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Posted: 10/27/2011 4:52:51 PM EDT
[#1]
Quoted:
Most of the cops and citizens of Kent, Ohio in the early 70s would probably agree. Hasn't there always been allegations that someone fired a pistol at the NG first? |
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Posted: 10/27/2011 4:53:27 PM EDT
[#2]
Chick in the OP was hit when they were trying to block a shipping terminal to stop vehicles from being sent to Iraq or Afghanistan.
Wooden dowel to the face. ETA: Beaten to it, and with a link no less |
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Posted: 10/27/2011 4:56:25 PM EDT
[#3]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Most of the cops and citizens of Kent, Ohio in the early 70s would probably agree. Hasn't there always been allegations that someone fired a pistol at the NG first? No. I was a Portage County Deputy in the 80s and trained by Deputies that were there that day. All of them thought it was a needless tragedy. None of them, based upon what they personally experienced would have fired into the crowd or anywhere else that day. |
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Posted: 10/27/2011 4:57:40 PM EDT
[#4]
The shock value intended on that photo is about as effective as the "This is your brain on drugs" promos from way back.
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Posted: 10/27/2011 4:58:13 PM EDT
[#5]
Quoted: (Rant) They are still acting in disobedience to the authorities......Sorry but if an officer tells you to move somewhere else.....and you do not comply, especially in a large group, where some are acting out...your gonna get hurt....it is non-lethal, it hurts like a mother (I have been hit with rubber bullets/ batons from a 37mm)...but it will not hurt her in the long run, if anything she learned a valuable lesson, if she is still participating in the demonstrations, perhaps she needs another one across her backside for old times sake. These reports need to stop saying, "Got shot"...It was rubber, not lead. I can see having to tell them once, maybe twice, but on the third time, it is open season for the police. I wish they would target the posers that are attempting to use the military uniform to discredit the government. You show up to an "Occupy" event in uniform, it should be open season as well. (end of rant) I know I am harsh, but I have deserved my right to be harsh to communists  -PC- edit- spelling During the RNC in Saint Paul I think they told the protesters about 50 times before they got the flash bangs and teargas and they still complained  |
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Posted: 10/27/2011 5:06:11 PM EDT
[#6]
Quoted:
As I remember it she was one of the ones blocking access to supply ships for our troops. Fuck her she diserved what she got. Non violent protesters do NOT deserve to be shot for exercising a constitutional right. However, blocking a GI supply convoy is not part of a non violent protest. It is out and out treason and aiding and comforting the enemy. If the troops cleared the way with M-60s I would have NO problem |
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Posted: 10/27/2011 5:38:52 PM EDT
[#7]
When you are protesting something and you have been at it for awhile (days, weeks, etc), and the Cops show up in riot gear and tell you to go home. You should go home. It won't hurt as much as the alternative.
Vulcan94 |
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Posted: 10/27/2011 5:48:57 PM EDT
[#8]
Quoted:
big league chew 
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Posted: 10/27/2011 5:51:05 PM EDT
[#9]
Quoted: Non-violent protester don't get shot with crowd control devices, rioters do. I heard the same thing said in 1770.  |
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Posted: 10/27/2011 5:54:32 PM EDT
[#10]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Non-violent protester don't get shot with crowd control devices, rioters do. I heard the same thing said in 1770.
<whining>But that was different </whining> |
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Posted: 10/27/2011 5:55:50 PM EDT
[#11]
Looks like she needs a shower.
