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Posted: 4/16/2014 3:58:18 AM EDT
[#1]
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Not trying to be argumentative, but what does that mean? I was baptized when I was twelve. I said what I was supposed to and believed what I was told. At that point I felt comfortable that I was saved. Well, for the next few decades, I had nothing to do with religion, drank, smoked, stole, fornicated, did drugs, took God's name in vain constantly, didn't honor my parents and pretty much was a heathen. If the world had ended and Jesus returned, or I was killed during that time there is no way I was still "saved". Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Nope, but i won't have to. Wife, Daughter and I are all Saved. Not trying to be argumentative, but what does that mean? I was baptized when I was twelve. I said what I was supposed to and believed what I was told. At that point I felt comfortable that I was saved. Well, for the next few decades, I had nothing to do with religion, drank, smoked, stole, fornicated, did drugs, took God's name in vain constantly, didn't honor my parents and pretty much was a heathen. If the world had ended and Jesus returned, or I was killed during that time there is no way I was still "saved". If you confessed with your mind and heart that Jesus save you and you believed it at the time, you were and are saved. Our sins afterward aren't pleasing to God but they don't keep you from entering heaven. Pre- salvation sin is what being saved is, the sins that one commits after being saved are forgiven when we continue to ask for forgivness , the saved person is reconciled with God period. We're saved by gods grace and not by our actions, I believe we'll see people in heaven who asked to be saved by Jesus but never lived for him. The thief on the cross had only minutes to live but he was saved because he asked Jesus to remember him, Jesus said " today you'll be with me in paradise" - he had no time left to live for God. The critical thing is to not die in your sins, asking Jesus to save you is the difference. |
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Posted: 4/16/2014 3:59:06 AM EDT
[#2]
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Posted: 4/16/2014 4:20:38 AM EDT
[#3]
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If you confessed with your mind and heart that Jesus save you and you believed it at the time, you were and are saved. Our sins afterward aren't pleasing to God but they don't keep you from entering heaven. Pre- salvation sin is what being saved is, the sins that one commits after being saved are forgiven when we continue to ask for forgivness , the saved person is reconciled with God period. We're saved by gods grace and not by our actions, I believe we'll see people in heaven who asked to be saved by Jesus but never lived for him. The thief on the cross had only minutes to live but he was saved because he asked Jesus to remember him, Jesus said " today you'll be with me in paradise" - he had no time left to live for God. The critical thing is to not die in your sins, asking Jesus to save you is the difference. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Nope, but i won't have to. Wife, Daughter and I are all Saved. Not trying to be argumentative, but what does that mean? I was baptized when I was twelve. I said what I was supposed to and believed what I was told. At that point I felt comfortable that I was saved. Well, for the next few decades, I had nothing to do with religion, drank, smoked, stole, fornicated, did drugs, took God's name in vain constantly, didn't honor my parents and pretty much was a heathen. If the world had ended and Jesus returned, or I was killed during that time there is no way I was still "saved". If you confessed with your mind and heart that Jesus save you and you believed it at the time, you were and are saved. Our sins afterward aren't pleasing to God but they don't keep you from entering heaven. Pre- salvation sin is what being saved is, the sins that one commits after being saved are forgiven when we continue to ask for forgivness , the saved person is reconciled with God period. We're saved by gods grace and not by our actions, I believe we'll see people in heaven who asked to be saved by Jesus but never lived for him. The thief on the cross had only minutes to live but he was saved because he asked Jesus to remember him, Jesus said " today you'll be with me in paradise" - he had no time left to live for God. The critical thing is to not die in your sins, asking Jesus to save you is the difference. That makes sense if somebody is sincere. But if somebody changes nothing and doesn't try to follow Jesus' example than it's saying hypocrites get saved and I doubt that. |
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Posted: 4/16/2014 5:32:33 AM EDT
[#4]
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How do you know he was not saved? Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Late getting here but it looks like the same folks that usually turn up for these threads. Just stopped by to say that you can not unaccept Jesus. That is all. What the hell does that mean? I know 1 person who was raised in the church and used to spend a lot of time proselytizing. We lost touch for about 12 years but he no longer believes in God and feels he was wasted a lot of time with what he calls a "perpetuated falsehood". Are you saying that even tho he no longer accepts Jesus, he still accept Jesus? Nope. He never was saved. He just pretended to be. How do you know he was not saved? Because he has rejected God. That is not possible if a person has been truly born again. Known as "Perseverance of the Saints" by Calvin. Only God can save me, and only He can keep me saved. If someone rejects Him, they were never born again. |
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Posted: 4/16/2014 5:37:16 AM EDT
[#5]
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Tell me exactly who you are to cast judgment upon and determine the fate of man's soul? Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Nope. He never was saved. He just pretended to be. Tell me exactly who you are to cast judgment upon and determine the fate of man's soul? No one. I'm not "casting judgment", only stating what the Bible clearly teaches. If he was truly born again, then God will keep him Saved. If he rejects God, then that proves that he was never born again. |
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Posted: 4/16/2014 5:47:31 AM EDT
[#6]
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I have a lot of respect for you O_P, but to pretend to know what was in his heart is asinine. He did not spend the first 33 years of his life pretending and all the while giving a large chunk of his time to the church as well as constantly annoying the hell out of me trying to bring me to God. But thanks for playing. I have a lot of respect for you too.
