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USA
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Posted: 5/10/2024 5:04:30 PM EDT
I have a very young engineer that has interned for us for the last 18 months or so. Planning on hiring him when he graduates.
The guy is smart, works pretty hard and is a self starter. Today, he got an email from the "owner" of our company (his name, not his email address) and took it upon himself to do what the scam email wanted...used his own debit card and sent $1750 worth of gift card codes to Russia or wherever. Guy was about to lose it. He thought he'd be fired and that he'd compromised us. As far as I can tell, everything is fine on our end. He used his company email to converse with the scammer and his own debit card (he doesn't have access to a company credit card). He talked to his bank and the gift card issuer...they are following up, but I am pretty sure that money is gone. So what do I do with him? It was seriously a boneheaded move, but really I can see he was just trying to do what he was told. Do we reimburse him? Only half so he has a reminder to think things through a little more? $1750 is a LOT of money to a kid just coming up on college graduation. |
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CO, USA
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Posted: 5/10/2024 5:06:13 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 10mmManiac]
[#1]
The employee. He can sort it out himself with his card company. In the mean time, it sounds like the company is short on proper security awareness training. The company may want to ensure no internal accounts have been compromised.
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Posted: 5/10/2024 5:06:31 PM EDT
[#2]
A little green behind the ears, but it's on him and not the company. Pretty sure y'all have some kind of IT policy that covers that, right?!
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Posted: 5/10/2024 5:07:35 PM EDT
[#3]
it's 100% on the employee.
this is why companies have compliance training for security awareness. |
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Posted: 5/10/2024 5:09:13 PM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By The_Beer_Slayer: it's 100% on the employee. this is why companies have compliance training for security awareness. With unscheduled tests throughout the year. |
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Posted: 5/10/2024 5:09:39 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Averagebear]
[#5]
Your company has very thorough training. He will never forget that lesson.
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Posted: 5/10/2024 5:09:41 PM EDT
[#6]
Kid is a dumbass
Sorry, it's the truth. |
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MT, USA
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Posted: 5/10/2024 5:11:01 PM EDT
[#7]
Sounds like he’s in on it
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KY, USA
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Posted: 5/10/2024 5:11:38 PM EDT
[#8]
Why would the employer be responsible for a scammer that spoofed a name in an email?
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TN, USA
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Posted: 5/10/2024 5:13:09 PM EDT
[#9]
Fucking gift cards lmao.
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CO, USA
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Posted: 5/10/2024 5:13:27 PM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By jonnyjeeps: Sounds like he’s in on it LOL wut? Yes, im sure he was in on the whole scam to be phished, made to be looked like a dumbass, all along while compromising his own credit. 
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USA
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Posted: 5/10/2024 5:13:47 PM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Abakan: Kid is a dumbass Sorry, it's the truth. Yes. But all of us are at 22. I’m really on the fence on this. Kid pulls his weight and then some. I think if we reimbursed him it would really help on loyalty front, and I doubt he’d forget the lesson. Background: small engineering firm with about 15 engineers. |
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USA
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Posted: 5/10/2024 5:14:55 PM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By jonnyjeeps: Sounds like he’s in on it Maybe dumber than the kid who made the mistake. |
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Posted: 5/10/2024 5:15:08 PM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By jonnyjeeps: Sounds like he's in on it |
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CO, USA
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Posted: 5/10/2024 5:15:27 PM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By mattellis2: Yes. But all of us are at 22. I’m really on the fence on this. Kid pulls his weight and then some. I think if we reimbursed him it would really help on loyalty front, and I doubt he’d forget the lesson. Background: small engineering firm with about 15 engineers. Why would the company reimburse him for a mistake he made on his own? He can work this out with his card company. Then force him to undergo regular cyber security awareness training if he wants the job. He has already proven he is a risk. |
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Posted: 5/10/2024 5:16:25 PM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By mattellis2: Yes. But all of us are at 22. I'm really on the fence on this. Kid pulls his weight and then some. I think if we reimbursed him it would really help on loyalty front, and I doubt he'd forget the lesson. Background: small engineering firm with about 15 engineers. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By mattellis2: Originally Posted By Abakan: Kid is a dumbass Sorry, it's the truth. Yes. But all of us are at 22. I'm really on the fence on this. Kid pulls his weight and then some. I think if we reimbursed him it would really help on loyalty front, and I doubt he'd forget the lesson. Background: small engineering firm with about 15 engineers. |
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NC, USA
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Posted: 5/10/2024 5:16:34 PM EDT
[#16]
not a Boomer thread. GD must be confused as hell on this one. 
