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Posted: 12/11/2014 4:57:56 PM EDT
[#1]
Do it. There are jobs that build time that don't look great on a resume, this is not one of them.
ETA: Tell him every time you find yourself close to 50 miles from where you took off, you are landing for a pee break (or just a touch and go). |
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Posted: 12/11/2014 5:07:14 PM EDT
[#2]
Hell yes do it. What do you think Maritime Patrol pilots do for most of their time on station? Or tanker pilots? They fly in big circles (ok, sometimes triangles or racetracks). You'd better believe the log every single hour, not just transit time.
Privacy concerns? You have no expectation of privacy in public. If nothing else, it's free stick time. |
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Posted: 12/11/2014 5:10:39 PM EDT
[#3]
Hours are hours.
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Posted: 12/11/2014 5:49:45 PM EDT
[#4]
There was a time when working for free was frowned upon in most aviation circles. I guess it doesn't matter these days.
Before you go, research thoroughly whether or not you actually need a commercial certificate. |
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Posted: 12/11/2014 6:06:27 PM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
There was a time when working for free was frowned upon in most aviation circles. I guess it doesn't matter these days. Before you go, research thoroughly whether or not you actually need a commercial certificate. You may well be right. I'll be asking around and researching to make double-sure. I don't think the FAA's stance on "free hours" qualifying as compensation has changed so I'm a little concerned. |
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Posted: 12/11/2014 6:14:10 PM EDT
[#6]
4th amendment
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Posted: 12/11/2014 6:27:22 PM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You may well be right. I'll be asking around and researching to make double-sure. I don't think the FAA's stance on "free hours" qualifying as compensation has changed so I'm a little concerned. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
There was a time when working for free was frowned upon in most aviation circles. I guess it doesn't matter these days. Before you go, research thoroughly whether or not you actually need a commercial certificate. You may well be right. I'll be asking around and researching to make double-sure. I don't think the FAA's stance on "free hours" qualifying as compensation has changed so I'm a little concerned. Food for thought... I wouldn't worry about the "free" hours being counted as compensation. I would worry about how incidental the flying is to a product that wouldn't exist without it. I'd also wonder if the mechanic who allegedly maintains these airplanes also works for free. Operations that cut one big corner, usually cut all corners. |
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Posted: 12/11/2014 6:28:45 PM EDT
[#8]
Almost every type of professional pilot has a large portion of their hours turning circles in the sky. Maybe not rotes, but fixed wing for sure.
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Posted: 12/11/2014 6:35:36 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Food for thought... I wouldn't worry about the "free" hours being counted as compensation. I would worry about how incidental the flying is to a product that wouldn't exist without it. I'd also wonder if the mechanic who allegedly maintains these airplanes also works for free. Operations that cut one big corner, usually cut all corners. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
There was a time when working for free was frowned upon in most aviation circles. I guess it doesn't matter these days. Before you go, research thoroughly whether or not you actually need a commercial certificate. You may well be right. I'll be asking around and researching to make double-sure. I don't think the FAA's stance on "free hours" qualifying as compensation has changed so I'm a little concerned. Food for thought... I wouldn't worry about the "free" hours being counted as compensation. I would worry about how incidental the flying is to a product that wouldn't exist without it. I'd also wonder if the mechanic who allegedly maintains these airplanes also works for free. Operations that cut one big corner, usually cut all corners. Thanks. I just asked this on an aviation forum and got that same article. The consensus seems to be that it is illegal on all fronts for a PPL to do this. Sounds like I'm SOL. (BTW, the guy also owns the FBO so the mechanic is paid.) |
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Posted: 12/11/2014 6:39:36 PM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Food for thought... I wouldn't worry about the "free" hours being counted as compensation. I would worry about how incidental the flying is to a product that wouldn't exist without it. I'd also wonder if the mechanic who allegedly maintains these airplanes also works for free. Operations that cut one big corner, usually cut all corners. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
There was a time when working for free was frowned upon in most aviation circles. I guess it doesn't matter these days. Before you go, research thoroughly whether or not you actually need a commercial certificate. You may well be right. I'll be asking around and researching to make double-sure. I don't think the FAA's stance on "free hours" qualifying as compensation has changed so I'm a little concerned. Food for thought... I wouldn't worry about the "free" hours being counted as compensation. I would worry about how incidental the flying is to a product that wouldn't exist without it. I'd also wonder if the mechanic who allegedly maintains these airplanes also works for free. Operations that cut one big corner, usually cut all corners. I'm no commercial pilot but that sound fishy. Remember a mortician that just so happened to be a private pilot flying dead people around. FAA ruled it was illegal with just a private ticket. |
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Posted: 12/11/2014 10:24:34 PM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
4th amendment Doesn't apply. Take the job. |
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Posted: 12/11/2014 10:59:38 PM EDT
[#12]
If it's FAA legal, take the job. Don't be a dumbass...
