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NV, USA
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Posted: 5/12/2024 10:08:13 AM EDT
[#1]
Not with my eyes.
 RDS for short range. LPVO for medium. Otherwise I might as well just use a sharp stick. 
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Posted: 5/12/2024 10:09:06 AM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By DUH556: The KISS rifle that stays in the trunk of my daily driver does. Pin and welded 14.5" with an old Colt A1 upper receiver. Edit to add. My main go everywhere else doesn't have irons. Yeah, a 11.5 barrel on an A2 upper pistol in the car. Well the upper lives in the car. The lower is in a backpack. |
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Posted: 5/12/2024 10:09:45 AM EDT
[#3]
Originally Posted By feetpiece: Yes. 6933 with a tritium front and Scalarworks fixed rear to save weight and fewest things to fail. Got a link for that? I have a set of fixed DD sights on one AR and would like to try that or a FO post. |
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Posted: 5/12/2024 10:10:22 AM EDT
[#4]
I have 20k in really nice optics on most of my rifles...
My rifle favorite right now is a H&R 653... |
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Posted: 5/12/2024 10:10:56 AM EDT
[#5]
My muskets (A1, A2). Everything else is sporting glass.
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OK, USA
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Posted: 5/12/2024 10:12:23 AM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 03RN: Just out of curiosity, where are you shooting piles of pigs in driving snow? Peep sights pose their own issues in snow as well. They are easier to clear though. Contrary to popular belief, it snows in Oklahoma and Texas. Not as often, but windy snowstorms and ice storms aren’t unusual. At all. Pigs are pretty great in the snow. They like the cold, and they are easy to spot. |
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PA, USA
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Posted: 5/12/2024 10:12:29 AM EDT
[#7]
Yes, on my CMP rifles
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Posted: 5/12/2024 10:13:11 AM EDT
[#8]
Two are irons only, two have optics.
Small aperture helps my older eyes especially on the carbine length sight radius. I can still work with it however, for a few more years anyway. |
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Posted: 5/12/2024 10:13:18 AM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By SpacemanSpiff: I haven't found an optic that works very well in a snow storm yet. In the winter I often run irons only. Be curious to see what the Canadians and Scandanavian countries run. Isn't Aimpoint Swedish? |
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Posted: 5/12/2024 10:16:51 AM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By SpacemanSpiff: I haven't found an optic that works very well in a snow storm yet. In the winter I often run irons only. Weird.  Attached File |
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Posted: 5/12/2024 10:17:57 AM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By SpacemanSpiff: I haven't found an optic that works very well in a snow storm yet. In the winter I often run irons only. American Pioneer Corps winter FTX. No one used irons.  Attached File |
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SC, USA
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Posted: 5/12/2024 10:19:06 AM EDT
[#12]
Irons only. There'll be plenty of RDS and optics lying on the ground if the time comes...
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Posted: 5/12/2024 10:20:30 AM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By GrayMan66: Irons only. There'll be plenty of RDS and optics lying on the ground if the time comes... 
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Posted: 5/12/2024 10:20:31 AM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By ED_P: My older eyes do much better with optics vs iron sights these days, so I'm forced into the optics camp. |
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Posted: 5/12/2024 10:22:07 AM EDT
[#15]
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Posted: 5/12/2024 10:34:01 AM EDT
[#16]
I'm cloning a post WWIII rifle. so after the coming solar maximum in a year and Nork and Taiwan ICBM's raining EMP's on us shortly after, yeah, you bet your ass i'm not having electric sights on anymore rifels
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FL, USA
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Posted: 5/12/2024 10:41:02 AM EDT
[#17]
I have irons on my SBR 9mm AR. Makes it fast & handy.
