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Posted: 3/28/2024 12:15:39 PM EDT
[#1]
Originally Posted By Aimless: My wife's Highlander has the feature where it shuts off when stopped I don't think you know what that word means. |
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Posted: 3/28/2024 12:17:24 PM EDT
[#2]
Buy her a 3/4 ton truck and not worry about such things. 
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Posted: 3/28/2024 12:21:20 PM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Denwad: Agm batteries are gay and always break before regular flooded batteries Of course that was 10 years ago when I worked at autozone I started out using them with my Stereos and Plow trucks after a few prematurely failing someone turned me on to XS power, all I buy now... |
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Posted: 3/28/2024 12:59:03 PM EDT
[#4]
Can anybody explain the down side to auto stop/start? I guess that driving hybrids for many years has made me not even notice it on regular cars.
Or is this just a "OMG ITS NEW...it must suck" thing. |
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TX, USA
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Posted: 3/28/2024 1:34:12 PM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By DoctorCAD: Can anybody explain the down side to auto stop/start? I guess that driving hybrids for many years has made me not even notice it on regular cars. Or is this just a "OMG ITS NEW...it must suck" thing. I see it as the answer to a question that I didn’t ask. I measured it on my very regular work route one week and saw so little difference that I couldn’t see the point. |
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Posted: 3/28/2024 2:12:20 PM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By DoctorCAD: Can anybody explain the down side to auto stop/start? I guess that driving hybrids for many years has made me not even notice it on regular cars. Or is this just a "OMG ITS NEW...it must suck" thing. It is more complicated, without any real efficiency benefit like a hybrid. Unlike a hybrid, the engine still has to start to move the vehicle. So again, no reall efficiency gain and more cycling of the IC engine than you'd see in a hybrid or a regular car without start stop. Most of them have a pretty decent delay when starting back up. Requires another battery, or puts more wear on a single battery system. |
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Posted: 3/28/2024 3:21:34 PM EDT
[Last Edit: zentradi]
[#7]
If I don't turn my car off to pump gas, why would I do it because the light is red?
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Posted: 3/28/2024 3:25:19 PM EDT
[#8]
Different cars use different types of batteries.
My Mazda CX50 uses the same system as Porsche and it is a special battery only at the dealership. It also requires a computer reset of some sort. Luckily the car lets you know the battery isn’t healthy. |
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Posted: 3/28/2024 3:31:59 PM EDT
[#9]
I assume it is simply an AGM battery. Maybe a high demand/high CCA version.
The AGM battery in my Cruze Diesel was insanely expensive and freaking huge. Guess it takes a ton of energy to heat glow plugs and to start a 2.0L diesel in forty below, but it did! |
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Posted: 3/28/2024 3:37:56 PM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By RattleCanAR: Different cars use different types of batteries. My Mazda CX50 uses the same system as Porsche and it is a special battery only at the dealership. It also requires a computer reset of some sort. Luckily the car lets you know the battery isn't healthy. i-Stop is implemented on Porsche models? I'd like to know more |
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AZ, USA
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Posted: 3/28/2024 3:42:32 PM EDT
[#11]
disable that shit and don't replace the secondary battery, it causes nothing but problems. there's usually a widget you can buy to keep the system off entirely too.