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Posted: 12/12/2014 1:29:51 AM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
If it's FFA legal, take the job. Don't be a dumbass... Point taken. 
Did some research and it does not seem kosher to the FAA. I'll talk with the guy and see where he's getting his info. Unless he has an opinion from the FSDO or something, it doesn't look good. |
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Posted: 12/12/2014 11:28:56 AM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Point taken.
Did some research and it does not seem kosher to the FAA. I'll talk with the guy and see where he's getting his info. Unless he has an opinion from the FSDO or something, it doesn't look good. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
If it's FFA legal, take the job. Don't be a dumbass... Point taken.
Did some research and it does not seem kosher to the FAA. I'll talk with the guy and see where he's getting his info. Unless he has an opinion from the FSDO or something, it doesn't look good. One FSDO can differ 180 degrees from the next one. |
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Posted: 12/13/2014 1:00:49 AM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted: One FSDO can differ 180 degrees from the next one. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: If it's FFA legal, take the job. Don't be a dumbass... Point taken. Did some research and it does not seem kosher to the FAA. I'll talk with the guy and see where he's getting his info. Unless he has an opinion from the FSDO or something, it doesn't look good. One FSDO can differ 180 degrees from the next one. |
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Posted: 12/13/2014 5:56:56 PM EDT
[#16]
Intern position as it doesn't pay anything. Great another cheap ass business owner, with a position that obviously needs a commercial pilot, fucking over the piloting profession.
The owner is getting big bucks with his government contract, don't let him screw you over. |
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Posted: 12/13/2014 9:28:11 PM EDT
[#17]
If you are going to fly for free to build hours, don't advertise it, especially when you are trying to interview for another job. The ugly secret is that most of us have done it to some extent, but most pilots despise the real whores, and for good reason.
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Posted: 12/14/2014 2:53:27 AM EDT
[#18]
I read too quickly and didn't realize you were talking about flying for free, for someone else's business. My answer would have been different.
Fuck cheap bastards who capitalize on low time pilots willing to work for free. |
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Posted: 12/14/2014 9:05:18 AM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
One FSDO can differ 180 degrees from the next one. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
If it's FFA legal, take the job. Don't be a dumbass... Point taken.
Did some research and it does not seem kosher to the FAA. I'll talk with the guy and see where he's getting his info. Unless he has an opinion from the FSDO or something, it doesn't look good. One FSDO can differ 180 degrees from the next one. That is what the FAA calls standardization. Go to one FSDO, ask 10 feds there the same question, get 15 different answers. After 41 years in the business, that is my story and I am sticking to it. |
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Posted: 12/14/2014 9:43:28 AM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Intern position as it doesn't pay anything. Great another cheap ass business owner, with a position that obviously needs a commercial pilot, fucking over the piloting profession. The owner is getting big bucks with his government contract, don't let him screw you over. Small drop zone operators do this all the time. One I jumped at in Canada though, insisted on paying all his pilots because he wanted professionals. Not that that really meant anything, but it's how he wanted it. They even got paid a small honorarium for showing up and not flying because of weather. |
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Posted: 12/14/2014 9:53:39 AM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I read too quickly and didn't realize you were talking about flying for free, for someone else's business. My answer would have been different. Fuck cheap bastards who capitalize on low time pilots willing to work for free. Not so fast ... a 206 ain't cheap and neither is an hour of fuel ... sounds like a win-win to me. |
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Posted: 12/14/2014 3:53:24 PM EDT
[#22]
Really? Thats a pretty dumb thing to say.
