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Posted: 1/7/2014 9:13:39 AM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
O.k., then why are you suggesting that I do so? I could sit next to Marcus for hours, and I wouldn't bother asking him anything about what happened. That would be beyond rude. You seem to be dying to take affront, on Marcus' behalf, for what I and others have posted in this thread. Why? Do you believe this is some sort of personal attack on Marcus? If so, how is discussing the differences between two books, with wildly differing accounts of what happened, an attack? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:I wouldn't ask him shit it's not my place to question his account of the events nor is it yours. I wasn't there and neither were you or Ed Darack. I'd buy him a beer O.k., then why are you suggesting that I do so? I could sit next to Marcus for hours, and I wouldn't bother asking him anything about what happened. That would be beyond rude. You seem to be dying to take affront, on Marcus' behalf, for what I and others have posted in this thread. Why? Do you believe this is some sort of personal attack on Marcus? If so, how is discussing the differences between two books, with wildly differing accounts of what happened, an attack? I know all I need to know about what happen from Marcus' account of it. So no I wouldn't ask him about it. It would be "beyond rude" to question his account as some one who wasn't there. Because you and others in this thread weren't there during the ambush. Calling a man a liar is a personal attack where I come from which you have done repeatedly so yes, you are personally attacking him. You have such a hard on for proving him a liar then be a fucking man and go confront him about it. You posted Ed Darak's link and we all get it that it was a Marine operation and that the exact number of enemy fighters is unknown. |
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Posted: 1/7/2014 9:14:13 AM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I think Marcus has lied, repeatedly, to stay with the story as written. But, I also think he is in a really tough position, and forced to do so. A really, really tough position between respecting his fallen brothers, pressure from the Navy, wanting to keep the story as positive as possible, his own tough times in dealing with what happened, of being the lone survivor of a really fucked-up situation, and whatever other personal reasons he has for doing so. But, to be fair, I haven't watched all of his interviews, I'm just going by what others have said about those interviews. Keep in mind, Ed Darak is a journalist, not a Marine. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted:Mr. Luttrell doesn't strike me as a liar. This guy is indirectly calling Marcus a Liar here. This guy also comes off as a Marine who is butt hurt that they didn't get a bigger part in the lone Survivor story, and is now actively trying to generate buzz around his story. People tend to make inflammatory statements in order to generate buzz for something they are trying to sell. I think Marcus has lied, repeatedly, to stay with the story as written. But, I also think he is in a really tough position, and forced to do so. A really, really tough position between respecting his fallen brothers, pressure from the Navy, wanting to keep the story as positive as possible, his own tough times in dealing with what happened, of being the lone survivor of a really fucked-up situation, and whatever other personal reasons he has for doing so. But, to be fair, I haven't watched all of his interviews, I'm just going by what others have said about those interviews. Keep in mind, Ed Darak is a journalist, not a Marine. If you really were interested in truth then you would seek out first hand knowledge. This is evident by the way you lose control of your emotions when criticised. |
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Posted: 1/7/2014 9:14:37 AM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
That depends. Check out the appendix of supporting information in "Victory Point", that is the part that gives credence to Darak's book for me. It's one thing to trust a person's written word, it's another to trust well documented, well fact-checked written words. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:A journalist is about a trustworthy as a politician in my experience. That depends. Check out the appendix of supporting information in "Victory Point", that is the part that gives credence to Darak's book for me. It's one thing to trust a person's written word, it's another to trust well documented, well fact-checked written words. According the the link posted a few pages back, Marcus' account is closer to reality than Daracks Also the passage I quoted and the passage in quoted in regards to discussing the goat herders fate (ever think the discussion took place before the "soft compromise" call) makes me think that Mr. Darack likes to make assumptions about event's he was not present for. I've read both Lone Survivor and Victory Point several times. I'll take the eyewitness account, even if it is slightly exaggerated.(the number of fighters, its quite possible it seemed like more than 100+ fighters were firing at them or more joined the fight after the original ambush). |
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Posted: 1/7/2014 9:15:02 AM EDT
[#4]
OP, I would like to see you call Marcus a liar to his face.