Read my comments above. |
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Posted: 4/16/2014 5:52:13 AM EDT
[#7]
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wait wait wait...........it's not like facebook? Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Late getting here but it looks like the same folks that usually turn up for these threads. Just stopped by to say that you can not unaccept Jesus. That is all. wait wait wait...........it's not like facebook? No I believe it is like facebook for you RMP but it would seem you haven't responded to His invite yet |
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Posted: 4/16/2014 6:12:46 AM EDT
[#8]
I am always astounded by the arrogance some people have claiming to know the sincerity and motivations behind everyone else's thoughts concerning religion.
Such people always take offense when others question the validity of their particular subjective interpretation of their religion, and call them arrogant for having the audacity to question their perfect understanding of things that are unobservable. In their minds, they are 100% in tune with the mind of god, so questioning their beliefs is questioning god. Its one thing to have some arrogance in your opinion based on reasoning (as I certainly have), its quite another to pretend you have such a perfect understanding of the universe that you can fully understand the minds of others and their reasoning. The latter live in a fantasy world, not able to appreciate the true diversity of motivations and beliefs people have. |
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Posted: 4/16/2014 6:36:34 AM EDT
[#9]
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It's pretty shitty that all those aborted babies and babies that died at birth are going to burn in hell because they never said "the prayer". It doesn't work that way. Babies (unborn included) and young children (along with mentally handicapped persons) that are not in a position to fully grasp the concept of accepting Jesus Christ as their savior, are protected. Plenty of scripture backs up this notion. People that are old/intelligent enough to take responsibility for their choices that knowingly, and of their choosing turn their back on Christ are the ones that will not receive his grace and mercy. |
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Posted: 4/16/2014 6:46:11 AM EDT
[#10]
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...in place of somebody you love and care about? For clarification: This person is going to Hell because they are not 'saved' ie; they never said "the prayer" to accept Jesus into their lives before they passed... Interesting idea....but no one can go to Heaven or Hell in another's place....as only Jesus Christ himself was God the Father's chosen sacrifice for human kind's sins. No other human being is an acceptable sacrifice to God other than Jesus Christ....the Christian bible is absolutely specific about this. John 14:6 Jesus said to him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man comes to the Father, but by me. Acts 4:12 Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved. There are absolutes in life....this is one of them.... Some people believe and some people do not...a Christian is suppose to tell people the truth because they care about them..... anyone who uses scripture for any other purpose is in the wrong....imo |
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Posted: 4/16/2014 6:50:46 AM EDT
[#11]
Quoted: ...in place of somebody you love and care about? For clarification: This person is going to Hell because they are not 'saved' ie; they never said "the prayer" to accept Jesus into their lives before they passed... No. Because I can visit them in Helgafell from Valhalla. |
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Posted: 4/16/2014 6:57:43 AM EDT
[#12]
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Atheists don't believe in god or Satan, so how in the hell would they be either of their foot soldiers? Or do you mean unwitting foot soldiers? For example, if Allah is real, Christians are unwittingly the devil's foot soldiers for misinterpreting the words of the Islamic prophet Jesus, and atheists for challenging the existence of god all together? Quote HistoryQuoted:
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So much visceral hatred over something that some don't believe in.......One only needs to read a thread in GD about Christianity to know that the devil is at work. As an atheist...I agree with this, actually. If a person doesn't believe, then why would you go to such great lengths to ridicule those that do? If Satan were real, and an enemy of God, then hard-core, rabid atheists would be his foot soldiers on the Earth. It makes perfect sense, theologically. What you say strikes true to me. Or do you mean unwitting foot soldiers? For example, if Allah is real, Christians are unwittingly the devil's foot soldiers for misinterpreting the words of the Islamic prophet Jesus, and atheists for challenging the existence of god all together? Yes. |
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Posted: 4/16/2014 7:07:03 AM EDT
[#13]
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No I believe it is like facebook for you RMP but it would seem you haven't responded to His invite yet Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Late getting here but it looks like the same folks that usually turn up for these threads. Just stopped by to say that you can not unaccept Jesus. That is all. wait wait wait...........it's not like facebook? No I believe it is like facebook for you RMP but it would seem you haven't responded to His invite yet Nope. I friended some other guy. He invited me out for ice cream. |
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Posted: 4/16/2014 7:11:48 AM EDT
[#14]
