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Posted: 7/21/2015 5:54:15 PM EDT
We basically had a new back end added on to our house, and after the rough electrical inspection, the electrian hasn't been seen by anyone.  After the Sheetrockers covered up half the outlet boxes, and I had to dig them out, I decided to hook the stuff myself.  The simple light switches, and the outlets were easy. The light switches by the doors in the bedroom and the living room are out of my league.  

First there wasn't any power on any wires in the boxes.  Finally found one live wire in the bedroom.  In the living room I used an extension cord to get into the outlet, a piece of left over wire to jam in there and hook to a switch, and some speaker cord with alligator clips on the ends to stick to wires to try to figure out which ones went where.  Found the outdoor outlet wire, and the outdoor flood light, but that's all.  No lights or fan in the living room would come on.  Second, Went to the bedroom and going off that live wire, I found the other flood light, the closet and outlets, but no ceiling fan outside.  I did notice that when I connected the live wire to the outdoor light wire, the one black wire, or the red wire (not taped in the pics) in the bedroom, I had power in the living room recepticals, but it was every wire live except the outdoor outlet.  Still didn't get any lights to come on.  I didn't figure out any of the wires in the left light switch box in the living room.  There is a single recessed light in the room between these, but it has its own light switch, I think.  It doesn't get power till I hook up those red or black wires in the bedroom either.  

As far as what these boxes feed, It's 1 outdoor flood light on that corner of the house, 1 ceiling fan 4 recessed lights (that I assume are wired as one) and an outdoor outlet with the two light switch boxes in the living room.  In the bedroom, it's the one light switch box with a porch light (ceiling fan),  the outdoor flood light on that side, (that seems to also feed back into the living room since attaching the live wire to it sends power in there), and the wire that feeds the power to the closet and its outlets.  I've marked the wires I know does what where.  The rest, I don't know, including the red ones.  Anyone with advice on how to get these going, or what the electrian did to keep the lights off please share.  Here's pics of the wires, bedroom first.  



The live wire is right under the closet wire. It's hard to see, but the red taped wire on the right is actually two wires, one the closet stuff, and the other the live.



The living room boxes together, with my homemade jumper.



Living room again, without my homemade jumper.



The one long wire has the center insulation removed, and the end insulation removed.  I guessed that was so he could just wrap it in one switch, and swing it over to the other in the box easy.  That's also the box on the right in the other picture and the only one I figured out some wires to.  It's easier to see his double stripping in the other box.



The left side.  There you can see the stripped middle and end on the one black wire.  It's also got the most red wires in it.  

Thanks in advance, just for reading this.  Hopefully someone has a clue about how to get this wires up right.   I've got both 2 and 3 way switches there, so I can try anything, and with using alligator clips on live wires, you can tell I don't mind getting shocked so I'll try best guesses without hesitation.
Link Posted: 7/21/2015 7:34:29 PM EDT
[#1]
This will not be easy, regardless of who may jump in to help...

1- Is it legal for a home owner in your state to work on the electrical?  Here, it is.

2- Did the electrician pull wire back to the panel box?  If he/she did, how many wires and what type- 14/2 with ground and 14/3 w/ground etc?

3- What rooms have wiring for for a three way switch?
Link Posted: 7/21/2015 7:44:11 PM EDT
[#2]
Is that piece of Romex in the bottom right hand corner of the box yellow?
Link Posted: 7/21/2015 7:49:22 PM EDT
[#3]

Can you see where (and if) there are any "home runs" from the addition back to the panel? Breakers installed? Breakers on?







I'd probably hire an electrician for a day and let him sort it out.
Link Posted: 7/21/2015 8:55:48 PM EDT
[#4]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
This will not be easy, regardless of who may jump in to help...

1- Is it legal for a home owner in your state to work on the electrical?  Here, it is.

2- Did the electrician pull wire back to the panel box?  If he/she did, how many wires and what type- 14/2 with ground and 14/3 w/ground etc?

3- What rooms have wiring for for a three way switch?
View Quote


On 1, I think so, it just has to be inspected by a licensed electrician so he can sign off on it for the inspector.  Could be wrong though.

On 2, no, he attached on to existing wiring, no new breakers.  

And 3, I'm guessing both since you're supposed to be able to cut the outdoor flood lights off from either room.