Hell, It could probably be arranged. 
never mind, you should just stay in your mommy's basement where you belong. |
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Posted: 1/7/2014 9:15:56 AM EDT
[#5]
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Let me ask the above posters; if you were on a plane, sitting next to Marcus for hours, what would you ask him? Keep in mind, I'm suggesting something as close to real life as possible, not some kindergarten fantasy. Marcus would no more kick my or anyone else's ass for asking if/why he's supporting a fictional account of what happened. He's an adult, he is able to handle life's little awkward moments. And I would bet money someone already has asked exactly that question, including some of his fallen team mate's families. Why would you assume that? Yeah, I wouldn't assume that. Buzz Aldrin sure loves decking people who call him a liar. Is he not an adult? Good enough for a spaceman, good enough for a SEAL.
You know, a bet a lot of the scenes in The Right Stuff were embellished. All those astronauts were dirty nasty liars not to spend every waking moment explaining to us that this was the case. |
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Posted: 1/7/2014 9:17:05 AM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted:Timeout. You are telling us to expand our knowledge on Operation Red Wings, saying Luttrell is full of crap and Darack is the expert on a mission he was not part of, nor did interview the survivor of, and you haven't even listened to Luttrell. How about you take your own advice?
I get that numbers were changed and things were sensationalized in Lone Survivor. But some of the issues Darack points our are petty and miss the point of the book. Red Wing vs Red Wings. END OF THE WORLD! Saying the book is a complete work of fiction is taking it the opposite extreme of calling it the gospel. The point is men fought and died. There were some pretty big screw ups. Lessons should be taken from the mission. People should see what we send our men into. O.k.....let me ask you; at what point would you start to doubt the veracity of "Lone Survivor"? How many points need to be proven false for you to doubt everything in "Lone Survivor" that can't be proven as fact? A page or so ago, I posted a list of 5 or 6 really important facts, very germane to what happened, that were complete fabrications/mistakes in "Lone Survivor". So, how many more would it take for your curiosity to be piqued, and for you to be interested in finding as much of the truth as possible? Look, you're trying to pain this as an if/then, black or white situation. Either "Lone Survivor" is the full and correct story, or it's not. I myself figure that about 20% of the book "Lone Survivor" is based on fact.....how much of it do you think is fact? I'm don't think Luttrell is full of crap, I think Robinson's book is 80% crap, and Marcus is forced to go along with it.....for a lot of reasons. |
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Posted: 1/7/2014 9:18:03 AM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
How old are you? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:A journalist is about a trustworthy as a politician in my experience. That depends. Check out the appendix of supporting information in "Victory Point", that is the part that gives credence to Darak's book for me. It's one thing to trust a person's written word, it's another to trust well documented, well fact-checked written words. How old are you? Old. Probably older than you. Why? |
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Posted: 1/7/2014 9:19:10 AM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted: O.k.....let me ask you; at what point would you start to doubt the veracity of "Lone Survivor"? How many points need to be proven false for you to doubt everything in "Lone Survivor" that can't be proven as fact? I thought this part of the movie seemed pretty fake:  Other than that, who gives a shit? |
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Posted: 1/7/2014 9:20:25 AM EDT
[#9]
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Will you say that there are some things his teammates families could ask of him that in no way in hell do you have the right to? Of course. Did you miss where I said I wouldn't ask him anything at all? |
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Posted: 1/7/2014 9:23:30 AM EDT
[#10]
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Of course. Did you miss where I said I wouldn't ask him anything at all? Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Will you say that there are some things his teammates families could ask of him that in no way in hell do you have the right to? Of course. Did you miss where I said I wouldn't ask him anything at all? smartest thing you have said yet. self preservation must be kickin in for ya. you are a bothersome little fella, why dont you just log out, and not log back in? |
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Posted: 1/7/2014 9:23:44 AM EDT
[#11]
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OP, I would like to see you call Marcus a liar to his face. Hell, It could probably be arranged.
never mind, you should just stay in your mommy's basement where you belong. Yes....that's it. You have figured me out. 
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Posted: 1/7/2014 9:24:35 AM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I posted "including" the families of those he served with. Did you miss that point, or are you just so hell-bent on attacking me you can't stop yourself? Christ dude, chill the fuck out. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:I would do like I do with most "famous" people I have met. For example, I asked Neal Armstrong what it was like to land on a carrier for the first time, Asked the Prime. Minister of Canada if it was weird handing out business cards (he gave me one during a meeting. I would probably ask him about his charity work, which is what I did when I met him.
