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Posted: 3/18/2014 6:57:19 PM EDT
[#1]
I need to put some sort of floor sink/drain beneath the washing machine. Any ideas on how to do this? Should I build it like a shower pan - curb, dry mud slope and drain?
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Posted: 3/19/2014 4:33:17 AM EDT
[#2]
So I have to ask, you ripped up flooring and installed new due to washing machine leaking for 60 years. Yet you didn't replace the machine that was the source of the issue?
I've helped friends install a drain/drip pan under their washers and water heaters. It really is a straight forward process, just make sure to take the extra time and effort to connect that pan to an actual drain line. Too many times I've seen a simple drain/drip pan but no drain and the pan gets nasty and will overflow if too much gets in there at once. The pans are easily damaged when moving the machine back into place so be careful of that. Moving the machine back into place is more than likely going to be a two person job to avoid any damages. With the amount of water your post seems to indicate a simple drain pan may not be enough. I would seriously look at your current drain line and modify or upgrade as needed. I believe you will have to use a sanitary tee to connect the new drain line to the pan if that is the route you go. These connectors have a slight curve to them to help the water move in the right direction version a standard tee that would allow the water to settle if no force (gravity, additional water etc) is applied. |
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Posted: 3/19/2014 4:37:02 AM EDT
[#3]
You don't need a drain beneath your washing machine. You need a new washer. |
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Posted: 3/19/2014 4:41:00 AM EDT
[#4]
I would either FIX the damned washer or throw it in a dumpster!!!!!
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Posted: 3/19/2014 4:44:06 AM EDT
[#5]
You have a very different idea of a "silver lining" than I do.
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Posted: 3/19/2014 8:23:57 AM EDT
[#6]
Quoted:
So I have to ask, you ripped up flooring and installed new due to washing machine leaking for 60 years. Yet you didn't replace the machine that was the source of the issue? I've helped friends install a drain/drip pan under their washers and water heaters. It really is a straight forward process, just make sure to take the extra time and effort to connect that pan to an actual drain line. Too many times I've seen a simple drain/drip pan but no drain and the pan gets nasty and will overflow if too much gets in there at once. The pans are easily damaged when moving the machine back into place so be careful of that. Moving the machine back into place is more than likely going to be a two person job to avoid any damages. With the amount of water your post seems to indicate a simple drain pan may not be enough. I would seriously look at your current drain line and modify or upgrade as needed. I believe you will have to use a sanitary tee to connect the new drain line to the pan if that is the route you go. These connectors have a slight curve to them to help the water move in the right direction version a standard tee that would allow the water to settle if no force (gravity, additional water etc) is applied. Exactly, but you are misreading me, a bit. Of course, all damaged washers have either been repaired or replaced. No damaged machine was left in place, continuing to be used if it was known to be leaking. This is axiomatic! The most recent washing machine failure occurred just yesterday. Maybe you guys have never experienced a real flood. The thing is, when a washer floods a floor, the water gets in between the layers of the flooring. I has no effective way to get back out and the susceptible materials, like the particle board a prior owner used as an underlayment, stay wet for a LONG time. This promotes the growth of fungi that eat the wood. Even when dry, the fungi are there, awaiting the next flood of moisture. Small drips beneath a washer can easily go undetected until the washer gets moved, something most people avoid doing unless they become aware of a problem with the machine. Then, the tech comes to repair it but has no interest in taking responsibility for consequential damages due to the leak he came to repair, so no mention is made of it. One of our machines had to be repaired two times before we threw it out. Each time, the tech, himself, caused a huge flood. There was evidence flooding and drips had occurred many times over the 60 year life of this home. In this post-War home, there is no provision for a drain beneath the washing machine. I will be installing one but this requires cutting in a new drain into the existing plumbing. It is interesting how poorly designed and constructed the drain pans are, hence how easily damaged they are. |
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Posted: 3/19/2014 8:24:22 AM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You don't need a drain beneath your washing machine. You need a new washer. Quote HistoryQuoted:
You don't need a drain beneath your washing machine. You need a new washer. Quoted:
I would either FIX the damned washer or throw it in a dumpster!!!!! Wrong and wrong! The way ALL washing machines are designed leaves them with failure modes that result in water being discharged into the room. You need a drain (not a drip pan) to prevent a flood when (not if) the washer fails. Drains are required by code in new construction but this is a post-War home and it was not required when it was built. Previous owners never bothered, despite the flooding, so it comes down to me to remedy this. Washing machines are no longer made to last, they are all cheap junk and getting worse. |
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Posted: 3/19/2014 8:26:24 AM EDT
[#8]
If instead of the Pergo laminate, you had gone with Ditra and real tile, you wouldn't have had to rip up anything.