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Posted: 5/12/2024 10:49:49 AM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Zebra120: Contrary to popular belief, it snows in Oklahoma and Texas. Not as often, but windy snowstorms and ice storms aren’t unusual. At all. Pigs are pretty great in the snow. They like the cold, and they are easy to spot. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Zebra120: Originally Posted By 03RN: Just out of curiosity, where are you shooting piles of pigs in driving snow? Peep sights pose their own issues in snow as well. They are easier to clear though. Contrary to popular belief, it snows in Oklahoma and Texas. Not as often, but windy snowstorms and ice storms aren’t unusual. At all. Pigs are pretty great in the snow. They like the cold, and they are easy to spot. I believe it snows there. I've been snowed on in Hawaii. But I think driving snow is a bit different. 1-2 feet in a day is what I'm thinking. I've hunted days with over a foot during daylight hours. I prefer irons but aimpoints with caps works well too since I'm really not shooting far in that type of snow anyways. I wouldn't even bother with caps for a 4" flurry. I think magnified optics are more of a pain in the ass then irons. It's doable and if I need the magnification for antler ID then I'll deal with it. |
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Posted: 5/12/2024 10:52:55 AM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Redbirdxx: American Pioneer Corps winter FTX. No one used irons. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/461668/mt_s_jpg-3212388.JPG Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Redbirdxx: Originally Posted By SpacemanSpiff: I haven't found an optic that works very well in a snow storm yet. In the winter I often run irons only. American Pioneer Corps winter FTX. No one used irons. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/461668/mt_s_jpg-3212388.JPG It's doable but living with optics in the cold is a pain. |
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Posted: 5/12/2024 11:17:11 AM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 03RN: It's doable but living with optics in the cold is a pain. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 03RN: Originally Posted By Redbirdxx: Originally Posted By SpacemanSpiff: I haven't found an optic that works very well in a snow storm yet. In the winter I often run irons only. American Pioneer Corps winter FTX. No one used irons. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/461668/mt_s_jpg-3212388.JPG It's doable but living with optics in the cold is a pain. You're not wrong, and I personally had some weather related optics issues that weekend. But it's a considerable leap from there to "optics don't work well in snow storms". If I were to do it again, I'd still run an optic. I'd just do a few things differently to mitigate the downsides. |
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Posted: 5/12/2024 11:19:59 AM EDT
[#21]
My KISS 6920 is set up with a Scalarworks rear, FSP, and a light
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Posted: 5/12/2024 11:30:43 AM EDT
[#22]
Even my carry handle AR has an optic.
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Posted: 5/12/2024 11:33:05 AM EDT
[Last Edit: Ben]
[#23]
Originally Posted By AbleArcher: Is anyone still running just iron sights as their primary sighting system on a modern AR in 2024? My truck gun was just irons until recently, because I picked up a Sig red dot for stupid cheap. All my loaner training rifles are iron sights. I should specify this is a cost thing though, and that is all. When you have several hundred rifles, it is expensive to put optics on all of them, and just not worth it for training rifles that get beat up. |
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Posted: 5/12/2024 11:46:49 AM EDT
[#24]
Originally Posted By AbleArcher: Is anyone still running just iron sights as their primary sighting system on a modern AR in 2024? 
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VA, USA
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Posted: 5/12/2024 11:57:12 AM EDT
[Last Edit: thedownzero]
[#25]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 03RN: The Marine Corps currently starts with optics now. They found it more efficient and effective to start that way. Interesting, I was reading they have had a decline in scores/performance since 2018. We were qualifying with acogs but when I got out in 12’ they were still only using irons in boot camp. I read they since introduced the optic in boot camp, but were still using iron sights (albeit micros) prior to qualification. |
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Posted: 5/12/2024 12:04:42 PM EDT
[Last Edit: southerncross]
[#26]
 Even my irons sights rifle has an optic. |
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Posted: 5/12/2024 12:11:16 PM EDT
[#27]
I do not use irons only on any of my primarily rifles however I do have irons in back up for them all.
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Posted: 5/12/2024 12:11:46 PM EDT
[#28]
A carry handle upper with an pic rail adapter seems like it could make a great modern setup. You could either put a T2 up there for a Unity style setup, or run a thermal with a QD mount up there, all while retaining a baseline cheek weld of standard height irons
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ID, USA
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Posted: 5/12/2024 12:12:34 PM EDT
[#29]
Both my basic 20" and my 10.5" are Irons.
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TX, USA
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Posted: 5/12/2024 12:16:32 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By SpacemanSpiff: I haven't found an optic that works very well in a snow storm yet. In the winter I often run irons only. For certain inclement weather conditions I have an irons set up |
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Posted: 5/12/2024 12:19:03 PM EDT
[#31]
Old bushy m4a2 14.5 pw. |
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USA
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Posted: 5/12/2024 12:21:24 PM EDT
[#32]
Iron sights only here.