I was told at a young age, if you do work, you get PAID. None of this experiance trade off bullshit. Do welders work for free to gain esperiance? What about doctors? Police? Lawyers? Sure all work lower paid entry positions, but they all got paid. Life isn't free. I can't pay for gas to get to work, road food on top of other life expenses with logbook entries. Almost every pilot at one time or another was fucked over by some shady asshole trying to get over on young pilots wanting experiance. Every shady asshole was your best friend, right up until you left for another gig. Then they MF'd you at every chance they could get and talked about how they gave you your start in the industry. F them and every other bastard making money off of people who do work for them without real financial payment. |
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Posted: 12/14/2014 4:34:06 PM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Really? Thats a pretty dumb thing to say. I was told at a young age, if you do work, you get PAID. None of this experiance trade off bullshit. Do welders work for free to gain esperiance? What about doctors? Police? Lawyers? Sure all work lower paid entry positions, but they all got paid. Life isn't free. I can't pay for gas to get to work, road food on top of other life expenses with logbook entries. Almost every pilot at one time or another was fucked over by some shady asshole trying to get over on young pilots wanting experiance. Every shady asshole was your best friend, right up until you left for another gig. Then they MF'd you at every chance they could get and talked about how they gave you your start in the industry. F them and every other bastard making money off of people who do work for them without real financial payment. Go rent a plane and pour gas in until you've sweetened your resume. ETA - I bet you're ready to kill any neighbor stupid enough to loan you a tractor. 
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Posted: 12/14/2014 4:55:34 PM EDT
[#24]
Nevrmind.
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Posted: 12/14/2014 4:56:54 PM EDT
[#25]
Neighbor loans me a tractor? He'll be getting it back full of gas and some other unexpected surprise to follow (dinner out for his family or maybe a nice bottle for his troubles).
These two things are not comparable. What you are alluding to would be like the neighbor loaning me his tractor so I could cultivate HIS field for him. Out of the goodness of his heart mind you. Next time your daughter needs a minor medical procedure, you could just take her down to the local pre-med school and find someone just entering the program to do it for free, you know, just for the experience. How's that sound? Then, after its done, go brag to your family doc about how much money you saved and see how he feels about it. Professional pilots have some fairly strongly rooted opinions on this matter, and for good reason. |
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Posted: 12/14/2014 5:02:28 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Neighbor loans me a tractor? He'll be getting it back full of gas and some other unexpected surprise to follow (dinner out for his family or maybe a nice bottle for his troubles). These two things are not comparable. What you are alluding to would be like the neighbor loaning me his tractor so I could cultivate HIS field for him. Out of the goodness of his heart mind you. You're wrong again. What I am alluding to is since the big boys want to see 200 hours of tractor time on my resume', I beg my neighbor to let me log those hours on his tractor. I burn up his engine, his discs, his fuel, but I get to log the 200 hours needed to have tractor street cred. And he gets his field plowed, hence the win-win. |
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Posted: 12/14/2014 5:20:51 PM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You're wrong again. What I am alluding to is since the big boys want to see 200 hours of tractor time on my resume', I beg my neighbor to let me log those hours on his tractor. I burn up his engine, his discs, his fuel, but I get to log the 200 hours needed to have tractor street cred. And he gets his field plowed, hence the win-win. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Neighbor loans me a tractor? He'll be getting it back full of gas and some other unexpected surprise to follow (dinner out for his family or maybe a nice bottle for his troubles). These two things are not comparable. What you are alluding to would be like the neighbor loaning me his tractor so I could cultivate HIS field for him. Out of the goodness of his heart mind you. You're wrong again. What I am alluding to is since the big boys want to see 200 hours of tractor time on my resume', I beg my neighbor to let me log those hours on his tractor. I burn up his engine, his discs, his fuel, but I get to log the 200 hours needed to have tractor street cred. And he gets his field plowed, hence the win-win. Mark do you have any young inexperienced machinist working in your shop, using your machine tools, building your product; and doing it for free so they can get a real job someday? |
