I'm planning to attend the local technical college and wonder what are some experiences you guys may have of these two jobs.

In high school I took a semester of welding and enjoyed it very much. Even caught on fire twice. The program for the school is a 37 degree diploma.

The it is the machine tool technology. I always liked seeing how machines work and the science behind metallurgy. Im sure all of you have taken your guns apart just to see how the action operates and such (Like Pvt Pyle in Full Metal Jacket) . There is a diploma and AAS degree.

I was taking my first year in a state university and found that school just isn't for me. I felt out of place and tired of taking a required class on how to have an argument. Next fall i will have three years left of my GI bill and then some from the National Guard. I'm planning for paramedicine and figured since it would take as long as three years I can be certified in another field so I wont be limited in the job market.

Ive spoken with my advisor and have a meeting scheduled for next week for the school (St Cloud Technical College) and would like any heads up.

Thank.

Which ever you enjoy more is where I would go. Welding has routes than can keep you in a shop or send you to the boonies. Machinists are a dying breed as far as I have seen, most the young people don't have the skill of the old timers, if you can put the time and effort into becoming a master than go for it. Also you must be able to read prints. If I had a dollar everytime I had to explain a print I could retire.

Learning to weld is a good skill to have, however, if you do it day in and out for a long time there will be significant health effects––-especially lung damage.

I am a maintenance machinist at the moment and run rather archaic machines.   But, being as almost all the stuff I do is set-up existing parts and repair them, the old manual machines are better suited for this.  

Going to school for either will teach you the basics, and give you the tools to figure out how to do things that you have never done before.  But, to get really good at either will take on-the-job experience.

ETA:  I would avoid a CNC only program, since you will be limited to mostly production work.  The better CNC guys, I know, know how to run and set-up the manual machines as well.  There is a significant difference between setting up to make one or a couple of parts as opposed to making hundreds.   Another valuable skill that most schools don't teach is how to make a part to fix something when the original is lost or destroyed to the point where no good dimensions can be made.

Most machinists do some welding. Welders, when they aren't welding...drink beer.

Do both, go machinist, but learn to weld as well, they go hand in hand

 

I am a CNC machinist and while I enjoy doing it, in my place of employment I've got it easier than the welders do.

They are both similar in the respect that almost anyone can pick it up but it takes a lot of skill/dedication to become great at it.

I like this thread as it corroborates my future life plans..

Button pusher.





Dont be one.
 

Yep.  Most machinists will have experience in GTAW on small, fine stuff.  Whereas welders will have most experience in SMAW and  FCAW, running pounds of filler per hour doing boring welds.  And if they are working out in the field, contending with wind, biting cold, baking heat, constant moving and lots of highway.



Go with machining.  After all, it is a great background for a gunsmith.



 

What are the salaries of a machinist vs a welder?

I have both a structural steel and architectural metal shop.  I can find a good "regular welder" with a phone call.  A machinist?  I could use about 2 more in the shop.  In my area a welder can make good money if hes good at what he does and hes a hard worker.  Thing is with enough practice its not to hard to become a good welder.  Now a machinist?  Not to many of them floating around.  I would go more for what I like to call architectural metal fabricator.  If you can machine parts, TIG weld, read drawings, understand the properties of different types of metal (particularly stainless and aluminum) you will have skills that are hard to come by and your hourly rate will probably be based on what you are asking for.  We make stuff like this, all custom (the whole door, hardware included):



 

I'm a cnc machinist. Love what I do and make good money doing it.


Not AeroE money, but good money none the less.

I'm just saying, this could be a plus for some people

I own a CNC machine shop that makes aircraft components. We can not find the type of workers we would like to hire.

Sure, there are plenty of machine operators out there but that is not what we are looking for. Button pushers, as said above.

When NASA shut down the Shuttle we got a lot of applicants from USA (United Space Alliance) but not one of them worked out. No ability to work on their own.

My advice - study math. Study programing, and learn not to pay attention to anonymous internet posters like me. Follow your interests.

Mike
Palm Coast FL.

Over the long haul, welding will fuck-up your eye-sight.

A good friend of my wife's husband owns a machine shop, he is always looking for a good machinist. I have had a lot of students go into welding over the years, around here, pay is not great. Based on my students experience, I would say go Machinist or electrician over welder.

I'm a mechanical engineer, and have worked with guys that have done either for 40+ years.  Machinist these days are more often CNC programers, not 'real' machinist.  Either one would have tons of job opportunities.  Pick the one you think you'd enjoy the most - It'll all work out just fine.

I've seen a CNC Machinist wanted sign locally for a few months before they hired finally.

If I was younger....  

