Here you go. Lets talk about the code requirement. I am quite sure we can keep it professional.

I too can see both sides, but of course think my opinion is correct.

Pro code -- It is the basic means of communication. People all over the world speak it as a language. It is a historical part of our hobby (like learning to shoot with iron sights). It is still useful even to the newest ham since most repeaters all ID in morse.

Anti code -- It is antiquated. An operator could spend a lifetime enjoying the hobby and never use it. Once it was dropped the number of licensed amateur radio operators increased drastically. More operators means more visibility, means less likelihood of loosing spectrum.

I am not "anti code" in the sense that we need to get it off the airways, I am anti code in the fact that it is used as a licensing requirement. Why not make hams demonstrate how to properly set and employ a macro on PSK? Or upload a image to SSTV? Everyone has their favorite mode that they could say one should have to demonstrate proficiency in before being allowed on the air.

Ham radio has been one of the most rewarding hobbies I have gotten into. Not because of the DX I have snagged, or the times when my cell phone died. To me the reward comes from the vastness of branches that stem from it. To limit people from starting the journey because they don't express interest in only one part of the hobby turns many off that could be a great asset.

Personally I wouldn't be opposed to code proficiency as a requirement to higher licensing but that isn't the discussion at hand, or likely to happen.

CW is no longer required for a license and one does have to demonstrate at least a rudimentary knowledge of data modes to pass the tests.

I use CW because I enjoy it. It's another language to me. In fact, if CW was not allowed, I'd sell off my station immediately.

Macros make PSK awful. I don't care what kind of computer you have. Besides, requiring someone to show competence in creating one would require endorsing a single PSK application.

Maybe you could take it a little more literal

FWIW there are an awful lot of no code licensees out there that have decided for their own reasons to learn CW.

A lot of them are very good at it to the point that there has been a resurgence in the use of it.

QRZ forum...butthurt old hams who bitch about no-coders

ARFCOM forum ...butthurt newbs who bitch about hams that had to or want to CW


GCW....replace those little horse toys with a CW paddle and join the fun

I fit into this category. I have really come to love CW in short order. It is such a fun mode that allows one much flexibility.
Of course, I'm also of the opinion that the hobby has been helped, and not hurt, by dropping the code requirement.

1 -- Never
2 -- I have a couple paddles/keys
3 -- This isn't about the fact of Morse being usable or practical. The butthurt comes from the old timers saying that you shouldn't have a license unless you know CW.

I support CW 100% and plan on playing more with it in 2015, however I don't think it should be a requirement to be a ham radio operator.

ETA; Those are Kenwood horse toys so you have to support them.

You could really confuse people and put this thread in the bear pit. haha.

I haven't see anyone on this forum like that.


.

I'll be that guy. You shouldn't have a license if you can't whistle packet at 300 baud and decode WeFAX in your head.
















It's actually really easy do decode WeFAX, just listen to it while watching it decode

Neither do I.

 

This shit is starting to piss me the fuck off.

I am SERIOUSLY tempted to get myself good enough to send/receive 50 WPM so I can stuff it up the ass of the old farts.

"I'm a no code extra and pound 50 WPM so suck my ass."

WTF is a macro? A 20kW legal limit amplifier?

He said marco.

POLO!

Damn....

Duuuuuhhhhhhh...............
I cannot tell the difference between dit and dah!  
I was always interested in licensing, but saw the code requirement as a deal breaker, so I never attempted it.  
Some people have said they could teach me, but I don't think they can.  I even tried an online training session, but still I could tell no difference between the an E or a T.

Bill

pretty much any ham who operates CW will welcome any ham who's trying to learn CW.

anyone who learns CW today, now that it's no longer a requirement, has my respect and admiration

When I was trying to pass my 13wpm test the local elmers told me to get on the air and call CQ

I was nervous as hell, and thought I'd make a fool of myself

what I found was guys who would slow down to my level and give lots of encouragement

And they still do.

Last night a very nice gentleman stayed with me for 20 minutes, 5 minutes beyond my NO CODE ability...but he didn't know any better.

God bless you D, and all who do as you do, the strength of this hobby in 10 years will be mass you have moved now....in spite of those who hate instead of help.

Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile

Morse code has been an albatross around my neck since age 12.

Back in my day you had to either learn morse code or semaphore to advance to first class Boy Scout. Nobody came forward to help and I couldn't learn it on my own. Ended up having to quit the Boy Scouts because of it. One the biggest fails of my life. Of course back then you had to learn CW to get an amateur license. Since I failed at learning morse as a Scout why bother even looking at amateur radio.