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Posted: 12/14/2014 5:39:48 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Mark do you have any young inexperienced machinist working in your shop, using your machine tools, building your product; and doing it for free so they can get a real job someday? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Neighbor loans me a tractor? He'll be getting it back full of gas and some other unexpected surprise to follow (dinner out for his family or maybe a nice bottle for his troubles). These two things are not comparable. What you are alluding to would be like the neighbor loaning me his tractor so I could cultivate HIS field for him. Out of the goodness of his heart mind you. You're wrong again. What I am alluding to is since the big boys want to see 200 hours of tractor time on my resume', I beg my neighbor to let me log those hours on his tractor. I burn up his engine, his discs, his fuel, but I get to log the 200 hours needed to have tractor street cred. And he gets his field plowed, hence the win-win. Mark do you have any young inexperienced machinist working in your shop, using your machine tools, building your product; and doing it for free so they can get a real job someday? Nope, the FAA has no requirement for a minimum amount of hours for commercial machining license, matter of fact, they have no jurisdiction.
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Posted: 12/14/2014 5:49:05 PM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Really? Thats a pretty dumb thing to say. I was told at a young age, if you do work, you get PAID. None of this experiance trade off bullshit. Do welders work for free to gain esperiance? What about doctors? Police? Lawyers? Sure all work lower paid entry positions, but they all got paid. Life isn't free. I can't pay for gas to get to work, road food on top of other life expenses with logbook entries. Almost every pilot at one time or another was fucked over by some shady asshole trying to get over on young pilots wanting experiance. Every shady asshole was your best friend, right up until you left for another gig. Then they MF'd you at every chance they could get and talked about how they gave you your start in the industry. F them and every other bastard making money off of people who do work for them without real financial payment. There is a local PD which is mostly made up of non paid officers straight out of the academy, they get stacks of applications 
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Posted: 12/14/2014 9:51:22 PM EDT
[#30]
Well thanks for the replies. Didn't realize this topic was still active.
I'm not taking the "job." For one, it's not legal and I've talked to other pilots who worked for him (for pay) and there are other issues that make it a bad idea. Totally agree with the sentiment against pilots willing to exploit younger inexperienced pilots. I don't intend to fly for a living, but the experience is necessary for advanced certificates. All that said, not sure I care to be called a "whore" no matter what anyone thinks. 
ETA: all this brings home yet again the fact that there is no free lunch! Gotta work your way up, not expect a handout. |
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Posted: 12/15/2014 12:37:19 AM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Well thanks for the replies. Didn't realize this topic was still active. I'm not taking the "job." For one, it's not legal and I've talked to other pilots who worked for him (for pay) and there are other issues that make it a bad idea. Totally agree with the sentiment against pilots willing to exploit younger inexperienced pilots. I don't intend to fly for a living, but the experience is necessary for advanced certificates. All that said, not sure I care to be called a "whore" no matter what anyone thinks.
ETA: all this brings home yet again the fact that there is no free lunch! Gotta work your way up, not expect a handout. If you don't want to fly for a living, but do want to work towards advanced ratings you should be working on your instrument rating. |
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Posted: 12/15/2014 3:34:47 PM EDT
[#32]
I'm almost sure that flying for free flight time is illegal. I actually got asked about this on my PPL checkride just a few months ago.
