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Posted: 11/12/2015 4:24:30 PM EDT
[#1]
Of your footwear choice, I would wear the Vibrams. I lift in Vibrams though and have for years.
That said, you will be fine with any of those choices. 
Of your program choices, I would pick SS. I am currently coming off a shoulder surgery and doing SS seems to be one the quickest ways back. That said, you will be fine with any of those choices.
Do what the plan says, don't try to change it for 6-8 months. Your goals are the most important thing we need to know about though. 
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Posted: 11/12/2015 4:39:51 PM EDT
[#2]
SL uses 5x5 set x rep scheme. SS 3x5 and 1x5.
They both program for the same compounds, squat, bench, press, deadlift. While SL uses the row and SS programs the power clean and accessory movements after time. Which one is the best? The one you stick with. For shoes, something hard soled. You don't want to be floating around on something thick and cushy. A raised heel will help with mobility while squatting. Still don't know why I've never seen a powerlifter square up to the rack in some shit kicking cowboy boots. Theoretically, they would be perfect functionally and fucking epic fashionably with a singlet. 
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Posted: 11/12/2015 8:48:13 PM EDT
[#3]
Alright, that's about what I expected based on the reading I had done. Was mainly checking to see if anything I listed fell under the "no, don't ever do that" category.
As far as goals, I'm looking to lose a bunch of weight (or a bunch of inches, whichever) and get fitter/stronger. I'm about 6 ft, 250 lbs, 27 years old. I'm not a total weakling (max at six chinups, woo!), but I'd like to get better. I also injured my lower back a few years ago, picking up a vacuum cleaner of all things, so I'm trying to be careful. That's why I liked the idea of SL, where you slowly work into things. My impression of SS is that you start at 80% of max or so and work from there. I honestly don't know if there'll be much difference at my level, though. I've sort of wanted to do barbell training for a couple years, but was nervous since I didn't have anyone to show me what to do, safely. I hopefully have that now. Goal: get stronger. Hopefully everything else will fall into place. And maybe, just maybe, I can give my younger brother some competition. 
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Posted: 11/12/2015 9:14:22 PM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Alright, that's about what I expected based on the reading I had done. Was mainly checking to see if anything I listed fell under the "no, don't ever do that" category. As far as goals, I'm looking to lose a bunch of weight (or a bunch of inches, whichever) and get fitter/stronger. I'm about 6 ft, 250 lbs, 27 years old. I'm not a total weakling (max at six chinups, woo!), but I'd like to get better. I also injured my lower back a few years ago, picking up a vacuum cleaner of all things, so I'm trying to be careful. That's why I liked the idea of SL, where you slowly work into things. My impression of SS is that you start at 80% of max or so and work from there. I honestly don't know if there'll be much difference at my level, though. I've sort of wanted to do barbell training for a couple years, but was nervous since I didn't have anyone to show me what to do, safely. I hopefully have that now. Goal: get stronger. Hopefully everything else will fall into place. And maybe, just maybe, I can give my younger brother some competition. You should actually read SS, the book. It starts with an empty bar and titrates up from there. More importantly, it breaks the lifts down into language that most neophytes can understand. There is value in the SS programming, but not nearly as much as in the education you receive. |
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Posted: 11/12/2015 9:26:33 PM EDT
[#5]
I did Stronglifts to get started and made great gains. It was a great springboard into more advanced lifting. I looked at Starting Strength but went with SL because I didn't want to try power cleans without someone to show me proper form.
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Posted: 11/12/2015 9:42:27 PM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You should actually read SS, the book. It starts with an empty bar and titrates up from there. More importantly, it breaks the lifts down into language that most neophytes can understand. There is value in the SS programming, but not nearly as much as in the education you receive. Working on it. Finished the section on squats last night. |
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Posted: 11/12/2015 11:08:38 PM EDT
[#7]
I was doing SL5x5. I liked it ok. With the app, it is really easy to figure weights/ reps/ warm ups. No % of anything to figure out. I'll be restarting it this weekend. Been out on a back injury.