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Posted: 10/27/2011 6:01:52 PM EDT
[#12]
Quoted: The fact that someone brought it up at all means there have been "allegations." Doesn't mean it actually happened, but the fact that people have been talking about it for 40 years means this:Quoted: Quoted: Most of the cops and citizens of Kent, Ohio in the early 70s would probably agree. Hasn't there always been allegations that someone fired a pistol at the NG first? No. I was a Portage County Deputy in the 80s and trained by Deputies that were there that day. All of them thought it was a needless tragedy. None of them, based upon what they personally experienced would have fired into the crowd or anywhere else that day. allegationsplural of al·le·ga·tion
Whether or not it actually happened, it's been well established that Kent State (and anti-war protestors in general) were not nonviolent in the least. |
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Posted: 10/27/2011 6:07:59 PM EDT
[#13]
Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Non-violent protester don't get shot with crowd control devices, rioters do. I heard the same thing said in 1770. <whining>But that was different </whining> If you are a government and you've got an angry group of people on your hands, if you can convince the majority of the populace that they are "rioters", then most people will cheer you on when you finally crack down on them. Its just a fact of history. |
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Posted: 10/27/2011 7:57:39 PM EDT
[#14]
Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Non-violent protester don't get shot with crowd control devices, rioters do. Unless the organization you are protesting donated $4.6 million to the NYPD... wanna talk about Soros for a while? Why what police department did he bribe to use as his personal security. |
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Posted: 10/27/2011 8:01:16 PM EDT
[#15]
I'd still hit it.
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Posted: 10/27/2011 8:05:10 PM EDT
[#16]
Quoted:
Saw this on Facebook. Anyone know the backstory? I want to get the facts before jumping into the melee. http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y126/von_landstuhl/AR15/occupy.jpg she's alive isn't she? she's breathing isn't she? Safe and deterrent dont always belong in the same sentence |
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Posted: 10/27/2011 8:18:53 PM EDT
[#17]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Saw this on Facebook. Anyone know the backstory? I want to get the facts before jumping into the melee. http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y126/von_landstuhl/AR15/occupy.jpg she's alive isn't she? she's breathing isn't she? Safe and deterrent dont always belong in the same sentence Had that been 00 Buck she would not have her snivelly little picture taken unless she was laid out in a box. |
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Posted: 10/27/2011 8:19:20 PM EDT
[#18]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Saw this on Facebook. Anyone know the backstory? I want to get the facts before jumping into the melee. http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y126/von_landstuhl/AR15/occupy.jpg she's alive isn't she? she's breathing isn't she? Safe and deterrent dont always belong in the same sentence Had that been 00 Buck she would not have her snivelly little picture taken unless she was laid out in a box. |
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Posted: 10/27/2011 8:22:39 PM EDT
[#19]
I thought she was giving free blow jobs, and someone kicked her in the side of the head and she bit down on the dudes junk and severed his penis?
Than again, she may be into BDSM?
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Posted: 10/27/2011 8:37:03 PM EDT
[#20]
Quoted:
This non-violent dude got it in the back. Twice. He doesn't look like a hippy. Must be a homo. http://www.commondreams.org/headlines03/images/0407-08.jpg double tap.....sweet!..... although grouping could of been a little better sometimes cops get all the fun
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Posted: 10/27/2011 8:40:43 PM EDT
[#21]
consequences . . . . life has them
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Posted: 10/27/2011 8:40:53 PM EDT
[#22]
Quoted:
I thought she was giving free blow jobs, and someone kicked her in the side of the head and she bit down on the dudes junk and severed his penis? Than again, she may be into BDSM? i thought that as well, or maybe just boils or something |
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Posted: 10/27/2011 9:40:31 PM EDT
[#23]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Non-violent protester don't get shot with crowd control devices, rioters do. Unless the organization you are protesting donated $4.6 million to the NYPD... wanna talk about Soros for a while? Why what police department did he bribe to use as his personal security. Didn't have to bribe the police...he went over their heads...to Bloomberg. |
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Posted: 10/27/2011 10:11:55 PM EDT
[#24]
Non of the OWS shitstains are non-violent. They are hyper violent hypocrites. They are petitioning for more force to be used to render more money from producers so it can be given to them.
They are violent and delusional. |
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Posted: 10/27/2011 10:38:52 PM EDT
[#25]
What is your definition of violence/non-violent?
You should not use violence against us, so we can with less effort and without having to use or risk violence ourselves take what we want from you. |
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Posted: 10/27/2011 11:00:08 PM EDT
[#26]
Quoted:
The shock value intended on that photo is about as effective as the "This is your brain on drugs" promos from way back. 404: Brain Not Found. Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile |
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Posted: 10/27/2011 11:00:59 PM EDT
[#27]
Quoted:
I'd still hit it. With a wooden dowel? Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile |
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Posted: 10/27/2011 11:15:46 PM EDT
[#28]
If I recall the incident related to that picutre was a leftist protest/blocade of the port of Oakland for some inane reason or another. The mob was non-violently depriving folks of their livlihoods by occupying a public road and the local constabulary dispersed them with rubber bullets. The police were supposed to aim below the waist but of course if your fellows knock you down while fleeing the rubber bullets, the below the waist precaution might not be 100% effective.
