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Posted: 5/16/2023 8:30:11 PM EDT
[Last Edit: RSG]
Vents
What really killed COVID-19 patients: It wasn't a cytokine storm, suggests study Secondary bacterial infection of the lung (pneumonia) was extremely common in patients with COVID-19, affecting almost half the patients who required support from mechanical ventilation. By applying machine learning to medical record data, scientists at Northwestern University Feinberg School of Medicine found that secondary bacterial pneumonia that does not resolve was a key driver of death in patients with COVID-19. It may even exceed death rates from the viral infection itself. The scientists also found evidence that COVID-19 does not cause a "cytokine storm," so often believed to cause death. The study was recently published in the Journal of Clinical Investigation. "Our study highlights the importance of preventing, looking for and aggressively treating secondary bacterial pneumonia in critically ill patients with severe pneumonia, including those with COVID-19," said senior author Dr. Benjamin Singer, an associate professor of medicine at Northwestern University Feinberg School of Medicine and a Northwestern Medicine pulmonary and critical care physician. The investigators found nearly half of patients with COVID-19 develop a secondary ventilator-associated bacterial pneumonia. "Those who were cured of their secondary pneumonia were likely to live, while those whose pneumonia did not resolve were more likely to die," Singer said. "Our data suggested that the mortality related to the virus itself is relatively low, but other things that happen during the ICU stay, like secondary bacterial pneumonia, offset that." The study findings also negate the cytokine storm theory, said Singer, also the Lawrence Hicks Professor of Pulmonary Medicine at Feinberg. ... |
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Posted: 5/16/2023 8:35:30 PM EDT
[#1]
So deep did the misinformation go, peddled as fact. How dare you challenge science!!
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LA, USA
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Posted: 5/16/2023 8:49:10 PM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By MouseBoy: So deep did the misinformation go, peddled as fact. How dare you challenge science!! When does the “winter of death” start? Is it before, after, or during the “pandemic of the unvaccinated”? |
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Posted: 5/16/2023 9:03:38 PM EDT
[#3]
everyone, especially Trump, was played by the elite for either power or money, sometimes both.
this was a semi-dry run. the next one will balls-deep totalitarianism. but they must disarm us first |
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CA, USA
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Posted: 5/16/2023 10:37:22 PM EDT
[#4]
In the early days of wuhan flu, I stated on ARFCOM that the last thing you one is to get on a ventilator. Some here criticized that.
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Posted: 5/16/2023 10:50:42 PM EDT
[#5]
Remdesivir (caused renal failure) and intubation were part of the failed treatment protocol. Another part was telling sick patients to go home (so the wuflu could spread in their body and make them sicker instead of giving them ivermectin or hydroxchloroquine and curing them).
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Posted: 5/16/2023 11:55:45 PM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Riter: Remdesivir (caused renal failure) and intubation were part of the failed treatment protocol. Another part was telling sick patients to go home (so the wuflu could spread in their body and make them sicker instead of giving them ivermectin or hydroxchloroquine and curing them). Word for word what happened with two of my wife's uncles. |
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TX, USA
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Posted: 5/17/2023 3:15:30 AM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Riter: Remdesivir (caused renal failure) and intubation were part of the failed treatment protocol. Another part was telling sick patients to go home (so the wuflu could spread in their body and make them sicker instead of giving them ivermectin or hydroxchloroquine and curing them). Yep, happened to me. Luckily my wife found another doc that prescribed what I needed |
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ID, USA
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Posted: 5/17/2023 3:34:50 AM EDT
[#8]
I do not have a medical background. Most of my family on my moms side does. I lost count of how many of them would loose their shit and get absolutely ballistic about the treatment protocols around Covid and respirators. General points they would rant about being, 100% healthy people put on a respirator for a week or two, have a much higher than zero chance of contracting pneumonia that would be ultimately fatal. Respirator is a last ditch/exigent circumstances kind of treatment. But someone(s) gave the order to use it as first line treatment for Covid... Using a respirator for extended lengths of time on patients with a respiratory illness was almost as bad a putting a gun in their mouth and pulling the trigger. They knew that when this was all starting. It was common knowledge in the medical world. And the people who ordered that knew it. The people who followed it should have known it.