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AZ, USA
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Posted: 3/28/2024 3:49:25 PM EDT
[Last Edit: XNARC]
[#12]
On jeeps, it’s called ESS, Electronic Stop Start, and if you drive an average of 12 k a year, it saves a whole 5 gallons of gas! The auxiliary battery is likely not taking a charge anymore. It may be in a plastic housing, under the full size battery. Some can be just as expensive as the full size. They will also charge you more to do the install, due to having to remove the full size battery, take apart the housing, etc. Look up a ‘hack’ for it, and just do without it. You may have to find what fuse to pull, so you don’t get a dash warning light
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Posted: 3/28/2024 3:50:34 PM EDT
[Last Edit: FlashMan-7k]
[#13]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Alacrity: @Aimless '17-'19 Highlander- yea had a special stop start battery. Upgraded (deep cycle?), special part number. I'll see if there's anything I can post that runs it down. ETA - EFB battery https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/14291/IMG_1416_jpeg-3171615.JPG https://static.nhtsa.gov/odi/tsbs/2019/MC-10153248-9999.pdf Actually needed? Toyota says so, documents in a Tech Tip that's submitted to NHSTA. More than likely to cover the possibility of the battery dying, no restart and some liability event proceeding. I'm sure you understand the motivation. Translation: The manufacturer has had to do stuff that's a net negative and bad for your car because they have to meet obscen regulation standards that are designed to make it impossible to make cars. Having to restart your car when you stop is wear and tear on the starter, shortens the lifespan of the battery by what has to be a noticeable amount, AND if you are stopped long enough with the oil pump not going, that means the top of the engine (read: valves and cams) will go dry of oil, leading to them lasting less than they would if the engine did not have the auto start/stop "feature." What's the upside? Auto manufacturers can claim higher MPG across their produced fleets and have to absorb less abuse from the governments. ETA: Requiring a deep cycle battery means you expect the battery to get more heavily discharged than it would otherwise. Deep (~50% ish) or complete discharges age a battery quickly. Deep cycle batteries are designed to try and minimize that effect. And that also means your alternator is getting hit a lot harder too. |
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MO, USA
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Posted: 3/28/2024 4:12:52 PM EDT
[Last Edit: ARinKCMO]
[#14]
A friend of mine has a mini-van with that 'feature' it also has the powered sliding side doors. so he has a second smaller 'motorcycle' type battery that runs them. It's a ... 2018(i think) Pacifica.
My '22 Subaru has the feature. Fortunately, right on the main screen of the ginormous tablet in my dash, there is a button to disable it. It still has the factory battery, so it could go at any time. It's turned over slow a few times on some of the cold days this winter. I looked in it's manual and all it says is 'this vehicles uses a high performance battery specifically designed for the start stop system. see your dealer for details' yay. So I'll be doing some research here shortly on what it actually needs. Batteries have gotten stupid expensive anyway, so I'm not looking forward to however much a 'fancy' battery is gonna run. (I've always wanted an Optima. A Yellowtop DH5 for my Legacy, which says it's for high electrical demand and start/stop is $340 direct. heh...) ((DieHards are 190-250 depending. Autozone has teh DH5s for $295) |
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Posted: 3/28/2024 4:25:44 PM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By ARinKCMO: A friend of mine has a mini-van with that 'feature' it also has the powered sliding side doors. so he has a second smaller 'motorcycle' type battery that runs them. It's a ... 2018(i think) Pacifica. My '22 Subaru has the feature. Fortunately, right on the main screen of the ginormous tablet in my dash, there is a button to disable it. It still has the factory battery, so it could go at any time. It's turned over slow a few times on some of the cold days this winter. I looked in it's manual and all it says is 'this vehicles uses a high performance battery specifically designed for the start stop system. see your dealer for details' yay. So I'll be doing some research here shortly on what it actually needs. Batteries have gotten stupid expensive anyway, so I'm not looking forward to however much a 'fancy' battery is gonna run. (I've always wanted an Optima. A Yellowtop DH5 for my Legacy, which says it's for high electrical demand and start/stop is $340 direct. heh...) ((DieHards are 190-250 depending. Autozone has teh DH5s for $295) If you're goint to spring for a top shelf battery. Odyssey. Optimas are reportedly not as good as they used to be. https://www.odysseybattery.com/ These rolls may be among the best, but the prices ... https://www.rollsbattery.com/ I have had optimas. No rolls or odyssey (yet). |
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Posted: 3/28/2024 4:35:55 PM EDT
[Last Edit: RattleCanAR]