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Posted: 10/27/2011 11:24:56 PM EDT
[#29]
Quoted:
I mostly agree. The instant a "demonstration" becomes a "riot", however (or the instant a single rock/bottle/whatever gets thrown), it's on like donkeykong and if you're caught in the middle it just plain sucks to be you (and it's your own damned fault). Sums up my feelings. Stay within the First Amendment and you can march about and chant slogans til your feet give out and your voice becomes hoarse. That's the American way. Throw a rock or brick at the po-po and the po-po will defend themselves. That's also the American way. |
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Posted: 10/27/2011 11:40:39 PM EDT
[#30]
Quoted:
.If you are a government and you've got an angry group of people on your hands, if you can convince the majority of the populace that they are "rioters", then most people will cheer you on when you finally crack down on them. Its just a fact of history. QFT |
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Posted: 10/27/2011 11:42:20 PM EDT
[#31]
That's not getting shot
That's a bitch slap at a distance  |
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Posted: 10/27/2011 11:44:08 PM EDT
[#32]
Quoted:
Non-violent protester don't get shot with crowd control devices, rioters do. Right. Clearly the cops have never advanced on a non-violent crowd before. Explain to me why crowd control couldn't be limited to flash bangs and tear gas? |
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Posted: 10/27/2011 11:46:05 PM EDT
[#33]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Non-violent protester don't get shot with crowd control devices, rioters do. Right. Clearly the cops have never advanced on a non-violent crowd before. Explain to me why crowd control couldn't be limited to flash bangs and tear gas? Because rubber bullets have an expiration date...they are just making sure the tax payers get their money out of it, instead of it going to waste. 
I am OK with this. -PC- |
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Posted: 10/28/2011 12:58:02 AM EDT
[#34]
Quoted:
Saw this on Facebook. Anyone know the backstory? I want to get the facts before jumping into the melee. http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y126/von_landstuhl/AR15/occupy.jpg Y'know.... I'm starting to see this chick in side-by-sides with that Marine who got nailed in Oakland. Some people are definitely trying to conflate the two incidents. All of this has happened before, it will happen again. |
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Posted: 10/28/2011 1:21:44 AM EDT
[#35]
Quoted:
Non-violent protester don't get shot with crowd control devices, rioters do. this just because you are not actively committing violence, in a riot situation where violence is being committed, the order is given to disperse the crowd. dont disperse, you get shot at with crowd control devices. |
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Posted: 10/28/2011 1:24:53 AM EDT
[#36]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Non-violent protester don't get shot with crowd control devices, rioters do. Right. Clearly the cops have never advanced on a non-violent crowd before. Explain to me why crowd control couldn't be limited to flash bangs and tear gas? 
So getting gassed and flashbanged is somehow better than getting hit by a non-lethal projectile. That's like saying getting stabbed by a folding knife is worse than getting stabbed by a knife of the same size, but with a fixed blade. Seriously did you think about what you are posting. It's bad to get hit be a rubber bullet, but chemical irritants are ok. 
Clearly the police do advance on non-violent crowds. Crowds that have been non-compliant when told to leave the area, get out of the street, stop setting stuff on fire, etc. Ask people to comply with the law. Tell people to comply with the law. Make people comply with the law. At any point that progression can be stopped by obeying the law. Chris Rock did a video on it, perhaps you should watch it. |
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Posted: 10/28/2011 1:52:39 AM EDT
[#37]
Once they disrupt law and order........something has to be done.
They are warned........told to move on..........they don't listen and get moved out by force. I don't see any other way to restore law and order. |
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Posted: 10/28/2011 2:26:48 AM EDT
[#38]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Non-violent protester don't get shot with crowd control devices, rioters do. Right. Clearly the cops have never advanced on a non-violent crowd before. Explain to me why crowd control couldn't be limited to flash bangs and tear gas?
