I would like to hear some opinions on this.  I am new to 3 gun so I don't exactly know what makes a great 3 guns rifle but I have shot a lot of guns and shoot well so I would like to think I know what would make a good rifle for competition.  I am looking at buying a SR15 mod 2 for next years 3 gun matches.  I own a sr15 mod 1 and SBR. Both great rifles.  The Mod 1 is a very smooth shooter with light recoil and very reliable and strong, as we all already know.  In my casual observations, no one competitive is using SR15s.  So what gives?  I know some prefer 18" rifles but I think I will be happy with a 16". Is it too heavy compared to the high end 3 gun rifles? Gas system not optimal?  What makes other options, such as JP, better choices?

I am going to go forward under the assumption that if I buy a mod 2, throw my Mark 6 on it, maybe upgrade the trigger, and add a JP compensator I will have a top notch rifle for competition.

Tell me why I am wrong.

I am asking this as a Knights lover and a 3 gun newb so I am genuinely interested in opinions on what else is out there.

What division are you planing on competing?

Ive seen this thread done before.

IIRC, the consensus was that the LPR would be the better choice due to the accuracy needed in 3gun comp.


Keep in mind I own a Mod1 but am NOT a 3gunner. Just relaying what I have read before when this exact question was asked. So take it for nothin.

I would like to try open but have been urged to shoot tac ops by buddies that are competitive.  I have pistols set up for both and will probably shoot both to see which one I like better

Dont wana get called a kac basher or a troll (seems like few kac owners are very sensitive), but there are better options for running an open gun.
Durability and reliability is a none issue in competition, so pick components that are there just for the "race".
Again better options are out there for an open 3 gun rifle.

Yeah like what? That's what I'm looking for.  What components of a rifle make it better suited for shooting fast?

If it was me, I'd have JP Enterprises build a 3-gun rifle. Gas system on the bleeding edge & low mass bolt carrier group so theres less recoil/muzzle rise and fast action, match grade SS barrel for excellent accuracy. John Paul knows his shit with race guns.

 
Im a big KAC fan and I agree.


Buy a gamer gun built for gamers, by gamers, to play games.


KAC is a genuine hard-use combat rifle. Not a game-optimized rifle.


As I said earlier, if you insist on KAC the LPR would better suit your needs.

Least amount of recoil. Shoot 223 ammo, slower more under powered the better. Componets to support weak ammo. Best muzzle device to keep gun on target. And i like signle stage trigger with minimal reset.
Like the guy said. Its a gamers rig meant for games. But thats who you will be up against in an open division.

What these guys have already said ^  It's a game, so treat it as such.

That being said, many 3-gun guys run rifles that would make decent 'combat' rifles as well.  All my stuff is built with a nod towards reliability, and I don't use any under powered ammo for the hoser stages.  The average 3-gun rifle out there is an 18" stainless barreled, rifle-length gas system (softer), 15" smooth handguard (no need to hang anything tacticool on them), with a really good trigger (JP is my personal favorite), with excellent quality components that is capable of roughly MOA accuracy with decent ammo. After that, it's just cosmetics.   I don't see all that many true 'race guns' when it comes to rifles (at least in Tac-Ops), probably because they seem to operate right on the edge of reliability.  All of my 3-gun rifles are builds, but if I didn't simply enjoy building guns, I'd get a JP--they really know their stuff.

There's no reason you can't use a KAC for 3-gun, and no one will care or make fun of you if you do.  Go have fun.

I think a Kac would do fine at the level that most people compete at.  I've seen people run 3 gun with SBR's and do better than guys with dedicated rigs. In general though, 3 gun competition negates a lot of the advantages that make KAC rifles great.  No need for an ambi lower, reliability isn't as important ( by that I mean the dirt in the gun still fires underwater reliability), weight isn't as big of an issue, no need for iron sights.

Chris Costa kind of talks about this issue in the discussion on the link.  I remember listening to it awhile back and thought that it was interesting.  

http://shootersmindset.com/003/

I would agree with this as well..