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This a pretty severe topic you are making light of. In fact, it is the most severe topic you can discuss as humans. Good luck with your choice. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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...in place of somebody you love and care about? For clarification: This person is going to Hell because they are not 'saved' ie; they never said "the prayer" to accept Jesus into their lives before they passed... Hell....  Next thing you'll tell me you can actually visit Santa's workshop at the North Pole...This a pretty severe topic you are making light of. In fact, it is the most severe topic you can discuss as humans. Good luck with your choice. Hell is earth for the people left behind after someone they love dies. Once you are gone you are just dirt, same as every other animal that has ever died. |
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Posted: 4/16/2014 7:16:16 AM EDT
[#15]
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Because he has rejected God. That is not possible if a person has been truly born again. Known as "Perseverance of the Saints" by Calvin. Only God can save me, and only He can keep me saved. If someone rejects Him, they were never born again. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Late getting here but it looks like the same folks that usually turn up for these threads. Just stopped by to say that you can not unaccept Jesus. That is all. What the hell does that mean? I know 1 person who was raised in the church and used to spend a lot of time proselytizing. We lost touch for about 12 years but he no longer believes in God and feels he was wasted a lot of time with what he calls a "perpetuated falsehood". Are you saying that even tho he no longer accepts Jesus, he still accept Jesus? Nope. He never was saved. He just pretended to be. How do you know he was not saved? Because he has rejected God. That is not possible if a person has been truly born again. Known as "Perseverance of the Saints" by Calvin. Only God can save me, and only He can keep me saved. If someone rejects Him, they were never born again. Or, he was 'saved' in exactly the same way as any other 'saved' person, but realized that it's not a real thing and moved on with his life. It's just the no true Scotsman fallacy, and whether you realize or not, it's incredibly insulting to say every person who stopped believing was never a true believer. |
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Posted: 4/16/2014 7:21:46 AM EDT
[#16]
Oh i see, so there is always a way in, now i get it, kind of like when you make up the rules as the game moves along.That way even if you fall over dead from a brain rupture yee be saved.
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It doesn't work that way. Babies (unborn included) and young children (along with mentally handicapped persons) that are not in a position to fully grasp the concept of accepting Jesus Christ as their savior, are protected. Plenty of scripture backs up this notion. People that are old/intelligent enough to take responsibility for their choices that knowingly, and of their choosing turn their back on Christ are the ones that will not receive his grace and mercy. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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It's pretty shitty that all those aborted babies and babies that died at birth are going to burn in hell because they never said "the prayer". It doesn't work that way. Babies (unborn included) and young children (along with mentally handicapped persons) that are not in a position to fully grasp the concept of accepting Jesus Christ as their savior, are protected. Plenty of scripture backs up this notion. People that are old/intelligent enough to take responsibility for their choices that knowingly, and of their choosing turn their back on Christ are the ones that will not receive his grace and mercy. |
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Posted: 4/16/2014 7:28:01 AM EDT
[#17]
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Oh i see, so there is always a way in, now i get it, kind of like when you make up the rules as the game moves along.That way even if you fall over dead from a brain rupture yee be saved. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Oh i see, so there is always a way in, now i get it, kind of like when you make up the rules as the game moves along.That way even if you fall over dead from a brain rupture yee be saved. Quoted:
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It's pretty shitty that all those aborted babies and babies that died at birth are going to burn in hell because they never said "the prayer". It doesn't work that way. Babies (unborn included) and young children (along with mentally handicapped persons) that are not in a position to fully grasp the concept of accepting Jesus Christ as their savior, are protected. Plenty of scripture backs up this notion. People that are old/intelligent enough to take responsibility for their choices that knowingly, and of their choosing turn their back on Christ are the ones that will not receive his grace and mercy. Or what about this dilemma, parents are non-believers and move to a country where there isn't much Christianity. The person grows up to an age where they could accept Jesus, but they don't know he ever even existed. He goes through life as a good person with good morals and then gets hit by a car and dies. Does he go to hell simply because he never even knew about Jesus and heaven in the first place? That seems a bit unfair. |
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Posted: 4/16/2014 7:39:39 AM EDT
[#18]
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Because he has rejected God. That is not possible if a person has been truly born again. Known as "Perseverance of the Saints" by Calvin. Only God can save me, and only He can keep me saved. If someone rejects Him, they were never born again. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Late getting here but it looks like the same folks that usually turn up for these threads. Just stopped by to say that you can not unaccept Jesus. That is all. What the hell does that mean? I know 1 person who was raised in the church and used to spend a lot of time proselytizing. We lost touch for about 12 years but he no longer believes in God and feels he was wasted a lot of time with what he calls a "perpetuated falsehood". Are you saying that even tho he no longer accepts Jesus, he still accept Jesus? Nope. He never was saved. He just pretended to be. How do you know he was not saved? Because he has rejected God. That is not possible if a person has been truly born again. Known as "Perseverance of the Saints" by Calvin. Only God can save me, and only He can keep me saved. If someone rejects Him, they were never born again. Basically, it is a CYA clause within the faith, as used by any given religious, political, or cultural group to protect itself from doubt or criticism. Blame the heretic for failing to truly believe. It is the most supreme expression of self-righteousness. |
