plan we are several bodies ahead (trillions vs. billions). However, Putin is sneaky so he might still win. Forgot the source: http://online.wsj.com/news/articles/SB10001424052702303663604579503433988345564?mod=trending_now_2 |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 10:02:55 PM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Then why not start your own thread? Go ahead. Create your topic. Set the tone of the thread and discuss whatever you want to your heart's content. Take a pro-Russian stance. Take an anti-Russian stance. I don't care. And I promise you'll be free of any comments from me because I'll stay out of that thread like I wish you would stay out of this one. That said, I know you won't take the high road and do that because this isn't about a real discussion. You are simply a troll and trolls seek attention. That is why you are here. You could easily start your own thread where you, Rossi and maybe even Tomislav (though I must say in his defense that he has mellowed as this thread progressed) could rub one out to fantasies about Putin, if that is what you wish to do. But that thread would likely be a very lonely place as outside of you three, I am not seeing very many people here who share your views. And as I previously said, trolls are all about attention. So I suspect you'll remain in this thread, polluting it with your pro-Russian, anti-American bullshit until it either gets locked or people just stop contributing because they don't like wadding through rivers of garbage to find a few nuggets of useful info here and there. And I suppose that has been your goal all along, to prevent any thread that reflects badly on old Pootie Poot from continuing. Ah well, keep at it. I'm sure the Kremlin appreciates your efforts. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Can we PLEASE use this thread for updates on what is a pretty fucking serious situation and keep the fucking sideshows to a minimum? Is that too much to ask for? When this thing first started this thread was a tremendous resource for updates. But as time went on, every visit meant wading through more and more bullshit posted by the same two or three guys to finds bits and pieces of good info that was sandwiched between the stacks of shit. In other words, a handful of you have RUINED an otherwise good thread with your own fucked-up political ramblings and insistence on posting nonsense for no other purpose other than to start arguments. If you guys (and you know who you are) wish to start your own thread glorifying Mother Russia and to slurp Putin's juices, then by all means go ahead. But leave that shit out of this thread. This is primarily an American site with America loving members. You aren't going to convince very many people here to oppose the interests of our own country and give that support to Russia. You know that. So that means you're just trolling and baiting in a purposeful attempt to derail the thread. And your schtick is wearing damn thin. Not everyone shares your intrests or opinion on these subject matters, it's what a disscussion is for. I can understand you wanting this thread to cater to updates and keep on topic but you soil your own logic and cede the high ground by making homosexual accusations and petty shots at other posters. Then why not start your own thread? Go ahead. Create your topic. Set the tone of the thread and discuss whatever you want to your heart's content. Take a pro-Russian stance. Take an anti-Russian stance. I don't care. And I promise you'll be free of any comments from me because I'll stay out of that thread like I wish you would stay out of this one. That said, I know you won't take the high road and do that because this isn't about a real discussion. You are simply a troll and trolls seek attention. That is why you are here. You could easily start your own thread where you, Rossi and maybe even Tomislav (though I must say in his defense that he has mellowed as this thread progressed) could rub one out to fantasies about Putin, if that is what you wish to do. But that thread would likely be a very lonely place as outside of you three, I am not seeing very many people here who share your views. And as I previously said, trolls are all about attention. So I suspect you'll remain in this thread, polluting it with your pro-Russian, anti-American bullshit until it either gets locked or people just stop contributing because they don't like wadding through rivers of garbage to find a few nuggets of useful info here and there. And I suppose that has been your goal all along, to prevent any thread that reflects badly on old Pootie Poot from continuing. Ah well, keep at it. I'm sure the Kremlin appreciates your efforts. This is a complex situation. Anyone who disagrees with or has a different opinion than a few of the more vocal members posting in this thread is labeled a troll, russophile, anti-American etc. Most of them know little to nothing about Russia and mistake any statement that is not unequivocally anti-Russian as Pro-Russian. And now here you are with your post calling for censorship. |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 10:13:53 PM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The Ukrainian government needs to not only allow the people to privately own firearms, they should encourage it. On the surface, I can see where government officials might be uneasy with doing so. If you have Russia demanding they disarm them and they don't, then something happens involving one of those groups, them boom, invasion time. OTOH, if Russia really wants to invade, all they need to do is shoot up some folks, blame it on right wing Ukrainian militia and go ahead and invade anyway. So forcing people to give up their weapons really solves nothing. And should push come to shove, it will be the common people who ultimately decide the fate of their nation. They need to be armed. Such thinking is largely foreign outside of the US. (Though one of those cuddly groups like Right Sector or Svaboda are calling for it) In Ukraine, it would present special problems for Kiev. Do they not encourage or allow the eastern sectors