Basically I'm trying to buy a new deer rifle, I will also be building a precision gun soon.  I want to keep the calibers the same between the two, so either .308 or .300 Win Mag.  Yes I know they will shoot different type of rounds but if I run out of ammo for one type in a SHTF type scenario at least they will all shoot the same caliber, so I can use the hunting rounds out of the precision or vice versa.

I was told that .300 Win Mag was "too much" for deer, which I find hard to believe considering .30-06 is a standard round.  What say you guys?

It's a bit more than necessary, but no too much.  





With the right bullet and shot placement, on a deer you'll have a small entry hole, and a slightly larger exit hole.





I use a 180 gr. Nosler partition on elk, and I've used the same bullet on deer with minimal damage to meat.





Just avoid the shoulder shots, put it in the boiler room and you'll be fine.

 

It's too much...

I have a 300 Win Mag and it is not extremely friendly to shoot either. It is my go-to rifle for deer hunting, but it is way overkill IMHO. I reload reduced charges with it so that the recoil isn't as bad, so basically I should have just stuck with a full charge 308.

I will not replace my rifle in case I go bear hunting, elk, moose, etc... But I do wish I would have just bought a good Savage 10 in 308 and been done with it.


You can't really compare it to 30-06. The 300 win mag is the same caliber, but shoots a much heavier bullet at higher velocity, leading to a much higher muzzle energy (and recoil).

It's a lot of rifle for a deer.  I shoot a .300 - but I've always been more looking for elk than deer.  What it buys you is flat shooting, basically you can sight it in about 3.5" high at 100 and it will be about 3.5" low at near 350.  So you're point blank out to 350 yds or so with a 200 gr pill.  

Downside is recoil (and ammo is expensive unless you reload)  I got my first one in high school. Shot it so much with inadequate protection I developed a really nifty flinch.  Only way I defeated it was to not shoot it for about 10 years.

I'm thinking seriously about chasing deer this year a bit, I'll be using the .270.  It's a good deer round.   If I was going to build a deer rifle I think I'd build a 7x57.

ETA: 50-140 is right - Thin skinned game stay out of the shoulder.  Put the shot behind the shoulder into the boiler room, otherwise all you'll get out of the front shoulders is bloodshot hamburger.

More than needed, sure; it will still work. If you have experience with the magnum rifle rounds and shoot them well knock yourself out. A dedicated deer rifle; I'd go with a 260 or 6.5x55; but I'm a reloader too.

Good ammo selection and shooting can prob get you anything up to a moose out as far as you can shoot with a 308. If you are always going to shoot long range then maybe the 300 would have the edge but otherwise, overkill.

Way overkill but what the heck is too much? Pick your shots so you don't tear up too much meat (should be doing that anyway)

Yeah ammo is more expensive but how much ammo are you ever going to use for deer hunting? A bit to practice and check sight in then the ones you shoot at bambi.

Your whole way of thinking is not the way I personally would go , I just can't get that excited at the benefit of having interchangeable ammo between my different guns. I personally would try to get the gun that best fitted my use and then buy a bit more ammo to cover any ammo shortage problems.

Learn to reload and stick to 30 caliber guns and share bullets?

My overwhelming thought is that most folks shoot say a 308 with much better confidence due to the recoil .

But in the end it is your choice to best fit your needs , no harm in hunting deer with the .300 WM . You can always trade it off if it gets to the point where you want to go lighter.

My sister used to have a boyfriend who had all sorts of back and shoulder problems due to some old injuries but the silly fool insisted on hunting deer with a 375 H&H and a 416 Rigby ! Most every year he would miss some work after hunting season because he beat himself up with the big guns . Fool had a closet full of regular guns , .243, 30-30 , 308 , 6.5 but he insisted on using the big boomers for deer

Just because .300 Win Mag can be overkill, doesn't mean it has to be.

They make .300 Win Mag ammo for medium game/deer. So according to the people that make ammunition for a living, it's not overkill. They also make ammo in .300 Win Mag for larger/thicker skinned animals. This is a bit of a generalization, since there is a big difference between a 90lbs doe, and a 230lbs buck.

Some of them even put a picture of the appropriate animal on the box, so people don't get confused by weights, numbers, speeds, and written words.