 The Ditra would have protected the subfloor and the tile would have made it easy to mop up the water.
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Posted: 3/19/2014 8:40:50 AM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
If instead of the Pergo laminate, you had gone with Ditra and real tile, you wouldn't have had to rip up anything. The Ditra would have protected the subfloor and the tile would have made it easy to mop up the water.I wanted tile but the wife said no - too hard, too cold, too expensinsive. There is a fair amount of live and learn in this for her,... and for me. Since yesterday, she sees tile as the remedy for this. Even with tile, there are issues of flooding. Without a way to contain the water, it would flow throughout the entire kitchen - under the cabinets, for example. Also, we live in earthquake country, too. Large expanses of masonry frequently get cracked and damaged. If water gets between the tile and the Ditra you can still have problems. The floor joists in this home were never designed to support a tile floor. It's amazing they were allowed to build it this way. So, even with tile, I think a washer drain pan is still indicated as a fail-safe remedy against future washer failures and is possibly even by the building code. Once you have a proper drain, the NEED for tile and Ditra is diminished. It is a tough problem with too many nuances to type. A proper drain solves all the problems. |
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Posted: 3/19/2014 8:47:03 AM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I wanted tile but the wife said no - too hard, too cold, too expensinsive. There is a fair amount of live and learn in this for her,... and for me. Since yesterday, she sees tile as the remedy for this. Even with tile, there are issues of flooding. Without a way to contain the water, it would flow throughout the entire kitchen - under the cabinets, for example. So, even with tile, I think a washer drain pan is still indicated (possibly even by the building code). Once you have a proper drain, the NEED for tile goes away. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
If instead of the Pergo laminate, you had gone with Ditra and real tile, you wouldn't have had to rip up anything. The Ditra would have protected the subfloor and the tile would have made it easy to mop up the water.I wanted tile but the wife said no - too hard, too cold, too expensinsive. There is a fair amount of live and learn in this for her,... and for me. Since yesterday, she sees tile as the remedy for this. Even with tile, there are issues of flooding. Without a way to contain the water, it would flow throughout the entire kitchen - under the cabinets, for example. So, even with tile, I think a washer drain pan is still indicated (possibly even by the building code). Once you have a proper drain, the NEED for tile goes away. I've installed tile for less than good laminate and that includes the cost of the Ditra. I've never had a washer leak. Maybe you need to buy a better brand. |
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Posted: 3/19/2014 8:50:02 AM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I've installed tile for less than good laminate and that includes the cost of the Ditra. I've never had a washer leak. Maybe you need to buy a better brand. We have tried them all, Maytag, Kenmore, Speed Queen,... I wish we knew of one that ws rock solid but have not yet found one. Read the reviews of current production machines - they are not what they used to be, they all suck. We've had expensive washers (>$1k) and inexpensive ones (<$400). We've had homeowner models and "commercial" models. They all broke. Several caused floods. Cost was only a secondary consideration in selecting our flooring. We did not try "to go cheap". One fundamental issue in all this is there is no floor drain in this home,... never was. I've never lived in a home that had one, either. Now I know you HAVE to have one if you have an indoor washer. |
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Posted: 3/19/2014 8:58:44 AM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You have a very different idea of a "silver lining" than I do. LOL!! Indeed. This was a very bad situation - I was thoroughly devastated yesterday. Still, knowing is better than not. It was the best I could come up with to rationalize this very bad situation. It also lead to constructive thinking on a REAL solution - install a floor drain. |
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Posted: 3/19/2014 9:00:10 AM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
We have tried them all, Maytag, Kenmore,... They all broke. Several caused floods. Cost was only a secondary consideration in selecting our flooring. We did not try "to go cheap". One fundamental issue in all this is there is no floor drain in this home,... never was. I've never lived in a home that had one, either. Now I know you HAVE to have one if you have an indoor washer. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
I've installed tile for less than good laminate and that includes the cost of the Ditra. I've never had a washer leak. Maybe you need to buy a better brand. We have tried them all, Maytag, Kenmore,... They all broke. Several caused floods. Cost was only a secondary consideration in selecting our flooring. We did not try "to go cheap". One fundamental issue in all this is there is no floor drain in this home,... never was. I've never lived in a home that had one, either. Now I know you HAVE to have one if you have an indoor washer. You have exceptionally bad luck with washers. I'm 52, and I've had one, count 'em one, "leak", which was actually a drain pipe clog and not the washer itself. Nor have I ever seen a house with a drain pan installed for the washing machine, though admittedly I don't go poking around people's laundry rooms. I must not get out enough. 
