User Panel
User Panel
User Panel
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Posted: 10/23/2010 4:34:58 AM EDT
[#1]
This would be a good thing to get to the tin foil types............govt 'secretly' passing laws without enough votes. You MIGHT get some interest in that , i don't know about how well they'd come on board with evil MGs though.
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Posted: 10/23/2010 4:46:39 AM EDT
[#2]
tag
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Posted: 11/8/2010 4:23:23 PM EDT
[#3]
Still looking for the tape.
Anybody here a bigwig in any of the progun groups? We need someone with clout to get CSPAN to puke up that tape. |
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Posted: 11/8/2010 4:59:48 PM EDT
[#4]
Isn't one of the NRA directors a member here? Maybe they'd be interested in helping.
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Posted: 11/8/2010 5:27:11 PM EDT
[#5]
In on this one.
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Posted: 11/8/2010 5:33:55 PM EDT
[#6]
Even if it comes out that the vote didn't go that way, do you think they would actually do anything with that info?
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Posted: 11/10/2010 3:54:58 PM EDT
[#7]
Quoted:
Even if it comes out that the vote didn't go that way, do you think they would actually do anything with that info? Nothing. But information is always useful. |
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Posted: 11/10/2010 4:01:13 PM EDT
[#8]
Quoted:
Isn't one of the NRA directors a member here? Maybe they'd be interested in helping. LOL |
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Posted: 11/17/2010 7:28:30 AM EDT
[#9]
Ok guys,
I found it. Cspan doesn't have the footage, nor does vanderbuilt or any of the other major video archives that I had access to. HOWEVER The good ol library of congress has a film reel copy. The reels we need are: 09:57-11:29 (VTA 0236) 11:26-13:00 (VTA 0237) http://lccn.loc.gov/91796859 So... Now I just need to pony up a couple hundered bucks to the library of congress and complete my order form (I just have to ask my wife when she gets back from work where the address of the new appartment is). Rush service is not available so we'd be looking at a month or two before we can actually see it. But It does exist. |
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Posted: 11/17/2010 7:30:02 AM EDT
[#10]
Quoted:
Ok guys, I found it. Cspan doesn't have the footage, nor does vanderbuilt or any of the other major video archives that I had access to. HOWEVER The good ol library of congress has a film reel copy. The reel we need is: 17:24-18:56 (VTA 0234) http://lccn.loc.gov/91796846 So... Now I just need to pony up a couple hundered bucks to the library of congress and complete my order form (I just have to ask my wife when she gets back from work where the address of the new appartment is). Rush service is not available so we'd be looking at a month or two before we can actually see it. But It does exist. Shit just got real |
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Posted: 11/17/2010 7:38:48 AM EDT
[#11]
Quoted: Ok guys, I found it. Cspan doesn't have the footage, nor does vanderbuilt or any of the other major video archives that I had access to. HOWEVER The good ol library of congress has a film reel copy. The reel we need is: 17:24-18:56 (VTA 0234) http://lccn.loc.gov/91796846 So... Now I just need to pony up a couple hundered bucks to the library of congress and complete my order form (I just have to ask my wife when she gets back from work where the address of the new appartment is). Rush service is not available so we'd be looking at a month or two before we can actually see it. But It does exist. Well, for the real tin foil inclined, I would have someone innocently go directly to the LOC and get the tape and film it, before some dork sees what it is and it gets "lost" |
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Posted: 11/17/2010 7:55:31 AM EDT
[#12]
Quoted:
Well, for the real tin foil inclined, I would have someone innocently go directly to the LOC and get the tape and film it, before some dork sees what it is and it gets "lost" I'd be more than willing to do it, but the time/money involved in the trip to DC is more than I can swing at the moment. If anyone is in the DC metro area it wouldn't be a bad idea.. |
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Posted: 11/17/2010 3:55:45 PM EDT
[#13]
Let me first say I am NOT volunteering, but I am considering it.