[#16]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By DoctorCAD: Can anybody explain the down side to auto stop/start? I guess that driving hybrids for many years has made me not even notice it on regular cars. Or is this just a "OMG ITS NEW...it must suck" thing. I hated it until I got used to it and drove a car with a smart system. My previously mentioned Mazda doesn’t use the starter for the restart and when the HVAC is working hard it doesn’t shut the car off. It also has a metal heat sync in the airflow. When it does shut off the airflow stays the current temp. The car also uses the direct injection and fires a top dead cylinder to restart. It is pretty seamless and fast enough to be fully running before your foot goes from the brake to the accelerator. My father has a GM CUV that is a dumb system. No airflow or AC and the thing uses the starter. It doesn’t care about temperatures or HVAC needs. It is useless. Saves very little fuel and only ensures the car passes emission tests. On the Mazda it only turns off if you press the brake hard at a stop. Normal driving you never notice until you consciously push the brake to make it activate. I drove 50 miles today and I don’t think it activated the entire drive because I never pushed hard enough when stopped. It is only off for 2 minutes maximum when engaged. |
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Posted: 3/28/2024 4:40:11 PM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Alacrity: i-Stop is implemented on Porsche models? I'd like to know more I am not sure which models but I looked it up, seems it is on their 4 door autos like their CUVs and big sedan. |
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MO, USA
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Posted: 3/28/2024 4:46:50 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By FlashMan-7k: If you're goint to spring for a top shelf battery. Odyssey. Optimas are reportedly not as good as they used to be. https://www.odysseybattery.com/ These rolls may be among the best, but the prices ... https://www.rollsbattery.com/ I have had optimas. No rolls or odyssey (yet). Nice Urbie! Those Rolls..yeah. I'm a Signalman at a Railroad, so it's cool to see some of the 2volt track batteries there! We wire them up in banks to get 12, 24, or 48 volts that can run for however many hours we think we need them to. Kind of fun doing that. I'll have to do some comparisons between the brand we currently use and those. The Odyssey is price competitive with the optimas, so I'll put them on the list! Thanks! |
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Posted: 3/28/2024 4:47:22 PM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Riter: You were being conned. You put your foot in your mouth in every thread you post in. It’s kind of incredible really. |
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GA, USA
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Posted: 3/28/2024 5:24:17 PM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By KySawgrass: Generally cars with stop start have a main battery and an auxiliary battery, usually an aux14-1. Not sure about location in the Highlander specifically, but if it has stop start, it has an aux battery of some kind hiding in there. I was going to say you are full of s__t. But I looked up "aux 14-1" and sure enough, Im ignorant. Still, my 2016 F150 2.7 has no aux battery but did come with an AGM that I have replaced once. |
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NY, USA
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Posted: 3/28/2024 5:25:30 PM EDT
[#21]
My 22.5 GMC sierra with the 3.0L diesel has the start stop feature. It has a single heavy duty battery under the hood. Nothing special, just a little larger than what you would find in a sedan or compact car.
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NY, USA
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Posted: 3/28/2024 6:15:17 PM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By FlashMan-7k: If you're goint to spring for a top shelf battery. Odyssey. Optimas are reportedly not as good as they used to be. https://www.odysseybattery.com/ These rolls may be among the best, but the prices ... https://www.rollsbattery.com/ I have had optimas. No rolls or odyssey (yet). Optima got bought out several years ago and production moved... They are not what they used to be. Odyssey is about the best you can buy right now. Also one of the best warranties in the battery business as well. |
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Posted: 3/28/2024 6:17:23 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Alacrity]
[#23]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By RattleCanAR: I am not sure which models but I looked it up, seems it is on their 4 door autos like their CUVs and big sedan. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By RattleCanAR: Originally Posted By Alacrity: i-Stop is implemented on Porsche models? I'd like to know more I am not sure which models but I looked it up, seems it is on their 4 door autos like their CUVs and big sedan. I know it's on 718, and pretty sure Macan and Cayenne. At least certain recent years. Silly, but the GT4 has both start stop and alternating cylinder deactivation.   It's slightly annoying, esp in a car with its use intention.Mazda used a particular combustion assist (the combustion only start SISS didnt make production), which I should know Porsche is using  - and I'm kinda wondering if there's licensing or how infringement was avoided if not. For S/S to operate in manual Porsche, where equipped, you need to place the gearbox in neutral, release the clutch while the brake is depressed. PDK it's just brake actuated.Now I need to ask some questions  |
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Posted: 3/28/2024 6:20:36 PM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Aimless: Mine is a 2019 and this is the second battery. I almost never drive it, but we had it for awhile before I realized it had that feature. I stopped at a stop light and it flashed a message that I had to press the brake harder for it to work. I asked my wife and she said she had no idea it had the stop light stop feature. FLA are for starting and do not like to be discharged. Do your own homework!