You need to decide what your intent is for getting into or shooting 3Gun. Do you want to play a game and be as competitive as possible, or just train to improve your shooting skills for practical purposes?  The SR15 would be fine if you want to train in a practical/tactical sense. You may or may not be competitive depending on who shoots in your matches and how serious they take it. You'll still come out a better shooter. I shot with a 6920 for a while and enjoyed it.

John Paul agrees.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JlZrPQNOblA

Are you saying that competition guns are not as reliable or durable as non competition rigs?  Can you please explain, serious question.

Yes thats what I'm saying, aluminum carriers, light weight buffer spring, 55 gr ammo that does 2,600 fps, light weight buffer does not lend their selves to reliability or durability.
Rifle like that is not meant for a fight.

Why is it less reliable? You don't need a heavy spring and buffer when your running a light weight carrier with an adjustable gas block.

Less mass to cut crud when rifle is dirty.

another huge kac fan here and I agree with going the jp route as well.Its the better gun for the job

Most of 3 gunners don't think of KAC as their first choice since there is already quite a bit of money in the rifle before modifications, cheaper to buy/build one from the ground up for 3 gun purposes with individualized components. However, if you already have a KAC that you like, just install an effective brake and a decent single stage trigger + optic(s) of your choice then go have fun.  Remember race equipment doesn't make anyone a top shot in 3 gun.  Put your $ in training & go to matches.

Welcome to the most addicting hobby

L
I have never shot a JP rifle built for competition or anything similar but the SR15 gas system with a AAC suppressor brake is one of the smoothest shooting rifles I have shot. I just assumed it would be a great platform for a race rifle with minor improvements.

Aside from JP, what other brands are out there for purpose built competition guns?

I totally agree, what makes a gamer gun? A compensator on the front, maybe JP silent capture recoil spring, match trigger. Now just this last year lightweight bolt carriers are becoming the norm but, that's it. You can take any rifle make it race ready.  Hard core 3gunners rifles tend to make their rifles look less tactical more sport oriented with flashy colors but that's just looks. If you got the cash to blow why not buy a Knights rifle at least you will know you have a top of the line rifle as your base....and it will look bad ass.

+1 on the reliability.  No sense of spending uber amount of cash on race equipment and have it fails on the clock at a big match that you spend $200-$300 to enter.

Regarding low mass BCGs, I have been running nothing but JP LMOS systems (either alum or stainless) since 2005, including his first version of the aluminum carrier, never a failure in feed or extraction.

Here is something to think about when shooting in Open/Unlimted. You are going to be shooting against people with gear like this. I shoot Open and these are my guns. And there are people out there that have even more gamer gear than I do. You can shoot the matches and still have tons of fun with any gear, but to be competitive, you'll want purpose built gear.

It's like driving a tricked out Honda, and then getting into a Ferrari. The Honda can be built up to be able to race, but the Ferrari is built for it from the start.

I started out with a rifle simlar to what you are looking to buy, except mine had a 20" CHF barrel. I have changed so much on it, I would have been much better off buying a gamer gun from the start. What makes the gamer guns better for the game is going to be the barrels, trigger, low mass bolt carriers and buffers, adjustable gas blocks, and comps / brakes. My rifle doesn't move when I shoot it, as a highly tuned rifle should be. Due to that, my double taps at close range will be much faster and accurate. CHF barrels are made to be durable, way outlasting a stainless barrel. But my stainless match barrel will be more accurate. When shooting 6"-8" plates at a few hundred yards, that make a huge diffence. Barrel length doesn't make as big a difference, as a lot of 3gun rifles are now coming with them. But they will be a much higher quality 16" barrel than the one you posted.

So to me, it boils down to what you want to do in 3gun. I have friends that use "duty" styled gear and shoot 3gun more as training, and they really enjoy themsleves, but they are not competitive. Then I have friends that are in it to be competitive, and they all have purpose built gear. If you are in it for the game, get a gamer gun.