Any reloader can tell you that a .300 Win Mag in a bolt gun can be used for anything from squirrel to Grizzly bear if you use the appropriate load/projectile. It can easily be loaded for the same velocity as a .308 load using the same projectile. Someone will have to explain to me, how the same bullet going the same speed, out of a different gun is "overkill" and will produce a different result.

well I have both....  I shoot my 308 ALL the time, I'm more confident in my 308, I'm more accurate with my 308... my 308 is easier to get ammo for and better for reloading.... I reload also.  reason for this is the 308, is cheap to find surplus or 7.62x51 ammo for.... you can get the zqi at walmart $10 for 20rds of brass casing... steel case tula Is about $8 for 20rds... sometimes i'll find deals on 308 cheaper than I can reload it... hit the gun shows and find cheap surplus ammo in the right tables.... 308 is better for reloading because primers are easier to get instead of magnum primers, you use a good bit less gunpowder,, and it has a lot longer case life.... I can shoot my 308 all day long, one because ammo is cheap, two because it is easy on the shoulder, while the 300 I'll shoot 10-15rds and I'm done, three you don't want to constantly shoot a 300 with the heat generated and velocity you can foul the rifling, or warp the barrel, which is true with any magnum, which I seen a buddy with with a 7mm rem mag....  the more you can shoot the gun the better you will be with it...  cheaper and lower the recoil it is the more you can shoot it...

I have shot 7-9lb 300win and they are not the pleasant, brakes help.



Back when I was 16-17 dad bought me a Ruger M77 All Weather Stainless in a Synthetic lightweight stock. Gun looked like it was new I weighed it came in at just 6lbs 5 oz, I bought one box of ammo and looked at the cartridge. Still have that box somewhere.



Looked like new when I traded it for a Smith 686.

I have used 1 for 7-8 years and have killed deer with 150g & 165g ,both did a fine job but for the most part I use 150g coreloc's . I weigh 220 or so and have shot ruff recoiling shot guns so its not too bad. if/when I get a chance to hunt elk I can just step up to a premium bullet and resite. I will always have 1 and a 243 in the safe as I can hunt mice too moose with them

7mm SAUM - ballistics similar to 30.06, but with the added benefit of high BC bullets available for 1000-yard match shooting.





I have a Remington Model 7 with a VAIS brake for hunting. (Gun feels like a .243 on the range.)





And a 20-lb. custom-built gun for precision work.





It really is an under appreciated cartridge (but one that is making a bit of a comeback in the benchrest world.)

 

No it is a dead right there gun.

Buya tikka 695 in 300 it will do double duty - hunt and precision.

300 Win Mag is totally unnecessary for deer.  You will be shooting far more powder, with much greater recoil and shorter barrel life, and you get more energy in return, energy that you totally do not need.  The vast majority of that energy will be expended on the hillside and the oak tree on the far side of the deer.  One of the most common Moose cartridges I see in Canada is the .308 Win.  I've personally seen complete penetration and clean kills with a .308 on moose, and using plain factory nonpremium ammo.  With good bullets it will do wonders...  If it'll kill moose, it'll kill deer...

For what its worth, I've used .308 for deer for many, many years.  You could argue that I'm using a 'weaker' version for .308 as well.  Since I'm shooting a relatively mild handload and using a 20" barrel, I'm at the lower end of .308 power.  it's effectively more of a .300 Savage load than a true .308 win load.  And when I use appropriate bullets, I still get the sort of 'Bang-flop" dead right there kills that would make you giggle.  Seriously, Boooom-flop, and they are down and twitching gently.  A .300 would give you little more than excessive power that would be wasted.

Again for what its worth, the key is matching bullet construction to impact speeds.  I've been using a relatively 'weak' rapidly expanding bullet.  165 Ballistic TIp.  At the modest speeds I shoot, these open very well and absolutely pound deer without being overly expansive.  Use the same bullet in a 300 win, and it will fail.  

The .300 Win has one advantage:  Range.  Unfortunately, I have yet to encounter anyone who can really, realistically utilize all that range.  The .308 will work on deer to 300, 400 yards.  Got a lot of 600 yard shots on deer in NJ???  Really???  Eve if you did, I'd argue that most of us (except for the many armchair commandos) lack the skill for a clean kill on deer at those ranges.  My longest shot to date is a laser ranged 292 yards....  And It looked and felt much farther.  I'd not care to make it a habit....

The 300 looks good on paper.  Most of us wont shoot it as well. And whatever load you use for the target gun wont likely be a decent deer load (diferent bullets).  You'lll probably shoot a ,308 batter (less recoil, less flinching, more ammo for your dollar so more shooting) in 308 as well.  And any rifle that is a pleasure to carry in the woods (handy and light) will be a hard kicker in 300.  Or itll be heavy enough to keep recoil down, but will suck as a deer rifle because its so damned heavy.  I've got a new Weatherby Backcountry in .30-06.  It's not a fly weight, but its about 6.5 lbs without bases, rings or scope.  Nice to carry.  And it kicks quite severely even with .30-06.  The same gun is available in a magnum, and I know I don't want it.