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Posted: 4/16/2014 7:55:39 AM EDT
[#19]
I've had my ass volunteered to guard the gates of Heaven when I die, so no. |
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Posted: 4/16/2014 8:04:20 AM EDT
[#20]
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Or, he was 'saved' in exactly the same way as any other 'saved' person, but realized that it's not a real thing and moved on with his life. It's just the no true Scotsman fallacy, and whether you realize or not, it's incredibly insulting to say every person who stopped believing was never a true believer. Make sure you understand......That is not "me" saying that, but Jesus Himself. John 6:39 And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day. Jesus said He will not lose even one soul that has been born again and "given to Him". Not one. If a soul is lost, it was never born again. |
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Posted: 4/16/2014 8:08:42 AM EDT
[#21]
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Basically, it is a CYA clause within the faith, as used by any given religious, political, or cultural group to protect itself from doubt or criticism. Blame the heretic for failing to truly believe. It is the most supreme expression of self-righteousness. No, it is exactly the opposite. It is the supreme expression of total unworthiness. I have absolutely nothing that will save me within myself. Only Jesus and His Perfect Righteousness can Save me. He has done so, and it was absolutely unmerited. I did not deserve it, and neither does anyone that is Saved by His Grace. What can wash away my sin? Nothing but the blood of Jesus; What can make me whole again? Nothing but the blood of Jesus. Oh! precious is the flow That makes me white as snow; No other fount I know, Nothing but the blood of Jesus. |
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Posted: 4/16/2014 8:10:01 AM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Make sure you understand......That is not "me" saying that, but Jesus Himself. John 6:39 And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day. Jesus said He will not lose even one soul that has been born again and "given to Him". Not one. If a soul is lost, it was never born again. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Or, he was 'saved' in exactly the same way as any other 'saved' person, but realized that it's not a real thing and moved on with his life. It's just the no true Scotsman fallacy, and whether you realize or not, it's incredibly insulting to say every person who stopped believing was never a true believer. Make sure you understand......That is not "me" saying that, but Jesus Himself. John 6:39 And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day. Jesus said He will not lose even one soul that has been born again and "given to Him". Not one. If a soul is lost, it was never born again. As is the case with me and millions of other former Christians. Your personal experience and opinion doesn't invalidate those of others. |
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Posted: 4/16/2014 8:10:23 AM EDT
[#23]
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Make sure you understand......That is not "me" saying that, but Jesus Himself. John 6:39 And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day. Jesus said He will not lose even one soul that has been born again and "given to Him". Not one. If a soul is lost, it was never born again. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Or, he was 'saved' in exactly the same way as any other 'saved' person, but realized that it's not a real thing and moved on with his life. It's just the no true Scotsman fallacy, and whether you realize or not, it's incredibly insulting to say every person who stopped believing was never a true believer. Make sure you understand......That is not "me" saying that, but Jesus Himself. John 6:39 And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day. Jesus said He will not lose even one soul that has been born again and "given to Him". Not one. If a soul is lost, it was never born again. Or, it's not true. You are saying it, if someone's religious text calls all unbelievers retards, and you go around calling unbelievers retards, you're still calling them retards, no matter the reason. There are a lot of people who wholeheartedly dedicated their lives to Jesus before realizing that it wasn't true. They never really believed is a copout and is insulting. |
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Posted: 4/16/2014 8:11:34 AM EDT
[#24]
This whole business of "I am being humble when I claim to know people who are no longer religious never actually believed" is utter BS. Claiming to know the sincerity of other's beliefs based on your personal opinions is the peak of arrogance. |