I'm a drafter on my second career, and I sometimes struggle with my work because I don't have practical machining experience. Welding too. I'd say get your machinist's career going for sure. They can SAY it is a dying field, but manufacturing is changing and evolving. There seems to be more demand for people with the skills and knowledge to build, service, and repair complicated, technical machinery. That is the field I'm in, and our bottom line is doing well and growing right now. I've heard many say, and I agree with them, that the best drafters come up from the shop floor. Everything looks good on paper, but a true machinist understands the limits of material and machine and knows what designs will work and what won't.

A machinist with an understanding of systems and how they work: mechanical, electrical, electronic, hydraulic, pneumatic...will go far. The older guys are giving it up because they haven't figured out how to capitalize on the automated nature of the field these days. If you can machine something without the computerized gadgetry with competence, I'd say your really ahead of the game. If you have that knowledge and can use the CAM systems too...you can make a decent living at it. You just wouldn't believe the parts i see cross my QC table from day to day. Space age stuff, parts a machinist from 1950 would not be capable of even imagining...it's just amazing what they do nowadays.

It sounds like machinist is the way to go.

What if the program only has CNC? Can I still be useful?

Same here. Something I found that's enjoyable is also a good career decision.

I have read in trade mags about a shortage of capable CNC machinists.  I haven't heard such about weldors.

Note that "CNC machinist" is quite different from "machinist".

There is indeed some demand  for "machinists" (as in old school machinists) but the growth field is in the CNC arena.

I'm plant supervisor at a metal fabrication company.  Nearly everything we make for a customer is welded.  75% is machined.  Pay scale for machinists tops out around $26/hr.  Specialty welders $24/hr.  I've had the pleasure of doing both, at different companies, at this company, even both at the same time running a robot welder alongside a horizontal machining center.  I enjoy machining, but I do not regret my time welding or having the skills.  There is a lot of knowledge in both areas, though depending on the company structure and product, either one can be reduced to a low skill low pay job, or on the other end of the spectrum, be a highly specialized high skill high paying job.  

Here's an interesting datum:  It takes me on average, 61 days to hire a new welder.  Regardless of skill level required for the position - just averaged across all welder openings.  It takes me less than 1 month to hire a machinist opening.  There's a specific reason for that though, we post all job openings internally prior to going outside.  90% of my machinist positions are filled by internal applicants.  Not many welding positions are.  On the other hand, if you are an outside applicant with no pedigree (currently welding for another company, certs, or diploma), we'll ask you to do a very simple weld test on your first interview.  Usually something like a 3/8"  fillet weld on a straight and around a round puck.  Probably 80% of the people who do that, fail miserably.  It's not any kind of weld test.  More like a bullshit test.

Learn both is not a bad suggestion.  My GTAW experience in the tool room opened other doors for me.  My willingness to get certified and run 2 machines at once opened other doors for me.  My general shop knowledge from both areas makes my life infinitely easier in my current position.


As far as a program, there is no need to learn manual machining.  People like to say "you're not a real machinist unless you can..." but what they're really trying to say is to learn the basic methodology of machining.  Yes, running manual machines can help you learn some things more easily, as you get direct feedback from the machine when you crank the handle or push the quill, but there's nothing you can't learn running CNC only.  Be observant and seek to understand the mechanics of making chips and it won't matter whether or not you turned the handles off some rusty old Bridgeport, except to the crusty old asshole who couldn't tell you G02 from G03, he thinks them there computars is a fad, see.

Absolutely.

Keep in mind there is a world of difference between being a CNC machinist, and a CNC machine operator. One is loading material in, hitting a button and maybe tweaking a coolant jet. The other is knowing how to setup the machine, maintain it and it's tooling, import a drawing and generate a program through CAM software, optimize a program etc. and do all this without being babysat. That takes education and experience, and it pays alright. It's not a huge difference from traditional 'manual' machining, but it depends much more on your ability to work with a computer and getting to know the ins and outs of specific machine/software combinations.

Manual machinists are a dying breed.    I work in the oilfield now, but have quite a few places I can go to if the boom dies and I need a job.     Like others have said, it goes hand in hand.    I have welded up and turned down shafts, and also brazed cast iron housings then bored them out.    This is a brass bushing I made for a cast iron housing that was destroyed due to poor maintanance.   I bored what was left of the brass out,  brazed up the housing, then bored the housing true.    After that I made this bushing to bring it back to original specs.




In my spare time I would help my brother (state trooper full time, former Navy Hull Tech) build these tool trays to haul mud motors, crossovers, and fishing tools.   Now I do not have the spare time.

Machinist tools make guns.