But Orange Man Bad. Fauci Good. Must comply. Must make everyone comply. At all costs. |
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Posted: 5/17/2023 5:11:28 AM EDT
[Last Edit: intheburbs]
[#9]
No shit.
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Posted: 5/17/2023 8:26:57 AM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 74HC: In the early days of wuhan flu, I stated on ARFCOM that the last thing you one is to get on a ventilator. Some here criticized that. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 74HC: In the early days of wuhan flu, I stated on ARFCOM that the last thing you one is to get on a ventilator. Some here criticized that. Originally Posted By BrotherJackToo: I do not have a medical background. Most of my family on my moms side does. I lost count of how many of them would loose their shit and get absolutely ballistic about the treatment protocols around Covid and respirators. General points they would rant about being, 100% healthy people put on a respirator for a week or two, have a much higher than zero chance of contracting pneumonia that would be ultimately fatal. Respirator is a last ditch/exigent circumstances kind of treatment. But someone(s) gave the order to use it as first line treatment for Covid... Using a respirator for extended lengths of time on patients with a respiratory illness was almost as bad a putting a gun in their mouth and pulling the trigger. They knew that when this was all starting. It was common knowledge in the medical world. And the people who ordered that knew it. The people who followed it should have known it. But Orange Man Bad. Fauci Good. Must comply. Must make everyone comply. At all costs. Both posts nailed it 100%...... I remember this early on also. My Dad (Doctorate in Chemistry & Doctorate in Pharmacy) was over-the-edge irate (rightfully so) about all of the mistreatment going on back then.... He was so mad when we talked about it...."They are putting these folks on the vents & the vents are what is going to help kill them.... Idiots!!!".... |
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WA, USA
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Posted: 5/17/2023 9:23:31 AM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By jebsofnga: Both posts nailed it 100%...... I remember this early on also. My Dad (Doctorate in Chemistry & Doctorate in Pharmacy) was over-the-edge irate (rightfully so) about all of the mistreatment going on back then.... He was so mad when we talked about it...."They are putting these folks on the vents & the vents are what is going to help kill them.... Idiots!!!".... Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By jebsofnga: Originally Posted By 74HC: In the early days of wuhan flu, I stated on ARFCOM that the last thing you one is to get on a ventilator. Some here criticized that. Originally Posted By BrotherJackToo: I do not have a medical background. Most of my family on my moms side does. I lost count of how many of them would loose their shit and get absolutely ballistic about the treatment protocols around Covid and respirators. General points they would rant about being, 100% healthy people put on a respirator for a week or two, have a much higher than zero chance of contracting pneumonia that would be ultimately fatal. Respirator is a last ditch/exigent circumstances kind of treatment. But someone(s) gave the order to use it as first line treatment for Covid... Using a respirator for extended lengths of time on patients with a respiratory illness was almost as bad a putting a gun in their mouth and pulling the trigger. They knew that when this was all starting. It was common knowledge in the medical world. And the people who ordered that knew it. The people who followed it should have known it. But Orange Man Bad. Fauci Good. Must comply. Must make everyone comply. At all costs. Both posts nailed it 100%...... I remember this early on also. My Dad (Doctorate in Chemistry & Doctorate in Pharmacy) was over-the-edge irate (rightfully so) about all of the mistreatment going on back then.... He was so mad when we talked about it...."They are putting these folks on the vents & the vents are what is going to help kill them.... Idiots!!!".... As a result of the Covid Emergency orders put in place by the White House and by states the medical facilities and providers were legally immune if they followed the CDC guidance. If they went off script they could be held liable. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7294282/ |
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WA, USA
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Posted: 5/17/2023 9:29:06 AM EDT
[#12]