As for comparing someone on an airplane sitting by Luttrell, to the family of those he served with you are a fucking idiot. I posted "including" the families of those he served with. Did you miss that point, or are you just so hell-bent on attacking me you can't stop yourself? Christ dude, chill the fuck out. Serious question - how old are you? |
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Posted: 1/7/2014 9:26:15 AM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Of course. Did you miss where I said I wouldn't ask him anything at all? You should go to Kunar and ask all those dudes. They will tell you the truth of it. Make sure to call them all "Chaylakays" They like that, it basically means "Sir". Have fun! |
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Posted: 1/7/2014 9:27:11 AM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted:smartest thing you have said yet.
self preservation must be kickin in for ya. you are a bothersome little fella, why dont you just log out, and not log back in? Ohhhh....am I bothering you? Sorry. We're you going to...like....actually add anything to the conversation? Or are you just here to stir up shit? |
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Posted: 1/7/2014 9:27:16 AM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Let me ask the above posters; if you were on a plane, sitting next to Marcus for hours, what would you ask him? Keep in mind, I'm suggesting something as close to real life as possible, not some kindergarten fantasy. Marcus would no more kick my or anyone else's ass for asking if/why he's supporting a fictional account of what happened. He's an adult, he is able to handle life's little awkward moments. And I would bet money someone already has asked exactly that question, including some of his fallen team mate's families. I'd ask him if he's comfortable and needs the arm rest up or down. Offer to swap seats if he needs to stretch. Your little crusade wouldn't come up in conversation, it's not relevant. |
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Posted: 1/7/2014 9:28:05 AM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Ohhhh....am I bothering you? Sorry. We're you going to...like....actually add anything to the conversation? Or are you just here to stir up shit? Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted:smartest thing you have said yet. self preservation must be kickin in for ya. you are a bothersome little fella, why dont you just log out, and not log back in? Ohhhh....am I bothering you? Sorry. We're you going to...like....actually add anything to the conversation? Or are you just here to stir up shit?  |
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Posted: 1/7/2014 9:28:12 AM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted: How old are you? Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted:A journalist is about a trustworthy as a politician in my experience. That depends. Check out the appendix of supporting information in "Victory Point", that is the part that gives credence to Darak's book for me. It's one thing to trust a person's written word, it's another to trust well documented, well fact-checked written words. How old are you? |
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Posted: 1/7/2014 9:28:24 AM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
There are tons of things that disprove what is in Robinson's book. -There wasn't 200 ACM attacking the SEALs, there was 8-10. -Shah wasn't an HVT, he was a low-level insurgent before the incident. -Luttrell was never tortured by Shah's ACM after seeking refuge in the village, as they were already back in Pakistan, or on their way there. -The was never a point where hundreds of ACM were streaming down a mountain side coming to attack the village, as Marcus was being evacuated, where Marcus called in air-strikes and decimated them. -The recon team was told by the Marines that their coms wouldn't work in that area. -Red Wings was not a NSW operation, it was a Marine operation. The SEALs were brought in at the last minute due to command conflicts between JSOC and the Marines. These are just some of the points that show that there is a much more detailed, complete, and factual account of what happened. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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I just finished "Victory Point" and while it tells the story of the larger operation that "Lone Survivor" was part of, I don't recall it getting into the details of what happened to Luttrell's team. Nobody could tell that story except Luttrell himself. How anybody could point to a book written by someone who never spoke to ML, and doesn't contain any details about what happened to his team, as somehow proving Luttrell's book is fiction is beyond me. I don't recall reading anything in VP that "disproved" anything in Luttrell's book. There are tons of things that disprove what is in Robinson's book. -There wasn't 200 ACM attacking the SEALs, there was 8-10. -Shah wasn't an HVT, he was a low-level insurgent before the incident. -Luttrell was never tortured by Shah's ACM after seeking refuge in the village, as they were already back in Pakistan, or on their way there. -The was never a point where hundreds of ACM were streaming down a mountain side coming to attack the village, as Marcus was being evacuated, where Marcus called in air-strikes and decimated them. -The recon team was told by the Marines that their coms wouldn't work in that area. -Red Wings was not a NSW operation, it was a Marine operation. The SEALs were brought in at the last minute due to command conflicts between JSOC and the Marines. These are just some of the points that show that there is a much more detailed, complete, and factual account of what happened. Holy, fuck, I had to wade through 3 damn pages to get to a fucking summary. That should have been your first fucking post OP! What the bloody fuck were you thinking dragging us through that bullshit of "read the links". |
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Posted: 1/7/2014 9:28:46 AM EDT
[#19]
Don't tell me Star Wars isn't real either??? You mean my Jedi training has been all for naught??