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Posted: 3/28/2024 6:36:30 PM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Alacrity: I know it's on 718, and pretty sure Macan and Cayenne. At least certain recent years. Silly, but the GT4 has both start stop and alternating cylinder deactivation. It's slightly annoying, esp in a car with its use intention.Mazda used a particular combustion assist (the combustion only start SISS didnt make production), which I should know Porsche is using - and I'm kinda wondering if there's licensing or how infringement was avoided if not. For S/S to operate in manual Porsche, where equipped, you need to place the gearbox in neutral, release the clutch while the brake is depressed. PDK it's just brake actuated.Now I need to ask some questions If driven in a spirited manner I am sure none of it activates. Mazdas in Sport mode don’t activate. Sport mode drinks fuel so I normally use it in traffic because the CUV holds the gears longer and downshifts more aggressively which makes the tq/hp more accessible. When spirited I use manual shift with the paddles and sport mode because it also changes throttle mapping. In normal driving I can command a downshift at anytime with the paddles no matter what mode I am in. The override the automatic scheduling which is cool. My CUV isn’t Porsche power of course but 320tq and 256hp is enough to be fun. Start stop is rarely ever activated and unlike Porsche it doesn’t nanny you to push harder on the brake. |
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Posted: 3/28/2024 6:50:48 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By RattleCanAR: If driven in a spirited manner I am sure none of it activates. Mazdas in Sport mode don't activate. Sport mode drinks fuel so I normally use it in traffic because the CUV holds the gears longer and downshifts more aggressively which makes the tq/hp more accessible. When spirited I use manual shift with the paddles and sport mode because it also changes throttle mapping. In normal driving I can command a downshift at anytime with the paddles no matter what mode I am in. The override the automatic scheduling which is cool. My CUV isn't Porsche power of course but 320tq and 256hp is enough to be fun. Start stop is rarely ever activated and unlike Porsche it doesn't nanny you to push harder on the brake. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By RattleCanAR: Originally Posted By Alacrity: I know it's on 718, and pretty sure Macan and Cayenne. At least certain recent years. Silly, but the GT4 has both start stop and alternating cylinder deactivation. It's slightly annoying, esp in a car with its use intention.Mazda used a particular combustion assist (the combustion only start SISS didnt make production), which I should know Porsche is using - and I'm kinda wondering if there's licensing or how infringement was avoided if not. For S/S to operate in manual Porsche, where equipped, you need to place the gearbox in neutral, release the clutch while the brake is depressed. PDK it's just brake actuated.Now I need to ask some questions If driven in a spirited manner I am sure none of it activates. Mazdas in Sport mode don't activate. Sport mode drinks fuel so I normally use it in traffic because the CUV holds the gears longer and downshifts more aggressively which makes the tq/hp more accessible. When spirited I use manual shift with the paddles and sport mode because it also changes throttle mapping. In normal driving I can command a downshift at anytime with the paddles no matter what mode I am in. The override the automatic scheduling which is cool. My CUV isn't Porsche power of course but 320tq and 256hp is enough to be fun. Start stop is rarely ever activated and unlike Porsche it doesn't nanny you to push harder on the brake. 2020 GT4, and assuming later, can be deactivated in Normal (each start IIRC), Sport and Sport Plus defeats it. There's a number of means to permanently defeat, both programming and physical. APR Tune kills it dead and is likely the most rewarding |
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TN, USA
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Posted: 3/28/2024 6:53:25 PM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By RIP-Yataski: So what is the question?... The post did seem a bit aimless, didn't it. |
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Posted: 3/28/2024 6:57:42 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By RIP-Yataski: So what is the question?... That feature is annoying AF. |
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AZ, USA
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Posted: 3/28/2024 7:04:48 PM EDT
[#29]
I'm confused...why is your wife not in the kitchen?