Did that help any?
Link Posted: 7/21/2015 9:01:09 PM EDT
[#5]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Is that piece of Romex in the bottom right hand corner of the box yellow?
View Quote

Might be, I just grabbed the piece of left over wire because I saw it in the pile and got the idea to use it to jump power from the outlet to the wires in the box.  The alligator clip wire came from my old truck, it got repurposed from that to my old bike so I could start it when my switch broke on it from a wreak.  I don't know if that wire came from back of the house where they tore it off or it was new wire they used.
Link Posted: 7/21/2015 9:06:30 PM EDT
[#6]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Can you see where (and if) there are any "home runs" from the addition back to the panel? Breakers installed? Breakers on?




I'd probably hire an electrician for a day and let him sort it out.
View Quote


They just attached to the wires in the from the spots in the walls they cut off.  And yeah, as much as it'll hurt my pride, I may end up calling a new electrician.  This is like my last ditch effort.  
Link Posted: 7/22/2015 8:53:05 AM EDT
[#7]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:

Might be, I just grabbed the piece of left over wire because I saw it in the pile and got the idea to use it to jump power from the outlet to the wires in the box.  The alligator clip wire came from my old truck, it got repurposed from that to my old bike so I could start it when my switch broke on it from a wreak.  I don't know if that wire came from back of the house where they tore it off or it was new wire they used.
View Quote View All Quotes
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Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
Is that piece of Romex in the bottom right hand corner of the box yellow?

Might be, I just grabbed the piece of left over wire because I saw it in the pile and got the idea to use it to jump power from the outlet to the wires in the box.  The alligator clip wire came from my old truck, it got repurposed from that to my old bike so I could start it when my switch broke on it from a wreak.  I don't know if that wire came from back of the house where they tore it off or it was new wire they used.


You missed his point, take a look at your 4th pic..  It looks like a piece of yellow romex that's rated for 20 amps but the other wires in the box, the white romex wires, are only rated for 15 amps.
Link Posted: 7/22/2015 8:57:58 AM EDT
[#8]
OP- I wanted to help but after looking at the pics for another 15 minutes this morning I think you'll be much better off with someone on site.
Link Posted: 7/22/2015 12:27:34 PM EDT
[#9]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


You missed his point, take a look at your 4th pic..  It looks like a piece of yellow romex that's rated for 20 amps but the other wires in the box, the white romex wires, are only rated for 15 amps.
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Is that piece of Romex in the bottom right hand corner of the box yellow?

Might be, I just grabbed the piece of left over wire because I saw it in the pile and got the idea to use it to jump power from the outlet to the wires in the box.  The alligator clip wire came from my old truck, it got repurposed from that to my old bike so I could start it when my switch broke on it from a wreak.  I don't know if that wire came from back of the house where they tore it off or it was new wire they used.


You missed his point, take a look at your 4th pic..  It looks like a piece of yellow romex that's rated for 20 amps but the other wires in the box, the white romex wires, are only rated for 15 amps.

Ah, I did miss his point.  I kinda found it out before looking back here at the post.  I got a light and looked in the box and it's only visible through the punch out., it goes somewhere else.  It just passes behind that box and you can see it from one of the punch outs.  Nothing but white romex in those boxes.
Link Posted: 7/22/2015 12:28:37 PM EDT
[#10]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
OP- I wanted to help but after looking at the pics for another 15 minutes this morning I think you'll be much better off with someone on site.
View Quote

I'm a bit closer and have some more info after climbing in the attic and getting a good look around.
Link Posted: 7/22/2015 12:35:05 PM EDT
[#11]
After spending about 30 minutes in the attic, and sweating about a gallon of water out, I figured out a few things.  One, the wire coming off the recessed lights leads to the left box, the ceiling fan, the right one.  

Two, Three wires come from the bedroom and go to the living room.  That light by itself is by itself, I found its only wire running down to the switch by it and no where else.  

And I also found that in the living room, in the left box, where he has all the white wires tied together, he has a black wire tied in them as well. In the right box, he has a red wire tied to the white wires.  Does that make any of that, or those pics make sense?
Link Posted: 7/22/2015 1:03:29 PM EDT
[#12]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
After spending about 30 minutes in the attic, and sweating about a gallon of water out, I figured out a few things.  One, the wire coming off the recessed lights leads to the left box, the ceiling fan, the right one.  

Two, Three wires come from the bedroom and go to the living room.  That light by itself is by itself, I found its only wire running down to the switch by it and no where else.  

