In reviewing my electrical system in the home I found two weird breakers.

I'm assuming these breakers, the ones with the yellow 'test' button, are old GFCI breakers which were put in when GFCI was needed but also where the the item being fed could not accomodate a GFCI outlet that could be reset.

The problem is that they are loose and wobble - a lot. The pictures below show a small pool sub-panel and my main house feed panel. The smaller pool panel with the 15A GFCI breaker wobbles around about 1/2" up and down and the other two pole breakers in the box also do not line up making the cover for the sub panel not close properly. It looks like the bus bar black plastic in the box is warped maybe causing this? Could the 15A GFCI be bad and just loose and need a new one?

The second photo of the main house feed panel also has a GFCI breaker that used to feed an old in-home jet tub with pump but that has since been removed and the line was converted to a 20A GFCI outlet. Is it necessary to have both a GFCI 20A outlet in the wall AND this 20A GFCI breaker or should this breaker be removed. Is double GFCI a thing that is OK to do or were the electricians just lazy? Is it better to have a regular outlet in the home and keep the GFCI breaker and just label it as GFCI with a sticker?

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I'm not seeing a neutral bar in that sub-panel with the loose QO GFCI bkr. Looks like the feeder neutral, GFCI neutral pigtail & branch neutral are all under a single wire nut. Am I seeing that correctly?

Also, redundant GFCIs are not kosher. There should only be one on a circuit unless they are in parallel. A GFCI bkr will not be in parallel with a GFCI receptacle...

Also, where do those #10s that are tapped to the bus (above the lugs at the bottom of the bus bars) in your main go to?...

As for the neutral...I guess? The green wires are connected to a common ground bar it seems but there is no white neutral wire connected to any bus bars, no.

Ok - So I will either remove the 20A GFCI receptable or the breaker but not keep both in the main panel.



Good question - I did notice those in there and thought about why something would not be going to a breaker, I will check as soon as I can and report back. As of now I have no idea.

A GFCI receptacle and/or GFCI bkr needs to have all of the neutral current flow through it along with the 'hot' conductor current. A GFCI monitors the current in both of these and interprets an imbalance of more than 3-5mA as a problem (current leaking/flowing through the green/ground wire/path). Having a neutral not connected properly should cause a GFCI to not operate properly...



ETA: ...I'd 86 that GFCI bkr only because I'd rather reset a GFCI receptacle as opposed to a bkr. That said, either is okay...

Those #10s are NOT protected at their rated ampacity (amperage capacity amount) at the point that they receive their supply because there is NO overcurrent device there. There are tap rules that allow an overcurrent device to be at the end of the conductor(s) as long as certain criteria are met...



...update once you trace them out...

The #14's connected directly to the main lines are going to a 'secondary surge device', some triangle shaped thing that says 175w on it and it's screwed into the side of the panel.

Good catch but still wrong.  Those generally need to be installed on 2 pole breakers.

Yeah I dont know what to tell you - but that's where those two lines are going. There is also one neutral and they're all 14GA. On my power bill from my electric company it also verifies and says 'surge device installed by us on your service line at the request of previous account holder'.

You can see where the wires are going to it in the bottom right corner of the photo.

This is what it is, but not made by Square D - it's a company that starts with a J