>308 will do everything you want better than 300 except shoot far, which most of us cannot do.  I think the choice is obvious.

Totally agreed.

It's fine. I've shot a .300H&H for years and never worried about having "too much gun"  I run 200grn Patitions through it.

 wish this page had a "like" button... I'd definitely hit the like button on this  and if you don't mind me asking what are you loading for moose in the 308?

Have both and reload for both,I use 168gr accubonds for both. My .308 AP4 loves the 168's and they work great in the .300 as a deer round and still have more than enough to drop an elk if needed.

I don't hunt in NJ but thanks for the input

I shoot 180 grain PSP's out of my two .30-06 bolts and they work wonders on deer. A .300 WM has roughly 33% more energy, which is a lot considering .30-06 and good shot placement will result in a lot of one-shot kills.

My main problem with .300 is recoil. Of all times you can not afford to flinch, hunting is one of them. I use a PAST (Mag Plus, I think) recoil shield that fits a little like an arm sling. Recoil on even the .300 is manageable - it kicks, but not to the point where it hurts.

You can never have too much power, handload and you will have the best of both worlds.

Cman 426:  Several of the moose I've seen taken with .308 were done in with plain jane, nothing fancy 180 grn soft points by Win and Rem....  I know these don't have a great reputation, but oddly enough, I think they work better in .308. These are either pushed through a bolt gun or a browning lever BL81 (kinda popular with tht grop I hunted with).  A big .300 H&H , a .300 Win, .300 Weatherby etc can push them fast enough that they come apart (hence the need for something like a Partition, a Swift Aframe, TTSx, etc).  However, in .308, impact speeds are lower, and these open without coming apart like they often might in a bigger faster cartridge.. They punch completely through....

My own loading uses 180 Nosler Partitions.  Probably not necessary, but its an extra measure of insurance....  I pretty much handload everything, so no factory load I have used that I can point you towards.  Federal premium .308 with the 180 Partition (load P308e) would be very hard to argue with.  It's not as modern or cutting edge as something like a TTSX or Trophy Bonded but ,308 really doesn't need bonding, monolithics, etc.  Muzzle velocities are some 400 FPS slower than any belted magnum.  Expect that 180 to open well and penetrate extremely deeply, without the over-expansive "It-just-came-apart" syndrome that could happen at speeds of 3000fps +.  I have not recovered a shot partition (they sail right through) but what I believe happens is that in .308, .30-06 etc they retain more weight than if the same bullet was used in a magnum.  More of that partition will hold together.

For clarification, we shoot eastern Canada moose.  Usually 600-1000 lb range, not those bigger, 1800lb  Yukon monsters.  We get full broadside penetration with .308 and .30-06 (and many .303s too, but these are becoming more scarce now).  I'm a rarity as a handloader, so most are shot with regular, non-premium factory by Win and Federal.  In our best year the group took three bulls.  Two with a .30-06, one with .308.  Zero bullets recovered, All factory cup and core 180's at ranges of 125-about 190 yards...

Seems a lot of people think that the same projectile going the same speed, fired from a different cartridge equates to overkill...

I have had a 300wm as my all around gun for 20yrs. It was my uncle's gun. It has taken countless deer, and a few elk.

It is not overkill. I do not care about the recoil. After all, I only shoot 3-5 rounds a year out of it. I take it out before the season and shoot a three shot group to make sure scope is on. Then one, maybe two shots at an animal. For hunting elk, I want the extra range and power. For me it's either 300wm or 30-06. My 308 is for shooting paper.

They're not going the same speed. .30-06 has more of a charge than .308 and thus more energy. .300 WM has more of a charge than .30-06 and thus more energy.

Depends on factory vs.hand loads.......

Not really. The case capacity of a .300 WM is roughly 75% higher than that of a .308.

I'd rather have one good rifle that does double duty but whatever...

If you take a look at the load data charts below you will see that the .300WM can be loaded light at close or below .308 max load speeds.

IMO... No such thing as overkill. Dead is dead. 300WM will give an edge if a longer shot is required or wanted.
Now if by over kill the other posters mean meat damage then I could see their point... A little. There are several bullets from which to pick with different goals at different ranges and different types of critters. Pick the one that best suits the parameters needed.

I say if you do not mind the recoil of 300WM and are looking for a general purpose all around North American rifle then it will be fine.

Capacity... I don't think this word means what you think it means.

125 grain handloads for deer and antelope have always been just right for me

I used to have a 300 and killed a dear with it.  But then realized it did nothing for me that an 06 can't do in a lighter less abusive package.  Plus I reload and the 300 uses a lot of damn powder. I have a 308 too and that will really do almost everything a 30-06 can do (for deer I would say flip a coin) but I like the 06 for elk... 180s are slow out of the 308.