ETA: Now, freezers with icemakers, on the other hand.... 
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Posted: 3/19/2014 9:02:02 AM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I've installed tile for less than good laminate and that includes the cost of the Ditra. I was thinking of installing a curb around the washer/dryer area, mudding in a pan with a floor drain and tiling the pan and curb. That way, if the next machine leaks, the water is contained by the curb and goes down the drain, instead of across the floor. In this scenario, I still need a drain that does not currently exist. Tile and mud are much more robust than the flimsy drain pans they sell. |
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Posted: 3/19/2014 9:05:45 AM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You have exceptionally bad luck with washers. I'm 52, and I've had one, count 'em one, "leak", which was actually a drain pipe clog and not the washer itself. Nor have I ever seen a house with a drain pan installed for the washing machine, though admittedly I don't go poking around people's laundry rooms. I must not get out enough.
ETA: Now, freezers with icemakers, on the other hand.... Yes, apparently, we do. Oh, by the way, the previous owners apparently had a clogged drain pipe, too. You could see the water stains inside the walls,... but I don't want to get off-topic. |
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Posted: 3/19/2014 11:04:33 AM EDT
[#16]
Okay good to know the machine was replaced.
A pan will work for smaller issues however based on what you have stated here you are having major failures. The pans you can buy are cheap and designed to stop slower leaks, yes they say designed to stop all out flooding but I can tell you first hand this is not always the case. A lot depends on if the floor is perfectly level, if the leak is a pressurized leak, how long the leak last, the drainage system in place etc. Ideally what I would do is build up a lip in front and around if possible of the wash machine and cover it in the Pergo that matches your floor where ever it would be visable. I would say anywhere from 1-4”. The layout of your room and machine will dictate the height better than I can arm chair it over the net. Next I would seal the area under the machine with a heavy duty rubber sealer. Look online or local hardware store, tons of good brands out there. Things like humidity and average temp of your area will impact the longevity of the product. Make sure to build it up a bit more near the edges to create a bit of a concave shape so the water does not stagnate but flows to the center. Lastly install a drain in the floor dead center if possible. The largest size you can squeeze in. The pan and drain method may work and would certainly be cheaper. However based on the experiences you have given I would over build this to ensure if there is a leak you don’t get a flooded kitchen or damaged floors. |
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Posted: 3/20/2014 9:01:05 PM EDT
[#17]
The dark clouds have come back totally obscuring any hint of silver I thought I might have seen.