The Public Readiness and Emergency Preparedness Act (PREP Act) authorizes the Secretary of the Department of Health and Human Services (Secretary) to issue a PREP Act declaration. The declaration provides immunity from liability (except for willful misconduct) for claims: of loss caused, arising out of, relating to, or resulting from administration or use of countermeasures to diseases, threats and conditions determined by the Secretary to constitute a present, or credible risk of a future public health emergency to entities and individuals involved in the development, manufacture, testing, distribution, administration, and use of such countermeasures A PREP Act declaration is specifically for the purpose of providing immunity from liability, and is different from, and not dependent on, other emergency declarations. https://aspr.hhs.gov/legal/PREPact/Pages/default.aspx But what the Trump Administration has also done is to slip COVID-19 into the Federal Register (read it here) as a declared pandemic under the Public Readiness and Emergency Preparedness (PREP) Act of 2005. What that means is that you’re basically screwed if something goes wrong with Coronavirus products, vaccines, and even professional treatments, as the Act provides broad protection for the companies making the products and the people providing the treatments if something does, indeed, go wrong. As some have argued, federal law actually encourages the manufacturers of vaccines or protective equipment to “willfully disregard or consciously avoid problematic risk information.” https://lawandcrime.com/legal-analysis/this-law-says-youre-mostly-screwed-if-you-receive-bad-coronavirus-products-vaccines-or-treatments/ Trump went right along with everything Fauci and the swamp said to do despite advisers in his administration telling him otherwise. |
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Posted: 5/17/2023 9:31:12 AM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By jebsofnga: Both posts nailed it 100%...... I remember this early on also. My Dad (Doctorate in Chemistry & Doctorate in Pharmacy) was over-the-edge irate (rightfully so) about all of the mistreatment going on back then.... He was so mad when we talked about it...."They are putting these folks on the vents & the vents are what is going to help kill them.... Idiots!!!".... Sorry, but your dad doesn't really know what he's talking about. Vents weren't used for stable patients. They were a last ditch effort after the patient continued to desaturate on room air, supplemental o2, high flow nasal cannula, and bipap. If they needed a vent and didn't get one, they'd have just died earlier. Most covid patients on the vent were already getting broad spectrum antibiotic treatment. A pharmacist isn't exactly qualified to make medical decisions regarding invasive procedures like mechanical ventilation. |
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Posted: 5/17/2023 9:36:08 AM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 74HC: In the early days of wuhan flu, I stated on ARFCOM that the last thing you one is to get on a ventilator. Some here criticized that. Because it's stupid. If you need a vent, you need a vent. You're going to work yourself to death on a bipap or simply live with an o2 sat that isn't compatible with life. Lose lose situation. In severe ARDS, mechanical ventilation with proning was your best bet. The ICU I worked in from 2020-2022 had the highest survival rate of all the HCA hospitals and all of the greater Austin area. Our pulmonary group was big on early proning and we continue to give a 3 day ivermectin course even today. |
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WA, USA
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Posted: 5/17/2023 10:12:45 AM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AKoch31: Sorry, but your dad doesn't really know what he's talking about. Vents weren't used for stable patients. They were a last ditch effort after the patient continued to desaturate on room air, supplemental o2, high flow nasal cannula, and bipap. If they needed a vent and didn't get one, they'd have just died earlier. Most covid patients on the vent were already getting broad spectrum antibiotic treatment. A pharmacist isn't exactly qualified to make medical decisions regarding invasive procedures like mechanical ventilation. You're assuming that most patients at the hospital were stable. Many states were telling people to go home until they couldn't breathe and then admitting them to the ICU and venting them, with zero treatment up until that point. |
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ID, USA
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Posted: 5/17/2023 10:30:47 AM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AKoch31: Vents weren't used for stable patients. They were a last ditch effort after the patient continued to desaturate on room air, supplemental o2, high flow nasal cannula, and bipap. The hell they weren't used on stable patients! That is exactly what my medical side of my family was livid about. I don't recall all the $10 medical words they were throwing around during the rants, but in English, they pissed that they were being directed to use the vent in cases that it was (at least in their view) totally inappropriate, and in violation of previously normal protocols for venting someone. |
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Posted: 5/17/2023 1:31:39 PM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Mr_Woodsy: https://aspr.hhs.gov/legal/PREPact/Pages/default.aspx https://lawandcrime.com/legal-analysis/this-law-says-youre-mostly-screwed-if-you-receive-bad-coronavirus-products-vaccines-or-treatments/ Trump went right along with everything Fauci and the swamp said to do despite advisers in his administration telling him otherwise. What do expect Trump to do? Faucci et al were supposed to know what they're doing. |
