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LA, USA
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Posted: 2/23/2017 12:28:59 PM EDT
So, I took this out the other day to shoot through my Mk12 inspired build. I'm using an 18" Ballistic Advantage barrel, which I know isn't going to be a match barrel, but they guarantee 1MOA or better.
I tried a variety of ammo through it, some handloads, some bulk commercial 55gr stuff, and some factory precision ammo. Black Hills and Norma both 77gr bullets shot like garbage...opened up to over 2" group at 100yds. I was sort of under the impression that shooting BH stuff was like shooting an index load...that if you don't shoot it well, something might be wrong with your rifle. For the record, handloads shot the best. I'm going back to check in .2gr increments, but a 69gr SMK with between 23.5 and 24gr of XBR set at 2.260" +/- shot well. I put all 5 in a 1" square at 100yds. |
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FL, USA
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Posted: 2/23/2017 12:54:40 PM EDT
[#1]
Try another match ammo or load your own and try again.
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Posted: 2/23/2017 1:04:37 PM EDT
[#2]
Try some Hornady 75 BTHP if you are loading the bullets or if buying ammo try some of the 75 BTHP Steel Match. I use it for 3 gun matches and it's very accurate out of my 18" Seekins SP3G and even my 20" bolt gun. Another bullet that will load to mag length is the new Hornady 73 ELD-M.
Three shots from my AR and a 5 shot group from the bolt gun. 
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Posted: 2/23/2017 1:12:33 PM EDT
[#3]
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Posted: 2/23/2017 2:45:55 PM EDT
[#4]
I typically see crazy accuracy from Black Hills 77gr SMK Mk.262 load from High Caliber Sales barrels.
When doing grouping exercises after initial fundamentals practical exercises, shooters have printed 1/2" groups even right out of the gate. You might have to work up a load in your rifle with that bullet and find the happy place. How far out are your lands? |
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MD, USA
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Posted: 2/23/2017 9:48:48 PM EDT
[#5]
The general rule that I've seen around seems that most rifles shoot the 77gr SMK very well. If they don't shoot the SMK well they heavily prefer the 75gr hornady. That's what I would try next.
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USA
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Posted: 2/24/2017 7:37:53 PM EDT
[Last Edit: FALex]
[#6]
When you say the 69's shot "well," can you define well?
I've said it before, but it bares repeating: I've not seen a Ballistic Advantage barrel that has consistently shot well. If you want a decent barrel for not a lot of money, go grab a Criterion or WOA. ETA - I think you need to alter your thread title, OP. It's not the BH 77 Ammo that's "not accurate," more than likely, it's your barrel. |
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Posted: 2/24/2017 8:15:31 PM EDT
[Last Edit: borderpatrol]
[#7]
Factory ammo, even Federal Gold Medal Match can sometimes fail to perform as expected. I just built two upper with 14.5" barrels with pin and welded flash hiders added to get them over the 16" length requirement. I fired my standard match load, a load that has performed extremely well through over a dozen different rifles (24.5 grains of Varget, CCI-BR4 primer, Winchester brass, Sierra 69 grain Match King seated @ 2.250") and I was all over the place at 200 yards. Approximate 8" groups if you can call that a group.
The rifles settled down after they had thirty or forty rounds though them and started shooting well (3" groups @ 200 yards) after they had been fired some more. Out-of-the-box I was worried, having never tested them prior to having the FH's permanently attached. Some barrels need a little time to become seasoned before they begin to shoot well. Hand loads have always been better than commercial ammo, even the best commercial ammo, after I discover what works in that particular rifle. Clean the rifle really well and try again. |
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Posted: 2/24/2017 8:45:57 PM EDT
[#8]
The only factory .223 ammo I've seen come anywhere close to my handloads is 69 grain GMM. And that is loaded so light that is it useless for anything other than shooting for group at 100 yards.
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Posted: 3/1/2017 10:26:00 AM EDT
[#9]
What twist is the OP barrel?