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Posted: 3/28/2024 7:12:55 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Alacrity: 2020 GT4, and assuming later, can be deactivated in Normal (each start IIRC), Sport and Sport Plus defeats it. There's a number of means to permanently defeat, both programming and physical. APR Tune kills it dead and is likely the most rewarding My Mazda is only a year old and under warranty. A tune won’t be a thing for a while. |
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Posted: 3/28/2024 7:57:58 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By RattleCanAR: My Mazda is only a year old and under warranty. A tune won't be a thing for a while. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By RattleCanAR: Originally Posted By Alacrity: 2020 GT4, and assuming later, can be deactivated in Normal (each start IIRC), Sport and Sport Plus defeats it. There's a number of means to permanently defeat, both programming and physical. APR Tune kills it dead and is likely the most rewarding My Mazda is only a year old and under warranty. A tune won't be a thing for a while. Tune (esp APR) isn't the most economic way to defeat S/S. There's surely a way to trick the system through coding status or some physical means. No idea what those would be for a Mazda CUV - but I wouldn't be inclined to tune a DD, esp a CUV anyway. |
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Posted: 3/28/2024 8:04:47 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Danted]
[#32]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Alacrity: I know it's on 718, and pretty sure Macan and Cayenne. At least certain recent years. Silly, but the GT4 has both start stop and alternating cylinder deactivation. It's slightly annoying, esp in a car with its use intention.Mazda used a particular combustion assist (the combustion only start SISS didnt make production), which I should know Porsche is using - and I'm kinda wondering if there's licensing or how infringement was avoided if not. For S/S to operate in manual Porsche, where equipped, you need to place the gearbox in neutral, release the clutch while the brake is depressed. PDK it's just brake actuated.Now I need to ask some questions Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Alacrity: Originally Posted By RattleCanAR: Originally Posted By Alacrity: i-Stop is implemented on Porsche models? I'd like to know more I am not sure which models but I looked it up, seems it is on their 4 door autos like their CUVs and big sedan. I know it's on 718, and pretty sure Macan and Cayenne. At least certain recent years. Silly, but the GT4 has both start stop and alternating cylinder deactivation. It's slightly annoying, esp in a car with its use intention.Mazda used a particular combustion assist (the combustion only start SISS didnt make production), which I should know Porsche is using - and I'm kinda wondering if there's licensing or how infringement was avoided if not. For S/S to operate in manual Porsche, where equipped, you need to place the gearbox in neutral, release the clutch while the brake is depressed. PDK it's just brake actuated.Now I need to ask some questions I have no idea how Mazda stuff works. Nothing in Porsche called " I-stop" They do use start stop. The reason for start stop, and regenerative braking ( non hybrid cars full field the alternator and engine brake during light braking) and all other modern battery mangement was to real world test the systems for implementation into hybird and EV vehicles. The combustion restart is the most common way to restart, I don't remember the % but something like 87% of restarts are from squirting fuel and lighting it off. I don't really understand what info your looking for but I probaly have the answer. |
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Posted: 3/28/2024 8:42:46 PM EDT
[Last Edit: RattleCanAR]
[#33]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Alacrity: Tune (esp APR) isn't the most economic way to defeat S/S. There's surely a way to trick the system through coding status or some physical means. No idea what those would be for a Mazda CUV - but I wouldn't be inclined to tune a DD, esp a CUV anyway. I think someone sells a bypass switch system. I have looked at the wiring and it isn't straightforward. I can turn it off just like you can in a Porsche. |
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Posted: 3/28/2024 9:00:02 PM EDT
[#34]
Wow
Hey lets shut the car off at every stop to save emissions and gas. Never mind your starter, and ignore the extra battery. Its to save the planet. |
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MI, USA
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Posted: 3/28/2024 9:15:21 PM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By PeepEater: You should have a button on the dash that disables it. |
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Posted: 3/28/2024 9:20:28 PM EDT
[#36]
I bought a plug in module from ZIC motor sports. No codes, no errors, 5 minute job and no more start stop or shortened battery life
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Posted: 3/29/2024 2:45:24 AM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By ARinKCMO: Nice Urbie! Those Rolls..yeah. I'm a Signalman at a Railroad, so it's cool to see some of the 2volt track batteries there! We wire them up in banks to get 12, 24, or 48 volts that can run for however many hours we think we need them to. Kind of fun doing that. I'll have to do some comparisons between the brand we currently use and those. The Odyssey is price competitive with the optimas, so I'll put them on the list! Thanks! Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By ARinKCMO: Originally Posted By FlashMan-7k: If you're goint to spring for a top shelf battery. Odyssey. Optimas are reportedly not as good as they used to be. https://www.odysseybattery.com/ These rolls may be among the best, but the prices ... https://www.rollsbattery.com/ I have had optimas. No rolls or odyssey (yet). Nice Urbie! Those Rolls..yeah. I'm a Signalman at a Railroad, so it's cool to see some of the 2volt track batteries there! We wire them up in banks to get 12, 24, or 48 volts that can run for however many hours we think we need them to. Kind of fun doing that. I'll have to do some comparisons between the brand we currently use and those. The Odyssey is price competitive with the optimas, so I'll put them on the list! Thanks! LOL ... I think I'll choose to not be insulted by that.  It's not an urbe, it's a (points at username). |
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Posted: 3/29/2024 10:31:26 AM EDT
[#38]
I found this link to a company who make ASS eliminators for most makes and models on the Subaru Outback forums: https://www.autostopeliminator.com/
No affiliation. |
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TX, USA
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Posted: 3/29/2024 10:39:01 AM EDT
[#39]
Our Honda Odyssey has stop start. On it's 3rd recall, the latest being an issue with the firmware that may leave you stranded in the middle of the intersection when it inadvertently shuts off. We go through an AGM battery every 6-9 months. So far it's been replaced by the dealer on their dime in warranty but we'll see how much it costs outside of it. Fucking environmentalists and California.