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Posted: 1/7/2014 9:29:00 AM EDT
[#20]
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I thought this part of the movie seemed pretty fake:  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GEnO_C5o9ts
Other than that, who gives a shit? Quote HistoryQuoted:
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O.k.....let me ask you; at what point would you start to doubt the veracity of "Lone Survivor"? How many points need to be proven false for you to doubt everything in "Lone Survivor" that can't be proven as fact? I thought this part of the movie seemed pretty fake: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GEnO_C5o9ts
Other than that, who gives a shit? Why does he have a cape? Was it general issue, or were they just trying to blend in with the locals? |
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Posted: 1/7/2014 9:29:23 AM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted:Serious question - how old are you? I'm 44. How old are you? Is there a reason you think that's important? Does one have to be a certain age to question things? Sorry if you thought I was a kid. |
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Posted: 1/7/2014 9:29:44 AM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I thought this part of the movie seemed pretty fake: Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: O.k.....let me ask you; at what point would you start to doubt the veracity of "Lone Survivor"? How many points need to be proven false for you to doubt everything in "Lone Survivor" that can't be proven as fact? I thought this part of the movie seemed pretty fake: Other than that, who gives a shit? There was entirely too much of that going on. But I'm not sure which was worse: the excessive downhill tumbling or the halting ending. |
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Posted: 1/7/2014 9:30:32 AM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted:I'd ask him if he's comfortable and needs the arm rest up or down. Offer to swap seats if he needs to stretch.
Your little crusade wouldn't come up in conversation, it's not relevant. Crusade? |
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Posted: 1/7/2014 9:30:57 AM EDT
[#24]
You mean Marky Mark didn't save the world?
Most good movies are mostly fiction. Haven't seen this one. |
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Posted: 1/7/2014 9:31:00 AM EDT
[#25]
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No way he's in sales with the hissy fit he threw yesterday. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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So, why do you care so much? The truth? I like reality and the truth, and figure other people do too. I hope you are not in sales for a living.  I have people skills damn it!!! I'm good with people!!
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Posted: 1/7/2014 9:32:10 AM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Holy, fuck, I had to wade through 3 damn pages to get to a fucking summary. That should have been your first fucking post OP! What the bloody fuck were you thinking dragging us through that bullshit of "read the links". Quote HistoryQuoted:
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I just finished "Victory Point" and while it tells the story of the larger operation that "Lone Survivor" was part of, I don't recall it getting into the details of what happened to Luttrell's team. Nobody could tell that story except Luttrell himself. How anybody could point to a book written by someone who never spoke to ML, and doesn't contain any details about what happened to his team, as somehow proving Luttrell's book is fiction is beyond me. I don't recall reading anything in VP that "disproved" anything in Luttrell's book. There are tons of things that disprove what is in Robinson's book. -There wasn't 200 ACM attacking the SEALs, there was 8-10. -Shah wasn't an HVT, he was a low-level insurgent before the incident. -Luttrell was never tortured by Shah's ACM after seeking refuge in the village, as they were already back in Pakistan, or on their way there. -The was never a point where hundreds of ACM were streaming down a mountain side coming to attack the village, as Marcus was being evacuated, where Marcus called in air-strikes and decimated them. -The recon team was told by the Marines that their coms wouldn't work in that area. -Red Wings was not a NSW operation, it was a Marine operation. The SEALs were brought in at the last minute due to command conflicts between JSOC and the Marines. These are just some of the points that show that there is a much more detailed, complete, and factual account of what happened. Holy, fuck, I had to wade through 3 damn pages to get to a fucking summary. That should have been your first fucking post OP! What the bloody fuck were you thinking dragging us through that bullshit of "read the links". Because he's wants you to buy the other book... |
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Posted: 1/7/2014 9:33:54 AM EDT
[#27]
due to coc I cant say what I want to,
so just another addition to the ignore pile. adios. op. im moving on. you are not worth it. |
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Posted: 1/7/2014 9:34:06 AM EDT
[#28]
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Posted: 1/7/2014 9:34:34 AM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