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LA, USA
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Posted: 3/2/2017 1:09:00 PM EDT
[Last Edit: tunatuk]
[#10]
I'm shooting a 1:7 twist barrel. Me and a buddy did some development, and with a 77gr TMK over 22.5gr of XBR, I'm shooting sub-MOA at 100yds. Gonna chrono it and come up with some charts, and see how that round will perform at further ranges. The furthest I have access to is about 700yds, and do have my 308 that will go that far without a problem. I'll likely keep this in the 500yd range.
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LA, USA
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Posted: 3/2/2017 1:13:24 PM EDT
[Last Edit: tunatuk]
[#11]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By FALex:
When you say the 69's shot "well," can you define well? I've said it before, but it bares repeating: I've not seen a Ballistic Advantage barrel that has consistently shot well. If you want a decent barrel for not a lot of money, go grab a Criterion or WOA. ETA - I think you need to alter your thread title, OP. It's not the BH 77 Ammo that's "not accurate," more than likely, it's your barrel. Considering I've had success loading a few different rounds, I think it's the BH ammo that wasn't shooting well in my gun. And I guess technically you are right. Ammo in and of itself cannot be accurate, it is always the barrel. |
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Posted: 3/9/2017 12:02:14 AM EDT
[Last Edit: bfoosh06]
[#12]
I agree about trying different ammo.
I suggest some "Creedmoor Sports" 77SMK. That ammo shoots great out of my rifles. As a matter of fact... my profile photo is 20rds rapid fire, 100yds benched, scoped, bagged |
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Posted: 3/9/2017 2:21:48 AM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By tunatuk:
69gr over 23.8gr of XBR shot a 5 round test string touching at 100yds. 77gr over 22.5gr XBR wasn't touching, but was within a 1" square at 100. I don't think it's the barrel. As far as not a lot of money, the WOA is $100 more than what I paid for the profile I wanted, and is also backordered. The Criterion is over double the price and over half the cost of the entire build. Considering I've had success loading a few different rounds, I think it's the BH ammo that wasn't shooting well in my gun. And I guess technically you are right. Ammo in and of itself cannot be accurate, it is always the barrel. I hit just about that very same node in my MK 262 clone tests, then accuracy went away till it got back up to 23.1gr of XBR. |
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LA, USA
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Posted: 3/9/2017 12:50:45 PM EDT
[#14]
Me and my buddy started getting compressed loads, so we kept it at a lower charge. I may load a few at that charge just to see how it feels...the higher the charge the better it shot, but we didn't want to overpressure it if we could avoid it.
I also found some 69gr TMK's that I have loaded up too...want to see how they shoot. Glad I'm on the right track with my loads though. |
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WA, USA
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Posted: 3/12/2017 11:38:51 PM EDT
[#15]
(Assuming you are normally a great shot and are doing everything possible on your end to create tight groups):
It's either barrel or ammo. As for Black Hills ammo; they're a great company but it isn't 'magical' ammunition. My LaRue Stealth (16" barrel, 5x scope) groups 0.25" at 100 yds with my 77gr SMK handloads, but 1"-1.5" with the equivalent BH load. I don't blame BH - my rifle simply doesn't "like" their recipe. |
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LA, USA
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Posted: 3/13/2017 11:17:09 AM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Schwag173:
(Assuming you are normally a great shot and are doing everything possible on your end to create tight groups): It's either barrel or ammo. As for Black Hills ammo; they're a great company but it isn't 'magical' ammunition. My LaRue Stealth (16" barrel, 5x scope) groups 0.25" at 100 yds with my 77gr SMK handloads, but 1"-1.5" with the equivalent BH load. I don't blame BH - my rifle simply doesn't "like" their recipe. |
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Posted: 3/13/2017 11:21:49 AM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Schwag173:
(Assuming you are normally a great shot and are doing everything possible on your end to create tight groups): It's either barrel or ammo. As for Black Hills ammo; they're a great company but it isn't 'magical' ammunition. My LaRue Stealth (16" barrel, 5x scope) groups 0.25" at 100 yds with my 77gr SMK handloads, but 1"-1.5" with the equivalent BH load. I don't blame BH - my rifle simply doesn't "like" their recipe. |
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Posted: 3/13/2017 11:36:18 AM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 03PSD:
.25" groups out of a AR, even a LaRue is hard to believe. Did this happen once or consistently? Those groups would put you at the top of every MOA all day challenge group, if you can walk the walk. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 03PSD:
<strong>Originally Posted By Schwag173:</strong>
(Assuming you are normally a great shot and are doing everything possible on your end to create tight groups): It's either barrel or ammo. As for Black Hills ammo; they're a great company but it isn't 'magical' ammunition. My LaRue Stealth (16" barrel, 5x scope) groups 0.25" at 100 yds with my 77gr SMK handloads, but 1"-1.5" with the equivalent BH load. I don't blame BH - my rifle simply doesn't "like" their recipe. tagged for answers. |
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Posted: 3/16/2017 12:20:00 PM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By rob78:
tagged for answers. Wondering about this myself |
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Posted: 3/16/2017 3:53:36 PM EDT
[#20]
My Larue Stealth barrel shoots MK262 1/2" @ 100 yards.