40 years later I went looking for options for alternative comms for when the SHTF. Amateur radio was actually far down the list as I still thought CW was still a requirement. Once I found out that the code requirement had been dropped amateur radio rose to the top.

13 months after getting licensed I made my first CW QSO. 2 months after that very nervous first QSO I made back to back contacts on 17m with AK and HI. Right then and there I realized the power of the mode. Log shows I made 137 contacts that year.

Let's face it. Dropping the code requirement was the best thing to happen to the hobby to keep it alive. I and many of you would not even be here discussing this subject if the code requirement were still in effect.

And that albatross tasted good in a gumbo with a touch of Tobasco.

Requiring code, is, well, it is just stupid.  It is stupid in that it has NOTHING to do with the proper operation of the radio. It has NOTHING to do with proper practice and operation. It has NOTHING to do with the theory or understanding of radio operations. It was nothing more than a reasonably difficult, antiquated method of sending signals, which was used as a gate (and not a very good one) to make it more difficult to get into the hobby.  Did it make for better operators?  I really doubt that is true.  Listen to 14.313, most of the goofs on there sound old enough to have gotten their licenses back in the days of code.
Older hams seem to be more polite and more respectful and ascribe to the rules and convention of HAM radio, because older folks ARE more polite, more respectful, and generally WANT to ascribe to the rules and conventions of everything--it has little to do with learning code or keeping no code folks out.  The no code folks that can get into the hobby, and act like little kids, generally will get bored and go away rather quickly. In addition, the simple cost of equipment and need for a an antenna beyond sticking a CB antenna out the window does a sufficient job of keeping the true little kids out--the rest of what you see is the generational difference that has been changing since man first walked erect.
I held a commercial radio license, back in the day when it was required, didn't need to know code for that, why would I need to prove a knowledge of code to operate a amateur radio?
I should start a campaign where if you did not do 10 years in commercial radio--so you know how to work a mic, not cuss on the air, and how to enunciate and project your voice, you shouldn't be on the air.  I have heard more than my share of Boomhauers on the air, and trying to get their call sign it a real pain in the butt!
Damn non-Comm operators ruing the hobby for the former pros!!
I teach chemistry in college.




When I took my chemistry classes, we were required to memorize the periodic table.  Why? Because the old folks that taught the classes had to memorize the periodic table when they took chemistry, that's why.  There was, and there is, no point in making kids try to memorize the periodic table. IT IS useful to understand and be able to USE the periodic table.  So, with one in hand you can use it to get information. I don't require the kids to memorize the periodic table (if you use it enough, you naturally memorize the parts of it you use and need), but I teach them and test them to see if they can use and understand all the information that the periodic table has.  Why? because that is what is important.  If they want to memorize it, I won't stop them, but I am not going to require it.  Memorizing the periodic table does not make for a better chemist.
 

No, what really chaps my knees is the old long-time hams that first gripe about "incentive licensing" (been going on 50+ years), the
imminent death of ham radio due to "CB'ers and these new no-code hams" and then say, "In my heyday I could do 40 wpm, but I haven't
touched a key in so long I doubt I could break 15 wpm."  

Really!  If CW is so important, why are you so out of practice?

If you're nervous about putting your CW skills on the air, try around the Straight Key Century Club operating frequencies. 7.055, 7.120, 14.050, and 21.050 MHz are the most used, and we'll gladly slow down for you. We don't insist on a straight key or bug unless you enter our twice-monthly sprints and want your points scored. If you don't hear anyone, call CQ. Many of us monitor the frequencies while we're doing other things, so give us a minute or two to finish balancing the checkbook, log out from the porn website, or put down the soldering iron so we can reply.

SKCC is free, so you might as well sign up and join in the fun.

CW will save the human race.  As evidence I submit the documentary:

Independence Day; 1996; 20th Century Fox



In the 60s I had ZERO interest in learning CW to get my license, but now, when I'm in my 60s, I'm learning it because I want to.

When I was first licensed in 1978 it was still a treaty requirement that all hams worldwide demonstrate code proficiency in some way in order to be allowed HF privileges.   It remained an ITU requirement until 2003 although I think one or two countries openly defied it before then.    FCC reduced the requirement to 5 WPM for all HF operator classes in 2000, and eliminated it altogether in 2007.

