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Posted: 6/30/2017 11:39:02 AM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
My T levels came back at 632. 
E level at 33.6. A little high there, but I guess w/in range. 
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Posted: 6/30/2017 12:20:36 PM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
trade ya? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
My T levels came back at 632.
E level at 33.6. A little high there, but I guess w/in range.
Look, I know your wife has your best interests at heart, but if there is going to be a heart problem from TRT, it's going to show regardless of the therapy...gels, patches, needle...whatever. The needle however, by literally any account, will give you the best quality of life. |
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Posted: 6/30/2017 12:31:45 PM EDT
[#3]
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HEY BACK OF THE LINE, PAL.
Look, I know your wife has your best interests at heart, but if there is going to be a heart problem from TRT, it's going to show regardless of the therapy...gels, patches, needle...whatever. The needle however, by literally any account, will give you the best quality of life. For me its just alot of QoL improvements with some pretty "meh" risks. |
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Posted: 6/30/2017 2:01:05 PM EDT
[#4]
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This is what I thought, If increased T = thicker blood then it doesnt matter how it was increased. I think she just doesnt want me to die but it seems pretty easy to work around the side effects. With her being a woman I dont think she gets the whole Testosterone concept. She doesnt have any fitness goals at all so she projects that to me a bit "who cares what your bench press is?" kind of thing. For me its just alot of QoL improvements with some pretty "meh" risks. I often think of how different things would have been had I gone to my anti-TRT, Beta Male, Internal Medicine doctor first... Well, I'm just glad I didn't, lol. |
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Posted: 6/30/2017 2:14:18 PM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
My T levels came back at 632.
E level at 33.6. A little high there, but I guess w/in range. Dr is probably not going to like that.
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Posted: 6/30/2017 3:26:20 PM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Mine came back at 1643. Dr is probably not going to like that.
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Posted: 6/30/2017 3:30:46 PM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Mine came back at 1643. Dr is probably not going to like that. "Damn, can't seem to get above 400 huh doc?"
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Posted: 6/30/2017 3:33:36 PM EDT
[#8]
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Sandbagging, you need to be sandbagging your results. Your mid week results should always be middle of the week after your last missed shot... "Damn, can't seem to get above 400 huh doc?"
Guess I shouldn't have gone in first thing in the morning. My free T was 450. |
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Posted: 6/30/2017 3:43:00 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I thought I was.
Guess I shouldn't have gone in first thing in the morning. My free T was 450. |
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Posted: 6/30/2017 4:18:44 PM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
If that is your sandbagging number, I am very impressed. Even if those were peak, that would be frikkin awesome. Who's on the gainz train? KaiK. |
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Posted: 6/30/2017 11:45:19 PM EDT
[#11]
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YES! He even went as far to discredit my TRT doctor, who I've known since he was a resident in the 90s, as a "money grabbing, anti-aging, fraud." The internal medicine doctor said that 300 was the low range of "normal" for my age group and I should learn to live with what my body produces. He also said I am no different than a bodybuilder doing anabolic steroids. Oh, I know for a fact that I am different from the abusers because, those cats take what I take weekly every other day. That's assuming they even use Testosterone since there are better steroids for building muscle.He would been publicly eviscerated if he'd said something like that to a woman seeking birth control. 
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Posted: 7/5/2017 9:41:04 AM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Testosterone, Free 9.7Normal Range: 8.7-55 Testosterone, Total 241Normal Range: 280-1000 Seems like my free is 1 point over normal and my Total was actually lower than before. This was 8:15am. 
When I initially faced TRT, I was aware of all the horror stories but research convinced me they were likely unfounded. I finally decided that even in the worst case scenario I would follow the advice of the Kurgan.  Attached File |
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Posted: 7/5/2017 8:04:10 PM EDT
[#13]
Doctor lowered my does. Still spent want to give me anti E. Wants to send me to specialist.