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Posted: 4/16/2014 8:16:06 AM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Or, it's not true. You are saying it, if someone's religious text calls all unbelievers retards, and you go around calling unbelievers retards, you're still calling them retards, no matter the reason. There are a lot of people who wholeheartedly dedicated their lives to Jesus before realizing that it wasn't true. They never really believed is a copout and is insulting. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Or, he was 'saved' in exactly the same way as any other 'saved' person, but realized that it's not a real thing and moved on with his life. It's just the no true Scotsman fallacy, and whether you realize or not, it's incredibly insulting to say every person who stopped believing was never a true believer. Make sure you understand......That is not "me" saying that, but Jesus Himself. John 6:39 And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day. Jesus said He will not lose even one soul that has been born again and "given to Him". Not one. If a soul is lost, it was never born again. Or, it's not true. You are saying it, if someone's religious text calls all unbelievers retards, and you go around calling unbelievers retards, you're still calling them retards, no matter the reason. There are a lot of people who wholeheartedly dedicated their lives to Jesus before realizing that it wasn't true. They never really believed is a copout and is insulting. I grew up believing in ghosts, UFO's, bigfoots, and the trinity. To pretend that I didn't, at one point in my life WHOLE HEARTEDLY believe in these things is extremely insulting. It implies that the person saying this knows more about your thoughts, motivations, and experiences than you do. The statement that the only true belief is belief that has never changed is one of the most ridiculous things I've ever heard. One can never hope to have a reasonable discussion with someone, who says up front, that they already know everything and nothing in the world could change their mind about it. |
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Posted: 4/16/2014 8:34:58 AM EDT
[#26]
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Because he has rejected God. That is not possible if a person has been truly born again. Known as "Perseverance of the Saints" by Calvin. Only God can save me, and only He can keep me saved. If someone rejects Him, they were never born again. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Late getting here but it looks like the same folks that usually turn up for these threads. Just stopped by to say that you can not unaccept Jesus. That is all. What the hell does that mean? I know 1 person who was raised in the church and used to spend a lot of time proselytizing. We lost touch for about 12 years but he no longer believes in God and feels he was wasted a lot of time with what he calls a "perpetuated falsehood". Are you saying that even tho he no longer accepts Jesus, he still accept Jesus? Nope. He never was saved. He just pretended to be. How do you know he was not saved? Because he has rejected God. That is not possible if a person has been truly born again. Known as "Perseverance of the Saints" by Calvin. Only God can save me, and only He can keep me saved. If someone rejects Him, they were never born again. True (agreeing with the logic, not saying I believe) As long as you believe in him He never was "born Again", He was raised in the church, He spent a great deal of his life devoting time to the church, he brought more then a few into the church (I would have put money on him going into the clergy) and he was still going strong when we lost touch (he was 33). We reconnected when he was 45 and all that changed. You really think he was pulling a long con for those 33 years (at least) I knew him? He is one of the VERY few I have ever known who I believer TRULY believed. Most "Christians" I have ever been around are hypocritical, vain, materialistic and arrogant, and only seem to be in it as a personal statement of how good and righteous they are. |
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Posted: 4/16/2014 8:35:27 AM EDT
[#27]
There are no dogs in heaven, you can keep it.
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Posted: 4/16/2014 8:38:35 AM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted: There are no dogs in heaven, you can keep it. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6dZjwsxYtUA |
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Posted: 4/16/2014 8:40:23 AM EDT
[#29]
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There are no dogs in heaven, you can keep it. Which makes practically no sense to me. My dogs are way more free of sin than most people. |
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Posted: 4/16/2014 8:42:20 AM EDT
[#30]
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Everyday I wake up and go to work for my wife and kids. Place is close enough. Ditto here. Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile |
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Posted: 4/16/2014 8:47:19 AM EDT
[#31]
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There are no dogs in heaven, you can keep it. All rocks go to heaven. |
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Posted: 4/16/2014 8:50:16 AM EDT
[#32]
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He never was "born Again", Quote HistoryQuoted:
He never was "born Again", And that's what I said.
He was raised in the church, He spent a great deal of his life devoting time to the church, he brought more then a few into the church (I would have put money on him going into the clergy) and he was still going strong when we lost touch (he was 33). We reconnected when he was 45 and all that changed. You really think he was pulling a long con for those 33 years (at least) I knew him? He is one of the VERY few I have ever known who I believer TRULY believed. Most "Christians" I have ever been around are hypocritical, vain, materialistic and arrogant, and only seem to be in it as a personal statement of how good and righteous they are.[/span] Lots of folks "go to church", and do churchy stuff, and look like Christians. But Jesus said that if they were not "born again", they were never Christians. |
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Posted: 4/16/2014 9:02:22 AM EDT
[#33]
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And that's what I said.
Lots of folks "go to church", and do churchy stuff, and look like Christians. But Jesus said that if they were not "born again", they were never Christians. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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He never was "born Again", And that's what I said.