So what you're saying is it's a classified document, and you want somebody with a clearance to read it and share classified information with people not authorized to have access to that information? How about no. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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I stopped being interested in Victory Point when he posted this gem as fact. A note on the "vote": In Lone Survivor, and countless articles written about Red Wings, Lieutenant Michael Murphy supposedly put to vote whether to kill unarmed Afghan civilians who soft compromised his team. This ended up being a central pillar to the overall story, and hence, countless blog and online discussoin board posts (and print and online articles) on rules of engagement and morality in warfare. Murphy placing something like this up to vote almost certainly did not happen. I'm so certain that it did not happen that I'm going to just say that it did not happen. After reading this in Lone Survivor, I re-interviewed the Marines who had intimate knowledge of Luttrell's after action. All those I re-interviewed stated that nothing in the AAR said anything about a vote. Why do you doubt this part? I have heard that the AAR is not available to the public, but that certain folks in the Military with the proper clearance can read it. It would be great if someone could read it and share their thoughts on it. He does say that there is nothing in Luttrell's AAR about a vote. Maybe he means just that, that there was no vote. They might have still discussed killing them though. So what you're saying is it's a classified document, and you want somebody with a clearance to read it and share classified information with people not authorized to have access to that information? How about no. IIRC, the AAR was leaked and is available. Nobody with a clearance can view it as the document has not been properly declassified. |
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Posted: 1/7/2014 9:34:37 AM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Holy, fuck, I had to wade through 3 damn pages to get to a fucking summary. That should have been your first fucking post OP! What the bloody fuck were you thinking dragging us through that bullshit of "read the links". Quote HistoryQuoted:
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I just finished "Victory Point" and while it tells the story of the larger operation that "Lone Survivor" was part of, I don't recall it getting into the details of what happened to Luttrell's team. Nobody could tell that story except Luttrell himself. How anybody could point to a book written by someone who never spoke to ML, and doesn't contain any details about what happened to his team, as somehow proving Luttrell's book is fiction is beyond me. I don't recall reading anything in VP that "disproved" anything in Luttrell's book. There are tons of things that disprove what is in Robinson's book. -There wasn't 200 ACM attacking the SEALs, there was 8-10. -Shah wasn't an HVT, he was a low-level insurgent before the incident. -Luttrell was never tortured by Shah's ACM after seeking refuge in the village, as they were already back in Pakistan, or on their way there. -The was never a point where hundreds of ACM were streaming down a mountain side coming to attack the village, as Marcus was being evacuated, where Marcus called in air-strikes and decimated them. -The recon team was told by the Marines that their coms wouldn't work in that area. -Red Wings was not a NSW operation, it was a Marine operation. The SEALs were brought in at the last minute due to command conflicts between JSOC and the Marines. These are just some of the points that show that there is a much more detailed, complete, and factual account of what happened. Holy, fuck, I had to wade through 3 damn pages to get to a fucking summary. That should have been your first fucking post OP! What the bloody fuck were you thinking dragging us through that bullshit of "read the links". Sorry, I've been real busy defending myself from people that think that such factual inaccuracies isn't important. Or are stupid enough to think I'm trying to sell copies of a book. |
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Posted: 1/7/2014 9:35:04 AM EDT
[#31]
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You too are making it too emotional. Realizing that what most likely took place is significantly different than the book and movie accounts does not make him "a fucking lying piece of shit". It is entirely understandable to not want to speak ill of ones fallen teammates. Any objective discussion of what happened would likely be seen as grandstanding and slandering the dead. Likewise, the narrative that was put forth by the Navy in Murphy's MOH citation would be impeached. He is not going to do that. Not only is Luttrell in the unenviable position of having survivor's guilt but has the pressure to maintain a narrative that is largely not his own. Face it,nobody wants to hear the brass tacks of what happened: a patrol of SEALs was drawn into an ambush by a squad sized element of well prepared,well motivated and well equipped bad guys. There were most likely no ACM casualties during the action. That says absolutely nothing bad about the valor and sacrifice of the SEALs but unfortunately,mistruths tend to compound. Allowing the showing of a defeat of America's best,with footage of fallen Americans and their gear displayed all across the Muslim world without response would mean embarrassment for the US and a morale boost and recruiting tool for jihadists. Likewise, it would be demoralizing for Americans.When bad events happen,there is a desire to alter the story to reflect more positively: witness the official version of what happened to Jessica Lynch and Pat Tillman vs what is now known. I think Luttrell is unfortunately in somewhat of the same boat,in being made a hero in an overall tale that he didn't script and is more than just about him. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Tell ya what, OP. Why don't you go look Mr. Luttrell up, stare him in the eye and call him a fucking lying piece of shit? That should solve the issue, here. You too are making it too emotional. Realizing that what most likely took place is significantly different than the book and movie accounts does not make him "a fucking lying piece of shit". It is entirely understandable to not want to speak ill of ones fallen teammates. Any objective discussion of what happened would likely be seen as grandstanding and slandering the dead. Likewise, the narrative that was put forth by the Navy in Murphy's MOH citation would be impeached. He is not going to do that. Not only is Luttrell in the unenviable position of having survivor's guilt but has the pressure to maintain a narrative that is largely not his own. Face it,nobody wants to hear the brass tacks of what happened: a patrol of SEALs was drawn into an ambush by a squad sized element of well prepared,well motivated and well equipped bad guys. There were most likely no ACM casualties during the action. That says absolutely nothing bad about the valor and sacrifice of the SEALs but unfortunately,mistruths tend to compound. Allowing the showing of a defeat of America's best,with footage of fallen Americans and their gear displayed all across the Muslim world without response would mean embarrassment for the US and a morale boost and recruiting tool for jihadists. Likewise, it would be demoralizing for Americans.When bad events happen,there is a desire to alter the story to reflect more positively: witness the official version of what happened to Jessica Lynch and Pat Tillman vs what is now known. I think Luttrell is unfortunately in somewhat of the same boat,in being made a hero in an overall tale that he didn't script and is more than just about him. exactly. what happened to him and his stgory was decided by people far far far above his paygrade. Look at the flag raisers at iwo jima and the combo of fadcts and legend that surround all that |
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Posted: 1/7/2014 9:35:29 AM EDT
[#32]
Next, you're gonna tell me that the fucking Germans didn't bomb Pearl Harbor!!
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Posted: 1/7/2014 9:35:52 AM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Why would you assume something different? Do you really believe that Marcus would go ape-shit if someone did confront him about the inaccuracies in Lone Survivor? Because, as I already stated, I would be willing to bet that has already happened. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Let me ask the above posters; if you were on a plane, sitting next to Marcus for hours, what would you ask him? Keep in mind, I'm suggesting something as close to real life as possible, not some kindergarten fantasy. Marcus would no more kick my or anyone else's ass for asking if/why he's supporting a fictional account of what happened. He's an adult, he is able to handle life's little awkward moments. And I would bet money someone already has asked exactly that question, including some of his fallen team mate's families. Why would you assume that? Why would you assume something different? Do you really believe that Marcus would go ape-shit if someone did confront him about the inaccuracies in Lone Survivor? Because, as I already stated, I would be willing to bet that has already happened. Well, I know he's been in at least one bar fight over someone insulting him(and Texas), and I don't really have a reason to doubt that he'd be willing to knock the shit out of someone else if he was given a good reason. |
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Posted: 1/7/2014 9:37:47 AM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted:Because he's wants you to buy the other book... Right....that's it, I'm a book salesman. No wait....I'm the author!!! Yeah....yeah, that's it, I'm the damn author. Is there anything I could do to ease your troubled mind? Some way I could convince you that I'm not trying to sell books? |
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Posted: 1/7/2014 9:39:59 AM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Right....that's it, I'm a book salesman. No wait....I'm the author!!! Yeah....yeah, that's it, I'm the damn author. Is there anything I could do to ease your troubled mind? Some way I could convince you that I'm not trying to sell books? Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted:Because he's wants you to buy the other book... Right....that's it, I'm a book salesman. No wait....I'm the author!!! Yeah....yeah, that's it, I'm the damn author. Is there anything I could do to ease your troubled mind? Some way I could convince you that I'm not trying to sell books? |
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Posted: 1/7/2014 9:40:29 AM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted:Well, I know he's been in at least one bar fight over someone insulting him(and Texas), and I don't really have a reason to doubt that he'd be willing to knock the shit out of someone else if he was given a good reason. So, since he got in a bar fight over someone insulting him (I think I read that too), what does that mean to you? Does that mean that the book "Lone Survivor" is pure fact, and nothing should be questioned? Oh, I get it. You're looking to start another fight. |
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Posted: 1/7/2014 9:41:25 AM EDT
[#37]
During Operation Anaconda, SASR forces were on overwatch and in direct contact with enemy forces for 14 days straight. When the SASR squad was lifted back to the coaltion base, they received their first hot meal in weeks. At the mess, The Americans respectfully parted the way for the SASR in tribute to the service provided by their overwatch and ordinance coordination that saved the men of a downed chopper.