I'm finishing up my schooling as a machinist this summer.  I have worked as a welder before (never anything special just TIG and MIG making Awnings)  And I enjoy machining much better.  It is easier on your body, and for me, more interesting and challenging.

ETA, I have already threaded some barrels and am making an all stainless and Inconel Form 1 Silencer....just sayin

Unless they're HK.  Then they're used to make sheet metal guns with an air of superiority.

My opinion, based on my experience in machining and grinding and my time spent with/around welding and welders:

Suck it up and get a 4 year degree.

I've been at it since I got out of high school, so 7-8 years now.  It's really fun and cool to be able to machine and weld.  Great skills that I'm glad I have a basic understanding of.  Useful for hobbies and around the house.  But unless you're doing custom work, prototypes and one-off/repair stuff, this shit gets really fucking old.  I'm in cylindrical grinding now, and I'm bored out of my skull for 8-12 hours per day.

You're likely to work with a bunch of fucking bums who may or may not even show up on any given day.  They'll trash the machines and tools, leave the work area a royal fucking mess, and generally piss you off.  I'm one of those people who has to have my work area clean and organized, the shifts before/after me, not a single fuck given.

If you want to make good money and work with professionals, you'll have to follow the work.  That's all well and good when you're single, but I don't want to be away from my wife and son for weeks/months at a time.

Machining you can do till you're old and gray, but welding will fuck you up eventually.  Lots of welders end up with Parkinson's, bad lungs, and blind.  

I've had about enough of it.  My wife has finished her bachelor's and is making enough money that I can work part time and go back to school.  I used to think school sucked, but that was before I worked in a factory.

 

I'm a cnc programmer. I also run manual machines but learned on a cnc first. I can also weld and do from time to time when we need a extra welder. I would choose to machine before if I had to make a choice between the two. also, if you never turn handles who cares, you can do it faster on a cnc. I had a machinist I worked with that thought he could do a faster and better job than what I was doing on a cnc, he was wrong and he was probably one of the best manual machinist I have ever seen. do what ever you think would be rewarding to you and enjoy the stuff you make.

I learned to weld informally, stick, mig, and tig. I then applied for an apprenticeship as a welder, but was placed in the machine shop. Looking back, I'm glad that I ended up where I am. Welding is pretty tough on the body, but as long as you can stand and see a print, you can machine. If you can, learn both, but go for machining as a career.

A good gunsmith can do fantastic repairs with GTAW.  I had a beavertail safety that had the horn a bit too short.  So I chucked a 0.040" thoriated tungsten in the torch, set the Dynasty 200 DX at 25 amperes DCEN, 12 cubic feet per hour on the argon and laid a 1/32" bead on the short part with 0.023" ER70-S6 filler wire.  Took 3 passes with a Swiss pattern file to dress it proper and it worked.



Precise welds ARE part of the skill set of any gunsmith.  



 

I used to be a machinist I say welder. I mean machining is cool, but depending on the job you may spend the rest of your life standing in front of a machine pushing a button and loading a part, can you handle that day in and day out. It's the reason I quit. Not only that they are trying to eliminate as many as they can right now with automation, the place I worked at had one guy running three machines to help keep pace with China. Welding at least you have options probably going to be different stuff, because the simple stuff the machines do. On top that you could easily do other things as a welder from maintenance work, exhaust shop, welding shop, manufacturing etc. on top of that all the welders I knew made about twice as much as a machinist with the same experience. In my town we had a bridge manufacture the welders other than having to work in hot building were starting out at close to $20 an hour, the average machinist with a 2 yr degree made $10 an hour. Or do both I know a lot of guys that do that, then they can do whatever they get a job in, and quit and do the other if they don't like it.

Even better skip it all together and get a 4yr degree, I worked and then decided to quit and go back to school for something not even related to manufacturing parts, should have done that right way to start with. Just make sure you get a 4yr degree in something you can use, people are dumb in college they just go for whatever they like best, but it may have a very dim career outlook, and then they end up being a secretary somewhere or some HS job for low pay job, because they were dumb and got a degree in Education or something.

Machinist, hands down



<- former welder


 

My FIL is a retired welder, had this conversation before

Machinist will machine as a hobby.  a welder doesn't weld as a hobby.  

Machinists are in high demand right now and most likely will be for the next 10 years. Many moved on to something else years ago and so many more will be retiring soon too. I don't know about the demand for welders right now but if this pipeline really goes, I'm sure it will be huge.

A welder might still make more money if he/she is all around certified. Mig, tig , etc.  Both are rewarding jobs if you like going home knowing you created something useful each day.

Toss up imho

Lots of good advice here..........................



In a true arfcom tradition––––-"Get Both!"