He was raised in the church, He spent a great deal of his life devoting time to the church, he brought more then a few into the church (I would have put money on him going into the clergy) and he was still going strong when we lost touch (he was 33). We reconnected when he was 45 and all that changed. You really think he was pulling a long con for those 33 years (at least) I knew him? He is one of the VERY few I have ever known who I believer TRULY believed. Most "Christians" I have ever been around are hypocritical, vain, materialistic and arrogant, and only seem to be in it as a personal statement of how good and righteous they are.[/span] Lots of folks "go to church", and do churchy stuff, and look like Christians. But Jesus said that if they were not "born again", they were never Christians. And its this vagueness and weaseling around, coupled with all the hypocrisy and arrogance that made me uneasy and uninterested tried to find a "relationship" with God. I'm sure I was just [span style='font-style: italic;']pretending [/span]to have an honest desire to find this "relationship" but in the end I was driven away by the "Christians" rather then brought in, I have never seen so much judgement and contempt as I did from those I tried to learn from. I stand by my statement from a few pages back, (most, so as not to paint with a broad brush) Christians tend to be their own worst enemies. |
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Posted: 4/16/2014 9:03:33 AM EDT
[#34]
Lol. Heaven.... Whatever helps you guys sleep at night, I guess.
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Posted: 4/16/2014 9:10:20 AM EDT
[#35]
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And its this vagueness and weaseling around, coupled with all the hypocrisy and arrogance that made me uneasy and uninterested tried to find a "relationship" with God. I'm sure I was just [span style='font-style: italic;']pretending [/span]to have an honest desire to find this "relationship" but in the end I was driven away by the "Christians" rather then brought in, I have never seen so much judgement and contempt as I did from those I tried to learn from. I stand by my statement from a few pages back, (most, so as not to paint with a broad brush) Satan makes Christians tend to be their own worst enemies. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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He never was "born Again", And that's what I said.
He was raised in the church, He spent a great deal of his life devoting time to the church, he brought more then a few into the church (I would have put money on him going into the clergy) and he was still going strong when we lost touch (he was 33). We reconnected when he was 45 and all that changed. You really think he was pulling a long con for those 33 years (at least) I knew him? He is one of the VERY few I have ever known who I believer TRULY believed. Most "Christians" I have ever been around are hypocritical, vain, materialistic and arrogant, and only seem to be in it as a personal statement of how good and righteous they are.[/span] Lots of folks "go to church", and do churchy stuff, and look like Christians. But Jesus said that if they were not "born again", they were never Christians. And its this vagueness and weaseling around, coupled with all the hypocrisy and arrogance that made me uneasy and uninterested tried to find a "relationship" with God. I'm sure I was just [span style='font-style: italic;']pretending [/span]to have an honest desire to find this "relationship" but in the end I was driven away by the "Christians" rather then brought in, I have never seen so much judgement and contempt as I did from those I tried to learn from. I stand by my statement from a few pages back, (most, so as not to paint with a broad brush) Satan makes Christians tend to be their own worst enemies. You do realize that one can have a relationship with God without anybody's or any churches approval. |
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Posted: 4/16/2014 9:12:10 AM EDT
[#36]
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Lol. Heaven.... Whatever helps you guys sleep at night, I guess. As an atheist, Shut up 13er, no need to be a dick about it. |
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Posted: 4/16/2014 9:12:53 AM EDT
[#37]
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Which makes practically no sense to me. My dogs are way more free of sin than most people. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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There are no dogs in heaven, you can keep it. Which makes practically no sense to me. My dogs are way more free of sin than most people. would it be a sin to sniff a random person's ass? |
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Posted: 4/16/2014 9:13:53 AM EDT
[#38]
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would it be a sin to sniff a random person's ass? Quote HistoryQuoted:
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There are no dogs in heaven, you can keep it. Which makes practically no sense to me. My dogs are way more free of sin than most people. would it be a sin to sniff a random person's ass? I don't think so. Is there anything in the bible on it? |
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Posted: 4/16/2014 10:21:33 AM EDT
[#39]
Heard Billy Graham once say he had a conversation in a hotel with an atheist who confronted him in the hall and said something to the affect , you Christians make me sick with your heaven crap and salvation bs. BG politely said, let me ask you something , if you had to catch a plane from NY to LA and there was a 50% chance it would crash and all on board would be killed would you get on the flight? The atheist said, of course not, BG continued to say, if there was a 10% chance it would go down and all passengers would die would you board the flight.. the atheist again said, no I wouldn't, that would be crazy. BG said to the guy , well what if there's just a 1% chance all this Jesus stuff I preach about is actually real , is it worth taking the chance with your soul to be lost for eternity.