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VA, USA
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Posted: 3/29/2024 10:57:11 AM EDT
[#40]
Just got a new Santa Fe (all gas, 2.5T) with stop/go and the first time I looked under the hood I saw that B-F-battery! We usually turn it off upon starting the car - not much of a PITA once you get used to doing that.
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Posted: 3/29/2024 3:16:19 PM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Merlin: I found this link to a company who make ASS eliminators for most makes and models on the Subaru Outback forums: https://www.autostopeliminator.com/ No affiliation. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Merlin: I found this link to a company who make ASS eliminators for most makes and models on the Subaru Outback forums: https://www.autostopeliminator.com/ No affiliation. I have these installed in our Subarus and they work and are 100% plug and play. You have to remove a couple screws on the eyesight system cover and then it plugs into the wiring harness. It's a stupid simple device, it just looks at the CAN bus, and when it sees the car start it waits a second and then sends the off command if the system was last set to off (it remembers state across starts.) Originally Posted By DoctorCAD: Can anybody explain the down side to auto stop/start? I guess that driving hybrids for many years has made me not even notice it on regular cars. Or is this just a "OMG ITS NEW...it must suck" thing. The downside is in city traffic, you're waiting to turn right out of a store parking lot, finally get an opening that's a few car lengths, and just as you take your foot of the brake and are about to hit the gas the car decides it's stop time putting your nose out in heavy traffic with a three-second delay in restarting and causing a near accident that wouldn't happen in a car without autostop engaged. That happened to me twice and my wife once and that was all it took to get me to buy the auto stop eliminator above. No one seems to acknowledge that unless you change driving habits engrained over decades it increases the danger of driving to save a few pennies worth of gas while stressing the electrical system and starter more than is necessary. |
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MI, USA
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Posted: 3/29/2024 3:57:54 PM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By DoctorCAD: Can anybody explain the down side to auto stop/start? I guess that driving hybrids for many years has made me not even notice it on regular cars. Or is this just a "OMG ITS NEW...it must suck" thing. Well, for Toyota you only have so many cycles before the chance starter comes up. |
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Posted: 3/29/2024 4:18:24 PM EDT
[#43]
What you'll save in gas costs will not come close to offsetting the increase cost in "enhanced flooded battery" purchases compared to the standard battery, and having to replace them more frequently, from what I've observed.
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Posted: 3/29/2024 5:19:06 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Alacrity]
[#44]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Danted: I have no idea how Mazda stuff works. Nothing in Porsche called " I-stop" They do use start stop. The reason for start stop, and regenerative braking ( non hybrid cars full field the alternator and engine brake during light braking) and all other modern battery mangement was to real world test the systems for implementation into hybird and EV vehicles. The combustion restart is the most common way to restart, I don't remember the % but something like 87% of restarts are from squirting fuel and lighting it off. I don't really understand what info you're looking for but I probaly have the answer. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Danted: Originally Posted By Alacrity: Originally Posted By RattleCanAR: Originally Posted By Alacrity: i-Stop is implemented on Porsche models? I'd like to know more I am not sure which models but I looked it up, seems it is on their 4 door autos like their CUVs and big sedan. I know it's on 718, and pretty sure Macan and Cayenne. At least certain recent years. Silly, but the GT4 has both start stop and alternating cylinder deactivation. It's slightly annoying, esp in a car with its use intention.Mazda used a particular combustion assist (the combustion only start SISS didnt make production), which I should know Porsche is using - and I'm kinda wondering if there's licensing or how infringement was avoided if not. For S/S to operate in manual Porsche, where equipped, you need to place the gearbox in neutral, release the clutch while the brake is depressed. PDK it's just brake actuated.Now I need to ask some questions I have no idea how Mazda stuff works. Nothing in Porsche called " I-stop" They do use start stop. The reason for start stop, and regenerative braking ( non hybrid cars full field the alternator and engine brake during light braking) and all other modern battery mangement was to real world test the systems