Gent’s,

I’m looking at purchasing a nice 22lr pistol, is this worth the price of admission?



Thanks in advance for any feedback!

Happy New Year boys!

Yes but it will spoil you

They are nice. Easy to shoot well. The older models (1970ish) with the cocking indicator on back have better blueing.

Occasionally one will come up in the classifieds on Rimfire Central  There's none at the moment, but it's worth checking out every now and then.

Many consider the Model 41 the best American made 22 target pistol.  This must be taken in context though.  They were designed for one purpose, Bullseye competition.  

The High Standard Supermatic pistols are the other American made pistol in this category, but they haven't been made for 40 years and quality of them became inconsistent 50 years ago.  

Used Hammerli 208/215 and other European target pistols can be found for similar prices, but they have not been made for many years.

All the above examples are highly refined compared to something like a Ruger.  A Ruger can be modified to compete with these, but a similar amount of money ends up getting spent.

The model 41 has advantages over some its alternatives; it is still manufactured, parts and service are still available and magazines are cheap and readily available.  

Some examples can be trouble.

I bought my 41 about 30 years ago - I had to order it and wait until they made a run.

At the time I shot with my wife's brothers and cousins most weekends at their farm. That was casual, but they were stepping up. I had a Mark 1 that was bone stock. They mostly had Mark II's, but they were getting examples with bull barrels and scopes, one guy had a Walther, so competition was getting tougher.

The 41 was definitely a step up. It's a bit more fussy about ammunition than the Rugers - wax buildup will cause it to stop. It's more accurate than I have ever been. now that I'm in my 60's my vision definitely keeps me from shooting to it's potential.

I sold my Mark1 not to long after I got the 41 (for $100, the same as I paid for it). I miss it a bit when I'm teaching a new shooter.

It's a gun I will never sell.

Buy used, older the better.  Have reads lots of posts with redecent production guns needing a trip to the mothership....

No offers to buy, sell, or trade in the tech forums.We have an EE for that-bodybagger

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A red dot dot is the answer.

I'm on my second 41. Love these things!

I agree the older models are the way to go. Obviously, on the internet it's hard to examine the gun for flaws before purchase. This is where a gun show is an excellent option. Gun Broker is another option, but buy from one of the Top 100 sellers, IMO.

New ones (of any vintage) have an extremely tight chamber. FTF is pretty common until 200~ rds are down the pipe. I shoot only match grade ammo in mine, some affordable SK from Germany.

Not sure if the new ones are worth the $1500 they're being asked for or not? That's up to the buyer. I went used for around $900 or so.

OP, another excellent option is a Browning Buckmark. My choice would be the Field Target with the threaded bbl.  Buckmarks

I also have a Hammerli International, which is an excellent target pistol. I haven't checked prices lately, so I don't know where they're running these days.

Another fav of mine is the Walther GSP. Odd looking trigger, but super nice pull. It's Walther, so no worries about quality. Easily found on the used market as well.

GSP:

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Problem with target .22 pistols is, one can never stop at only one of them..................    

Good luck!

Thanks for all the feedback boys! Now the hunt begins for an older model 41. My local dealer has a new production 41 that I may consider if my hunt is unsuccessful.

My Mom has one....My Dad bought it for here back in the early '70s when he was stationed in CA.  She taught on a pistol team there and was able to get a lot of extra ammunition to run through each range trip.  She ran it with a 5 1/2" barrel.  He also bought a weight and 7 1/2" ported field barrel for it.  I shot it a lot, my favorite 22 next to a S&W 34 Kit revolver.  I have replaced several springs and a couple extractors.  I have used it on several occasions to demonstrate to shooters some of their minor inducted errors.  

I think the pistol is worth the cost.  As others mentioned keep your eyes open for an older one in excellent condition.  You may walk into a good deal.  

Mike

There is a nice looking one over on EE right now.
Not mine , just passing the word.

I have my dad’s that he got back when he shot competition back in the 60s or 70s. He had the 5 and 7in uppers. Best shooting 22 pistol I have.

The issue with a used one is many of them were used by someone shooting competition and they can have super high round counts .

Yes they are solid guns and they will take all your excuses away (if you ain't scoring it's you,not the gun)

Yes, you should get one.

My Model 41 is simply the finest firearm that I own.  I certainly has the best trigger.  I found mine for a good price in the used case of a good gun shop and I made the purchase before one of the counter jockeys at the shop bought it.

I use CCI Standard Velocity ammo and I can shoot it better than any other gun I own.  In this instance, the gun makes all the difference.

There is nothing wrong with the new production guns, I own one and I have shot many model 41s and model 46s.

The newer ones aren't as nice as older ones.

Other than that they are just way overpriced at $1500 for what they are.

The Hammerli Xesse Sport is being blown out right now for $1k and for less than $1500 you could build/buy a Marvel/ Nelson 1911 conversion 22 that will outshoot a 41.

Stating facts not in evidence, IMO..........................  

I picked up one off gunbroker last year after being recommended one.
Mine is made in 1980 according to the SN.
Mine is a clean example, smooth and have not had any issues with it. Seems to not have a excessive amount of rounds through it.