So getting gassed and flashbanged is somehow better than getting hit by a non-lethal LESS THEN LETHAL projectile. That's like saying getting stabbed by a folding knife is worse than getting stabbed by a knife of the same size, but with a fixed blade. Seriously did you think about what you are posting. It's bad to get hit be a rubber bullet, but chemical irritants are ok.
Clearly the police do advance on non-violent crowds. Crowds that have been non-compliant when told to leave the area, get out of the street, stop setting stuff on fire, etc. Ask people to comply with the law. Tell people to comply with the law. Make people comply with the law. At any point that progression can be stopped by obeying the law. Chris Rock did a video on it, perhaps you should watch it. Fixed, I know you know better then to claim that shooting someone in the head with crowd control munitions is non-lethal force, in fact I bet your departments UOF manuals list it as lethal force. |
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Posted: 10/28/2011 2:45:52 AM EDT
[#39]
My response to that picture has been this:
I agree, however protesters who charge a riot line and throw rocks do deserve an escalation of force. It's all about context, and this picture lacks any. Having seen what real bullets do, I think the above photo does illustrate a safe deterrent compared to the alternative. |
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Posted: 10/28/2011 2:55:08 AM EDT
[#40]
I've scrubbed that video at least a dozen times. He wasn't shot. He was hit by something that exploded out of something else about 6 feet away.
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Posted: 10/28/2011 3:01:50 AM EDT
[#41]
Quoted: Looks like maybe she took an FN303 round or two or maybe rubber slugs to the jaw? Regardless of what the scenario was that led up to that, a head shot is always a no no with any less-leathal deployment, someone messed up on that one pretty bad. I took a rond from an FN303 to the head with a level IIIA balistic helmet on and it still rang my bell, I can only imagine how bad that hurt. We were using training rounds and the rounds we received from FN were apperebtly recalled for terrible accuracy issues. We didn't find that out until after I took the one to the helmet (which was aimed at my back, center mass). The known fatal shooting with an FN was in Boston durring a riot, where a male was shot in the eye while on the run behind the actual target. It was a straight up accident, but as we all know, accidents with weapons of any kind are never acceptable regardless of the scenario. Y you contradict yourself? |
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Posted: 10/28/2011 3:20:06 AM EDT
[#42]
Quoted: Or just zip-ties and dragging them away, I am sure everyone down there understands there is a possibility of getting arrested.Quoted: Non-violent protester don't get shot with crowd control devices, rioters do. Right. Clearly the cops have never advanced on a non-violent crowd before. Explain to me why crowd control couldn't be limited to flash bangs and tear gas? |
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Posted: 10/28/2011 3:28:05 AM EDT
[#43]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Non-violent protester don't get shot with crowd control devices, rioters do. Right. Clearly the cops have never advanced on a non-violent crowd before. Explain to me why crowd control couldn't be limited to flash bangs and tear gas?
So getting gassed and flashbanged is somehow better than getting hit by a non-lethal LESS THEN LETHAL projectile. That's like saying getting stabbed by a folding knife is worse than getting stabbed by a knife of the same size, but with a fixed blade. Seriously did you think about what you are posting. It's bad to get hit be a rubber bullet, but chemical irritants are ok.