I ran the washer thru two cycles today (outdoors in the back yard). There was no evidence of a water leak - nothing! Is it possible this event was caused by an obstructed drain pipe which could not handle the flow, backed up and then over-flowed onto the floor? There was no evidence of water on the wall behind the washer. This is really abysmal. |
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Posted: 3/21/2014 1:00:14 AM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Is it possible this event was caused by an obstructed drain pipe which could not handle the flow, backed up and then over-flowed onto the floor? Well, as I mentioned above, this has happened to me before. Or, depending on how it's plumbed, it might even be leaking inside the wall somewhere - a bad joint in the drain pipe or something. If that's the case, it could be running down the inside of the wall and coming in to the room under the baseboard. You could try running the water supply hose straight from the spigot into the drain pipe, turn it on and see what happens... |
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Posted: 3/21/2014 9:08:28 AM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You could try running the water supply hose straight from the spigot into the drain pipe, turn it on and see what happens... Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Is it possible this event was caused by an obstructed drain pipe which could not handle the flow, backed up and then over-flowed onto the floor? You could try running the water supply hose straight from the spigot into the drain pipe, turn it on and see what happens... I did this test just now. I hooked a short garden hose to the cold water supply line and turned it fully on. I watched to see the flow it provided and can say it is comparable to the discharge flow rate from the washer when it is draining. It's possible the hose provided more flow, or less, but it is comparable. I put the end of the hose into the drain pipe, just like the discharge hose from the washer, and turned the water on, full-flow. I let it run for 5 to 10 minutes. At no time did the drain back up nor did the sound change in pitch which would indicate the drain pipe was filling. I am stumped (and exasperated). The washer and the drain tested okay, yet we had the flood. Does anyone have any ideas on what to do? |
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Posted: 3/21/2014 10:17:35 AM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I did this test just now. I hooked a short garden hose to the cold water supply line and turned it fully on. I watched to see the flow it provided and can say it is comparable to the discharge flow rate from the washer when it is draining. It's possible the hose provided more flow, or less, but it is comparable. I put the end of the hose into the drain pipe, just like the discharge hose from the washer, and turned the water on, full-flow. I let it run for 5 to 10 minutes. At no time did the drain back up nor did the sound change in pitch which would indicate the drain pipe was filling. I am stumped (and exasperated). The washer and the drain tested okay, yet we had the flood. Does anyone have any ideas on what to do? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Is it possible this event was caused by an obstructed drain pipe which could not handle the flow, backed up and then over-flowed onto the floor? You could try running the water supply hose straight from the spigot into the drain pipe, turn it on and see what happens... I did this test just now. I hooked a short garden hose to the cold water supply line and turned it fully on. I watched to see the flow it provided and can say it is comparable to the discharge flow rate from the washer when it is draining. It's possible the hose provided more flow, or less, but it is comparable. I put the end of the hose into the drain pipe, just like the discharge hose from the washer, and turned the water on, full-flow. I let it run for 5 to 10 minutes. At no time did the drain back up nor did the sound change in pitch which would indicate the drain pipe was filling. I am stumped (and exasperated). The washer and the drain tested okay, yet we had the flood. Does anyone have any ideas on what to do? This won't help all that much but you need to find the source of the leak. You need to run a load through the washer and sit there and watch for leaking water. Try to replicate the incident that caused the water leak in the first place. When you say flood...roughly how much water do you mean? A quart, a gallon, 10 gallons, 100 gallons? How many gallons does your washer use for a normal cycle? Is it more than that? If so, you have a supply side leak. |
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Posted: 3/21/2014 10:23:26 AM EDT
[#21]
Yes, as posted above, I did that test yesterday. I ran the machine twice - nothing at all, not a drip.
I inspected the machine inside and out looking for water residue. The tub and machinery were totally clean. The discharge hoses had no evidence of a leak. Does it sound like a venting problem (as opposed to a drain problem)? The only thing I can think of to do, at this point, is to replace everything - replace the sewer drain lines; add a drain pan with a floor drain beneath the washer and (possibly) buy a new washing machine. Can anyone offer any advice or things to consider/test? |
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Posted: 3/22/2014 1:56:25 PM EDT
[#22]
I still have no indication what caused the flood.
I have the washer in the back yard. It has been running like a champ - no drips, no leaks. To me, this is indicative of some sort of drainage problem, not a washer problem. Perhaps an obstructed drain or vent. I really don't know what happened. I think I will replace the drain lines leading from the washer to the main drain. I'll router out the main drain line where the washer joins in. I may router out the vent line down to the washer. I just don't know what happened. I wonder if the right thing to do is to relocate the washer to garage where the floor is sloped concrete and water spills are not a threat to the wooden structure of the home. |
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Posted: 3/22/2014 5:43:18 PM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I still have no indication what caused the flood. I have the washer in the back yard. It has been running like a champ - no drips, no leaks. To me, this is indicative of some sort of drainage problem, not a washer problem. Perhaps an obstructed drain or vent. I really don't know what happened. I think I will replace the drain lines leading from the washer to the main drain. I'll router out the main drain line where the washer joins in. I may router out the vent line down to the washer. I just don't know what happened. I wonder if the right thing to do is to relocate the washer to garage where the floor is sloped concrete and water spills are not a threat to the wooden structure of the home. This is what I would do.--- Would have done to begin with. |
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Posted: 3/22/2014 9:00:01 PM EDT
[#24]
dunno what the temps have been, could the problem be your drain line freezes?
Is the washer in a cold area, actually could parts of the washer freezing cause your repeated leaks? |
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Posted: 3/22/2014 9:03:01 PM EDT
[#25]
Maybe you could move the washer from the kitchen to the laundry room.