And I also found that in the living room, in the left box, where he has all the white wires tied together, he has a black wire tied in them as well. In the right box, he has a red wire tied to the white wires.  Does that make any of that, or those pics make sense?
View Quote



Oops, I meant two wires come out of the bedroom to the living room, the three wire romex, and a two wire romex.  Found the outdoor ceiling fan wire, and traced the wires (best as I could) like pipe tracing at work.  And the outdoor light doesn't go to either box in the living room, it just runs the length of the attic to the outside.  I also figured out after one more trip, one of the wires going into the left side powers the outlets on that side where that one light is.  I'll try to have a crude wire map for you guys in a bit.
Link Posted: 7/22/2015 2:08:49 PM EDT
[#13]
Ok, here's what I figured out, and drew out.  Sadly my hand writing is terrible, and it really did make more sense in my head when I drew it, but this is basically it.  That should be everything, it's just trying to figure out where the wires go on the switches.  







Link Posted: 7/22/2015 4:16:57 PM EDT
[#14]
I'm sorry but i'm stuck.  Maybe someone else sees the whole picture...

I had assumed in your original post that the majority of the 3 wire was for travelers between 3-way switches, now I'm not so sure since you posted the sketch.  It looks like in the living room that the paddle fan and light are switched with a stack switch, one switch for the light and one for the fan.  The bedroom paddle fan and light looks like it's power source is one single pole switch so the light and paddle would be controlled by a chain.  The three wire between the bedroom and the living room doesn't make sense to me either.  I'm probable just being hard headed but I hope someone else here sees the whole picture better than I do.
Link Posted: 7/22/2015 8:26:25 PM EDT
[#15]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
I'm sorry but i'm stuck.  Maybe someone else sees the whole picture...

I had assumed in your original post that the majority of the 3 wire was for travelers between 3-way switches, now I'm not so sure since you posted the sketch.  It looks like in the living room that the paddle fan and light are switched with a stack switch, one switch for the light and one for the fan.  The bedroom paddle fan and light looks like it's power source is one single pole switch so the light and paddle would be controlled by a chain.  The three wire between the bedroom and the living room doesn't make sense to me either.  I'm probable just being hard headed but I hope someone else here sees the whole picture better than I do.
View Quote

I just got back home and looked in the switch boxes and realized I've got something wrong.  There's an extra white and black wire in each box that's not in my drawing, but I didn't see from the attic.  I either missed it, or I need to go back and look again.  But ther is an extra set of wires in each box.  

Oh, and did anyone figure out why he would have a black wire wired in with the grounds, and a red wire wired in with the grounds in the other?  I didn't think you ever got white tied to another color.
Link Posted: 7/22/2015 11:19:54 PM EDT
[#16]
Here's pics of the red and black wires tied to the white wires.  







Link Posted: 7/26/2015 11:40:43 PM EDT
[#17]
Update.  Finally figured it out.  Biggest thing was making that map.  Second was looking at the pics before the Sheetrock went up and noticing an extra wire in the back of the last outlet.  Thing was, it was a pic we took of my daughter getting ready for her prom, and not one we had in the folder listed with the addition.  An electrician at work told me to stop trusting that electric wand tracer since it could be showing everything back feeding through the grounds and put my meter on them.  After finding no full power on them, I just started testing resistance on all the wires trying to find that loop, the switch at he other wall, and the recessed lights.  By doing that, I found every wire in there.  Labeled them, and had two that you couldn't see, but the meter said it was one single wire looped across.  That mystery wire turned out to be the wire that jumped power from box to box.  The wire coming from the bedroom ended up being part of the 3 way for the outdoor lights.  It wasn't for bringing power from the bedroom like I thought earlier.  After taking the cover off that last outlet in the series, thinking I didn't remember any extra wire in there, I found right at the top, the wire, capped off.  It had 120 on it.  Hooked every wire up on the switches.  Got shocked again in the bedroom doing that. Set every switch to off, hooked up the outlet wires, and these pics are the result. Now I can gloat to the misses about how good I am after she kept telling me to give up and get an electrician.  ??

I did those floors myself as well. And the trim.  I'll be finishing up the fireplace and door tomorrow.  



Link Posted: 7/27/2015 8:13:23 PM EDT
[#18]
Glad you got it all resolved.   It's difficult sorting things out behind someone else when there aren't a set of plans to reference.
Link Posted: 7/27/2015 10:04:09 PM EDT
[#19]
Ha I was just going to jump in and say get a meter and disconnect power and tone all wires out and find what is what.

Glad you got it OP
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