Then do what turns your crank.

Simple and persuasive.

<–– Welder. It's alright.

Machinist here.  Most older guys who run the big manual machines that do the large fabs and repairs will be retiring soon.  Who is going to replace them?
The community colleges are pushing CNC to fill the growing job market which is calling for button pushers/part changers.

More and more programming is going to the engineers in the front office so you get guys on the floor who change offsets and speeds/feeds only.

Only good CNC jobs left are the top companies in aerospace and racing who do the intricate machining.  Mostly they are looking for engineers with a machining background in those areas.

Go with learning the basics and get a job in a small shop first with some old guy who knows his sh×t.  Then move on to bigger and better things.

Have a willingness to learn something new everyday.  You will never learn it all in the machining world.   I know a guy who has forgot more about machining than I will probably ever learn.

If you do welding take a class on pressure welding. Someone good at pressure welds and pipe fabrication is a lot harder to come by and makes more money than someone who can only do structural welds. It make take some serious work to find a pressure welding/pipe fabrication class in your area. There's only one place that offers it here and they do it once a year.

I do a little machining at home on a small lathe/mill and enjoy it.  I am sort of at at crossroads now as far as career....at 46, it is smart to go back to school for formal training in machining?  My current career is QA and is chock full of applicants.

Many Welders never live past 60. The shit they breath for years destroys their lungs. You will see alot of old Machinist, Old Welders are extremely rare.


Just something you might want to take into consideration.

If you can pass a drug test you'll always have a job as either.

I hate the term "machinist"

Most are machine operators........

I'm a machinist. I served my 8000 hour apprenticeship years ago and have papers from the state of Connecticut.          

For me, I'm 50 and I'm tired of factories. They all close up in time.
I run manual and CNC machines of all types. I currently machine big stuff with a CNC Devlieg 65RK
boring mill that has an 120 inch table. Above my head is a 120 ton crane to flip the parts.

CNC machines do operations that manual machines just can't do as quickly.

I'd rather be an engineer, pays more and you don't get your hands dirty.....

I work in IT and if I ever get burnt out enough to quit doing it I think I'd like to go be a machinist... it's a shrinking career field and like has been said, the guys that can do the manual machning and also import stuff into the CNC machines are getting hard to come by... I think I'd like to try that... or be a backhoe operator. Dig holes all day...

CNC machinist here. Also have alot of background in manual work on lathes, mills, universal grinders, centerless grinders, Blanchard grinders, surface grinding, and entirely too much else precision grinding related. Hated that.

There is a BIG difference between a real machinist, CNC or otherewise, and a button pusher. I am fluent in several programming formats, although I prefer Misubishi G&M coding. Alot of the stuff we do where I am currently employed would be impossible to do efficiently on a manual lathe. Think .125 diameter bored pocket, .057 deep, 16 finish or better on the bottom face, size -.0005 tolerance. We run a couple hundred of these at a time, out of heat reated stainless that Rockwells at ~48C. Fun stuff.

If you have a mechanical aptitude and problem solving ability, I'd go machinist. There is quite a demand for good people. We can't seem to find enough good people, although there are quite a few idiots that get shipped through.

Typically a lot more money in high-end welding than machining.  But you have to go to odd locations and do semi-dangerous stuff to REALLY bank.

I have a couple of guys making $60k a year for me machining, and they never get cold, never have to go on the road, and the only thing they risk is a cut finger.

They're two completely different disciplines though, much like auto repair and auto body tech.  One is numbers and mechanics, the other is an art form.  I teach CNC programming and advanced machining as my second job at the local trade school, and I've had people that have done both that and welding classes.  Very, very rarely does one excel at both.

I'd spend some time in the meantime messing with both and see what you have an acumen for.  If you're a machinist aptitude, you won't want to take up welding and vice-versa.

Shoot me a PM anytime for the lowdown on the machining aspect of things.  Good luck in your choice, and kudos to you for stepping out of the box of what schools tell you these days (Doctor, Lawyer, Computer Tech are your only options, otherwise you're working at Pizza Hut) and looking at an applied trade.  I started out wanting to be a Spanish teacher, ended up machining and programming, and it grew into an engineering degree and very nice living.

Truth.  We have begun a few initiatives to get young people more involved in this and aware of it, due to the problem in my previous post of it not even being offered as a career suggestion in these highly liberalized school systems.

Involved to the point where we, with other local manufacturers, have the local trade school (Where I also teach) outfitted nicely with some of the nicest, newest gear you can get.  Probably nicer than what my guys get to use on a daily basis.  But it's working, there's a good amount of new young blood interested.  SOME of them might even turn out useful