Also, you should probably have a Water Cop installed by now with this much plumbing trouble. |
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Posted: 3/22/2014 9:13:47 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
dunno what the temps have been, could the problem be your drain line freezes? Is the washer in a cold area, actually could parts of the washer freezing cause your repeated leaks? It does sound more like a drain problem than a mechanical problem with the machine, doesn't it. Machines don't break and then get unbroken. I live in southern California not far from the beach. The Pacific Ocean moderates our temperature and keeps it mild. It is extremely rare that we ever see frost or any sort of freeze - it didn't happen at all last winter. All this plumbing and machinery was in the heated portion of the house. Last week, at the time when this happened, it was about 60-65 degrees. The overnight low was about 50-55. The daytime high that day was around 75. I would have to sketch up some plans to get a building permit to install utilities in the garage and move the washer and drier out there. |
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Posted: 3/22/2014 9:16:50 PM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Maybe you could move the washer from the kitchen to the laundry room. Also, you should probably have a Water Cop installed by now with this much plumbing trouble. There is no "laundry room" in this house. It is a small, "California bungalow" built before washers and driers, as we know them today, existed. The washer is located near the back door, where the water heater was originally located. You can see the vestiges of a patched-over exhaust vent in the ceiling and the old gas supply line in the wall. We believe the water heater was moved outside to make room for a side-by-side washer and drier, when these became popular appliances. This was done after the house had been repainted several times, so quite some time had elapsed before it was done. Prior to that time, washing machines were a sealed tub with a central agitator and a pair of roller bars to squeeze the water out of the clothes. Clothes were dried on a clothes line in the back yard. What's a water cop and how will it help? <scurries off to research any possible lead> |
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Posted: 3/22/2014 9:21:02 PM EDT
[#28]
What kind of washing machine do you have?
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Posted: 3/22/2014 9:25:13 PM EDT
[#29]
It's a "commercial" Maytag.
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Posted: 3/22/2014 9:26:46 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted: There is no "laundry room" in this house. It is a small, "California bungalow" built before washers and driers, as we know them today, existed. What's a water cop and how will it help? <scurries off to research any possible lead> Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Maybe you could move the washer from the kitchen to the laundry room. Also, you should probably have a Water Cop installed by now with this much plumbing trouble. There is no "laundry room" in this house. It is a small, "California bungalow" built before washers and driers, as we know them today, existed. What's a water cop and how will it help? <scurries off to research any possible lead> |
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Posted: 3/22/2014 9:31:46 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
It's a "commercial" Maytag. How old and how high is the drain hose dump line? |
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Posted: 3/22/2014 9:34:09 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
It's a motor operated valve on your water supply. It has a radio receiver and it listens for a signal from water sensors placed wherever you put them. When a sensor gets wet it sends the signal and the water shuts off. No help if it's the drain but it doesn't sound like that's certain and since that's not generally a line under pressure that seems less likely to me. The drain has to carry the water away that is being pumped by the washer at a high flow rate - low pressure but high flow. I am suspecting the drain could not carry the flow and the water backed up. I have no proof of this, as yet. There were no leaks found in the water supply lines, hot or cold. It is my intention to open up the wall with the drain line and to inspect inside for water residue. This would be evidence the water came from the drain. The wall is nearly new (~ 2 months old) and should be clean as a whistle. The exterior of that wall is clean and dry with no evidence of a water leak. |
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Posted: 3/22/2014 9:41:02 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
How old and how high is the drain hose dump line? The drain line for the washer is old (early 1960's <-- a pure guess). It is heavy galvanized pipe and cast iron fittings (threaded). The opening for the drain hose is about 4 feet above the ground (~1 foot above the highest water level in the washer when it's full). In a recent test, the drain was able to carry the full flow from a garden hose for 5 to 10 minutes without a hiccup or any audible hint the water was backing up in the drain line (no change in pitch). The washer's drain hose is in good condition and does not leak. The washer is currently on a concrete slab in the back yard. I washed 3 loads today and not a single drip was dropped. |
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Posted: 3/22/2014 9:47:18 PM EDT
[#34]
I just want to say thank you to everyone for trying to help me with this puzzle.