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WA, USA
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Posted: 5/17/2023 2:29:43 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By zeekh: What do expect Trump to do? Faucci et al were supposed to know what they're doing. the man that promised to drain the swamp should have trusted the swamp? All while his own advisers were telling him not too? Trust the same man that funded the research in chYna? Yeah.......ok |
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Posted: 5/17/2023 2:37:53 PM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By BrotherJackToo: The hell they weren't used on stable patients! That is exactly what my medical side of my family was livid about. I don't recall all the $10 medical words they were throwing around during the rants, but in English, they pissed that they were being directed to use the vent in cases that it was (at least in their view) totally inappropriate, and in violation of previously normal protocols for venting someone. They weren't. There was a massive shortage of vents. Why do you think anyone unnecessarily tube patients and take up a vent? As someone who was there and worked with a ton of travel nurses who worked across the country, no one was tubing people who could get by with other options. |
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Posted: 5/17/2023 2:59:13 PM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AKoch31: They weren't. There was a massive shortage of vents. Why do you think anyone unnecessarily tube patients and take up a vent? As someone who was there and worked with a ton of travel nurses who worked across the country, no one was tubing people who could get by with other options. The vent shortage was pure MSM doomer theater. Just like the field hospitals and Navy hospital ship in NYC that were barely used. All fear porn to keep the masses scared. It, sadly, worked on way too many sheeple. |
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USA
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Posted: 5/17/2023 4:59:36 PM EDT
[#21]
I think keeping my grandma out of the hospital when she got covid saved her life. There was one point when I believed maybe it would be a good idea if my grandma and mom got the "vaccines". I am endlessly thankful they never did.
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Posted: 5/17/2023 7:29:35 PM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Riter: Remdesivir (caused renal failure) and intubation were part of the failed treatment protocol. Another part was telling sick patients to go home (so the wuflu could spread in their body and make them sicker instead of giving them ivermectin or hydroxchloroquine and curing them). Yep. My niece was told to go home and take Tylenol. |
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Posted: 5/17/2023 7:36:21 PM EDT
[#23]
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Posted: 5/17/2023 7:36:57 PM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 74HC: In the early days of wuhan flu, I stated on ARFCOM that the last thing you one is to get on a ventilator. Some here criticized that. There were/are a lot of very stupid people in the world. |
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Posted: 5/17/2023 10:08:19 PM EDT
[#25]
Most of those who died simply had too many underlying health problems to compensate .
Covid pushed their bodies over the edge and then opportunistic infections and complications from treatment and prolonged immobility finished them off. |
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Posted: 5/18/2023 8:01:15 AM EDT
[#26]
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Posted: 5/18/2023 8:16:18 AM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By g8rgunner: The vent shortage was pure MSM doomer theater. Just like the field hospitals and Navy hospital ship in NYC that were barely used. All fear porn to keep the masses scared. It, sadly, worked on way too many sheeple. Yeah bro, that's why we had to get vents from all over the world. We had shit flown in from Germany primarily, but got multiple vents from different countries. It's okay to be ignorant, but to say it was all doomer theater is right up there with flat earth bros. Better go look for your Chem trails! |
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Posted: 5/18/2023 8:18:28 AM EDT
[Last Edit: AKoch31]
[#28]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By exponentialpi: The medical community also had a nice financial incentive to use vents. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/200878/A7ECFBDF-48DC-4BDC-8045-97CD71E3D152_jpe-2820401.JPG https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/200878/5A8A0342-EF5A-4DD3-B9D4-26C33084E63A_jpe-2820403.JPG  You're joking right? Both before and after COVID the cost of treating ARDS with >96 hours of vent time is exactly the same. Bottom of your first pic and top of your second. It's almost like caring for a vented patient is more difficult and costly. |
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Posted: 5/18/2023 8:38:29 AM EDT
[#29]
Putting my granny on a vent after she had heart surgery issues finished her off, she never recovered from that.