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Posted: 7/5/2017 9:06:20 PM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Doctor lowered my does. Still spent want to give me anti E. Wants to send me to specialist. That's why you now have a doctor who's lowering your doses and wants you to see a specialist. You failed to plan and now you're reaping it. |
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Posted: 7/5/2017 9:48:47 PM EDT
[#15]
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Weren't you saying at one point you were on 200+mg/wk to get yourself into "acceptable" ranges and now you're into the 1600+ range on a trough in treatment on the same protocol? That's why you now have a doctor who's lowering your doses and wants you to see a specialist. You failed to plan and now you're reaping it. |
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Posted: 7/5/2017 9:53:08 PM EDT
[#16]
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Yes. Not sure what happened. I was only at 600 at 180 a week. But I was doing lots of cardio. Not sure if this effects it. Also didn't get tested first thing in the morning like this time. Look at it like this though. You can maybe lower your dose and get good results. Then cycle 12-16 weeks and get some really good results. |
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Posted: 7/5/2017 9:59:18 PM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Getting tested in the morning vs evening is not going to have that big of a swing. Same thing with cardio. Look at it like this though. You can maybe lower your dose and get good results. Then cycle 12-16 weeks and get some really good results. |
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Posted: 7/5/2017 10:06:30 PM EDT
[#18]
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Who knows. Maybe it finally added up. Due to frequent injections. .50 ml of 200 every 3 days. They also changed the maker of the test on me. Not sure if this stuff worked better. I have much better results with Watson(while more expensive) than the off label. |
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Posted: 7/5/2017 10:20:00 PM EDT
[#19]
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Watson brand vs off? I have much better results with Watson(while more expensive) than the off label. |
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Posted: 7/7/2017 5:33:33 AM EDT
[#20]
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If it wasn't for your heart condition I'd PM you everything you need to do it yourself. You don't need a doc for this stuff. I know more about it than 99% of the docs out there. With your heart I don't have an answer for you. Sort of like being interested in a "try before you buy" program. |
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Posted: 7/7/2017 8:31:41 AM EDT
[#21]
Glad I saw this thread.
I am using androgel with good results, so it seems. My total # has been at a high of 1164, but that is eating right and exercising, my average is around 600-650. I have no issues with my PA/MD, so am gonna stay with the gel, I also use dmso to help boost it getting past the skin contact. What are some natural estrogen blockers, I eat a lot of button mushrooms, as I have read that they do have a natural blocking effect ? |
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Posted: 7/7/2017 10:47:20 AM EDT
[#22]
have a dr appointment next week to hopefully discuss options.
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Posted: 7/7/2017 12:41:11 PM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Glad I saw this thread. I am using androgel with good results, so it seems. My total # has been at a high of 1164, but that is eating right and exercising, my average is around 600-650. I have no issues with my PA/MD, so am gonna stay with the gel, I also use dmso to help boost it getting past the skin contact. What are some natural estrogen blockers, I eat a lot of button mushrooms, as I have read that they do have a natural blocking effect ? |
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Posted: 7/7/2017 12:57:53 PM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
wife insists I should not to T shots. She thinks I will die by either prostate cancer or blood clot. Of course to her this is all stupid and dumb and not worth the risk. I feel like it would be a great QoL change. The risk with taking a 100mg to 150mg a week of Testosterone hardly exists, unless you have some other condition. |
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Posted: 7/7/2017 1:35:59 PM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Ha get on those BB forums or steroid forums, those guy literally ABUSE the stuff for decades, and guess what? Most of them are just fine. The risk with taking a 100mg to 150mg a week of Testosterone hardly exists, unless you have some other condition.
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Posted: 7/7/2017 10:50:55 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I might be interested in a PM, for purely academic reasons of course. Sort of like being interested in a "try before you buy" program. You might end up like a dude at my gym who is now lactating because he doesn't understand what a tren only cycle will do to you. But hey bro, go after the gainz train if you feel like it. |
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Posted: 7/8/2017 1:01:57 AM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You need to do your homework before you even attempt to go down this road. You might end up like a dude at my gym who is now lactating because he doesn't understand what a tren only cycle will do to you. But hey bro, go after the gainz train if you feel like it. We won't worry about an ai cause ya know, not gonna run any test. Just makes it that much easier. Well I guess the dbol does aromatize, especially at 100mg a day. Oh and lactating on tren ain't no big deal, nothing a little prami can't fix in about a week, as long as the prami doesn't make him sick. |
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Posted: 7/8/2017 1:05:44 AM EDT
[#28]
I started the keto diet in January.