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Posted: 5/10/2024 5:17:11 PM EDT
[Last Edit: colklink]
[#17]
Someone stole my paycheck months ago by pretending to be me and emailing our HR lady to change my direct deposit
The owner cut me a paper check and tore her a new asshole over it. Just found out about a week ago they were not able to recover the money from the gold dot account it went to. I felt horrible for her. The point being, you don't have to be a young, green kid to get scammed. Sharon is like late 50s and has been with the company like 30 years. |
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Posted: 5/10/2024 5:17:13 PM EDT
[#18]
Another prime example of being book smart but still not having any common sense. Tell him it was a cheap lesson. Had it been company property, he would have been canned.
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USA
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Posted: 5/10/2024 5:17:58 PM EDT
[Last Edit: mattellis2]
[#19]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By thesquidliest: I'd reimburse him. Goodness knows how my engineering firms have troubles getting and keeping PEs. That’s what I’m waffling over. He’s four years from his PE, but shows the inclination. If it were some of the other interns we’ve had they’d be SOL. |
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MO, USA
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Posted: 5/10/2024 5:18:00 PM EDT
[#20]
Our head buyer did that at a company I worked for. Kept sending iTunes gift cards to the "owner". She did it twice though.
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CO, USA
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Posted: 5/10/2024 5:18:03 PM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By thesquidliest: I'd reimburse him. Goodness knows how my engineering firms have troubles getting and keeping PEs. There is nothing for the company to reimburse. The kid needs to learn to not be a fool and take responsibility for the incident. His card company can deal with it. Chances are it's not the first time he's fallen for something like this. |
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Posted: 5/10/2024 5:18:03 PM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By mattellis2: Yes. But all of us are at 22. I'm really on the fence on this. Kid pulls his weight and then some. I think if we reimbursed him it would really help on loyalty front, and I doubt he'd forget the lesson. Background: small engineering firm with about 15 engineers. |
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USA
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Posted: 5/10/2024 5:18:27 PM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By mattellis2: Yes. But all of us are at 22. I’m really on the fence on this. Kid pulls his weight and then some. I think if we reimbursed him it would really help on loyalty front, and I doubt he’d forget the lesson. Background: small engineering firm with about 15 engineers. Why? I mean sure, whatever, if you want to be super nice, but he did something dumb and it will sting, but he will get over it. It's not like you're taking up collection for someone whose daughter broke her leg or something. |
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Posted: 5/10/2024 5:18:45 PM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 10mmManiac: The employee. He can sort it out himself with his card company. In the mean time, it sounds like the company is short on proper security awareness training. The company may want to ensure no internal accounts have been compromised. Does the company require IT training? If you do, 100% on him. If not, you should, so he doesn't do something even stupider. |
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NC, USA
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Posted: 5/10/2024 5:19:29 PM EDT
[#25]
Kid just graduated from the School of Hard Knocks. His tuition cost him $1,750. He earned his diploma.
He'll be your best employee when it comes to IT security and scams. You don't owe him a dime. (<- If you pay him, how many other employees did something that cost them money and they just sucked it up without mentioning it? Bad precedent if you try to recompense him.) |
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Posted: 5/10/2024 5:19:58 PM EDT
[#26]
He is responsible, 100%.