to arm? With Russian population ranging from 25% or so to just under half, that could create more of what is going on now. And if they exclude ethnic Russians specifically, that probably doesn't end well either. IMO, a Swiss/Israeli style reserve system is what would serve them best, as long as they are careful to play the needed games with ethnic Russians. Don't call them up, or make them all water purification and distribution specialists, etc. Gotta be creative with it. So you get a large armed populace, but you control who gets said arms, and when. But even that is ignoring more serious problems Ukraine is facing. They can't effectively resist Russia militarily on their own, and it's not like anyone is offering to send troops to Ukraine, blustering aside. Some armed citizens aren't going to change that equation. And, as long as Ukraine is operating under the danger of an Argentina-style collapse, they aren't going to be able to modernize and overhaul their armed forces. |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 10:46:22 PM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
This is a complex situation. Anyone who disagrees with or has a different opinion than a few of the more vocal members posting in this thread is labeled a troll, russophile, anti-American etc. Most of them know little to nothing about Russia and mistake any statement that is not unequivocally anti-Russian as Pro-Russian. And now here you are with your post calling for censorship. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Can we PLEASE use this thread for updates on what is a pretty fucking serious situation and keep the fucking sideshows to a minimum? Is that too much to ask for? When this thing first started this thread was a tremendous resource for updates. But as time went on, every visit meant wading through more and more bullshit posted by the same two or three guys to finds bits and pieces of good info that was sandwiched between the stacks of shit. In other words, a handful of you have RUINED an otherwise good thread with your own fucked-up political ramblings and insistence on posting nonsense for no other purpose other than to start arguments. If you guys (and you know who you are) wish to start your own thread glorifying Mother Russia and to slurp Putin's juices, then by all means go ahead. But leave that shit out of this thread. This is primarily an American site with America loving members. You aren't going to convince very many people here to oppose the interests of our own country and give that support to Russia. You know that. So that means you're just trolling and baiting in a purposeful attempt to derail the thread. And your schtick is wearing damn thin. Not everyone shares your intrests or opinion on these subject matters, it's what a disscussion is for. I can understand you wanting this thread to cater to updates and keep on topic but you soil your own logic and cede the high ground by making homosexual accusations and petty shots at other posters. Then why not start your own thread? Go ahead. Create your topic. Set the tone of the thread and discuss whatever you want to your heart's content. Take a pro-Russian stance. Take an anti-Russian stance. I don't care. And I promise you'll be free of any comments from me because I'll stay out of that thread like I wish you would stay out of this one. That said, I know you won't take the high road and do that because this isn't about a real discussion. You are simply a troll and trolls seek attention. That is why you are here. You could easily start your own thread where you, Rossi and maybe even Tomislav (though I must say in his defense that he has mellowed as this thread progressed) could rub one out to fantasies about Putin, if that is what you wish to do. But that thread would likely be a very lonely place as outside of you three, I am not seeing very many people here who share your views. And as I previously said, trolls are all about attention. So I suspect you'll remain in this thread, polluting it with your pro-Russian, anti-American bullshit until it either gets locked or people just stop contributing because they don't like wadding through rivers of garbage to find a few nuggets of useful info here and there. And I suppose that has been your goal all along, to prevent any thread that reflects badly on old Pootie Poot from continuing. Ah well, keep at it. I'm sure the Kremlin appreciates your efforts. This is a complex situation. Anyone who disagrees with or has a different opinion than a few of the more vocal members posting in this thread is labeled a troll, russophile, anti-American etc. Most of them know little to nothing about Russia and mistake any statement that is not unequivocally anti-Russian as Pro-Russian. And now here you are with your post calling for censorship. There are many regular posters here who have a good knowledge about Russia and the region. This oft repeated nonsense about we just don't know what it is really like there is silly. |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 10:57:09 PM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
And now here you are with your post calling for censorship. Once again, asking that off-topic political debate and rambling be taken to a new thread so this one can remain uncluttered for news updates isn't "censorship". You might not like it. You might not agree with it. But it isn't censorship. Censorship would be flatly telling you that you couldn't post your opinion here anywhere. Nobody is suggesting that. And quite frankly, it doesn't bother me if there is some discussion in this thread so long as it doesn't take the thread completely off the rails. We all clearly have an interest in what's taking place over there, regardless of our exact opinion. Maybe it would be in everyone's best interest to not make any outlandish, over-the-top accusations or posts going forward which are sure to draw ridicule? Surely we as adults can accomplish such a small task. |
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Posted: 4/21/2014 12:16:40 AM EDT
[#50]
Back on track.
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