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Posted: 3/22/2014 9:53:43 PM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The drain line for the washer is old (early 1960's <-- a pure guess). It is heavy galvanized pipe and cast iron fittings (threaded). The opening for the drain hose is about 4 feet above the ground (~1 foot above the highest water level in the washer when it's full). In a recent test, the drain was able to carry the full flow from a garden hose for 5 to 10 minutes without a hiccup or any audible hint the water was backing up in the drain line (no change in pitch). The washer's drain hose is in good condition and does not leak. The washer is currently on a concrete slab in the back yard. I washed 3 loads today and not a single drip was dropped. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
How old and how high is the drain hose dump line? The drain line for the washer is old (early 1960's <-- a pure guess). It is heavy galvanized pipe and cast iron fittings (threaded). The opening for the drain hose is about 4 feet above the ground (~1 foot above the highest water level in the washer when it's full). In a recent test, the drain was able to carry the full flow from a garden hose for 5 to 10 minutes without a hiccup or any audible hint the water was backing up in the drain line (no change in pitch). The washer's drain hose is in good condition and does not leak. The washer is currently on a concrete slab in the back yard. I washed 3 loads today and not a single drip was dropped. It's very possible it [leaks] only happens under certain conditions like a sink full of water [vent issue] or water being drained into the system elsewhere causing backup and overflow. You need to introduce different scenarios and see if that makes a difference. [sink drain plugs installed, shower running, other water drain usage and so on. |
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Posted: 3/23/2014 8:44:03 AM EDT
[#36]
Was there any moisture on any walls other than the floor?
Post up pics of your laundry area...otherwise we are all just guessing. |
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Posted: 3/23/2014 9:12:48 AM EDT
[#37]
When you replace your washer, get a top loading one. Front loaders will eventually vomit everywhere. I know.
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Posted: 3/23/2014 12:37:37 PM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
When you replace your washer, get a top loading one. Front loaders will eventually vomit everywhere. I know. Our washer is a top loader. |
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Posted: 3/23/2014 12:43:21 PM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Was there any moisture on any walls other than the floor? Post up pics of your laundry area...otherwise we are all just guessing. There was no moisture evident anywhere except on the floor. I will be opening the wall soon to inspect inside for signs of moisture/leakage there. Honestly, I hope I find some. I am headed to Home Depot to buy the pipes and fittings to replace the drain lines. It might be wasted effort but it is a first step. If the old galvanized drain line is heavily corroded inside and there's signs of moisture inside of the wall,... I will actually be happy about that as an outcome because the root cause will have been found. As it is, I feel I am just flailing around and also just guessing. I am thankful for the help everyone is offering. |
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Posted: 3/23/2014 11:16:12 PM EDT
[#40]
I've lived in residences with washing machines for 38 years.
Never seen one leak yet. Hope I didn't just jinx myself LOL.
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Posted: 3/24/2014 7:30:58 AM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I've lived in residences with washing machines for 38 years. Never seen one leak yet. Hope I didn't just jinx myself LOL. Then, you just haven't lived. It's that simple. 
I now have all the parts to replace the drain lines and add a drain pan beneath the washer. |
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Posted: 3/25/2014 4:35:18 PM EDT
[#42]
Yesterday, I removed the main run of drain line from the washer. I was disappointed at how clean the insides were because it implies an obstructed drain is not the problem. At least, this piece of pipe is not obstructed. This is a pipe that is likely 50 to 60 years old.
The two photos are of the same piece of pipe. One shows the "top" side of the pipe, the other shows the "bottom" (relative to how it hung beneath the house). TOP 
BOTTOM 
I am going to remove and replace the rest, tomorrow. I just ran out of gas yesterday. It is TOUGH working in a 12" to18" high crawl space beneath the house. These houses were not constructed with any thought of future maintenance needs, that's for sure. |
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Posted: 3/26/2014 6:16:33 AM EDT
[#43]
I have had the water level sensor clog with debris or grease and let water out when the tub overfilled. The first time it cleared it self and I never found the leak. Figured it out the second time it clogged with grease and stayed clogged.
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Posted: 3/26/2014 3:13:36 PM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I have had the water level sensor clog with debris or grease and let water out when the tub overfilled. The first time it cleared it self and I never found the leak. Figured it out the second time it clogged with grease and stayed clogged. That's a great tip. I will look into that very carefully on the machine. |
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Posted: 3/26/2014 3:33:13 PM EDT
[#45]
I removed another section of the drain line today and came across this nearly clogged section. To me, it is the best indicator yet that it was the drain that caused the flood, not the machine. This is not the P-trap, itself, but is the nipple that joined the P trap to the drain/vent line. I can't imagine what the P trap looks like but it's probably pretty bad, too.