Even if your company doesn't have security awareness training (it should) he's still responsible. Why is the company responsible in any way because the scammer emailed a company address? It may seem nice to reimburse him, but IMO it also sets a dangerous precent. Are you going to reimburse every moron that gets scammed? |
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USA
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Posted: 5/10/2024 5:21:33 PM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By c3k: Kid just graduated from the School of Hard Knocks. His tuition cost him $1,750. He earned his diploma. He'll be your best employee when it comes to IT security and scams. You don't owe him a dime. (<- If you pay him, how many other employees did something that cost them money and they just sucked it up without mentioning it? Bad precedent if you try to recompense him.) Also an excellent point. |
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USA
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Posted: 5/10/2024 5:22:44 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By jonnyjeeps: Sounds like he’s in on it “Maybe he was doing it to steal our wire cutters. ever think of that?” -Animal in Stalag 17. |
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Posted: 5/10/2024 5:23:17 PM EDT
[#29]
Do we reimburse him?  |
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Posted: 5/10/2024 5:24:12 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 10mmManiac: The employee. He can sort it out himself with his card company. In the mean time, it sounds like the company is short on proper security awareness training. The company may want to ensure no internal accounts have been compromised. Card company is going to tell him to get fucked |
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Posted: 5/10/2024 5:24:17 PM EDT
[Last Edit: thesquidliest]
[#31]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 10mmManiac: There is nothing for the company to reimburse. The kid needs to learn to not be a fool and take responsibility for the incident. His card company can deal with it. Chances are it's not the first time he's fallen for something like this. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 10mmManiac: Originally Posted By thesquidliest: I'd reimburse him. Goodness knows how my engineering firms have troubles getting and keeping PEs. There is nothing for the company to reimburse. The kid needs to learn to not be a fool and take responsibility for the incident. His card company can deal with it. Chances are it's not the first time he's fallen for something like this. Compensation is unique to every individual. Should you choose to reimburse him given his PE potential, that's between you and him. I've done stuff like that before and won't hesitate to do it again (under the right circumstances) if the company will benefit in the long run. Not everything is about money since someone else will always pay more than you. It's what else you have to offer that gets folks to stay. |
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MO, USA
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Posted: 5/10/2024 5:25:09 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By glenn_r: Does the company require IT training? If you do, 100% on him. If not, you should, so he doesn't do something even stupider. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By glenn_r: Originally Posted By 10mmManiac: The employee. He can sort it out himself with his card company. In the mean time, it sounds like the company is short on proper security awareness training. The company may want to ensure no internal accounts have been compromised. Does the company require IT training? If you do, 100% on him. If not, you should, so he doesn't do something even stupider.  Attached File |
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Posted: 5/10/2024 5:26:47 PM EDT
[Last Edit: NH556]
[#33]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By c3k: Kid just graduated from the School of Hard Knocks. His tuition cost him $1,750. He earned his diploma. He'll be your best employee when it comes to IT security and scams. You don't owe him a dime. (<- If you pay him, how many other employees did something that cost them money and they just sucked it up without mentioning it? Bad precedent if you try to recompense him.) [ x ] Doubt Most of us go through life without sending $1,750 in gift cards to Nigerian Princes that frequent our email That said, hopefully he learns something from it |
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Posted: 5/10/2024 5:27:46 PM EDT
[#34]
By “very young” could you still mean he’s a boomer? I have a hard time believing that someone with an education they finished after 1990 would fall for that.
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TX, USA
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Posted: 5/10/2024 5:28:10 PM EDT
[#35]
I think he showed you he has book smarts and zero actual intellect.
Hopefully if you hire him he's not responsible for anything proprietary or important information. Obviously he was willing to do whatever for the owner, and retarded enough to do it This is shit my grandfather would fall for. The same guy who needs me to change the ink on his printer, or restart his PC. |
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Posted: 5/10/2024 5:29:00 PM EDT
[#36]
Fired for being fucking retarded
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Posted: 5/10/2024 5:29:06 PM EDT
[#37]
Originally Posted By mattellis2: I have a very young engineer that has interned for us for the last 18 months or so. Planning on hiring him when he graduates. The guy is smart, works pretty hard and is a self starter. Today, he got an email from the "owner" of our company (his name, not his email address) and took it upon himself to do what the scam email wanted...used his own debit card and sent $1750 worth of gift card codes to Russia or wherever. Guy was about to lose it. He thought he'd be fired and that he'd compromised us. As far as I can tell, everything is fine on our end. He used his company email to converse with the scammer and his own debit card (he doesn't have access to a company credit card). He talked to his bank and the gift card issuer...they are following up, but I am pretty sure that money is gone. So what do I do with him? It was seriously a boneheaded move, but really I can see he was just trying to do what he was told. Do we reimburse him? Only half so he has a reminder to think things through a little more? $1750 is a LOT of money to a kid just coming up on college graduation. I’ve read the thread. How exactly was the scam worded? |
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NC, USA
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Posted: 5/10/2024 5:29:13 PM EDT
[#38]
This kid is the reason I have to take redundant phishing training quarterly... thanks kid.
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UT, USA
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Posted: 5/10/2024 5:29:48 PM EDT
[#39]
Originally Posted By mattellis2: I have a very young engineer that has interned for us for the last 18 months or so. Planning on hiring him when he graduates. The guy is smart, works pretty hard and is a self starter. Today, he got an email from the "owner" of our company (his name, not his email address) and took it upon himself to do what the scam email wanted...used his own debit card and sent $1750 worth of gift card codes to Russia or wherever. Guy was about to lose it. He thought he'd be fired and that he'd compromised us. As far as I can tell, everything is fine on our end. He used his company email to converse with the scammer and his own debit card (he doesn't have access to a company credit card). He talked to his bank and the gift card issuer...they are following up, but I am pretty sure that money is gone. So what do I do with him? It was seriously a boneheaded move, but really I can see he was just trying to do what he was told. Do we reimburse him? Only half so he has a reminder to think things through a little more? $1750 is a LOT of money to a kid just coming up on college graduation. |
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Posted: 5/10/2024 5:30:11 PM EDT
[#40]
Delete that company email account
I would also delete his employment |
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USA
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Posted: 5/10/2024 5:31:34 PM EDT
[#41]
Who would think their boss wants them to send them gift card numbers?