Americans say they parted the way in tribute/honor/thanks to the life savings actions of the Aussies. The SASR members say it was because they had went two weeks without a shower and smelled so bad that no one wanted to keep them company...... so everyone moved to let them through. There are always two sides to every story. We only know Marcus Lutrell's so hats off to him and let him be. |
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Posted: 1/7/2014 9:41:58 AM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted:Stop posting. That would do it. No. Why are you still in this thread? Don't like it? Leave. There's also the "ignore" button you could use. |
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Posted: 1/7/2014 9:42:46 AM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Right....that's it, I'm a book salesman. No wait....I'm the author!!! Yeah....yeah, that's it, I'm the damn author. Is there anything I could do to ease your troubled mind? Some way I could convince you that I'm not trying to sell books? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:Because he's wants you to buy the other book... Right....that's it, I'm a book salesman. No wait....I'm the author!!! Yeah....yeah, that's it, I'm the damn author. Is there anything I could do to ease your troubled mind? Some way I could convince you that I'm not trying to sell books? STFU and let it go? |
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Posted: 1/7/2014 9:44:18 AM EDT
[#40]
I'm till waiting for some good discussion on this topic.
Anything....and I mean anything else other than personal attacks and petty, play-ground crapola. Anyone want to discuss the differences between the book, the movie, and other sources of information on Red Wings? |
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Posted: 1/7/2014 9:45:04 AM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
There are tons of things that disprove what is in Robinson's book. -There wasn't 200 ACM attacking the SEALs, there was 8-10. This is a guess as well. I have watched one of the ACM videos and there is no way I could come up with a number of attackers. -Shah wasn't an HVT, he was a low-level insurgent before the incident. While this may have been true, and the author of Lone Survivor/the Navy changed that. How does that affect the story. For all we know, the team was briefed and led to believe Shah was an HVT. -Luttrell was never tortured by Shah's ACM after seeking refuge in the village, as they were already back in Pakistan, or on their way there. I haven't read Lone Survivor in a while, so I don't remember this from the book. I do remember seeing an interview with Luttrell stating it. -The was never a point where hundreds of ACM were streaming down a mountain side coming to attack the village, as Marcus was being evacuated, where Marcus called in air-strikes and decimated them. -The recon team was told by the Marines that their coms wouldn't work in that area. -Red Wings was not a NSW operation, it was a Marine operation. The SEALs were brought in at the last minute due to command conflicts between JSOC and the Marines. This seems petty to me. Like Darack/the Marines are hurt by not being mentioned. I bought Victory Point when it came out and couldn't get passed the first chapter. Butthurt seemed to flow with greatness. My dad recently read the booked and has encouraged me to finish it. Last night I was reading the 3/3 frequently used the SEALs to do recon and surveillance for the first parts of their missions. I have read the articles and seen the side from Victory Point's perspective. I get there weren't 200 guys and it was RED WINGS. These are all details, some minor and some pretty big. However, a 4 man team was inserted on the mountain, was compromised, and put up a huge fight, 3 men died, one survived, and 16 more died trying to come to their aid. That is the same in both accounts. Whose overall mission it was doesn't matter. I would say it is more like 60-70% factual, but I don't have clearance and will never know the true story. I will believe Marcus and a close friend of mine who was a teammate of his. We haven't discussed it to this depth, but he doesn't doubt the account, and that is plenty for me. I do like researching it and educating myself, but it seems to me that some of the items you/Darack have fault with don't impact the story. They should impact the military and be lessons on how missions are planned and executed. These are just some of the points that show that there is a much more detailed, complete, and factual account of what happened. |
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Posted: 1/7/2014 9:45:16 AM EDT
[#42]
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Posted: 1/7/2014 9:45:37 AM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Book says Patrick Robinson is a co-author. Hi s name is on the cover of the book. He's not some mysterious Ghost Writer. Just because someone has written military fiction in the past, doesn't mean that everything they have ever written was made up. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
I hate to break this, but "Lone Survivor" was written co-written by Patrick Robinson, who is a writer of Military Fiction. Book says Patrick Robinson is a co-author. Hi s name is on the cover of the book. He's not some mysterious Ghost Writer. Just because someone has written military fiction in the past, doesn't mean that everything they have ever written was made up. \Plenty of writers out there who have written fiction and non fiction on the same subject...Barrett Tillman is one... |
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Posted: 1/7/2014 9:45:45 AM EDT
[#44]
I read on a website that Luttrel was never even a SEAL. He was actually just researching a book he wanted to write, so he traveled to Nevada and took some glamour shots and bought a SEAL outfit.
