A big thing is avoiding the extremes- I don't really think anyone that's been doing this seriously for more than about 2 months thinks they can go it "alone" as in truly alone.

On the other hand is the extreme of thinking that a bunch of spoiled suburbanite yuppies who can barely make it in the comfy world of today are somehow going to be your shield, or your help when time comes- that's even more sad than thinking your rambo and can go alone. But at least in the former you only will have yourself to blame.

Basing your plans on either truly being "alone" or relaying fully on others you don't know, that are not prepared and have dubious characters are both quick ways to end up dead.

Polyanna'ish thinking, fiction stories of "saviors of the subdivision" making it and wishful thinking are not going to get you through. Meeting and making bonds with like minded people who are also preparing ahead of time and training and are at times willing to compromise to get to the same goals, that's what it will take. That's way too much work for most, hence why the fiction stories of the loaner  "organizing his subdivision" are so popular.  Great for survivalist bed time reading, not for real life planning.

+1 million gold!

This needs to be re-read by everyone.

Things have changed in this country. The lived through the depression generation is all but gone. It's the "I'm always perfect and I DESERVE everything I want" Bernie Sanders supporting snowflake generation and their parents who aren't much better that WE have to deal with.

I said on radio show almost two decades ago that IF you feel like you have to be the neighborhood savior and planned to "hand out butter knives" (cheap guns) to them, then you better have a six month supply of grains to "hand out" to them then as well. No unpaid mercenary continues to work...  They usually turn on you. And make no mistake about how they will see their part in the "savior of the subdivision" drama.

IF you were somehow convinced that the "savior of the subdivision" route was your only recourse, then you HAVE to make it not a last minute fantasy but truly put in the work NOW. Yep that means exposure. That means getting everyone in "Slice of Heaven" subdivision to store six months of food NOW, and be sure you put back a lot of extra for those that WON'T (majority). Then remember, it's "community" so you absolutely positively cannot "exclude" ANYONE- the convicted child molester down the street, the meth heads around the corner, the family with 5 out of control kids that steal stuff from everyone's yards- EVERYONE has to be included. You cannot "exclude" anyone- that's the big thing in society and you better damn well follow that or your the evil capitalist probably racist ba$tard and you'll be found after you "fell on a knife 18 times backwards", then one of your "trusted" neighbors will show the others (after liberating much for himself) all the things your evil capitalist hoarding self was EXCLUDING from SHARING with them. God forbid you have so much as an aspirin you didn't share with others- you evil sob....

It's ALL OR NOTHING. Jump in the fray with a bunch of unprepared people of dubious characters and backgrounds, share absolutely everything with them and expect some sort of return from them (labor, help with "security", all the little ideas bantied about).  And the ONLY way to remotely keep them in the game is giving them six months of food so that THEY have something worth protecting also. The 96" flatscreens, chipboard McMansion houses and other items they are in debt up to their eyeballs with now won't be worth them truly fighting for.

It truly is an ALL OR NOTHING proposition. And I wish someone well who truly attempts to try that. They better be truly boning up on their people skills, being able to negotiate with unruly people, being able to calm a crowd down, be able to identify problem people and negate them or win them over. And don't forget everyone's touchy little "feelings"- they damn sure ain't going to go away just because it's TEOTWAWKI! You better make sure you talk extra special nice, cherry on top style to every Suzy Soccor Mom when she screams at you that it isn't "fair" that you have so much and her family has so little.

Guys, I'm being a smart A here a lot, but I am bringing up some REAL ISSUES that you will have to deal with if you truly pulled this off. I sense a couple people think/have plans to truly try this. Instead of getting pissed reading this post I suggest you re-read it and think to yourself- "how WOULD I deal with that?"

It happens folks, anyone who deals with the public regularly, works with groups of pretty much ANY type now a days, organizes people, etc. has experienced this. If you haven't, it's just a matter of time. SHTF time will be worse cause "social norms" and the worry that "Fred will probably slam me on Facebook for yelling at him" type BS will be GONE and people will be a lot less cordial than they already are.

I would be truly interested in hearing people's ideas about how these sorts of things will be REALLY handled. I would be happy to provide numerous REAL LIFE situations/trials etc. that have happened (changing some details for OPSEC obviously) to give you some idea of the things you WILL have to work through if you'd like. If someone was TRULY serious about making this happen, these are things you should be prepared for.

Negative Ghostrider.

I was referring to the whole ad hoc "subdivision surviving together" non sense, NOT a real survival group.

I've been involved in groups for 30 years. They have their problems and problem people as well, but a much better option than an ad hoc last minute join up with some people you barely know that are not prepared (savior of the subdivision fantasy).

It's not about quenching other's ideas in group setting,  but you have to be realistic and trying to survive with a bunch of idiot suburbanites with no preps, no plans and little skills in suburbia is not a viable plan. No matter how much BS democracy (mob rule) you try to throw in there.

I don't give a rip if you disagree with me, but show me through logic and experience, not emotions and fantasy fiction stories. If you think 50 unprepared yuppies in a subdivision will work out PROVE IT, make it happen, get them all prepared now. Like I said, if you truly think you can do this, you will start thinking about how you WILL deal with the situations I brought up.

As to the "you spelled tyranny wrong" comment- this was more talking from the context of someone trying to evoke the savior of the subdivision concept. ALL of these little fantasy stories involve the 1 prepared guy "leading" the neighbor and all the rest lining up without question all the while saying "my hero!!"   In reality? Negative. People are going to get pissed, Suzy Soccor Mom is NOT going to till up her manicured lawn to grow tomatoes and they ALL will be thinking the Red Cross will be pulling in soon with hot donuts and blankets.

Argue my logic..

So just a personal attack then? Gotcha, no problem. At least call it what it was

Anywhooo, my point in this was that ANY group of people is potentially riff with problems. With people that you can prepare with ahead of time (real survival group), get to know over years or decades even, small spats of BS tend to get worked out, friendships are developed and people work together because they understand the common goal. And smart survivors know that you DO need others to make it long term.


The other option being discussed here is an after the fact, throw together with a bunch of unprepared people you know nothing about, that you have experienced little or no adversity with previously (lacking common bounds). This is the ad hoc fortify your subdivision after the fact concept aka "savior of the subdivision" because the guy doing it in all the cute little fiction stories always ends up being the "hero" and saves all the unprepared yuppies.

Two greatly different ideas. The latter being something that just surfaced in fiction stories in the last decade or so since the "prepper" fade started. It also being the easier thing to think is possible because 99% of those that advocate it literally never try it ahead of time (too afraid of exposure and the knowledge that you can't go back afterwards). I think the only reason it gets any play is because in general people are lazy and want any easy way out. And that fantasy leads one to believe that they do not have to make any serious lifestyle changes ahead of time.

There is the logic, a little slower and clearer, argue the logic. I love to debate and I would assume serious about survival would enjoy debating plans they are making. Better to figure out NOW that their may be issues and how to avoid them (you know planning ahead) then just assuming a crazy plan will go perfectly to plan just because you read it in a crappy fiction story. If I seem bold when I debate these things, it's because they are important- we ARE talking about life and death situations folks.

So, back to the question posted before- how will you handle some of these issues if you stick with the fortify the subdivision plan? I'm genuinely curious to hear from folks that are going to try that plan.