My grievances with the model 41:
The mag release is very small and had to operate.
I do not like the mag disconnect.
Factory magazines may or may not work.

Mine only came with 1 mag. So I ordered 4 more new mags. I found they did not want to insert all the way without a frim push, and then had to be pried back out.
Searing online this appears to be a EXTREMELY common issue. So it seem S&W does not know how to make mags to fit their own guns.
I had to disassemble and mod the mags. Two of them, I had to file/grind the floor plates thinner and then squeeze the mags in a vice to get them to finally insert and drop free.

Accuracy is pretty decent, but my Rugers are more accurate.

Shooting the same ammo the same day at the same distance, my Ruger MkII government target was more accurate, and I got it for half the price of the M41.






The ruger was cheaper to buy, has more aftermarket support, cheaper/easier to build/modify, the magazines actually fit, and in my case, more accurate.
Am I selling my M41? No, I am keeping it, as well as all my other rimfire pistols.
I even have a buckmark with the 7.25 in contour barrel that edges out the M41 as well.

Back in the day the major US made Bullseye pistols in order of cost and desirability were:

- the Ruger Mk I or II Target in either the 5 1/2” bull barrel or 6 7/8” tapered heavy barrel;
- the S&W 41, mostly in the 5 1/2” heavy barrel or 7” barrel; or
- the High Standard 107 Victor.

When I got started the Ruger target models sold for around $125.  The Model 41 was around $240 and the High Standard was around $270.  It’s been a minute. Now, the price spread is a bit different as the Victors sell for $500-$800 while the Model 41s seem to sell for $1000-1200, and the Rugers are still about half as much as the others.  That makes the Rugers a continued good bang for the buck pistol, while the High Standard Victors are great deals. The old Model 41s sell for as much as the new ones.

—-

Here is my 1971 vintage 5 1/2” heavy barrel Model 41:



Here is my 2020 vintage 7” Model 41 and one of my Hi Standard Victors:



Both my High Standard Victors:



And finally my 6 7/8” Mk I Target, 5 1/2” Mk II Target and my Mk II Government Model:




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My observations:

1) The Ruger Mk I and MK II targets are good pistols out of the box and with a volquartzen trigger and sear they are very good entry level Bullseye competition pistols.  The Government Model trigger was great out of the box.

2) The 6 7/8” tapered heavy barrel and 5 1/2” bull barrel pistols both have very similar balance with the longer barrel having a slightly longer sight radius.  Neither one is better than the other, it just comes down to preference.

3) The High Standard Victor has a better trigger than the Model 41 and it’s readily adjustable.  The Victor is a bit odd as it doesn’t have a feed ramp.  Feeding is entirely dependent on the magazine feed lips, so quality magazines are important. The aftermarket Triple K magazines have soft lips that won’t hold their shape.  The current InterarmsX magazines have been 50/50 in terms of feeding as new.  But all of them could be tweaked to feed properly and then held their shape.  They also sell a magazine adjustment tool that’s worth the $50.

The Victor came with barrel weights that are nice for shooters who prefer a heavier, more weight forward pistol.

I shoot the High Standard Victor better than the S&W 41,  and my scores over 90 rounds will consistently show it.  But that might just be me and how it fits my hand.

The 107 Victor was designed for Bullseye shooting as a rimfire counterpart to a 1911 and shares the same grip angle.

4) The S&W 41 7”, and 5” heavy barrel pistols both offer similar balance, and one isn’t better than the other, it really comes down to personal preference.

I think the workmanship and polish on the older pistols is better than the new ones.  But my new one shoots as well as my old one.

Can't count the number of mags I've bought for my 41s. Close to 10, maybe?

Never, ever did one not work, didn't fit or had to be altered. I certainly don't know what happened in your case, but something, somewhere is out of whack.

My 41 was my second gun back in 88. I was young and dumb.  Shot the shit out of it. Still shoots great. Mine pretty much runs any ammo. Make sure you change your recoil spring now and then.
I have not heard good things about new production ones. I would hunt for a nice used one.  S&W has been a disappointment with new production guns. Be patient, they are out there, but they are not cheap.

My 41 target today, shooting it for the first time. Super, super shitty red dot too. About 15 yards.

Just ordered a new, better red dot from Midway. Old one came with the gun.


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Any updates, OP?

I inherited my dad’s 1969 with 5.5” & 7.5” barrels.

I agree with those who recommend an older S&W, as I have older & newer production.  S&W just hasn’t been what it once was….I saw this owning both older pre-1990 guns and more recent production.  An investment-grade gun will only appreciate in value, unless damaged or abused.  

Kind of like a Randall knife.

That said, the recent weird .gov nonsense re: guns & personal profit is unclear & certainly could change at the drop of ink, especially with this administration.

Love mine!

This one's not bad. either. Just can't suppress it

Marvels and Nelsons have better barrels than S&W 41s and can group better at 50 yards. Since it is a conversion to a 1911 they can take a while to get to run reliably but S&W 41s can take some work to run well too. A S&W with a relined factory barrel or an aftermarket barrel can shoot well at 50 yards.