Went to my annual checkup in February. The Doc ordered labs, I asked him to include Testosterone. The test they used had limits of 20-90, mine tested at 95! More bacon!!! |
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Posted: 7/8/2017 8:55:37 AM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Relax pumba, I'm gonna recommend a nice beginner stack of tren, NPP, deca with no test. Try and get all the nadrolones in on his first go. Also kick start him with some dbol, superdrol, anavar and finish with some winny. And of course slin pinning some insulin for maximum gains. We won't worry about an ai cause ya know, not gonna run any test. Just makes it that much easier. Well I guess the dbol does aromatize, especially at 100mg a day. Oh and lactating on tren ain't no big deal, nothing a little prami can't fix in about a week, as long as the prami doesn't make him sick. 
Pm me because I want to get on that ride! Lol |
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Posted: 7/8/2017 2:17:48 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You need to do your homework before you even attempt to go down this road. You might end up like a dude at my gym who is now lactating because he doesn't understand what a tren only cycle will do to you. But hey bro, go after the gainz train if you feel like it. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
I might be interested in a PM, for purely academic reasons of course. Sort of like being interested in a "try before you buy" program. You might end up like a dude at my gym who is now lactating because he doesn't understand what a tren only cycle will do to you. But hey bro, go after the gainz train if you feel like it. Not looking for teh gainz, but would be curious what a couple weeks of a normal dose would make me feel like, without getting slammed with bills to try it out. The first blood test cost me $170 plus the office visit, second test was a huge panel and ran me about $500 plus the visit. If I felt like I was 20 again, then it would prompt a visit to a couple doctors. The guy that did my vasectomy would be a start, my primary care is a female. I read these threads and a common theme is that most people feel like they are dragging ass hard when they finally get tested, I've been going in waves lately. A couple weeks of high energy, then one where I can barely get out of my own way, and I need more sleep lately. |
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Posted: 7/8/2017 2:44:32 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Meh, my blood work gave me a total of 400 when it was checked, results may have been skewed though because I was pretty sick at the time. Not looking for teh gainz, but would be curious what a couple weeks of a normal dose would make me feel like, without getting slammed with bills to try it out. The first blood test cost me $170 plus the office visit, second test was a huge panel and ran me about $500 plus the visit. If I felt like I was 20 again, then it would prompt a visit to a couple doctors. The guy that did my vasectomy would be a start, my primary care is a female. I read these threads and a common theme is that most people feel like they are dragging ass hard when they finally get tested, I've been going in waves lately. A couple weeks of high energy, then one where I can barely get out of my own way, and I need more sleep lately. |
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Posted: 7/10/2017 10:39:58 AM EDT
[#32]
Guess what I have for you? Another T-nation article! lol. This one talks about a few myths of T including its relation to heart disease. It may be worth your time to read it and follow up with the sources they cite to see if it applies to your situation.