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Posted: 11/13/2015 9:40:30 AM EDT
[#8]
I did SL for about 4-5 months before moving into Wendler's 5/3/1 when I joined a PL/Strongman gym. I chose SL mainly because it was free
. But now that I've read/watched enough Rippetoe...he's a more qualified instructor than Medhi
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Posted: 11/13/2015 8:16:33 PM EDT
[#9]
I started out on "Greyskull LP"
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Posted: 11/14/2015 1:31:03 PM EDT
[#10]
Lifted yesterday. I was more uncoordinated than I thought I'd be. Even on what seems simple, like bench press.
Is it common to have issues getting the bar into place on squat? Getting my elbows back far enough to allow keeping my wrists straight with the bar in roughly the right position was difficult, and I had to widen my grip to do it. |
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Posted: 11/14/2015 2:24:09 PM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Lifted yesterday. I was more uncoordinated than I thought I'd be. Even on what seems simple, like bench press. Is it common to have issues getting the bar into place on squat? Getting my elbows back far enough to allow keeping my wrists straight with the bar in roughly the right position was difficult, and I had to widen my grip to do it. On days that I'm feeling particularly stiff I can barely keep my hands inside the rack for a squat. If that's the case I go spend 20 minutes on upper body stretching and I'm in a lot better shape. And I think it's also reasonable to not be able to perform the lifts perfectly the first little while, it's takes a while to get the movements from the brain to each of the muscles, and to be able to get them each to fire in the correct order. ETA- you'll get more comfortable with the bar on your back. At first it seems like it will never get stable, and after a while it's just not a problem anymore and you can concentrate on other things. |
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Posted: 11/14/2015 3:12:04 PM EDT
[#12]
What program did you pick to do? Most of the first few weeks is nerve training learning the movement. The first bit is kinda awkward but it comes together pretty quick. Stay tight under the weight. Watch form and bar path. By the time you start to feel better at the lifts on SL, the weights will be heavy and you'll be pushing harder.
Your avatar is CLICK approved. |
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Posted: 11/14/2015 6:19:14 PM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
What program did you pick to do? Most of the first few weeks is nerve training learning the movement. The first bit is kinda awkward but it comes together pretty quick. Stay tight under the weight. Watch form and bar path. By the time you start to feel better at the lifts on SL, the weights will be heavy and you'll be pushing harder. Your avatar is CLICK approved. Yesterday was more of a "day zero" deal than a workout from either. Just a couple of sets of squat, bench, and deadlift (new PRs!) with a friend giving pointers. I think I'm going to do SL, mainly because then I don't need to clean off of the floor, and it looks like the app will make things stupidly simple. Official day one is Monday. I was sort of expecting the first week or three would be awkward. I'll just see how it goes. I'm somewhat surprised that collectively, arf has pretty much nailed a wide variety of C&H artwork, but with minimal overlap. It makes me happy. |
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Posted: 11/14/2015 10:56:30 PM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Lifted yesterday. I was more uncoordinated than I thought I'd be. Even on what seems simple, like bench press. Is it common to have issues getting the bar into place on squat? Getting my elbows back far enough to allow keeping my wrists straight with the bar in roughly the right position was difficult, and I had to widen my grip to do it. I still don't wrap my thumbs around the bar on squats and only my outer fingers touch the bar. |
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Posted: 11/16/2015 12:45:54 PM EDT
[#15]
SL, day one done.
45 lb squat, 45 lb bench, 65 lb barbell row. I can confirm that the gym is, in fact, mostly empty at 6 AM.
