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Posted: 5/12/2024 12:56:56 PM EDT
[Last Edit: CarmelBytheSea]
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USA
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Posted: 5/12/2024 1:14:09 PM EDT
[#1]
Private contractors I forsee in the future.
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Posted: 5/12/2024 1:14:27 PM EDT
[#2]
The DoD has to change a lot of things if it wants to get what it wants.
I know this won’t be popular, but the Flag Officer pay cap needs to go away. When you compare what generals/admirals get paid, and what they are expected to do… the delta is significant. You’re not going to get the best and the brightest to stick around and lead the force when a flag officer makes about as much as a the General Manager of a Buckies. |
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USA
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Posted: 5/12/2024 1:15:32 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Tao]
[#3]
For those that haven't seen it, take a gander at the dumpster fire that is r/army for an inside look at the recruiting/retention crisis.
https://www.reddit.com/r/army |
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Posted: 5/12/2024 1:15:49 PM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By NDHojo: Private contractors I forsee in the future. Or androids. |
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Posted: 5/12/2024 1:16:41 PM EDT
[#5]
the merican draft for WWIII is gonna be epic.
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Posted: 5/12/2024 1:17:16 PM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Tao: For those that haven't seen it, take a gander at the dumpster fire that is r/army for an inside look at the recruiting/retention crisis. https://www.reddit.com/r/army  |
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Posted: 5/12/2024 1:19:59 PM EDT
[#7]
Originally Posted By CarmelBytheSea: https://www.businessinsider.com/us-armys-new-plan-russia-china-glaring-problem-crs-2024-5?amp https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/459941/IMG_4054_jpeg-3212491.JPG https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/459941/IMG_4048_jpeg-3212501.JPG https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/459941/IMG_4049_jpeg-3212502.JPG https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/459941/IMG_4050_jpeg-3212503.JPG https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/459941/IMG_4051_jpeg-3212504.JPG https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/459941/IMG_4052_jpeg-3212505.JPG https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/459941/IMG_4053_jpeg-3212506.JPG Racism in the Army is so prevalent even the paper detailing problems is white |
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Posted: 5/12/2024 1:23:31 PM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By sharkman6: The DoD has to change a lot of things if it wants to get what it wants. I know this won’t be popular, but the Flag Officer pay cap needs to go away. When you compare what generals/admirals get paid, and what they are expected to do… the delta is significant. You’re not going to get the best and the brightest to stick around and lead the force when a flag officer makes about as much as a the General Manager of a Buckies. I’ll be honest, the pay is a very low consideration at O-6 and above. Speaking from personal experience, it is typically PCS moves, family considerations, and time demands which weigh more heavily on the decision to continue serving. Do I think flag officers should be paid more for what they do? Absolutely. Will it affect retention of talented officers if we did? Probably not. |
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USA
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Posted: 5/12/2024 1:26:43 PM EDT
[#9]
Well, they will have to draft their useful idiots to get the job done. Oh, don't forget the trannies and feminists in the mixed infantry brigades. I'm sure the Chins and Russies will have much mercy on them.
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AK, USA
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Posted: 5/12/2024 1:31:32 PM EDT
[#10]
Security Force Assistance is a fantastic way to describe conventional FID, which is fucking stupid and we have no business doing it. Introducing TRADOC and Western civics to the 3rd World should be considered a war crime.
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Posted: 5/12/2024 1:34:47 PM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By feetpiece: Security Force Assistance is a fantastic way to describe conventional FID, which is fucking stupid and we have no business doing it. Introducing TRADOC and Western civics to the 3rd World should be considered a war crime. The two are not the same task, they are explicitly different. |
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Posted: 5/12/2024 1:43:39 PM EDT
[#13]
When the Army wants to offer guarantees for certain jobs within the MOS, then they would be +1.
Other branches offer flight billets for enlisted perso. Army..you have to be "invited" after they have you, with not having any idea what squadron you're going to, what the # of flight billets are there, who is waiting, for how long and if someone more popular than you for all sorts of reason shows up and gets you bumped. |
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Posted: 5/12/2024 1:49:50 PM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Lawmonkey: Nobody wants to fight for a corrupt shit bag I just can’t see many people being willing to sign up to be the tip of the spear for imposing high tech feudalism on the world. This also applies to police forces who are having similar issues. I wonder if the various 3 letter agencies are having issues as well? Or are they paying more or offering perks like all the underage sex slaves you can handle in some billionaires dungeon? |
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Posted: 5/12/2024 1:54:04 PM EDT
[#15]
Isn’t the military all gays and transformers? Dudes wearing dog masks and shit now? The rest are lesbians thinking they are Demi Moore in that movie where she tells the guy to suck her dick?