I also agree with Mark. If it were legal I would take free flight time in a heartbeat as it is a win-win for both parties.. As a physician, I had to sew up many wounds for free back when I was in medical school. As a resident, if you divided my pay by the number of hours worked (sometimes over 100/week) I made less than minimum wage. Now as an attending physician I can afford to fly but it certainly punches a hole in my wallet. I could have a closet full of LaRue rifles for what I spent on flight time in the past year. Aviation, as everyone here knows is very expensive and increasing by the day. "Free" flight time has a significant monetary value. If it were legal I would take some free flight time to burn holes in the sky above some fields. Sure beats the $175/hr I'm paying right now to rent. 
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Posted: 12/15/2014 6:58:28 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I'm almost sure that flying for free flight time is illegal. I actually got asked about this on my PPL checkride just a few months ago. I also agree with Mark. If it were legal I would take free flight time in a heartbeat as it is a win-win for both parties.. As a physician, I had to sew up many wounds for free back when I was in medical school. As a resident, if you divided my pay by the number of hours worked (sometimes over 100/week) I made less than minimum wage. Now as an attending physician I can afford to fly but it certainly punches a hole in my wallet. I could have a closet full of LaRue rifles for what I spent on flight time in the past year. Aviation, as everyone here knows is very expensive and increasing by the day. "Free" flight time has a significant monetary value. If it were legal I would take some free flight time to burn holes in the sky above some fields. Sure beats the $175/hr I'm paying right now to rent.
What about borrowing a friend's plane once a month to exercise the engine during a $100 burger flight ? |
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Posted: 12/15/2014 7:13:45 PM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted: What about borrowing a friend's plane once a month to exercise the engine during a $100 burger flight ? Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: I'm almost sure that flying for free flight time is illegal. I actually got asked about this on my PPL checkride just a few months ago. I also agree with Mark. If it were legal I would take free flight time in a heartbeat as it is a win-win for both parties.. As a physician, I had to sew up many wounds for free back when I was in medical school. As a resident, if you divided my pay by the number of hours worked (sometimes over 100/week) I made less than minimum wage. Now as an attending physician I can afford to fly but it certainly punches a hole in my wallet. I could have a closet full of LaRue rifles for what I spent on flight time in the past year. Aviation, as everyone here knows is very expensive and increasing by the day. "Free" flight time has a significant monetary value. If it were legal I would take some free flight time to burn holes in the sky above some fields. Sure beats the $175/hr I'm paying right now to rent. What about borrowing a friend's plane once a month to exercise the engine during a $100 burger flight ? |
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Posted: 12/15/2014 10:32:42 PM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
What about borrowing a friend's plane once a month to exercise the engine during a $100 burger flight ? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
I'm almost sure that flying for free flight time is illegal. I actually got asked about this on my PPL checkride just a few months ago. I also agree with Mark. If it were legal I would take free flight time in a heartbeat as it is a win-win for both parties.. As a physician, I had to sew up many wounds for free back when I was in medical school. As a resident, if you divided my pay by the number of hours worked (sometimes over 100/week) I made less than minimum wage. Now as an attending physician I can afford to fly but it certainly punches a hole in my wallet. I could have a closet full of LaRue rifles for what I spent on flight time in the past year. Aviation, as everyone here knows is very expensive and increasing by the day. "Free" flight time has a significant monetary value. If it were legal I would take some free flight time to burn holes in the sky above some fields. Sure beats the $175/hr I'm paying right now to rent.
What about borrowing a friend's plane once a month to exercise the engine during a $100 burger flight ? Good question and certainly a grey area as far as FAA is concerned. If only I could find a friend with a plane who wouldn't mind me taking it a couple times a month. Unfortunately the friends I know with airplanes have planes way above my ability to safely fly. As a physician, I most certainly don't want to die in a Bonanza or a Cirrus. I'd be ashamed to be headlined "killed by the doctor killer". |
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Posted: 12/16/2014 11:14:10 AM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Good question and certainly a grey area as far as FAA is concerned. If only I could find a friend with a plane who wouldn't mind me taking it a couple times a month. Unfortunately the friends I know with airplanes have planes way above my ability to safely fly. As a physician, I most certainly don't want to die in a Bonanza or a Cirrus. I'd be ashamed to be headlined "killed by the doctor killer". Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
I'm almost sure that flying for free flight time is illegal. I actually got asked about this on my PPL checkride just a few months ago. I also agree with Mark. If it were legal I would take free flight time in a heartbeat as it is a win-win for both parties.. As a physician, I had to sew up many wounds for free back when I was in medical school. As a resident, if you divided my pay by the number of hours worked (sometimes over 100/week) I made less than minimum wage. Now as an attending physician I can afford to fly but it certainly punches a hole in my wallet. I could have a closet full of LaRue rifles for what I spent on flight time in the past year. Aviation, as everyone here knows is very expensive and increasing by the day. "Free" flight time has a significant monetary value. If it were legal I would take some free flight time to burn holes in the sky above some fields. Sure beats the $175/hr I'm paying right now to rent.