That is really pretty quick action in the realm of a US government regulating body, absent an act of Congress.    But that is not to say it shouldn't have been done both sooner and faster, Morse code knowledge just hasn't been a relevant factor in safe and efficient amateur station operation for a number of decades.

So it is done and gone as a requirement and that's good, it seems to me.

The next big nut to crack would be the huge disconnect in the Amateur Extra class exam, from Extra class privileges.    Here, if you are one who likes things to make sense the problem is pretty easy to see and really it is even bigger than the code requirement.    It may be just one to let go, because it is hard to envision a solution that wouldn't make a whole lot of people unhappy.

Yeah, but guess what I am going to learn to send and send fast!

I learned cw in order to get general.  I busted my butt to learn it.  Then I never used it nod forgot it.  Then last year I decided I was going to learn it again and use it.  It was still hard but I did it.  First contact I made wasn't even a real contact.  I was sending and trying to copy...when I sent the guy an email thanking him, he told me he had been talking to someone else...I was that bad....but said he would be glad to set up a sked with me.  I did actually later talk to him.  cW ops are very understanding.  I love it and would rather be on CW than voice.  As a plus many CW qso cards actually have messages written on them as opposed to just a fill in the blank card.

I am not sure why I am being "called out" as to the code requirement ???

I think we have gotten much more interesting people into ham radio since the requirement was dropped ?
People doing a lot of very interesting stuff (interesting to me) who probably wouldn't be involved in ham radio otherwise.

I know that dropping the CW requirement hasn't resulted in any less people on CW or any less people learning and becoming active on CW.

I am not pro, or anti CW.
I personally use CW all the time and I honestly consider it to be the best mode in ham radio for a variety of reasons.

As far as it being a license requirement, that ship has long ago sailed. It isn't coming back and I personally wouldn't want it to. As I said previously, I think we are getting more interesting people in ham radio since it was dropped.

Haha it isn't one of those kinda call out threads. You said you had wanted to start this thread but was afraid it would be a shit show.

Oh, Ok, I posted a few weeks ago that I was tempted to start a thread about why people have been pissed off over the years about the various changes in licensing. I had actually forgotten about it: I haven't been on here much lately.

I am not going to start a thread about it, because I saw that it is very difficult to simply discuss issues like this without people choosing sides and getting pissed off about it. As I said in a previous thread, I have always been interested in the history of ham radio including licensing. And ham radio licensing has taken a lot of twists and turns over the years. And since  the beginning, it has steadily gotten much easier to become licensed. And each time it has gotten easier, the people who previously got licensed were bitter about it because they saw it as a lowering of the bar. They worked hard to get their license and then later, the requirements were changed.

I know that when I got licensed, and took the test that it was FAR easier for me to get licensed than it would have been 30 years earlier.

One of the biggest controversies is referred to as incentive licensing and I had a couple really good ham radio friends (now both dead) who were bitter about it for decades. In a nutshell, without going into a lot of specific detail, what they were pissed off about is that at one time, if you got a general class license, you could operate anywhere and use any mode. Then the FCC created the Extra and Advanced classes and over night, guys who could operate anywhere they pleased, now lost that and they would now have to take more tests to get back what they already had. They would have had to upgrade to Advanced and/or Extra to operate where they had previously been able to operate as a general.

A couple other big shake ups occurred in my lifetime when licensing tests went from being administered by the FCC to being administered by other hams. And of course when question pools with the exact questions and answers were given and the test could be memorized without understanding any of the material. And later dropping the CW requirement.

My interest in the thing isn't about arguing the pros and cons of any of this, but I do think that it is important for people to think about it and understand why people are sensitive about it instead of just taking sides and getting pissed off about it.

From my own viewpoint, the requirements are what they are and we really don't have any say in the matter. So why choose sides ?


Another ham radio history lesson: You may or many not have ever heard of Myron H. Primus W2OY. It's more likely you may have heard ABOUT him calling CQ: No Kids, No Lids, No Space Cadets. Class A operators only............................. And if you read about the licensing requirements and the changes made, you will understand what he was talking about: what Class A operators only actually meant. HERE is a link about the guy and you can hear audio of his calling CQ. For those of you that think you are being oppressed, this guy was trolling ham radio back in the 1950s on AM and was/is legendary.

agreed, I am one of those No Code Hams Ruining the Hobby, but I am slowly learning CW. I can send ok (about 12-15 wpm) but i am having a hard time receiving. I get confused.  