for implementation into hybird and EV vehicles. The combustion restart is the most common way to restart, I don't remember the % but something like 87% of restarts are from squirting fuel and lighting it off. I don't really understand what info you're looking for but I probaly have the answer. I'll clarify - have a link to tech details for Porsche Stop/Start system? Assumed it had the same elements as other mfgs combustion assist as you describe, but Rattle seems to be indicating something particular to Mazda shared. That would be SISS or i-Loop (regen/capacitor stored). i-Stop is just the trade-name for Mazda's S/S that is combustion assist start - not full combustion start like SISS or ISG/Enhanced Starter as some other mfg use . Given what Rattle has indicated subsequently sounds like it's a referral to a shared combustion assist type S/S generally, not identical shared systems. But I'd be interested in you sharing whatever specific knowledge can share. I'll be in ATL in a few weeks and I'll make some asks there to get my curiosity satisfied regardless. |
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Posted: 3/29/2024 6:37:45 PM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Alacrity: I'll clarify - have a link to tech details for Porsche Stop/Start system? Assumed it had the same elements as other mfgs combustion assist as you describe, but Rattle seems to be indicating something particular to Mazda shared. That would be SISS or i-Loop (regen/capacitor stored). i-Stop is just the trade-name for Mazda's S/S that is combustion assist start - not full combustion start like SISS or ISG/Enhanced Starter as some other mfg use . Given what Rattle has indicated subsequently sounds like it's a referral to a shared combustion assist type S/S generally, not identical shared systems. But I'd be interested in you sharing whatever specific knowledge can share. I'll be in ATL in a few weeks and I'll make some asks there to get my curiosity satisfied regardless. Correct, it is a shared design not the same exact name for the process. This is how it works.  Mazda's SKYACTIV® I Stop System |
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Posted: 3/29/2024 6:45:12 PM EDT
[#46]
I just had to buy a new AGM battery for my jeep today. $250 after the core refund.
 At least the swap was super easy. |
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Posted: 3/29/2024 6:53:54 PM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Esterhase: I think if you put a battery in that can't manage the stop/start duty cycle your car will just limit stop/start. It might limit it by not starting. Definitely use the battery the manufacturer recommends or an equivalent third party battery. Don’t you just love how tge government decided we shoukd have this feature? I know it was not required, they just wrote the rules to make it advantageous to the manufacturer. |
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Posted: 3/30/2024 6:33:28 AM EDT
[Last Edit: Alacrity]
[#48]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By RattleCanAR: Correct, it is a shared design not the same exact name for the process. This is how it works.  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KjNANDsAfe0Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By RattleCanAR: Originally Posted By Alacrity: I'll clarify - have a link to tech details for Porsche Stop/Start system? Assumed it had the same elements as other mfgs combustion assist as you describe, but Rattle seems to be indicating something particular to Mazda shared. That would be SISS or i-Loop (regen/capacitor stored). i-Stop is just the trade-name for Mazda's S/S that is combustion assist start - not full combustion start like SISS or ISG/Enhanced Starter as some other mfg use . Given what Rattle has indicated subsequently sounds like it's a referral to a shared combustion assist type S/S generally, not identical shared systems. But I'd be interested in you sharing whatever specific knowledge can share. I'll be in ATL in a few weeks and I'll make some asks there to get my curiosity satisfied regardless. Correct, it is a shared design not the same exact name for the process. This is how it works. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KjNANDsAfe0Thanks, I'm somewhat familiar with i-Stop but hadn't seen that video. Good info. S/S seems simple enough but it's a pretty complex system no matter what mfg, going back to Valeo's iStARS and ReSTART. In a discussion around SkyActiv-X's debut, a Mazda engineer - maybe Tony Chen - mentioned Mazda had gained insights due to their work on HCCI/SPCCI engines (prolly Hitomi's team) and how some was put to use in the evolution/choice from SISS and i-Stop. Didn't occur to me the tendrils that link much of this new engine technology, nor did I really understand all the systems S/S touches. Similar, until you mentioned the connection I never realized how little of Porsche S/S I was aware of - basically I knew where the button was until it got programmed out I hadn't recalled seeing anything on Porsches system. When investigated, nothing. So I'm still interested |
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