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Posted: 11/16/2015 1:26:12 PM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
SL, day one done. 45 lb squat, 45 lb bench, 65 lb barbell row. I can confirm that the gym is, in fact, mostly empty at 6 AM. Lucky. My local gym is standing room only at 6am. Bros waiting in line to curl in the squat rack. Anymore I have to move the hooks back up every time I use the rack. Only another couple of weeks and I'll have my own stuff set up. Nice job on the lifts, it will go pretty quick from here. Even though I'm doing really well for a new lifter I wish I'd started with lower weights. I think I began with a 185lb squat but had to reset at lower weights several times as I realized I wasn't doing things right. Why the barbell row instead of dead lifts? |
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Posted: 11/16/2015 1:36:13 PM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Lucky. My local gym is standing room only at 6am. Bros waiting in line to curl in the squat rack. Anymore I have to move the hooks back up every time I use the rack. Only another couple of weeks and I'll have my own stuff set up. Nice job on the lifts, it will go pretty quick from here. Even though I'm doing really well for a new lifter I wish I'd started with lower weights. I think I began with a 185lb squat but had to reset at lower weights several times as I realized I wasn't doing things right. Why the barbell row instead of dead lifts? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
SL, day one done. 45 lb squat, 45 lb bench, 65 lb barbell row. I can confirm that the gym is, in fact, mostly empty at 6 AM. Lucky. My local gym is standing room only at 6am. Bros waiting in line to curl in the squat rack. Anymore I have to move the hooks back up every time I use the rack. Only another couple of weeks and I'll have my own stuff set up. Nice job on the lifts, it will go pretty quick from here. Even though I'm doing really well for a new lifter I wish I'd started with lower weights. I think I began with a 185lb squat but had to reset at lower weights several times as I realized I wasn't doing things right. Why the barbell row instead of dead lifts? In SL you squat/ bench/ row on workout A. Squat/ press/ dead on workout B. Week one is A, B, A. Week two is B, A, B. Ect. |
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Posted: 11/16/2015 2:53:43 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Lucky. My local gym is standing room only at 6am. Bros waiting in line to curl in the squat rack. Anymore I have to move the hooks back up every time I use the rack. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
SL, day one done. 45 lb squat, 45 lb bench, 65 lb barbell row. I can confirm that the gym is, in fact, mostly empty at 6 AM. Lucky. My local gym is standing room only at 6am. Bros waiting in line to curl in the squat rack. Anymore I have to move the hooks back up every time I use the rack.  I've yet to see either the squat rack or power cage being used for anything aside from squats, but I haven't gone at peak times either. Supposedly, Monday nights are busy, which is why I went this morning. Against my better judgement, since I hate mornings.
Why the barbell row instead of dead lifts? Basically what he said. SL is set up as sets of squat/press/pull. Today's pull was barbell rows, Wednesday's is deadlift. Eta: I'm also not seeing any benches that I could pull into the power rack, which means I need a spotter before I can bench anything heavy. 
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Posted: 11/16/2015 6:19:37 PM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Basically what he said. SL is set up as sets of squat/press/pull. Today's pull was barbell rows, Wednesday's is deadlift. Eta: I'm also not seeing any benches that I could pull into the power rack, which means I need a spotter before I can bench anything heavy. I wouldn't worry about it too much, don't use any collars on the bar and don't bench at your max. I pretty much never work out at the max of any lift, you get a lot more work done at submaximal weights. I almost never lift with others, sometimes my wife is around but not always 'with' me in the gym, I just try to make it an hour without doing anything stupid. |
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Posted: 11/18/2015 8:48:07 AM EDT
[#20]
Day two down: 50 lb squat, 45 lb overhead press, 95 lb deadlift.
OHP is much harder than any of the other lifts I've tried, with the exception of DL, even with the empty bar. I'm having trouble getting my elbows slightly forward, and I think my forearms are too long to actually rest the bar on my chest like I'm supposed to.
Squat is feeling less awkward, and deadlift isn't nearly as awkward as the other ones. |
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Posted: 11/18/2015 10:15:46 AM EDT
[#21]
Lots of videos to take tips and learn from.
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Posted: 11/18/2015 10:38:22 AM EDT
[#22]
Stick with it.
I've been doing strong lifts for a few months now, started about where you did. Currently up to 265 squat, 345 deadlift, and 120 overhead press. Nothing to brag about, but just keep plugging away. I went with strong lifts for the sheer simplicity, but read Rip's book as well (highly recommended). Do the warm up sets! Good luck! |
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Posted: 11/18/2015 11:19:46 AM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Day two down: 50 lb squat, 45 lb overhead press, 95 lb deadlift. OHP is much harder than any of the other lifts I've tried, with the exception of DL, even with the empty bar. I'm having trouble getting my elbows slightly forward, and I think my forearms are too long to actually rest the bar on my chest like I'm supposed to.