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Posted: 3/26/2014 4:44:14 PM EDT
[#46]
Pain in the butt issue I installed a drain in my laundry area after the flood.
But quick question was the water dirty or clean? |
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Posted: 3/26/2014 5:01:53 PM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Pain in the butt issue I installed a drain in my laundry area after the flood. But quick question was the water dirty or clean? The flood water was clean. |
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Posted: 3/26/2014 5:06:08 PM EDT
[#48]
IMPORTANT ISSUE -
Does anyone make a narrow p-trap, one that does not require as much width between the studs? The wall studs are too close together to fit an ABS p-trap. The old cast iron p-trap was several inches more narrow and just barely fit. The new ABS trap is not even close to fitting. Alternatively, I could turn the p-trap and bring the final bit of drain to the outside of the wall. This would allow the drain (and p-trap) to be clamped to wall's exterior. Future maintenance would be easier because some of the drain would be exposed. |
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Posted: 3/27/2014 12:22:48 AM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I removed another section of the drain line today and came across this nearly clogged section. To me, it is the best indicator yet that it was the drain that caused the flood, not the machine. This is not the P-trap, itself, but is the nipple that joined the P trap to the drain/vent line. I can't imagine what the P trap looks like but it's probably pretty bad, too. http://www.hunt101.com/data/500/medium/P-trap_nipple.jpg http://www.hunt101.com/data/500/medium/IMGA19221.JPG Looks like you're on to something there! Testing by running the supply hose directly to the drain pipe may not have worked because it looks like the the clearance through the clog is pretty close to the diameter of a water hose... probably just enough room for the stream from the hose to pass, but not enough to avoid backing up when the washer drained, which is probably a greater volume of water at once. That fitting at the top of the drain pipe has me wondering, though. How did the drain hose from the washer connect to the drain pipe? Was it just the typical washer drain hose with a soft rubber "J" formed in the end, hooked into the open drain pipe? Or was the drain hose connected to the pipe with some kind of fitting? Just asking because if it were the former, a backup in the pipe should have showed up as water running out of the top of the drain pipe (perhaps down into the wall), but if it was some kind of 'hard' connection, it would probably have backed up somewhere inside the washer, making the leak appear to originate from there. |
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Posted: 3/27/2014 7:53:38 AM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Looks like you're on to something there! Testing by running the supply hose directly to the drain pipe may not have worked because it looks like the the clearance through the clog is pretty close to the diameter of a water hose... probably just enough room for the stream from the hose to pass, but not enough to avoid backing up when the washer drained, which is probably a greater volume of water at once. That fitting at the top of the drain pipe has me wondering, though. How did the drain hose from the washer connect to the drain pipe? Was it just the typical washer drain hose with a soft rubber "J" formed in the end, hooked into the open drain pipe? Or was the drain hose connected to the pipe with some kind of fitting? Just asking because if it were the former, a backup in the pipe should have showed up as water running out of the top of the drain pipe (perhaps down into the wall), but if it was some kind of 'hard' connection, it would probably have backed up somewhere inside the washer, making the leak appear to originate from there. The washer discharge hose is screwed to the wall at the top of the loop to limit its movement. The end of the hose is further restrained/attached to the drain's opening with a vented rubber collar (not shown in photos). 
I agree with your idea about the hole. The garden hose I used had the end fitting cut off. It delivered a huge volume of water but it was delivered at higher velocity than the washer discharge. When I saw the hole, the first thing that came to mind was the higher velocity garden hose may have been able to punch through the obstruction to create the opening we now see, whereas the lower velocity washer discharge could not. There was nothing I recognized as evidence of water inside the wall. The wall board is a piece of 3/4" plywood (not gypsum board or plaster). There was no streaking or residue and it still had saw dust on its interior surface. Perhaps it did back up into the washer. Still, there is no going back now. The old plumbing has been removed and today's job is to install the new ABS drain. Any comments on having the standpipe on the outside of the wall rather than buried? It seems more maintainable but will look more crude. IMO, maintainable is good. It won't overflow into the wall cavity, either. |
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