Working on it though.


talked with a ham yesterday on Cw that was awesome. i sent out a CQ and he answered pretty fast. I told him that I was learning code and asked him to slow way down, which he did sending each letter by itself. after about 5 minutes i had my first CW qso. When we were finished he told me that if I ever wanted to practice sending and receiving CW, to shoot him an email and we would practice together.

Guy's an elmer to. said he's been a ham so long that he helped samuel morse invent the code.

Congrats on your first CW qso. Work the arfcom CW roundup and you get to join the elite ranks of the Arfcom CW Ops. The CW Roundup QSL card is pretty cool too . The card should have been delivered to the first handful of participants early last week.

I'm just happy to be here

I can confirm that the QSL card is worth striving to obtain.

well...I totally misunderstood this thread

gcw, , I thought you were pissed off at 444  ( and CW ops )




We had a thread a while back about code / no- code,  and I think it was K9-bob who said something like....


" it's not no-code that's messing up the hobby, it's just the degradation of society"

I think that's true....this K1N http://www.navassadx.com/ is a good example of it.

The CW ops have been as bad or worse than the SSB pile-ups.

idiots tuning up right on top of the DX....even on 30meters   ( running an amp on 30m ?!? )
others banging out
ass
ass
ass

or
retard
retard
retard

I've been telling folks for over 20 years than Ham is not like CB, it's more civilized, and professional,  but I'm beginning to doubt it  


it ain't all bad...and this forum is proof of it.

I talked to someone here CW, I didn't get any cool card...

Did we have a QSO? Drop me a pm with your callsign. I'll search the log.

At one time there were two ways to communicate with radio, CW and phone.  That is no longer the case.

CW is just another mode now, and is relatively slow, not as universal as you might think.  Yes, at one time the military
used it.  No one in the military uses it now.  There are not a huge number of former military that know code now, nor
even if it was still a ham license requirement, would CW be of any benefit to the military by feeding them radio operators
proficient in code.

CW can get through when voice can't.  Well, the same can be said of many of the digital modes.

There is not a current need for CW proficiency, and making it a requirement for higher licenses would not mean we had
better Generals and Extras.  It would just be a filter for keeping people out of amateur radio.  

I have heard more than once, "In my heyday I could do 35 wpm, but I haven't used CW in years.  Now I'd be lucky if I
could break 15 wpm."  And this from guys that are pissed that CW is no longer part of the ham tests.  This tells me there
is not a big need for CW, or these guys would have kept up their skills.  No, it is a filter to keep people out of ham radio.

Don't get me wrong, I have nothing against CW.  If that is what you like, go right ahead.  As Picc said, there are many learning
CW now, me included.

And you don't have to look far on the ham forums to find older guys still pissed off about "incentive licensing" 50 years later.

I, for one, am glad I don't have to make a ham radio transmitter from a bread pan, two bed springs, and a galena crystal I
had to dig up myself.

But if you did, it would be fun.

so while I did create a 'just another...ruining' shirt today.  

I also did this one, and I think it speaks to what we're all really trying to say:



QRV

It certainly is, thanks Archbru!

Thanks fellas! I need to figure out what caliber to use for the next ones that I have to send out. Anybody can get one... Just gotta work me on CW!

-Bru

What caliber for a QSL card ?

I would suppose it would depend on your station. If you are a big gun or a little gun.

I sent out a bunch to arfcommers with a full color pic of my M1 GARAND

I still have some left,....I Need to get back on some ARFCOM nets so I can send some more out


I've received some really cool cards from the arfcom crew also

I have wanted to get my ticket for longer than most here are alive, just too busy. Now I am wetting it as I get ready to retire. Not having to deal with code at this time is a +1. I will learn it later, when I have a thing called time

444, Check your mailbox. I sent you a QSL card over a week ago. The envelope contains two QSLs (my personal card and an arfcom card). When you see the CW Roundup QSL card, you'll know what I'm talking about.

-Bru

I got it.
That is why I said it was well worth trying to get.
Thank you very much and I trust you got mine ? Sorry I don't have a cool/high end card.

I texted photos of your card to several local hams. So obviously I liked it.

Now I'm getting curious! Sounds like an interesting card!

To me CW is hamradio. However I have been trying to improve my SSB and DIGI DXCC totals in the last year or so.  I find Digi awkward and SSB boring.

HOWEVER- each mode has its place and I don't really care what mode you like the best.  I don't think that people have to enjoy the hobby the way I do.

One of the reasons I always enjoyed CW is because there were far fewer assholes on CW. But lately, I think I might have been wrong. This Navassa operation has brought them out in a big way.