Squat is feeling less awkward, and deadlift isn't nearly as awkward as the other ones. I can't rest the bar on my chest with my elbows in position. It's ok. Just don't cheat. Make sure you come all the way down. |
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Posted: 11/18/2015 5:39:20 PM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I can't rest the bar on my chest with my elbows in position. It's ok. Just don't cheat. Make sure you come all the way down. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Day two down: 50 lb squat, 45 lb overhead press, 95 lb deadlift. OHP is much harder than any of the other lifts I've tried, with the exception of DL, even with the empty bar. I'm having trouble getting my elbows slightly forward, and I think my forearms are too long to actually rest the bar on my chest like I'm supposed to.
Squat is feeling less awkward, and deadlift isn't nearly as awkward as the other ones. I can't rest the bar on my chest with my elbows in position. It's ok. Just don't cheat. Make sure you come all the way down. Hmm, I thought you weren't supposed to take your elbows past 90 deg due to shoulder issues? (serious question- I'm no expert) |
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Posted: 11/18/2015 7:36:06 PM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Hmm, I thought you weren't supposed to take your elbows past 90 deg due to shoulder issues? (serious question- I'm no expert) Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Day two down: 50 lb squat, 45 lb overhead press, 95 lb deadlift. OHP is much harder than any of the other lifts I've tried, with the exception of DL, even with the empty bar. I'm having trouble getting my elbows slightly forward, and I think my forearms are too long to actually rest the bar on my chest like I'm supposed to.
Squat is feeling less awkward, and deadlift isn't nearly as awkward as the other ones. I can't rest the bar on my chest with my elbows in position. It's ok. Just don't cheat. Make sure you come all the way down. Hmm, I thought you weren't supposed to take your elbows past 90 deg due to shoulder issues? (serious question- I'm no expert) According to Rippetoe, OHP starting position is with the bar resting on your chest, assuming forearms aren't too long for that. If they are, the bar floats above the chest. From the front, forearms should be vertical. Pick grip width accordingly. From the side, elbows should be just in front of the bar, which apparently gets one of the forearm bones vertical. The press goes to full extension above your head, elbows locked, shoulders shrugged up in support, bar in line with the back of your neck. Then back down to the start. How to go between the top and bottom is a bit weird and complicated. |
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Posted: 11/18/2015 9:27:44 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
According to Rippetoe, OHP starting position is with the bar resting on your chest, assuming forearms aren't too long for that. If they are, the bar floats above the chest. From the front, forearms should be vertical. Pick grip width accordingly. From the side, elbows should be just in front of the bar, which apparently gets one of the forearm bones vertical. The press goes to full extension above your head, elbows locked, shoulders shrugged up in support, bar in line with the back of your neck. Then back down to the start. How to go between the top and bottom is a bit weird and complicated. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Day two down: 50 lb squat, 45 lb overhead press, 95 lb deadlift. OHP is much harder than any of the other lifts I've tried, with the exception of DL, even with the empty bar. I'm having trouble getting my elbows slightly forward, and I think my forearms are too long to actually rest the bar on my chest like I'm supposed to.
Squat is feeling less awkward, and deadlift isn't nearly as awkward as the other ones. I can't rest the bar on my chest with my elbows in position. It's ok. Just don't cheat. Make sure you come all the way down. Hmm, I thought you weren't supposed to take your elbows past 90 deg due to shoulder issues? (serious question- I'm no expert) According to Rippetoe, OHP starting position is with the bar resting on your chest, assuming forearms aren't too long for that. If they are, the bar floats above the chest. From the front, forearms should be vertical. Pick grip width accordingly. From the side, elbows should be just in front of the bar, which apparently gets one of the forearm bones vertical. The press goes to full extension above your head, elbows locked, shoulders shrugged up in support, bar in line with the back of your neck. Then back down to the start. How to go between the top and bottom is a bit weird and complicated. You don't think that you are overthinking things just a little bit do you? At the bottom bring the bar down far enough to touch your chest. Cheating would be only bringing the bar down to the chin height and lifting again. You might have some discomfort in the shoulders doing this, if so get a band and get stretching the shoulders, hold a 5 or 10lb plate and hang it off the shoulder to distract it in socket, etc. you might find it's helpful to lift with dumbbells until you get your shoulders tuned up and pain free. My wife had an impingement in one shoulder and it took about 3 weeks for her to be pain free on the OHP. |
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Posted: 11/18/2015 10:25:45 PM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You don't think that you are overthinking things just a little bit do you? At the bottom bring the bar down far enough to touch your chest. Cheating would be only bringing the bar down to the chin height and lifting again. You might have some discomfort in the shoulders doing this, if so get a band and get stretching the shoulders, hold a 5 or 10lb plate and hang it off the shoulder to distract it in socket, etc. you might find it's helpful to lift with dumbbells until you get your shoulders tuned up and pain free. My wife had an impingement in one shoulder and it took about 3 weeks for her to be pain free on the OHP. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Day two down: 50 lb squat, 45 lb overhead press, 95 lb deadlift. OHP is much harder than any of the other lifts I've tried, with the exception of DL, even with the empty bar. I'm having trouble getting my elbows slightly forward, and I think my forearms are too long to actually rest the bar on my chest like I'm supposed to.