What about borrowing a friend's plane once a month to exercise the engine during a $100 burger flight ? Good question and certainly a grey area as far as FAA is concerned. If only I could find a friend with a plane who wouldn't mind me taking it a couple times a month. Unfortunately the friends I know with airplanes have planes way above my ability to safely fly. As a physician, I most certainly don't want to die in a Bonanza or a Cirrus. I'd be ashamed to be headlined "killed by the doctor killer". Using someone's plane is entirely legal IMHO. |
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Posted: 12/16/2014 12:44:26 PM EDT
[#37]
I would think that flying a friends plane for free would be fine. The intent of the FAA rule is to prevent some PPL idiot form trying to make money by flying people or airplanes around. That's understandable. I wouldn't think they would care about a guy flying his buddy's airplane. They would likely care about a PPL guy flying a plane for free (or pay) to inspect fields for a small company. I like one poster's idea. Call up a FSDO and if they say it's OK get it in writing. Easy.
This is all just my opinion of course. And I'm just a doctor and we know the reputation of doctors in aviation. 
I had a situation come up where I was asked to ferry an airplane for the flight school from one airport to another. It was basically asked as a favor and of course I would not have to pay for time. I told the owner of the school that this may be illegal as it would be considered free flight time. He said he hadn't thought about it like that and we mulled around the idea of whether it was legal or not. Who knows? |
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Posted: 12/17/2014 12:28:08 AM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Good question and certainly a grey area as far as FAA is concerned. If only I could find a friend with a plane who wouldn't mind me taking it a couple times a month. Unfortunately the friends I know with airplanes have planes way above my ability to safely fly. As a physician, I most certainly don't want to die in a Bonanza or a Cirrus. I'd be ashamed to be headlined "killed by the doctor killer". Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
I'm almost sure that flying for free flight time is illegal. I actually got asked about this on my PPL checkride just a few months ago. I also agree with Mark. If it were legal I would take free flight time in a heartbeat as it is a win-win for both parties.. As a physician, I had to sew up many wounds for free back when I was in medical school. As a resident, if you divided my pay by the number of hours worked (sometimes over 100/week) I made less than minimum wage. Now as an attending physician I can afford to fly but it certainly punches a hole in my wallet. I could have a closet full of LaRue rifles for what I spent on flight time in the past year. Aviation, as everyone here knows is very expensive and increasing by the day. "Free" flight time has a significant monetary value. If it were legal I would take some free flight time to burn holes in the sky above some fields. Sure beats the $175/hr I'm paying right now to rent.