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Posted: 5/18/2023 9:02:47 AM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AKoch31: You're joking right? Both before and after COVID the cost of treating ARDS with >96 hours of vent time is exactly the same. Bottom of your first pic and top of your second. It's almost like caring for a vented patient is more difficult and costly. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AKoch31: Originally Posted By exponentialpi: The medical community also had a nice financial incentive to use vents. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/200878/A7ECFBDF-48DC-4BDC-8045-97CD71E3D152_jpe-2820401.JPG https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/200878/5A8A0342-EF5A-4DD3-B9D4-26C33084E63A_jpe-2820403.JPG You're joking right? Both before and after COVID the cost of treating ARDS with >96 hours of vent time is exactly the same. Bottom of your first pic and top of your second. It's almost like caring for a vented patient is more difficult and costly. No, I’m not joking. The MS-DRG’s were increased 20% by the CARES act for a COVID diagnosis during the PHE . The differences in the tables is the advent of the U07.1 ICD-10 code. The point was “following the protocol” escalated to the higher payment DRG’s. But what do I know about Medicare, claims payments, or billing… |
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USA
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Posted: 5/18/2023 9:54:35 AM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By exponentialpi: No, I’m not joking. The MS-DRG’s were increased 20% by the CARES act for a COVID diagnosis during the PHE . The differences in the tables is the advent of the U07.1 ICD-10 code. The point was “following the protocol” escalated to the higher payment DRG’s. But what do I know about Medicare, claims payments, or billing… Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By exponentialpi: Originally Posted By AKoch31: Originally Posted By exponentialpi: The medical community also had a nice financial incentive to use vents. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/200878/A7ECFBDF-48DC-4BDC-8045-97CD71E3D152_jpe-2820401.JPG https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/200878/5A8A0342-EF5A-4DD3-B9D4-26C33084E63A_jpe-2820403.JPG You're joking right? Both before and after COVID the cost of treating ARDS with >96 hours of vent time is exactly the same. Bottom of your first pic and top of your second. It's almost like caring for a vented patient is more difficult and costly. No, I’m not joking. The MS-DRG’s were increased 20% by the CARES act for a COVID diagnosis during the PHE . The differences in the tables is the advent of the U07.1 ICD-10 code. The point was “following the protocol” escalated to the higher payment DRG’s. But what do I know about Medicare, claims payments, or billing… PMPM AND R A F IS JUST A VAST RIGHT WING CONSPIRACY THEORY, CHUD. Teach the class about risk adjustment factors and cpt codes. |
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Posted: 5/18/2023 11:19:24 AM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AKoch31: Yeah bro, that's why we had to get vents from all over the world. We had shit flown in from Germany primarily, but got multiple vents from different countries. It's okay to be ignorant, but to say it was all doomer theater is right up there with flat earth bros. Better go look for your Chem trails! Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AKoch31: Originally Posted By g8rgunner: The vent shortage was pure MSM doomer theater. Just like the field hospitals and Navy hospital ship in NYC that were barely used. All fear porn to keep the masses scared. It, sadly, worked on way too many sheeple. Yeah bro, that's why we had to get vents from all over the world. We had shit flown in from Germany primarily, but got multiple vents from different countries. It's okay to be ignorant, but to say it was all doomer theater is right up there with flat earth bros. Better go look for your Chem trails! How many patients needed a vent and couldn't get one? What about all the emergency vents NYC had, and sold, because they didn't want to pay for upkeep? And all the hospitals at *gasp* 100% capacity!!! Upon closer examination, there were plenty of beds available, just not staff. Were things bad in some crowded, shitty big cities? Yes. Were they ever as bad as the MSM portrayed? No. Were the young and healthy ever at significant risk? No. The whole scamdemic was the biggest example of .gov overreach and tyranny in our lifetime. You fell for it, I didn't. And before you whip out your healthcare hero badge, I'm a RN, who has been working in hospitals for over 25 years, including a very large teaching hospital when Covid hit. |
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Posted: 5/18/2023 11:37:23 AM EDT
[Last Edit: AKoch31]