Side note, our IT sent out a fake test email and one of the guys fell for it. They then sent him a fake email for IT security training with all of the indicators that it was fake and he fell for that one too. We gave him so much shit for it for weeks.
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Posted: 5/10/2024 5:34:06 PM EDT
[#42]
This is how stupid someone with an engineering degree is today?
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MO, USA
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Posted: 5/10/2024 5:36:14 PM EDT
[#43]
It's on him to work out with his card company. He should get the money back.
Also, I'd sit down with the intern and talk through it with him. Why would the owner of the company ask him to do these things? Did he ask his manager/supervisor if the request made sense and get their approval to move forward? The kid needs to learn to stop and think before acting. Also just in general using your personal card for anything for the company is a hard no. Not even once. If the boss/company needs something they need to be paying for it on a company card or account. |
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Posted: 5/10/2024 5:37:50 PM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By thesquidliest: I know that the company isn't required to do so. But $1700 will buy you loyalty which is damn near priceless nowadays, and he will likely tell his PE buddies what an awesome place to work it is. And maybe that small engineering firm won't be so small after awhile. Compensation is unique to every individual. Should you choose to reimburse him given his PE potential, that's between you and him. I've done stuff like that before and won't hesitate to do it again (under the right circumstances) if the company will benefit in the long run. Not everything is about money since someone else will always pay more than you. It's what else you have to offer that gets folks to stay. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By thesquidliest: Originally Posted By 10mmManiac: Originally Posted By thesquidliest: I'd reimburse him. Goodness knows how my engineering firms have troubles getting and keeping PEs. There is nothing for the company to reimburse. The kid needs to learn to not be a fool and take responsibility for the incident. His card company can deal with it. Chances are it's not the first time he's fallen for something like this. Compensation is unique to every individual. Should you choose to reimburse him given his PE potential, that's between you and him. I've done stuff like that before and won't hesitate to do it again (under the right circumstances) if the company will benefit in the long run. Not everything is about money since someone else will always pay more than you. It's what else you have to offer that gets folks to stay. IMO this presents a few problems. 1, as I said before it sets a bad precedent. Next, what will the other good long time employees think? If we had a new employee that fell for this and the boss decided to pay the employee I would honestly wonder what the fuck is wrong with management. Are this fiscally irresponsible with everything? What else are they spending money on? Why does dummy get $1700 for fucking up meanwhile everyone else is taking home their regular pay? Seems ridiculous to me. |
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Posted: 5/10/2024 5:39:18 PM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By jonnyjeeps: Sounds like he’s in on it
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Posted: 5/10/2024 5:41:20 PM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By The_Beer_Slayer: it's 100% on the employee. this is why companies have compliance training for security awareness. |
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Posted: 5/10/2024 5:46:53 PM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Whippet06: Who would think their boss wants them to send them gift card numbers? Side note, our IT sent out a fake test email and one of the guys fell for it. They then sent him a fake email for IT security training with all of the indicators that it was fake and he fell for that one too. We gave him so much shit for it for weeks. |
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Posted: 5/10/2024 5:46:57 PM EDT
[Last Edit: JBecker_72]
[#48]
The employee, without question. We get regular phishing tests from our IT guys trying to trip us up and if you do, you get smacked by management.
And yes, we all get KnowBe4 training. |
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Posted: 5/10/2024 5:47:33 PM EDT
[#49]
Who is responsible? The kid.
Would I reimburse him with a talk and an opportunity to teach, yes. *coming from a business owner. But that’s just me. That’s A LOT of money to him, and not to my business. |
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CO, USA
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Posted: 5/10/2024 5:49:24 PM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By JohnnyBuckshot: Who is responsible? The kid. Would I reimburse him with a talk and an opportunity to teach, yes. *coming from a business owner. But that’s just me. That’s A LOT of money to him, and not to my business. You'd be giving him a bonus to fuck up if you reimburse him. He can get the money back if he works with his card company. |
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