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Posted: 4/16/2014 10:23:17 AM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Heard Billy Graham once say he had a conversation in a hotel with an atheist who confronted him in the hall and said something to the affect , you Christians make me sick with your heaven crap and salvation bs. BG politely said, let me ask you something , if you had to catch a plane from NY to LA and there was a 50% chance it would crash and all on board would be killed would you get on the flight? The atheist said, of course not, BG continued to say, if there was a 10% chance it would go down and all passengers would die would you board the flight.. the atheist again said, no I wouldn't, that would be crazy. BG said to the guy , well what if there's just a 1% chance all this Jesus stuff I preach about is actually real , is it worth taking the chance with your soul to be lost for eternity. We are all "taking chances" when it comes to no buying religions. It is not, and has never been, about hedging your bets. Pascal got it completely wrong. And as for the percentage chance of the stuff he preaches about being real? From what I've seen, I'd put it at 0.0000001%. |
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Posted: 4/16/2014 10:26:58 AM EDT
[#41]
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Heard Billy Graham once say he had a conversation in a hotel with an atheist who confronted him in the hall and said something to the affect , you Christians make me sick with your heaven crap and salvation bs. BG politely said, let me ask you something , if you had to catch a plane from NY to LA and there was a 50% chance it would crash and all on board would be killed would you get on the flight? The atheist said, of course not, BG continued to say, if there was a 10% chance it would go down and all passengers would die would you board the flight.. the atheist again said, no I wouldn't, that would be crazy. BG said to the guy , well what if there's just a 1% chance all this Jesus stuff I preach about is actually real , is it worth taking the chance with your soul to be lost for eternity. I don't really understand the comparison. |
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Posted: 4/16/2014 10:28:03 AM EDT
[#42]
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Nope. I friended some other guy. He invited me out for ice cream. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Late getting here but it looks like the same folks that usually turn up for these threads. Just stopped by to say that you can not unaccept Jesus. That is all. wait wait wait...........it's not like facebook? No I believe it is like facebook for you RMP but it would seem you haven't responded to His invite yet Nope. I friended some other guy. He invited me out for ice cream. No no no...I'm calling BS. There is no way you have chosen to worship Satan over ice cream! We need to talk, there is a whole lot more than ice cream over here on this side. Ice cream??? He offered a lot more to Jesus I'm just saying. I'm sure you are special to him but may wanna ask about the other deals he has going. Also, the guy I friended casts out demons on a dime. Ice cream.....please |
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Posted: 4/16/2014 10:46:54 AM EDT
[#43]
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No no no...I'm calling BS. There is no way you have chosen to worship Satan over ice cream! We need to talk, there is a whole lot more than ice cream over here on this side. Ice cream??? He offered a lot more to Jesus I'm just saying. I'm sure you are special to him but may wanna ask about the other deals he has going. Also, the guy I friended casts out demons on a dime. Ice cream.....please Quote HistoryQuoted:
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wait wait wait...........it's not like facebook? No I believe it is like facebook for you RMP but it would seem you haven't responded to His invite yet Nope. I friended some other guy. He invited me out for ice cream. No no no...I'm calling BS. There is no way you have chosen to worship Satan over ice cream! We need to talk, there is a whole lot more than ice cream over here on this side. Ice cream??? He offered a lot more to Jesus I'm just saying. I'm sure you are special to him but may wanna ask about the other deals he has going. Also, the guy I friended casts out demons on a dime. Ice cream.....please It was actually Gelato and his new friends name is Nicky 
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Posted: 4/16/2014 10:58:43 AM EDT
[#44]
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And its this vagueness and weaseling around, coupled with all the hypocrisy and arrogance that made me uneasy and uninterested tried to find a "relationship" with God. I'm sure I was just pretending to have an honest desire to find this "relationship" but in the end I was driven away by the "Christians" rather then brought in, I have never seen so much judgement and contempt as I did from those I tried to learn from. I stand by my statement from a few pages back, (most, so as not to paint with a broad brush) Christians tend to be their own worst enemies. I'm truly sorry to hear that. There is absolutely no reason for a real Christian to be filled with "judgment and contempt" towards those that are not Christians. We are no better than they are. I am just a lost sinner who was save by Grace. I did not do it myself, so have no reason to be prideful. Even as a Christian, I am still a sinner and have no reason to look down on others. I am not just making up stuff on my own on this subject. I am merely saying what Jesus said. He met with a Jewish scholar named Nicodemus who asked Jesus the most important question ever asked. John 3:1 There was a man of the Pharisees, named Nicodemus, a ruler of the Jews: 2 The same came to Jesus by night, and said unto him, Rabbi, we know that thou art a teacher come from God: for no man can do these miracles that thou doest, except God be with him. 3 Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God. 4 Nicodemus saith unto him, How can a man be born when he is old? can he enter the second time into his mother's womb, and be born? 5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God. 6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. 7 Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again. 8 The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit. Jesus was saying that just as we are naturally born (born of water), we must be born again by God's Spirit to be a true believer. A man that is only born of the flesh is merely a man, but to be a Christian, we must be born of God's Spirit, or "born again". It is not an insult to say that a person cannot be a real Christian unless he is born again. That is simply what it means to become a child of God. And we can't do it ourselves, God must do it for us. I wish you would not give up, but continue to search and desire God's Savior. |