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Posted: 5/12/2024 1:59:08 PM EDT
[#16]
Fuck off.
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Posted: 5/12/2024 1:59:19 PM EDT
[#17]
They fucked themselves when they mandated the clot shot, and when they went woke. It will be a long time before they recover from those two epic fuck ups.
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Posted: 5/12/2024 2:05:42 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By GutWrench: Isn't the military all gays and transformers? Dudes wearing dog masks and shit now? The rest are lesbians thinking they are Demi Moore in that movie where she tells the guy to suck her dick? fuck 'em. 
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AK, USA
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Posted: 5/12/2024 2:07:53 PM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By daemon734: The two are not the same task, they are explicitly different. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By daemon734: Originally Posted By feetpiece: Security Force Assistance is a fantastic way to describe conventional FID, which is fucking stupid and we have no business doing it. Introducing TRADOC and Western civics to the 3rd World should be considered a war crime. The two are not the same task, they are explicitly different. Making KFOR a career field to give everyone who survived Obama's purge a job is akin to giving welfare to illegals after SOUTHCOM rebuilds their roads, schools and hospitals. |
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Posted: 5/12/2024 2:10:02 PM EDT
[#20]
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Posted: 5/12/2024 2:11:09 PM EDT
[#21]
What if they threw a war and nobody showed up?
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Posted: 5/12/2024 2:23:18 PM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Hesperus: I wonder if the various 3 letter agencies are having issues as well? Or are they paying more or offering perks like all the underage sex slaves you can handle in some billionaires dungeon? If you join the FBI, you have the possibility to date and film 80 chicks. |
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Posted: 5/12/2024 2:23:54 PM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By foxxnhound: What if they threw a war and nobody showed up? We wouldn't get to see Ann Margaret. |
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Posted: 5/12/2024 2:51:27 PM EDT
[Last Edit: sharkman6]
[#24]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By sanausnol: I’ll be honest, the pay is a very low consideration at O-6 and above. Speaking from personal experience, it is typically PCS moves, family considerations, and time demands which weigh more heavily on the decision to continue serving. Do I think flag officers should be paid more for what they do? Absolutely. Will it affect retention of talented officers if we did? Probably not. I get what you are saying, but I think it is a sum-total thing. Work-Life balance vs. compensation. For example, you can retire as an 0-6 over 30, get your retirement and probably some VA disability, and settle where you want to live and work zero hours, OR, you stay in at a minimum of 3 more years, work 80 plus hours a week (minimum), spend nights and weekends on the phone, Be on the road all the time, PCS, take your 30 days of leave/vacation in 2-3 day increments because you are so busy, have a lot more responsibility, and make a little more than a retired 0-6. And that’s to be a one-Star, which I think at that level is similar to being a 2nd LT/Ensign in some regards. I guess I’m saying the compensation package does offer much. For a good leader who is on the fence, it doesn’t offer any incentive to keep fighting. |
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Posted: 5/12/2024 2:54:05 PM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Hesperus: I just can’t see many people being willing to sign up to be the tip of the spear for imposing high tech feudalism on the world. This also applies to police forces who are having similar issues. I wonder if the various 3 letter agencies are having issues as well? Or are they paying more or offering perks like all the underage sex slaves you can handle in some billionaires dungeon? I’ve been told all Federal Agencies are having trouble hiring and retaining. I expect things won’t change after the election. But I’m pessimistic by nature. |
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Posted: 5/12/2024 2:58:14 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By JLPettimoreIII: does this mean Lujan's not coming? https://i.makeagif.com/media/1-13-2024/IL-hhJ.gif Huh. She pretty average looking unless pic is from just the right angle. Psyop indeed. |
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Posted: 5/12/2024 3:00:59 PM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By sharkman6: The DoD has to change a lot of things if it wants to get what it wants. I know this won’t be popular, but the Flag Officer pay cap needs to go away. When you compare what generals/admirals get paid, and what they are expected to do… the delta is significant. You’re not going to get the best and the brightest to stick around and lead the force when a flag officer makes about as much as a the General Manager of a Buckies. Lol. Lol Yes. That's what's wrong with the US Army. Generals aren't being paid enough. 