[#33]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By g8rgunner: How many patients needed a vent and couldn't get one? What about all the emergency vents NYC had, and sold, because they didn't want to pay for upkeep? And all the hospitals at *gasp* 100% capacity!!! Upon closer examination, there were plenty of beds available, just not staff. Were things bad in some crowded, shitty big cities? Yes. Were they ever as bad as the MSM portrayed? No. Were the young and healthy ever at significant risk? No. The whole scamdemic was the biggest example of .gov overreach and tyranny in our lifetime. You fell for it, I didn't. And before you whip out your healthcare hero badge, I'm a RN, who has been working in hospitals for over 25 years, including a very large teaching hospital when Covid hit. Actually a few, at least until someone else died or got extubated a good number of folks sat on airvo or bipap until a vent was free. Lots of facilities were both under staffed and short beds. We rented beds and ran our icu at 150-200% licensed capacity for 2 years straight. All intubated patients were doubled up in a single room. Holds were held in the ER for 24-72 hours before either being discharged or finally getting a bed. Did I ever say it was as bad as the MSM portrayed it? Did I ever say it was dangerous to the young and healthy? No. It was mostly dangerous to the fat and diabetics. I didn't fall for shit. That doesn't mean that what I'm saying isn't also true. Sounds like your very large teaching facility probably had more resources than most normal facilities. Imagine that. |
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Posted: 5/18/2023 1:31:42 PM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AKoch31: Yeah bro, that's why we had to get vents from all over the world. We had shit flown in from Germany primarily, but got multiple vents from different countries. It's okay to be ignorant, but to say it was all doomer theater is right up there with flat earth bros. Better go look for your Chem trails! Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AKoch31: Originally Posted By g8rgunner: The vent shortage was pure MSM doomer theater. Just like the field hospitals and Navy hospital ship in NYC that were barely used. All fear porn to keep the masses scared. It, sadly, worked on way too many sheeple. Yeah bro, that's why we had to get vents from all over the world. We had shit flown in from Germany primarily, but got multiple vents from different countries. It's okay to be ignorant, but to say it was all doomer theater is right up there with flat earth bros. Better go look for your Chem trails! Actually, no, we didn't. We had tens of thousands of ventilators already when Uncle Sugar issued purchase orders for boatloads more of them. Even NASA got in the act designing and prototyping an easily produced vent. And, after thousands of vents were sent to Cuomo, they sat unused just like the Javits Center ad-hoc hospital and the USNS hospital ship. Worse still, it's been found that venting patients worsened their condition, not improved it. |
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Posted: 5/18/2023 1:36:24 PM EDT
[#35]
VAP is a long-known issue. Docs weren't traching vent pts much 2020-2021. We've known for a long time that trachs reduce the risk of VAP and improve mortality with pts that are vent dependent for more than a few days. Most places I've worked look at 10-14 days.
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WA, USA
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Posted: 5/18/2023 3:05:48 PM EDT
[#36]
I recall seeing a video that showed semi-loads of brand new vents in the box being dumped in a landfill, Florida IIRC. Complete waste of money and resources. Story was they weren't held onto and used later because they didn't meet the normal standards. They relaxed the specs due to the "emergency".
The machine shop I work in could have been spitting out pump parts the day after getting the prints. It's what we do, quick turn around of short run parts. Every day is something different. Other than when covid hit we weren't doing much of anything. This isn't the same video but a similar one. China made a buttload of money off our response........
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Posted: 5/18/2023 4:26:32 PM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Mr_Woodsy: I recall seeing a video that showed semi-loads of brand new vents in the box being dumped in a landfill, Florida IIRC. Complete waste of money and resources. Story was they weren't held onto and used later because they didn't meet the normal standards. They relaxed the specs due to the "emergency". The machine shop I work in could have been spitting out pump parts the day after getting the prints. It's what we do, quick turn around of short run parts. Every day is something different. Other than when covid hit we weren't doing much of anything. This isn't the same video but a similar one. China made a buttload of money off our response........
They weren't approved for medical use in the US and it was cheaper to dump them versus sending them back. |
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Posted: 5/18/2023 10:25:19 PM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Riter: Remdesivir (caused renal failure) and intubation were part of the failed treatment protocol. Another part was telling sick patients to go home (so the wuflu could spread in their body and make them sicker instead of giving them ivermectin or hydroxchloroquine and curing them). First - Meh, go home until you can't breath. Second - You can't breath, so I guess we have to intubate you. Third - Here's some of this run death is near. Fourth - Shit man, I'm glad your daughter a nurse told us you had pneumonia from all this, here, we're going to put you back on the ventilator again. Fifth - Wow, it's like crazy but now you have another infection in your lungs so we're going to have to drain that. OK, make sure you wear your mask MMMkay. |
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Posted: 5/18/2023 10:30:09 PM EDT
[#39]
The key takeaways seemed to be, don't already be under a DNR order or morbidly obese.