If you don't handload yourself, try Copper Creek ammo. |
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Posted: 3/16/2017 4:14:13 PM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Schwag173:
(Assuming you are normally a great shot and are doing everything possible on your end to create tight groups): It's either barrel or ammo. As for Black Hills ammo; they're a great company but it isn't 'magical' ammunition. My LaRue Stealth (16" barrel, 5x scope) groups 0.25" at 100 yds with my 77gr SMK handloads, but 1"-1.5" with the equivalent BH load. I don't blame BH - my rifle simply doesn't "like" their recipe. 
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WA, USA
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Posted: 3/22/2017 7:19:19 PM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 03PSD:
.25" groups out of a AR, even a LaRue is hard to believe. Did this happen once or consistently? Those groups would put you at the top of every MOA all day challenge group, if you can walk the walk. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 03PSD:
Originally Posted By Schwag173:
(Assuming you are normally a great shot and are doing everything possible on your end to create tight groups): It's either barrel or ammo. As for Black Hills ammo; they're a great company but it isn't 'magical' ammunition. My LaRue Stealth (16" barrel, 5x scope) groups 0.25" at 100 yds with my 77gr SMK handloads, but 1"-1.5" with the equivalent BH load. I don't blame BH - my rifle simply doesn't "like" their recipe. Cheers 
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Posted: 3/22/2017 8:52:18 PM EDT
[Last Edit: MRW]
[#23]
I'll be direct: BS. Let me guess, 3 round groups every other once in a while?
go shoot the MOA all day thread and post your results. |
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Posted: 3/23/2017 9:13:40 AM EDT
[#24]
I have a chrome lined DPMS 16" that doesn't like boat tail bullets at all. Yet it will put the cheapest 55 gr flat base bullet into an inch and half group. But throw good quality boat tail bullets into a shotgun pattern. Now the Hornady steel match it will half ass shoot. But keep in mind this is a chrome lined barrel from a rack grade gun. Some barrels will prefer one bullet style over another. Personally I have no problem with the 55 soft point with cannelure. I can remember when the Sierra 52gr and 53gr bullets were the standard to test the .223 and the .222 for accuracy. One was a flat base match and the other was boat tail.
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SC, USA
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Posted: 3/29/2017 7:18:34 PM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Schwag173:
(Assuming you are normally a great shot and are doing everything possible on your end to create tight groups): It's either barrel or ammo. As for Black Hills ammo; they're a great company but it isn't 'magical' ammunition. My LaRue Stealth (16" barrel, 5x scope) groups 0.25" at 100 yds with my 77gr SMK handloads, but 1"-1.5" with the equivalent BH load. I don't blame BH - my rifle simply doesn't "like" their recipe. ZA |
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LA, USA
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Posted: 3/29/2017 9:52:21 PM EDT
[Last Edit: tunatuk]
[#26]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By ZA206:
Can you post your load? Very interested! ZA 69gr TMK over 23.8gr XBR 77gr TMK over 22.5gr XBR The 69gr was tighter out of my gun, but both my buddy and I are loading, and we wanted to find a high performing round that worked in both of our guns, that way we knew our data would be good and we could spot for the other, especially when we go p'dog hunting soon. The group for 69 was within 2/3 MOA @ 100yds, and the 77 was about 3/4 MOA at the same. |
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