I have a LOC card, so access is not a problem. I have only ever searched for books and photographs. Is there a different section for films? |
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Posted: 11/18/2010 11:10:05 AM EDT
[#14]
Ok guys,
It appears I had made an error earlier, (The April 9th files were actually a typo I had made in my notes, the stuff I had been looking at was actually the 10th) All the stuff on April 9th was procedural and wasn't particularly relevant to what we were looking for. All the good stuff is on the 10th. So I've rectified the issue. Thankfully I caught it before the film order was placed. So... This is a little bit of good news, as that is 1.5 hours of film that we don't have to order. Here is the correct info, (and yes I double checked) The congressional record indicates that the recorded vote (taken before the vote which 'passed' it) was defeated 298 to 124with 12 not voting Here is a PDF of the relevant section of April 10th https://docs.google.com/leaf?id=0B4xHVurgr6T4NmRkYjJmZTYtM2MzNS00ODk2LWJjODYtYWY4ZDAzY2Q0NjEz&sort=name&layout=list&num=50 Here is a TXT file of the relevant section of April 10th https://docs.google.com/leaf?id=0B4xHVurgr6T4NDMwM2YyZWYtNmFlNS00MDRkLWJhZDYtNmY3Y2Q4NjU0ODcw&hl=en Here is a PDF of the full section of April 10th https://docs.google.com/leaf?id=0B4xHVurgr6T4NDU5NjhhNGEtYjRlMy00YTQxLWE5MTUtMzhjMGNlNDA0ODk2&sort=name&layout=list&num=50 the tapes we need are: |
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Posted: 11/18/2010 11:57:38 AM EDT
[#15]
Quoted:
Let me first say I am NOT volunteering, but I am considering it. I have a LOC card, so access is not a problem. I have only ever searched for books and photographs. Is there a different section for films? I'm not 100% sure. Here is the info from my price quote request... The reference librarians are amazing and can point you in the correct direction. DATE:
TO: November 18, 2010 Public Services Office NAVCC Laboratory REQUESTOR NAME, ADDRESS, PHONE, FAX, EMAIL: Marc XXXX XXXX XX Street Astoria NY 11103 1-718-XXX-XXXX [email protected] REQUESTED TITLE(S) AND CALL NUMBER(S): U.S. House of Representatives. House Sessions. 1986-04-10. - 1” video; 11:00-11:29 (VTA 0236); partial tape - MAVIS No. 1810229-1-1 - Please also price for whole tape: 9:57 - 11:29 - 1” video; 11:26-12:00 (VTA 0237); partial tape - MAVIS No. 1810229-1-2 - Please also price for whole tape: 11:26-13:00 COPYRIGHT RIGHT SEARCH: No. FORMAT REQUESTED: DVR-R RUSH OR STANDARD SERVICE: STANDARD INTENDED USE: Research (I'm a Columbia University Student) TECHNICAL REQUIREMENTS |
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Posted: 11/22/2010 2:43:07 PM EDT
[#16]
Here is a bit of a breakdown of some relevent segments of the congressional record
Parts to note: Hughes introduces his Machine gun banning amendment and attempts to have it NOT read, which is sneaky, since he's the only one who knows its in there (as illustrated by the little surprised comments from Volkmer). AMENDMENT OFFERED BY MR. HUGHES TO THE
AMENDMENT, AS AMENDED, OFFERED BY MR. VOLKMER AS A SUBSTITUTE FOR THE JUDICI- ARY COMMITTEE AMENDMENT IN THE NATURE OF A SUBSTITUTE, AS AMENDED Mr. HUGHES. Mr. Chairman, I offer an amendment to the amendment of- fered as a substitute for the committee amendment in the nature of a substi- tute. PARLIAMENTARY INQUIRY Mr. VOLKMER. Mr. Chairman, I have a parliamentary inquiry. The CHAIRMAN. The gentleman will state it. Mr. VOLKMER. Mr. Chairman, before the amendment is read, I would like to know if the amendment was one of those printed in the RECORD prior to today. The CHAIRMAN. The Chair will so inquire of the gentleman from New Jersey whether his amendment has been printed in the RECoRD? Mr. HUGHES. It has been printed in the RECoaR, Mr. Chairman. The CHAIRMAN. The Clerk will read. Mr. VOLKMER. Mr. Chairman, has it been printed in the RECORD by Mr. HUOHES? The CHAIRMAN. Under the rule, it is not required that the sponsor of the amendment have it printed in the REcoRD. The Clerk will report the amend- ment. The Clerk read as follows: [SNIP- Just the text of the machine gun ban] Mr. HUGHES (during the reading). Mr. Chairman, I ask unanimous con- sent that the