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USA
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Posted: 5/18/2023 10:42:50 PM EDT
[#40]
The experts
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FL, USA
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Posted: 5/18/2023 11:59:13 PM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AKoch31: Sorry, but your dad doesn't really know what he's talking about. Vents weren't used for stable patients. They were a last ditch effort after the patient continued to desaturate on room air, supplemental o2, high flow nasal cannula, and bipap. If they needed a vent and didn't get one, they'd have just died earlier. Most covid patients on the vent were already getting broad spectrum antibiotic treatment. A pharmacist isn't exactly qualified to make medical decisions regarding invasive procedures like mechanical ventilation. The bigger problem was that in certain areas (NYC in particular) older Covid positive people were told by their doctors to just stay home and not call for medical assistance unless they started having breathing difficulties or had lowered O2 sats. There were no therapeutic treatments being performed in the meantime and by the time they finally had issues with breathing they were basically dead men and women walking. I personally know someone whose 70 yr old Covid positive aunt was sent home by her doctor for several days and by the time she started having breathing difficulties and got on the vent she was dead in less than 24 hours. I have a nurse friend I’ve known for over 30 years who volunteered to go work in the Covid wards up there. She told me that virtually every elderly patient who got put on a ventilator died. The medical community or the CDC either didn’t know what the fuck they were doing or they knew ‘exactly’ what they were doing. It’s amazing that when their patients on vents were dying in droves no one thought that maybe they should look at trying something before it got to ventilator time. It’s almost like the lack of attempting therapeutic treatments on the elderly during the beginning of the plandemic was on intentional. If so, it certainly served its purpose of scaring the hell out of the oldsters and getting them on the vaccines when they magically appeared in short order. |
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Posted: 5/19/2023 12:11:02 AM EDT
[Last Edit: Gamma762]
[#42]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AKoch31: Vents weren't used for stable patients. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AKoch31: Vents weren't used for stable patients. Yes they were. Patient goes to hospital with symptoms, within a day gets sedated, put on ventilator and remdesivir and wait for death. Hospital has zero liability and gets paid big bucks. No one is allowed in the hospital so there are no witnesses to the treatment protocols. There were numerous reports out of NY and other places, especially early on, that patients were treated this way so that medical staff wouldn't have to be exposed to them. Patients put in a room on a vent with a big IV drip and not seen again for over 24 hours, sometimes longer. Because pandemic. Originally Posted By BrotherJackToo: The hell they weren't used on stable patients! That is exactly what my medical side of my family was livid about. I don't recall all the $10 medical words they were throwing around during the rants, but in English, they pissed that they were being directed to use the vent in cases that it was (at least in their view) totally inappropriate, and in violation of previously normal protocols for venting someone. This. |
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GA, USA
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Posted: 5/19/2023 7:54:56 AM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AKoch31: The ICU I worked in from 2020-2022 had the highest survival rate of all the HCA hospitals and all of the greater Austin area. Our pulmonary group was big on early proning and we continue to give a 3 day ivermectin course even today. That’s interesting, because I recall that the govt. enacted an emergency medical act that gave the medical industry protection from legal liability, as long as the government’s prescribed treatment program was followed. And ivermectin was NOT part of that program. That’s amazing that a big corp. like HCA would give up that legal immunity so that they could administer ivermectin. |
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Posted: 5/19/2023 8:34:42 AM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By planemaker: Actually, no, we didn't. We had tens of thousands of ventilators already when Uncle Sugar issued purchase orders for boatloads more of them. Even NASA got in the act designing and prototyping an easily produced vent. And, after thousands of vents were sent to Cuomo, they sat unused just like the Javits Center ad-hoc hospital and the USNS hospital ship. Worse still, it's been found that venting patients worsened their condition, not improved it. I don't care to go hunt it down, but there are stats on venting and patient outcomes that show that just being on one is bad, and the time on one vastly increases the likelihood of a negative outcome. |
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USA
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Posted: 5/19/2023 8:44:53 AM EDT
[#45]
And speaking of misinformation, remember asymptomatic spread????