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Posted: 5/12/2024 3:03:49 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By colklink: Lol. Lol Yes. That's what's wrong with the US Army. Generals aren't being paid enough. Like I said, I knew it wouldn’t be popular. |
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Posted: 5/12/2024 3:04:47 PM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By PacNW5: If you join the FBI, you have the possibility to date and film 80 chicks. That dude did that as a hobby. It’s like saying that National Guard supply clerks are expert shooters because you know one who is a 3-gun champion. That FBI dude would be banging skanks and making surreptitious videos in any career he chose. It’s what he loves, it’s his art. |
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OH, USA
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Posted: 5/12/2024 3:16:14 PM EDT
[#30]
I thought ads about having two moms and changing the names of Confederate bases was the ticket to success
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Posted: 5/12/2024 3:37:22 PM EDT
[#31]
Didn't they lower the fitness standards not that long ago for basic training because so many new recruits are in bad shape?
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Posted: 5/12/2024 3:50:58 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By sharkman6: The DoD has to change a lot of things if it wants to get what it wants. I know this won't be popular, but the Flag Officer pay cap needs to go away. When you compare what generals/admirals get paid, and what they are expected to do the delta is significant. You're not going to get the best and the brightest to stick around and lead the force when a flag officer makes about as much as a the General Manager of a Buckies. |
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Posted: 5/12/2024 4:02:16 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Cypher15: There are more generals/flag officers per capita thann in WW2. Fire a bunch of them. The problem is that no individual branch within the Army can get anything done for themselves without GOs, so each one is always trying to increase their number of flag officers. |
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Posted: 5/12/2024 4:11:38 PM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By daemon734: The problem is that no individual branch within the Army can get anything done for themselves without GOs, so each one is always trying to increase their number of flag officers. If the thing they want to “get done” is increase the number of generals, and they want more generals so that they have the organizational influence to create even more generals in their particular power center, you may have just revealed the secret hamster wheel that powers the Army. |
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Posted: 5/12/2024 4:14:45 PM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By NDHojo: Private contractors I forsee in the future. This. My unit was fielded new equipment. EVERYTHING is under warranty and supported by contractors. No green suitor can fix anything. I ask what happens when we have to defend tiwan or exterminate the houthines. Broken equipment? Find the local fedex office to ship it back to the oem. All of the contractors give me the shrugged shoulders look. So fucking pathetic. 
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Posted: 5/12/2024 4:15:39 PM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By FightingHellfish: If the thing they want to “get done” is increase the number of generals, and they want more generals so that they have the organizational influence to create even more generals in their particular power center, you may have just revealed the secret hamster wheel that powers the Army. That's the vicious cycle, but no individual branch will ever accomplish anything without GOs. Which leads to a desire for more GOs. |
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Posted: 5/12/2024 4:17:44 PM EDT
[#37]
They need to expand on the use of civilian DoD employees for military functions.
They also need to reconsider which sorts of medical conditions really mean someone isn't fit for service. The military's logistics system can sustain keeping people sustained with prescription medications easier than it can handle people who are physically out of shape. I remember going in and physically fit people were getting disqual'ed at MEPS for tattoos and medication history. The guy who had a heart murmur during childhood but can do 20 pull-ups is more fit for service than the guy with no formal medical history but can only do 5 pull-ups. |
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Posted: 5/12/2024 4:22:00 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Pogo55]
[#38]
nvm
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Posted: 5/12/2024 4:22:47 PM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By daemon734: That's the vicious cycle, but no individual branch will ever accomplish anything without GOs. Which leads to a desire for more GOs. I suspect that aspiring colonels wanting to brigadier generals, and brigadier generals thinking that more brigadier slots necessitates more major generals, and all of these folks possessing a selfless desire for further service plays a part here. |
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Posted: 5/12/2024 4:24:37 PM EDT
[#40]
We just had a thread on recalling retirees. They'll resort to that as long as they can, along with stop/ loss and IRR recalls.