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USA
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Posted: 5/12/2024 12:23:42 PM EDT
[#33]
Not as primary, but I do keep my skills honed using BUISs
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ME, USA
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Posted: 5/12/2024 12:31:39 PM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Redbirdxx: You're not wrong, and I personally had some weather related optics issues that weekend. But it's a considerable leap from there to "optics don't work well in snow storms". If I were to do it again, I'd still run an optic. I'd just do a few things differently to mitigate the downsides. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Redbirdxx: Originally Posted By 03RN: Originally Posted By Redbirdxx: Originally Posted By SpacemanSpiff: I haven't found an optic that works very well in a snow storm yet. In the winter I often run irons only. American Pioneer Corps winter FTX. No one used irons. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/461668/mt_s_jpg-3212388.JPG It's doable but living with optics in the cold is a pain. You're not wrong, and I personally had some weather related optics issues that weekend. But it's a considerable leap from there to "optics don't work well in snow storms". If I were to do it again, I'd still run an optic. I'd just do a few things differently to mitigate the downsides. I'm not talking about larping for a few hours. I'm talking about living in the mountains in northern Maine through the winter, hiking, cutting trees, hauling firewood, breaking trail, etc etc. Keeping an optic on all the time isn't worth the hassle for me. Half the time the lens is full of ice or mud or sawdust and even irons have issues with shit getting in them, it's just they are more likely to stay usable. I'm not interested in worrying if my lens covers are on or if I need to clean my lenses again. I want a rifle I can sling up and go in and out of the house or truck or ATV and not have to worry if the lens is going to frost over with condensate or get covered in crap when it's -15 and snow and ice is blowing off of every tree. |
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Posted: 5/12/2024 12:36:57 PM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By SpacemanSpiff: I'm not talking about larping for a few hours. I'm talking about living in the mountains in northern Maine through the winter, hiking, cutting trees, hauling firewood, breaking trail, etc etc. Keeping an optic on all the time isn't worth the hassle for me. Half the time the lens is full of ice or mud or sawdust and even irons have issues with shit getting in them, it's just they are more likely to stay usable. I'm not interested in worrying if my lens covers are on or if I need to clean my lenses again. I want a rifle I can sling up and go in and out of the house or truck or ATV and not have to worry if the lens is going to frost over with condensate or get covered in crap when it's -15 and snow and ice is blowing off of every tree. Basiacally the one less thing to worry about on an item I have 100% of the time? |
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Posted: 5/12/2024 12:38:01 PM EDT
[Last Edit: AK-12]
[#36]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By thedownzero: Interesting, I was reading they have had a decline in scores/performance since 2018. We were qualifying with acogs but when I got out in 12’ they were still only using irons in boot camp. I read they since introduced the optic in boot camp, but were still using iron sights (albeit micros) prior to qualification. There's a been a decline in the number of experts since 2021, but that's due to the changeover from ART to ARQ more than anything else. We could just blame the Zoomers though. |
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Posted: 5/12/2024 12:38:11 PM EDT
[Last Edit: BikerNut]
[#37]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By WacoKid: Not saying optics are not a force multiplier, but my A1/A2 Carry handles and FSB gas block have really good battery life. My 20" A2 is iron sights only. I use it for Service Rifle matches. But 4X optics are now in the rule book for NRA High Power/Service Rifle matches, and I'm the only one on the firing line still using irons. ETA: My other two (16") rifles have a Trijicon MRO and a Trijicon 4X ACOG, both with back-up irons. |
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Posted: 5/12/2024 12:43:50 PM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By SpacemanSpiff: I'm not talking about larping for a few hours. I'm talking about living in the mountains in northern Maine through the winter, hiking, cutting trees, hauling firewood, breaking trail, etc etc. Keeping an optic on all the time isn't worth the hassle for me. Half the time the lens is full of ice or mud or sawdust and even irons have issues with shit getting in them, it's just they are more likely to stay usable. I'm not interested in worrying if my lens covers are on or if I need to clean my lenses again. I want a rifle I can sling up and go in and out of the house or truck or ATV and not have to worry if the lens is going to frost over with condensate or get covered in crap when it's -15 and snow and ice is blowing off of every tree. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By SpacemanSpiff: Originally Posted By Redbirdxx: Originally Posted By 03RN: Originally Posted By Redbirdxx: Originally Posted By SpacemanSpiff: I haven't found an optic that works very well in a snow storm yet. In the winter I often run irons only. American Pioneer Corps winter FTX. No one used irons. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/461668/mt_s_jpg-3212388.JPG It's doable but living with optics in the cold is a pain. You're not wrong, and I personally had some weather related optics issues that weekend. But it's a considerable leap from there to "optics don't work well in snow storms". If I were to do it again, I'd still run an optic. I'd just do a few things differently to mitigate the downsides. I'm not talking about larping for a few hours. I'm talking about living in the mountains in northern Maine through the winter, hiking, cutting trees, hauling firewood, breaking trail, etc etc. Keeping an optic on all the time isn't worth the hassle for me. Half the time the lens is full of ice or mud or sawdust and even irons have issues with shit getting in them, it's just they are more likely to stay usable. I'm not interested in worrying if my lens covers are on or if I need to clean my lenses again. I want a rifle I can sling up and go in and out of the house or truck or ATV and not have to worry if the lens is going to frost over with condensate or get covered in crap when it's -15 and snow and ice is blowing off of every tree. If you had said all that instead of "I haven't found an optic that works very well in a snow storm yet", we wouldn't be having this conversation. And to be fair, we larped for a solid 36+ hours.  I actually learned a lot about my gear that weekend. |
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TN, USA
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Posted: 5/12/2024 12:45:45 PM EDT
[Last Edit: hydrostatic_cling]
[#39]
I can’t think of a better way to tell the world your knowledge is out of date and you can’t perform at a high level than to advertise an affinity for iron sights only in 2024.