http://www.t-nation.com/pharma/tip-the-top-3-myths-about-testosterone?utm_source=tnation&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=weekly_dose-170709 |
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Posted: 7/10/2017 2:27:03 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Guess what I have for you? Another T-nation article! lol. This one talks about a few myths of T including its relation to heart disease. It may be worth your time to read it and follow up with the sources they cite to see if it applies to your situation. http://www.t-nation.com/pharma/tip-the-top-3-myths-about-testosterone?utm_source=tnation&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=weekly_dose-170709 Go tomorrow for the "talk"
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Posted: 7/10/2017 2:49:20 PM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
FOR THE WIN Go tomorrow for the "talk" What is your take on this? Do you think you have an increased risk due to your pre-existing conditions? Or that you will just need to stay on top of your red blood cell levels a little more than the rest of us? |
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Posted: 7/10/2017 3:02:10 PM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Good timing then. What is your take on this? Do you think you have an increased risk due to your pre-existing conditions? Or that you will just need to stay on top of your red blood cell levels a little more than the rest of us? The only other thing im wondering about is estrogen levels and getting consistent levels of T via shots/shots per week vs prescription. |
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Posted: 7/10/2017 3:31:18 PM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
the only issue for is thick blood and this valve. I already take an aspirin to help keep it thin. So ill just have to stay on top and see if its a big issue or not. The only other thing im wondering about is estrogen levels and getting consistent levels of T via shots/shots per week vs prescription. |
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Posted: 7/10/2017 3:35:23 PM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
So typically you will take an estrogen blocker along with the T. I'm on 1.5mgs of arimidex/week split in 3 doses. Some people need none, some less, some more. Dialing in the right doses of T and E blockers takes time and labs. I know when my E goes high because I'll start getting pimples, some guys get emotional while watching tv or other stupid things. lol. There are apparently reliable ways of getting e blockers without a Rx, but my doctor Rx'd them so it isn't an issue for me. |
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Posted: 7/10/2017 3:57:57 PM EDT
[#38]
Def will have to watch that then. My wife woild never let me live down crying. 4 females in this house already.
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Posted: 7/10/2017 4:01:11 PM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I'll here a song and I'll get emotions. Those are weird. I don't like them.
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Posted: 7/10/2017 9:29:49 PM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Feelings? Gross. Maybe you should switch from coffee to whiskey and get good and numb. 
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Posted: 7/11/2017 1:02:22 AM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
So typically you will take an estrogen blocker along with the T. I'm on 1.5mgs of arimidex/week split in 3 doses. Some people need none, some less, some more. Dialing in the right doses of T and E blockers takes time and labs. I know when my E goes high because I'll start getting pimples, some guys get emotional while watching tv or other stupid things. lol. There are apparently reliable ways of getting e blockers without a Rx, but my doctor Rx'd them so it isn't an issue for me.
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Posted: 7/11/2017 8:18:36 AM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
That's a pretty high dose of arimidex for a trt dose of test. Are you sure you aren't taking more test than your supposed to?
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Posted: 7/11/2017 2:46:00 PM EDT
[#43]
Well boys got a script.
Only for 100mg but it is a start. She didn't know anything about estrogen side with it so I'll have to do some natural stuff. The only remaining issue is, this still needs approved by insurance since my labs came back "normal" range there is a gamble there. How much is this if insurance decides no dice? |
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Posted: 7/11/2017 8:33:52 PM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Well boys got a script.
Only for 100mg but it is a start. She didn't know anything about estrogen side with it so I'll have to do some natural stuff. The only remaining issue is, this still needs approved by insurance since my labs came back "normal" range there is a gamble there. How much is this if insurance decides no dice? |
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Posted: 7/11/2017 8:54:59 PM EDT
[#45]
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They have coupons online. If you can get a scrip for a 10ml vile it's only like $60. how long does that last? |
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Posted: 7/11/2017 9:04:23 PM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Think that is exactly what it is. how long does that last? |
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Posted: 7/11/2017 9:05:22 PM EDT
[#47]
If you get the 200mg/ml that is theoretically 20 doses at 100mg/week. So .5ml/week. If it is 100mg/ml(haven't actually seen this strength) then it'd be 1ml/week for theoretically 10 doses.
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Posted: 7/11/2017 9:06:10 PM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
If you get the 200mg/ml that is theoretically 20 doses at 100mg/week. So .5ml/week. If it is 100mg/ml(haven't actually seen this strength) then it'd be 1ml/week for theoretically 10 doses. 
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Posted: 7/11/2017 9:06:38 PM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Well if you do 100mg a week and it's a 200mg/ml x10. That would be 20 weeks. how long to feel the effect after the shot? |
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Posted: 7/11/2017 9:10:30 PM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
If you get the 200mg/ml that is theoretically 20 doses at 100mg/week. So .5ml/week. If it is 100mg/ml(haven't actually seen this strength) then it'd be 1ml/week for theoretically 10 doses. |
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