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AZ, USA
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Posted: 5/12/2024 4:28:12 PM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By daemon734: The problem is that no individual branch within the Army can get anything done for themselves without GOs, so each one is always trying to increase their number of flag officers. Maybe the real problem is the branch system. Although it's improved since the last serious reform the Army took, under Elihu Root. That would be 125 years ago for those that are keeping count. |
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Posted: 5/12/2024 4:30:13 PM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By HIMARS13A: Maybe the real problem is the branch system. Although it's improved since the last serious reform the Army took, under Elihu Root. That would be 125 years ago for those that are keeping count. The bureaucracy in the various departments and branches is an unwieldy monster |
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Posted: 5/12/2024 4:37:04 PM EDT
[#43]
 US Army - Emma, The Calling #GOARMY (2021) |
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AZ, USA
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Posted: 5/12/2024 4:37:28 PM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By R0N: The bureaucracy in the various departments and branches is an unwieldy monster I suspect that the Army makes it more complicated than it has to be. But that's just based on limited interactions with branch. |
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Posted: 5/12/2024 4:38:21 PM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By sanausnol: I’ll be honest, the pay is a very low consideration at O-6 and above. Speaking from personal experience, it is typically PCS moves, family considerations, and time demands which weigh more heavily on the decision to continue serving. Do I think flag officers should be paid more for what they do? Absolutely. Will it affect retention of talented officers if we did? Probably not. We aren’t loosing needed flag officers because of pay. We have more than we need as it is. Now maybe some 04-06’s are getting out who are have critical skills and are still young enough to continue to serve at 100% are getting out and going on to better paying jobs outside of the service. Same thing probably goes for some senior NCO’s below E-9 |
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CO, USA
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Posted: 5/12/2024 4:39:41 PM EDT
[#46]
I wonder if they have thought about adding more diversity?
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Posted: 5/12/2024 4:42:34 PM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By sharkman6: I get what you are saying, but I think it is a sum-total thing. Work-Life balance vs. compensation. For example, you can retire as an 0-6 over 30, get your retirement and probably some VA disability, and settle where you want to live and work zero hours, OR, you stay in at a minimum of 3 more years, work 80 plus hours a week (minimum), spend nights and weekends on the phone, Be on the road all the time, PCS, take your 30 days of leave/vacation in 2-3 day increments because you are so busy, have a lot more responsibility, and make a little more than a retired 0-6. And that’s to be a one-Star, which I think at that level is similar to being a 2nd LT/Ensign in some regards. I guess I’m saying the compensation package does offer much. For a good leader who is on the fence, it doesn’t offer any incentive to keep fighting. Work schedule is certainly a bigger issue than pay. I actually had time off when I was an Enlisted man and a Company Grade. It’s tiring and you don’t have a good work life balance. I have no desire for what goes with having a star on your chest |
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UT, USA
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Posted: 5/12/2024 4:45:12 PM EDT
[Last Edit: HitsCount]
[#48]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By sharkman6: I get what you are saying, but I think it is a sum-total thing. Work-Life balance vs. compensation. For example, you can retire as an 0-6 over 30, get your retirement and probably some VA disability, and settle where you want to live and work zero hours, OR, you stay in at a minimum of 3 more years, work 80 plus hours a week (minimum), spend nights and weekends on the phone, Be on the road all the time, PCS, take your 30 days of leave/vacation in 2-3 day increments because you are so busy, have a lot more responsibility, and make a little more than a retired 0-6. And that’s to be a one-Star, which I think at that level is similar to being a 2nd LT/Ensign in some regards. I guess I’m saying the compensation package does offer much. For a good leader who is on the fence, it doesn’t offer any incentive to keep fighting. The difference between retiring at o5 with 20 and o6 with 24 is about $1M lump sum in the retirement plan. Which sounds like a lot until you realize that a lot of o5s can walk into a GS13+ step 5ish that requires way fewer hours, no moves and less stress and brings home $150k/year. O5 retirement pay plus that GS salary makes a $1M retirement kicker a little underwhelming. And that's before considering contractor pay options. The math is similar for o6 to o7. GS15 on top of retired o6 pay ain't bad. ETA -- while there is a floor for performance and certain jobs that have to be raced through for G/FO, a lot of it is who is most willing to put up with bullshit for the longest. It's more of an endurance contest than anything else. Which isn't necessarily going to give you the talent you need to make good decisions. |
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Posted: 5/12/2024 4:46:11 PM EDT
[#49]
#defundDOD
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AK, USA
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Posted: 5/12/2024 4:46:26 PM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By sharkman6: Like I said, I knew it wouldn’t be popular. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By sharkman6: Originally Posted By colklink: Lol. Lol Yes. That's what's wrong with the US Army. Generals aren't being paid enough. Like I said, I knew it wouldn’t be popular. Does pointing out Field Grade O's careers have nothing to do with Service let alone defending the Constitution count as trolling for stolin valour?  |
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