tl;dw There's about 4,000 machine guns imported before 1986 that were classified as dealer samples, but are actually eligible for transfer to individuals. They are from police departments and the NFATCA has been working for a few years to get these added to the list of legal personally owned machine guns.

Down with the Hughes amendment, all gun laws are infringements, but there's 4,000 more legal machine guns today than there were last month so I'll take it.

So, you just add a zero to the price now?

I still can't afford one. When can I buy a post 86?

This pisses me off
When dad died I had to sell 2 as samples. They probably would now qualify as transferable, especially the BAR

It will probably be a mixture of both; some of these guns are with dealers who got them from the original PD, and some are still with the original PD.

I personally am not a fan of any police department making money off of gun control but I get it.

An M16 is what 30k now?

I’d wager to guess the vast majority are in private hands of those able to own post samples. That would have been the impedance to fight the classification over the years.

Ian mentioned there were already a few HK’s at Morphy’s.

In theory, the additional volume should decrease prices to some degree, but I would also bet that the public distribution will be played out over an extended period as to not upset the market.

It's roughly a 4% dilution of the legal MG market (I think there's 100kish legal MGs on the registry) so I wouldn't expect a huge dip in prices.

edit: There's about 180k transferable MGs, so it's an even smaller dilution:

https://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/atf-reveals-the-number-of-registered-machine-guns/

I bought my first MG in 2008, it was a good investment.  I recently ended up with a HK21/23 that is pretty special, even if it is older tech.

Shop local to me has an M16 and a CAR-15, both are 35K

Seems like ATF is liking more guns out there now and silencers and SBR'S

At least it's an increase.
What was the total count on transferables lost when Vickers had his plea bargain? A few hundred?


Kharn

Depends on what they are.

If 87% are MP5’s, it should move the needle in that market.

It will all go back to the department and then they will cut their budget the same amount.

Seems like they're up against several suits and are trying to make it look like the NFA isn't the burden we know it to be. "See new guns can be added to registry". "See it only
takes a week or two for the approval". "It's definitely not an unreasonable burden"

100% this, someone somewhere realized the whole "register, then take possession 8 months later" scheme was going to lose in the courts. ATF doesn't want NFA items to be cash and carry where you buy it and send off your paperwork and if takes them months to add to the registry, that's on them.

The ATF never does a single thing for the benefit of the 2A or for gun owners. Every single thing they do is to either cover their ass, preserve their relevance as an agency, or to make gun ownership or gun proliferation more difficult.

It was my understanding that there were approx 250k transferable MG's.

Thanks.  Always kind of wanted an American 180 because it's the only one i could afford to feed but too many other things in life taking priority over limited funds.

But then start thinking well why not an artillery cannon after watching the big Sandy shoot on YouTube.  It's a slippery slope...

Registration.

A sheriff's department I knew of in Tenn has  40 pre May MP5's. I tried to work a deal with them to sell them to a dealer friend of mine. The sheriff was ready to sign off on the sale. At the last day he decided to have the department keep them and held in reserve.

I stood to make a decent finders fee on that deal + one of the MP5's transferred to me.

Interesting

Wow, I wouldn't have guessed the registry was that small.  There are more SBR's and Suppressors added to that list pretty much monthly.
If I had the chance to go FA, I think I'd want an M16 (which I'd reconfigure to something modern immediately), maybe a 10/22, and ... a Stribog actually (but those are too new) so an MP5 would be an acceptable substitute .  After that, you know, I'd love an AUG, neat trigger system.  

Speaking of quick transfers, my wife e-filed last Thursday for a Gemtech 9mm suppressor,
got the call yesterday that it was approved. 3 1/2 days.
Crazy fast.

I don't think all dealer samples are being added to transferable list, just some. So I don't know that you'd be able to know if those two guns would have been included ?

I thought it was 250k. Pretty sure there is well over 100k.

I'd love to have an MG, but I cant afford one either.............I just shoot my friends gun when he shoots

If he was smart he'd sell them and buy brand new MP5's for a fraction of the cost.