Bonjour. |
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Posted: 1/7/2014 9:45:51 AM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryQuoted:STFU and let it go? Nothing? You've got nothing? Nothing but "STFU and let it go?"? How about some small morsel of real discussion? Or are insults and personal attacks all you can do? |
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Posted: 1/7/2014 9:46:03 AM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I'm till waiting for some good discussion on this topic. Anything....and I mean anything else other than personal attacks and petty, play-ground crapola. Anyone want to discuss the differences between the book, the movie, and other sources of information on Red Wings? |
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Posted: 1/7/2014 9:46:26 AM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
So, since he got in a bar fight over someone insulting him (I think I read that too), what does that mean to you? Does that mean that the book "Lone Survivor" is pure fact, and nothing should be questioned? Oh, I get it. You're looking to start another fight. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:Well, I know he's been in at least one bar fight over someone insulting him(and Texas), and I don't really have a reason to doubt that he'd be willing to knock the shit out of someone else if he was given a good reason. So, since he got in a bar fight over someone insulting him (I think I read that too), what does that mean to you? Does that mean that the book "Lone Survivor" is pure fact, and nothing should be questioned? Oh, I get it. You're looking to start another fight. Dude, that's just pathetic. I quoted YOUR fucking question about why someone would assume that he might kick someone's ass over being questioned about his story and answered it, and now you're trying to imply that I'm trying to start a fight or that I'm saying that everything in the book is fact? |
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Posted: 1/7/2014 9:46:29 AM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Sorry, I've been real busy defending myself from people that think that such factual inaccuracies isn't important. Or are stupid enough to think I'm trying to sell copies of a book. No, you've been busy telling us your opinion. You are not the arbiter of fact and fiction on this matter. |
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Posted: 1/7/2014 9:48:59 AM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Dude, that's just pathetic. I quoted YOUR fucking question about why someone would assume that he might kick someone's ass over being questioned about his story and answered it, and now you're trying to imply that I'm trying to start a fight or that I'm saying that everything in the book is fact? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:Well, I know he's been in at least one bar fight over someone insulting him(and Texas), and I don't really have a reason to doubt that he'd be willing to knock the shit out of someone else if he was given a good reason. So, since he got in a bar fight over someone insulting him (I think I read that too), what does that mean to you? Does that mean that the book "Lone Survivor" is pure fact, and nothing should be questioned? Oh, I get it. You're looking to start another fight. Dude, that's just pathetic. I quoted YOUR fucking question about why someone would assume that he might kick someone's ass over being questioned about his story and answered it, and now you're trying to imply that I'm trying to start a fight or that I'm saying that everything in the book is fact? Keep in mind, in the end, he doesn't even rate. |
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Posted: 1/7/2014 9:50:01 AM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Nothing? You've got nothing? Nothing but "STFU and let it go?"? How about some small morsel of real discussion? Or are insults and personal attacks all you can do? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:STFU and let it go? Nothing? You've got nothing? Nothing but "STFU and let it go?"? How about some small morsel of real discussion? Or are insults and personal attacks all you can do? No one cares. Get over it noob. |
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