 Asymptomatic BOMBSHELL - This Changes EVERYTHING We Were Told |
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Posted: 5/20/2023 3:28:34 PM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AKoch31: ......... Sorry, but your dad doesn't really know what he's talking about. ........... ........ A pharmacist isn't exactly qualified to make medical decisions regarding invasive procedures like mechanical ventilation. ....... Hmmmm, I wonder why his Inbox is quite full of "***, your thoughts on this patient desired" type emails from seasoned Doctors & Surgeons across many specialties ? As many posters here have already noted, not reacting to it vigorously enough early on & allowing it to get to the vent stage was where the biggest mistakes were made. That point should not be very hard to grasp.... First, do no harm. It's not supposed to be a throw-away oath. |
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Posted: 5/20/2023 6:07:46 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Gamma762]
[#47]
Much of the very early covid response was because of pre-arranged pandemic disaster plans which were set up to combat the Spanish Flu outbreak... just like how the mil plans to fight the last war. Their disaster plan assumed that ventilators would be needed for the pandemic illness, so ventilators were used regardless of the actual clinical presentation of the actual illness that was spreading, which was not a flu variant. In fact it wasn't even a respiratory illness IMO, Covid's primary mechanism is as a blood and metabolic illness. Especially with the early variants one of the biggest problems of the illness is that hemoglobin in the blood was being destroyed, so oxygen couldn't be transported through the body. The biochemical debris from that process (ferritin) ends up being deposited in the lungs causing massive inflammation. Combination of ferritin and spike protein caused full-body inflammation. Mechanical ventilation in no way can fix either of those problems and in fact make lung problems worse. Even today much of the medical community doesn't know or understand that fundamental fact of the early covid variants, because the CDC never talked about it. The real science, in early papers and clinical evidence, was crystal clear though, as far back as March 2020.
Remdesivir was an even worse killer. Hundreds of thousands of Americans were killed in order to make a buck off the pandemic and exacerbate the impacts of the illness for political reasons, using a drug known to be fatally toxic and ineffective. This was Mengele level medical misadventure done to the American people at large. A whole lot of people are in denial about that, but it is what it is. |
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Posted: 5/20/2023 7:10:54 PM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Gamma762: Much of the very early covid response was because of pre-arranged pandemic disaster plans which were set up to combat the Spanish Flu outbreak... just like how the mil plans to fight the last war. Their disaster plan assumed that ventilators would be needed for the pandemic illness, so ventilators were used regardless of the actual clinical presentation of the actual illness that was spreading, which was not a flu variant. In fact it wasn't even a respiratory illness IMO, Covid's primary mechanism is as a blood and metabolic illness. Especially with the early variants one of the biggest problems of the illness is that hemoglobin in the blood was being destroyed, so oxygen couldn't be transported through the body. The biochemical debris from that process (ferritin) ends up being deposited in the lungs causing massive inflammation. Combination of ferritin and spike protein caused full-body inflammation. Mechanical ventilation in no way can fix either of those problems and in fact make lung problems worse. Even today much of the medical community doesn't know or understand that fundamental fact of the early covid variants, because the CDC never talked about it. The real science, in early papers and clinical evidence, was crystal clear though, as far back as March 2020. Remdesivir was an even worse killer. Hundreds of thousands of Americans were killed in order to make a buck off the pandemic and exacerbate the impacts of the illness for political reasons, using a drug known to be fatally toxic and ineffective. This was Mengele level medical misadventure done to the American people at large. A whole lot of people are in denial about that, but it is what it is. Spot on. I can't help but wonder now, how many people did Covid kill that never went to a hospital? |
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Posted: 5/20/2023 8:46:44 PM EDT
[Last Edit: ricky_45]
[#49]
I never took that clot shot and had Covid twice
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USA
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Posted: 5/21/2023 4:58:17 PM EDT
[#50]
Had it multiples and no shots either.
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