Did a little digging and I found this post, seems to be around 180k or so (as of 2016)

https://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/atf-reveals-the-number-of-registered-machine-guns/

Last I saw was a report from 2016 that said ~175,000 transferrable MGs. I seem to recall updated numbers at the last SHOT show, but have not found them. Whatever the case, a win is a win. Now let's keep the momentum going.

Open the registry faggots.

Where are these firearms?

Open the registry.

Nah subtract a zero.

Nfa’s days are numbered.

While it great to always have more transferable available, I honestly think its probably not really going any meaningful change to machinegun pricing or availability and in some cases may even turn out to be a nightmare for some buyers.

The upside is more transferables machineguns.   However the downside is most of these guns are going to be formerly unavailable "factory" machineguns that are probably going to be primarily HK, FN, Beretta, IMI and maybe a few others that were generally previously unavailable in "factory" machinegun form.  These are going to primarily be high end collector guns for folks where a sear, a conversion RR, isn't good enough and will pay anything for that rare factory example.  There are also going to be rare guns, like maybe some 93Rs that there just really are not any meaningful number of even conversion or domestic made examples.

As example three of these new pre-may now blessed transferables MP5's went in the Morphy's auction today.  If you thought a transferable MP5 registered receiver was expensive at $35 to $40K.....wait until you see the almost double prices paid today for factory examples.

https://auctions.morphyauctions.com/LotDetail.aspx?inventoryid=603072

https://auctions.morphyauctions.com/LotDetail.aspx?inventoryid=603069

https://auctions.morphyauctions.com/LotDetail.aspx?inventoryid=603071

Oh you always wanted a HK VP70 but could never get one until now because there were no transferable versions...hope you have $290K laying around.

https://www.gunbroker.com/item/1049670761

There is also always going to be confusion over what formerly pre-may guns are now transferable.  According to the reports its only guns that came in direct to a PD and were not imported under the "sales sample" provision.   Knowing how not great the NFA records and NFRTR is there are probably going to be some pretty disappointed folks who fork over six digits for some rare gun only to have the transfer denied once further researched by the ATF.

You can even see in the addendum of the Morphys auction has refund clause just for this potential outcome.  Granted I am not sure 120 days is enough to find out you struck out on the transfer for your new $80K MP5.

"ADDENDUM: Morphy Auctions warrantees that this machine gun, formerly classified as a “Pre-86 Dealer Sample”, has had its restrictions removed by the BATF, and it will now transfer as fully transferable to individuals. This guarantee will be valid for 120 days after auction close. This gives the winning bidder of record ample time to pay for the item, have it E-file transferred by Morphy’s to their active FFL/SOT dealer of choice, and then initiate a Form 4 transfer to a private citizen (non-FFL/SOT holder). Should the BATF provide written (or email) notification that this transfer application is denied due to the gun being restricted as, “Limited to use as a Sales Sample”, then Morphy’s will refund the price paid, in full, upon receiving the lot back in the same condition as shipped out from our facility."

So for your average gun owner, your average machinegun owner, or even a more advanced machinegun collector most of these guns are going to be way out of reach to basically not even really exist.  IMHO, its like somebody finding another 10 Van Gogh paintings in a warehouse or another handful of Ferrari 250 GT California's in a barn in relative volume terms.

In response to the second part of the video... My trust is a "single person" trust, and I'm going on 45 days.

over 3 decades to add just those, yeah not unreasonable at all.

What would the NFATCA say about the Hughes Amendment being repealed?

A lotta departments turned a lotta historical guns owned by the dept into scrap over the years.

They're trying to appear innocent in lawsuits.

I’d like to see a list of what was added. 4000 is a lot of guns.

Interesting.. How so?

That was the plan. New MP5's and FN M4's.

I doubt it. There is no way any legislative body is going to pass a bill to be signed into law overturning the National Firearms Act.
Wish it would happen. But it's a pipe dream.

Years back there was an auction of a old dudes collection after he died.

Got a SGW M16 registered receiver with a weird franken upper set up as a SAW with a bipod.  Had to use a hammer to get it off.  Sent the lower to M60Joe to get it blue printed before he retired.  Its a beautiful now and set up as a MK18.

Paid $13,000 total after fees and tax.

My father in law sold his transferable DIAS last year to a guy for 55k

A guy at the range bought an M-16 years ago for $6000. He's happy with the return on his investment.