So no, absolutely everything for actual use has an optic. ACOG with RMR, Aimpoints, some LPVOs, and higher mag stuff. If you can’t make optics work at all in the winter it is 100% a skill issue. This is like people stuck in 1980 thinking everything should just be smocks and belt kits. |
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Posted: 5/12/2024 12:49:39 PM EDT
[#40]
At worst for any serious gun I have a primary optic and BUIS. If the primary optics is a scope it has a QD mount
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ME, USA
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Posted: 5/12/2024 12:51:49 PM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Gunnie357: Basiacally the one less thing to worry about on an item I have 100% of the time? Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Gunnie357: Originally Posted By SpacemanSpiff: I'm not talking about larping for a few hours. I'm talking about living in the mountains in northern Maine through the winter, hiking, cutting trees, hauling firewood, breaking trail, etc etc. Keeping an optic on all the time isn't worth the hassle for me. Half the time the lens is full of ice or mud or sawdust and even irons have issues with shit getting in them, it's just they are more likely to stay usable. I'm not interested in worrying if my lens covers are on or if I need to clean my lenses again. I want a rifle I can sling up and go in and out of the house or truck or ATV and not have to worry if the lens is going to frost over with condensate or get covered in crap when it's -15 and snow and ice is blowing off of every tree. Basiacally the one less thing to worry about on an item I have 100% of the time? Yeah pretty much. For my use, I've found the only rifle doo-dad I really need or want is a functioning light. |
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Posted: 5/12/2024 12:51:49 PM EDT
[#42]
I keep one around to maintain proficiency. It can be fun to shoot something different from time to time.
It's not the AR I'm grabbing for anything except a range trip. |
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TN, USA
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Posted: 5/12/2024 12:52:48 PM EDT
[#43]
Some law enforcement agencies issue ARs with iron sights and require them on privately owned rifles.
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Posted: 5/12/2024 12:56:14 PM EDT
[#44]
Yes, I still have one rifle, a M4A1ish build with Colt SOCOM FSB barrel and a Colt M4 carry handle.
Using Molon's RIBZ, I am capable of engaging steel echo silhouette targets out to 500+ yards; using good ole M855. I've thought about tossing a RCO on the thing, but there's just something about irons that I enjoy.  |
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Posted: 5/12/2024 1:02:32 PM EDT
[#45]
I think a high quality LPVO is all your typical average Joe Blow shooter should ever need on an AR type rifle.
For urban warfare or long range bench shooting maybe something different. For a truck gun Iron sights are a great option. |
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Posted: 5/12/2024 1:11:00 PM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By StevenH: Depends on the mission. What’s the longest distance in your house? What’s your zero? What’s your height over bore? How do the combo of your zero distance and height over bore impact your hold overs at the distances found in your home. 25 yards inside my house. My zero is 50 yards. Hold high center chest and I’m money. Doesn’t matter that much. |
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Posted: 5/12/2024 1:11:38 PM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By jdessell: I use optics. That being said, about 20 years ago my then girlfriend's father was a Gunnery Sgt. in the Marines. He once made the comment that "Scopes are for pussies." when I told him I wanted to mount an optic on my 20" A3. Did he get out when they figured out he was retarded? |
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TN, USA
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Posted: 5/12/2024 1:12:54 PM EDT
[#48]
I prefer irons on pistols, but on rifles, there isn't a reasonable argument that an optic isn't better. A rifle is a precision tool, and optics are more precise. Up close, they are not any faster as lots of guys use offset irons just as quickly as a RDS. But beyond 50 yards, optic all the way.
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Posted: 5/12/2024 1:14:37 PM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By thedownzero: Iron sights aren’t necessarily a handicap depending on what/how you’re shooting. 14.5” w/ irons is EASILY capable of 500yds. Flip the larger aperture and it’s very capable indoors as well. Works for the Marine Corps… The Marine Corps teaches irons almost as an afterthought these days and proficiency has improved. Can you make hits at 500 with irons? Sure. Hell, they shoot Palma at 1k with irons. Who cares? It’s faster and more accurate with optics under a wider variety of conditions so I’ll just go ahead and do that. |
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Posted: 5/12/2024 1:19:49 PM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By GrayMan66: Irons only. There'll be plenty of RDS and optics lying on the ground if the time comes... Oh Jesus Christ…. |
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