What about borrowing a friend's plane once a month to exercise the engine during a $100 burger flight ? Good question and certainly a grey area as far as FAA is concerned. If only I could find a friend with a plane who wouldn't mind me taking it a couple times a month. Unfortunately the friends I know with airplanes have planes way above my ability to safely fly. As a physician, I most certainly don't want to die in a Bonanza or a Cirrus. I'd be ashamed to be headlined "killed by the doctor killer". Well, plus, the Screen Name would make it extra ironic. |
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Posted: 12/17/2014 8:33:41 PM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Good question and certainly a grey area as far as FAA is concerned. If only I could find a friend with a plane who wouldn't mind me taking it a couple times a month. Unfortunately the friends I know with airplanes have planes way above my ability to safely fly. As a physician, I most certainly don't want to die in a Bonanza or a Cirrus. I'd be ashamed to be headlined "killed by the doctor killer". Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
I'm almost sure that flying for free flight time is illegal. I actually got asked about this on my PPL checkride just a few months ago. I also agree with Mark. If it were legal I would take free flight time in a heartbeat as it is a win-win for both parties.. As a physician, I had to sew up many wounds for free back when I was in medical school. As a resident, if you divided my pay by the number of hours worked (sometimes over 100/week) I made less than minimum wage. Now as an attending physician I can afford to fly but it certainly punches a hole in my wallet. I could have a closet full of LaRue rifles for what I spent on flight time in the past year. Aviation, as everyone here knows is very expensive and increasing by the day. "Free" flight time has a significant monetary value. If it were legal I would take some free flight time to burn holes in the sky above some fields. Sure beats the $175/hr I'm paying right now to rent.
What about borrowing a friend's plane once a month to exercise the engine during a $100 burger flight ? Good question and certainly a grey area as far as FAA is concerned. If only I could find a friend with a plane who wouldn't mind me taking it a couple times a month. Unfortunately the friends I know with airplanes have planes way above my ability to safely fly. As a physician, I most certainly don't want to die in a Bonanza or a Cirrus. I'd be ashamed to be headlined "killed by the doctor killer". My kids' doctor has a Bonanza with "Doctor Killer" painted in small script on the tail. He said accident investigators have a shitty job and finding that note might lighten their mood one day. :) |
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Posted: 12/21/2014 1:25:22 AM EDT
[#40]
Quoted:
So I got to know the owner of an aerial surveillance company at my local airport and he offered me a position flying his C206 camera system and later the Cirrus. It would be an intern position to build time and I don't need an IR or commercial because of how the FAA classifies the work, flying is "incidental" to it. Sounds interesting, particularly since my part-time/hourly job allows for it, but I have some concerns. 1. Is this a waste of time? You're on station for 3-6 hours so you're getting "flight time" technically, but it's pretty much running in a big circle with the camera humming. Is that pretty much worthless? 2. What doest the hive think of the privacy concerns? He contracts with LE depts for certain occasions, claims to have watched over 30 murders and gotten confessions for over 70. Nothing that he's doing now gives me any concerns, but....you know how that goes. It's a slippery slope. I can barely afford to fly as it is with life and the shooting "problem" (haven't been up in 7 weeks) so this sounds interesting. I'm not going to the airlines or anything but I'm looking to build time for the IR and commercial. I'd appreciate any thoughts. (I have another possible opportunity for towing gliders in a Pawnee as part of a club, but that requires a significant investment in a glider rating and membership up front. May happen later.) If this guy is doing that much work with the aircraft it's more than incidental. You better make sure or you're going to throw away a lot of money that you've already spent on ratings. |
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Posted: 12/21/2014 1:27:23 AM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Well thanks for the replies. Didn't realize this topic was still active. I'm not taking the "job." For one, it's not legal and I've talked to other pilots who worked for him (for pay) and there are other issues that make it a bad idea. Totally agree with the sentiment against pilots willing to exploit younger inexperienced pilots. I don't intend to fly for a living, but the experience is necessary for advanced certificates. All that said, not sure I care to be called a "whore" no matter what anyone thinks.
ETA: all this brings home yet again the fact that there is no free lunch! Gotta work your way up, not expect a handout. I read this after I posted. I figured I was right about it not being legal. You need to get your instrument and commercial before you go flying for money and even then, you're going to be wet behind the ears and dangerous for a while. |
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Posted: 12/21/2014 6:03:29 PM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Hell yes do it. What do you think Maritime Patrol pilots do for most of their time on station? Or tanker pilots? They fly in big circles (ok, sometimes triangles or racetracks). You'd better believe the log every single hour, not just transit time. Privacy concerns? You have no expectation of privacy in public. If nothing else, it's free stick time. This. |
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