If you are really hunting only deer, get a 308.  No reason to bust yourself up using a 300... unless you are the few that hunt at 600+ yards.

Well what I mean is the volume of powder the case can handle. Don't think I'm the only one who uses that term.

I didn't know that. I guess I figured it was possible with a really hot .308 and a really underpowered .300 WM, but I would think that's more along the lines of "technically possible" rather than the average shot.

That's the point. It's more about using the right ammunition, than caliber.

Just buy or load the right ammo. For example:

Federal ammo factory deer loads
.300 Win Mag-  165 grain vital shock rated at 3050fps Link
.308- 165 grain rated at 2880 Link

They are the same projectile, moving at pretty much the same speed. I wouldn't classify the extra 170 FPS (5%) of speed as "overkill" for deer. I wouldn't use it on a young doe, but then again, I wouldn't use .308 for that either.  And if the OP ever wants to shoot further, or at bigger game with .30'Cal, .300 Win Mag has more options.

The most common ammunition that I shoot for my guns:

.308 - Prvi Partizan Match 168: 2608 fps, 2537 ft. lbs.
.30-06 - Remington 180 PSP: 2700 fps, 2913 ft. lbs.
.300 WM - Remington 180 PSP: 2960 fps, 3501 ft. lbs.

An interesting point of comparison is that the Remington 180 PSP for .308 is at 2620 fps, 2743 ft. lbs.

I admit I have not done any research on the various factory ammunition loads available, but I would guess that the case capacity of the .300 WM would make it have a ton more options as far as light loads, hot loads, or whatever, especially for a reloader.

Well it looks like I'm probably going to go with a .308.  I hunt in Vermont so I'll only ever have deer unless I'm a lucky SOB and win the lottery for a moose tag.  Some of the distances can be pretty long which is why I was looking at .300 Win Mag.  With the price of the PPU .308 Match ammo at $15.50 a box on AIM I've pretty much decided to go with that.  I'll be picking up my new rifle here in a couple weeks, decided on the Ruger American.  Cheap and more than accurate for deer.

Just use decent glass and you're GTG.

Depends on where you hunt, what you hunt and what ranges you most often encounter.  When I was hunting deer a lot I'd use either my 300 or a 270, with the nod to the mag if there were ranges over 350 yards in the mix.  The drawback is when longer range isn't in the mix and you're presented with a 50 yard shot, in that instance you can mess up some meat pretty easy if you're not careful about your shot placement.  Great caliber though if you need or think you might need the power.

Yeah, this is another well thought out post.

Just throwing this suggestion out to you, Frozeny, 'cause I have an Encore 30-06 that I shoot really well;  have you ever tried a Limbsaver recoil pad ?

Those recoil pads have really tamed felt recoil on all my shotguns and rifles.

With the .308, you will also get the benefit of a shorter and lighter action. I really don't like carrying a heavy rifle for hours on end, but personally could care less about the recoil.

You might also want to look at the 7mm-08. Same parent case as .308, just shoots flatter and faster and use bullets with better BCs. Probably my favorite deer cartridge, and very pleasant to shoot.

What I like about 300 win mag is it's versatility.  I love variety in my hunting rifles but some seasons I just don't have the time preseason to practice with multiple rifles to where I feel comfortable taking longer shots.  With 300 win mag I can pick one rifle and one bullet and hunt everything from Blacktail deer to bear.  It may be overkill for deer but by no means does it mangle them.

Is there any difference between a 300 Winchester Magnum and a 300 Weatherby Magnum?  

I just traded a guy for a beautiful 300 Weatherby Magnum.  I am not sure what the hell I am going to do with it or even what ammo to use.  It was just so damn pretty....I couldn’t refuse.

Velocity/Ballistics are very close. The price of factory loads is quite different, Weatherby is considerably more expensive

The weapon is a Weatherby.  Can I use  300 Winchester Magnum ammo in it?

No, different calibers with same diameter bullet .308.  Do not fire 300 Winchester ammo in a 300 Weatherby.

When I lived in NJ we couldn't hunt with a rifle.

There is a reason for all the .300 Win Mags on the secondary market.  Actually, several: recoil, ammo price, gun size, etc.  Buy 7mm-08 and thank me later.

It depends,  Weatherby makes rifles chambered in .300 win mag and they make rifles chambered in .300 Weatherby.  They are not interchangeable.  .300 wby ammo is expensive.  Iirc it uses considerably more powder than a .300 win mag.

No. Different cartridge completely.