Clearly the police do advance on non-violent crowds. Crowds that have been non-compliant when told to leave the area, get out of the street, stop setting stuff on fire, etc. Ask people to comply with the law. Tell people to comply with the law. Make people comply with the law. At any point that progression can be stopped by obeying the law. Chris Rock did a video on it, perhaps you should watch it. Fixed, I know you know better then to claim that shooting someone in the head with crowd control munitions is non-lethal force, in fact I bet your departments UOF manuals list it as lethal force. I'm not advocating misusing the weapons. |
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Posted: 10/28/2011 3:31:37 AM EDT
[#44]
Quoted:
Looks like maybe she took an FN303 round or two or maybe rubber slugs to the jaw? Regardless of what the scenario was that led up to that, a head shot is always a no no with any less-leathal deployment, someone messed up on that one pretty bad. I took a rond from an FN303 to the head with a level IIIA balistic helmet on and it still rang my bell, I can only imagine how bad that hurt. We were using training rounds and the rounds we received from FN were apperebtly recalled for terrible accuracy issues. We didn't find that out until after I took the one to the helmet (which was aimed at my back, center mass). The known fatal shooting with an FN was in Boston durring a riot, where a male was shot in the eye while on the run behind the actual target. It was a straight up accident, but as we all know, accidents with weapons of any kind are never acceptable regardless of the scenario. BS. unless you have a time machine, accidents happen all the time, humans can't make the world free from accidents, we do our best, but sometimes the best falls short. that's reality, that's life. |
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Posted: 10/28/2011 4:13:05 AM EDT
[#45]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Non-violent protester don't get shot with crowd control devices, rioters do. Right. Clearly the cops have never advanced on a non-violent crowd before. Explain to me why crowd control couldn't be limited to flash bangs and tear gas?
So getting gassed and flashbanged is somehow better than getting hit by a non-lethal LESS THEN LETHAL projectile. That's like saying getting stabbed by a folding knife is worse than getting stabbed by a knife of the same size, but with a fixed blade. Seriously did you think about what you are posting. It's bad to get hit be a rubber bullet, but chemical irritants are ok.
Clearly the police do advance on non-violent crowds. Crowds that have been non-compliant when told to leave the area, get out of the street, stop setting stuff on fire, etc. Ask people to comply with the law. Tell people to comply with the law. Make people comply with the law. At any point that progression can be stopped by obeying the law. Chris Rock did a video on it, perhaps you should watch it. Fixed, I know you know better then to claim that shooting someone in the head with crowd control munitions is non-lethal force, in fact I bet your departments UOF manuals list it as lethal force. I'm not advocating misusing the weapons. I know you weren't but crowd control munitions, even under ideal conditions are less then lethal, not non-lethal. |
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Posted: 10/28/2011 4:19:24 AM EDT
[#46]
Quoted:
I know you weren't but crowd control munitions, even under ideal conditions are less then lethal, not non-lethal. The correct term is "less lethal". Meaining they aren't designed to be lethal, but can inflict lethal wounds under some circumstances. Less than lethal is no longer the current buzz phrase. ––––––––––––––––––––––––––- When I said "non-lethal", I was kinda refering to the woman that had the big welt/bruise/swelling. Since she had been hit, and survived, that was a non-lethal round. |
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Posted: 10/28/2011 4:19:50 AM EDT
[#47]
Quoted:
old picture, can't recall the specifics, but an old picture this.........very old........like me.........
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Posted: 10/28/2011 4:25:08 AM EDT
[#48]
Quoted:
Most of the cops and citizens of Kent, Ohio in the early 70s would probably agree. Yeah, but how many riots have there been at Kent State since 1970? Teachable moment. |
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Posted: 10/28/2011 4:56:31 AM EDT
[#49]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Non-violent protester don't get shot with crowd control devices, rioters do. I heard the same thing said in 1770.
And John Adams argued convincingly in Defense of the soldiers charged. |
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Posted: 10/28/2011 4:58:31 AM EDT
[#50]
Quoted:
Looks like maybe she took an FN303 round or two or maybe rubber slugs to the jaw? Regardless of what the scenario was that led up to that, a head shot is always a no no with any less-leathal deployment, someone messed up on that one pretty bad. I took a rond from an FN303 to the head with a level IIIA balistic helmet on and it still rang my bell, I can only imagine how bad that hurt. We were using training rounds and the rounds we received from FN were apperebtly recalled for terrible accuracy issues. We didn't find that out until after I took the one to the helmet (which was aimed at my back, center mass). The known fatal shooting with an FN was in Boston durring a riot, where a male was shot in the eye while on the run behind the actual target. It was a straight up accident, but as we all know, accidents with weapons of any kind are never acceptable regardless of the scenario. Female, Victoria Snellgrove. She was not involved in the violence and the officer firing the weapon was not certified in it's use. As I understood it at the time he was supposed to be raking the ground to release gas but was shooting people. |
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