Squat is feeling less awkward, and deadlift isn't nearly as awkward as the other ones. I can't rest the bar on my chest with my elbows in position. It's ok. Just don't cheat. Make sure you come all the way down. Hmm, I thought you weren't supposed to take your elbows past 90 deg due to shoulder issues? (serious question- I'm no expert) According to Rippetoe, OHP starting position is with the bar resting on your chest, assuming forearms aren't too long for that. If they are, the bar floats above the chest. From the front, forearms should be vertical. Pick grip width accordingly. From the side, elbows should be just in front of the bar, which apparently gets one of the forearm bones vertical. The press goes to full extension above your head, elbows locked, shoulders shrugged up in support, bar in line with the back of your neck. Then back down to the start. How to go between the top and bottom is a bit weird and complicated. You don't think that you are overthinking things just a little bit do you? At the bottom bring the bar down far enough to touch your chest. Cheating would be only bringing the bar down to the chin height and lifting again. You might have some discomfort in the shoulders doing this, if so get a band and get stretching the shoulders, hold a 5 or 10lb plate and hang it off the shoulder to distract it in socket, etc. you might find it's helpful to lift with dumbbells until you get your shoulders tuned up and pain free. My wife had an impingement in one shoulder and it took about 3 weeks for her to be pain free on the OHP. I tend to overthink things, as a general rule. It's how I am. In this case that was meant as a direct response to skin's question. That may have meandered a bit. I'm not worried about cheating, at all. |
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Posted: 11/19/2015 10:23:19 AM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I tend to overthink things, as a general rule. It's how I am. In this case that was meant as a direct response to skin's question. That may have meandered a bit. I'm not worried about cheating, at all. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
You don't think that you are overthinking things just a little bit do you? At the bottom bring the bar down far enough to touch your chest. Cheating would be only bringing the bar down to the chin height and lifting again. You might have some discomfort in the shoulders doing this, if so get a band and get stretching the shoulders, hold a 5 or 10lb plate and hang it off the shoulder to distract it in socket, etc. you might find it's helpful to lift with dumbbells until you get your shoulders tuned up and pain free. My wife had an impingement in one shoulder and it took about 3 weeks for her to be pain free on the OHP. I tend to overthink things, as a general rule. It's how I am. In this case that was meant as a direct response to skin's question. That may have meandered a bit. I'm not worried about cheating, at all. Thanks to both of you, off to read a little more on it again... 
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Posted: 11/19/2015 12:07:53 PM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
According to Rippetoe, OHP starting position is with the bar resting on your chest, assuming forearms aren't too long for that. If they are, the bar floats above the chest. From the front, forearms should be vertical. Pick grip width accordingly. From the side, elbows should be just in front of the bar, which apparently gets one of the forearm bones vertical. The press goes to full extension above your head, elbows locked, shoulders shrugged up in support, bar in line with the back of your neck. Then back down to the start. This. If you have long forearms the bar will float above your chest [and power cleans and push presses will suck for you]. There is no reason to touch your chest; just get to the correct efficient starting position as in SS; the bar will be below your chin. The bottom portion of the motion is easy anyway, you should be able to press 20 lbs above your press max up to nose or forehead level as a partial lift (sometimes called a press start). The sticking point when it transitions to mostly tricep is where it gets hard. |
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