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Posted: 4/16/2014 11:58:53 AM EDT
[#45]
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No, it is exactly the opposite. It is the supreme expression of total unworthiness. I have absolutely nothing that will save me within myself. Only Jesus and His Perfect Righteousness can Save me. He has done so, and it was absolutely unmerited. I did not deserve it, and neither does anyone that is Saved by His Grace. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Basically, it is a CYA clause within the faith, as used by any given religious, political, or cultural group to protect itself from doubt or criticism. Blame the heretic for failing to truly believe. It is the most supreme expression of self-righteousness. No, it is exactly the opposite. It is the supreme expression of total unworthiness. I have absolutely nothing that will save me within myself. Only Jesus and His Perfect Righteousness can Save me. He has done so, and it was absolutely unmerited. I did not deserve it, and neither does anyone that is Saved by His Grace. You miss the point. Claiming that any and every person who turns away from Christianity never truly believed or had true faith is a self-justifying and self-righteous defense. That type of self-justifying defense is not surprising, though, since how could Christianity be true if a person could turn away from the faith through legitimate shortcomings of the faith? Thus, blame must be placed upon the non-believer, not Christianity. This tactic is an effective means of preventing other Christians from questioning or critically thinking about the faith. |
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Posted: 4/16/2014 12:09:57 PM EDT
[#46]
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No no no...I'm calling BS. There is no way you have chosen to worship Satan over ice cream! We need to talk, there is a whole lot more than ice cream over here on this side. Ice cream??? He offered a lot more to Jesus I'm just saying. I'm sure you are special to him but may wanna ask about the other deals he has going. Also, the guy I friended casts out demons on a dime. Ice cream.....please It's really good ice cream. |
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Posted: 4/16/2014 1:00:49 PM EDT
[#47]
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It's really good ice cream. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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No no no...I'm calling BS. There is no way you have chosen to worship Satan over ice cream! We need to talk, there is a whole lot more than ice cream over here on this side. Ice cream??? He offered a lot more to Jesus I'm just saying. I'm sure you are special to him but may wanna ask about the other deals he has going. Also, the guy I friended casts out demons on a dime. Ice cream.....please It's really good ice cream. Okay I laughed but I am still going to pray for you. That was good.... |
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Posted: 4/16/2014 1:27:52 PM EDT
[#48]
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I don't think so. Is there anything in the bible on it? Quote HistoryQuoted:
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There are no dogs in heaven, you can keep it. Which makes practically no sense to me. My dogs are way more free of sin than most people. would it be a sin to sniff a random person's ass? I don't think so. Is there anything in the bible on it? By Christian standards, animals can't have souls. Animals aren't baptized, so how can they be saved? If they aren't saved their soul can not enter heaven. Other parts of the bible say there will be animals cavorting about, but no mention of dogs. Wolves, horses, lions, sheep. No dogs. Or cats. |
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Posted: 4/16/2014 1:54:57 PM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted: By Christian standards, animals can't have souls. Animals aren't baptized, so how can they be saved? If they aren't saved their soul can not enter heaven. Other parts of the bible say there will be animals cavorting about, but no mention of dogs. Wolves, horses, lions, sheep. No dogs. Or cats. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: would it be a sin to sniff a random person's ass? I don't think so. Is there anything in the bible on it? By Christian standards, animals can't have souls. Animals aren't baptized, so how can they be saved? If they aren't saved their soul can not enter heaven. Other parts of the bible say there will be animals cavorting about, but no mention of dogs. Wolves, horses, lions, sheep. No dogs. Or cats. |
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Posted: 4/16/2014 2:12:02 PM EDT
[#50]
Lime most people who have a distaste of Christianity and Catholicism in particular yet claim to have gone to a Catholic School or church for years; you sure don't seem to know much. Maybe you never paid attention for all those years...
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I know this. Went to a Catholic elementary school and then 2 years of high school at a Jesuit. I know it very well. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Actually Jesus is the son of god, I don't even believe and I know this 
I know this. Went to a Catholic elementary school and then 2 years of high school at a Jesuit. I know it very well. Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile |
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