amendment be consid- ered as read and printed in the RECORD. Hughes tries to avoid having it read the first time... remember, no one was expecting this, it wasn't up for a vote the night before, hughes had it entered in sometime between when the april 9th session ended and the early april 10th session began. The CHAIRMAN. Is there objection to the request of the gentleman from New Jersey? Mr. WALKER. Mr. Chairman, I object. The CHAIRMAN. Objection is heard. The Clerk continued the reading of the amendment. Mr. HUGHES (during the reading). Mr. Chairman, I renew my request that the amendment be considered as read and printed in the RECORD. I ask my colleagues, in all fairness and ra- tionality-we only have 3 minutes left-to give me an opportunity to ex- plain why machineguns should be banned. With 3 minutes left, Huges tries a SECOND time to avoid having the bill read Mr. WALKER. Mr. Chairman, regu- lar order and reserving the right to object- The CHAIRMAN. The Clerk will read. The Clerk continued the reading of the amendment. Mr. HUGHES (during the reading). Mr. Chairman, I renew my request for a waiver of the reading of the amend- ment. Hughes tries a THIRD time to avoid having his amendment read The CHAIRMAN. Is there objection to the request of the gentleman from New Jersey? Mr. SENSENBRENNER. Mr. Chair- man, I object. The CHAIRMAN. The Clerk will read. The Clerk continued the reading of the amendment. Mr. HUGHES (during the reading). Mr. Chairman, I renew my request for )NGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUSE a waiver of the reading of the amend- ment, I do not know why anyone would object to the banning of ma- chineguns. Hughes tries a FOURTH time to avoid having his amendment read (remember, he's interrupting it being read each and every time he does this) The CHAIRMAN. Is there objection to the request of the gentleman from New Jersey? Mr. SENSENBRENNER. Mr. Chair- man, I object. The CHAIRMAN. Objection is heard. The Clerk concluded the reading of the amendment. Hughes, with 140 seconds or so left to debate his bill, has everyone rise to vote, (we don't know if they actually get all the way through reading it... they may be voting on something they haven't even read) it gets slapped down hard Mr. HUGHES. Mr. Chairman, I move that the Committee do now rise. Mr. SENSENBRENNER. Mr. Chair- man, I demand a recorded vote. The CHAIRMAN. Is it the Chair's understanding that the gentleman from New Jersey moves that the Com- mittee do now rise? Mr. HUGHES. That is my motion, Mr. Chairman. I move that the Com- mittee do now rise. The CHAIRMAN. The question is on the motion offered by the gentleman from New Jersey [Mr. HUGHES]. The question was taken; NOTE: Mr Chairman (Good Ol, Charlie Rangel, AGAIN can't seem to tell that 298 is bigger than 124, and what a coincidence, he's one of the 124) and the Chairman announced that the ayes appeared to have it. RECORDED VOTE Mr. SENSENBRENNER. Mr. Chair- man, I demand a recorded vote. A recorded vote was ordered. The vote was taken by electronic device, and there were-ayes 124, noes 298, not voting 12, as follows: (Roll No. 73] So... The electronic vote tally's everything up, and the motion/amendment has been soundly defeated... or has it? Some guy named Weiss, uses up the last of the time going on a TOTALLY unrelated diatribe about martin luther king and random stuff totally un related to machine guns.. 0 1130
The CHAIRMAN. All time has ex- pired for consideration of the Hughes amendment to the Volkmer substitute. For what purpose does the gentle- man from New Jersey [Mr. HUGHES] rise? Time has run out, Hughes, desperately tries to get some more time to explain why machine guns are bad Mr. HUGHES. Mr. Chairman, I have a unanimous-consent request. Mr. Chairman, I made the motion to rise so that I could get additional time for the Rules Committee to finish debate on a number of amendments that were noticed, have not been reached and will not be heard, and that is unfortunate. It is an important matter. My unanimous-consent request is that I have 5 minutes to explain this vote. Mr. SENSENBRENNER. A point of order. Mr. Chairman, that is not a proper Inquiry. Mr. DINGELL. Mr. Chairman, a point of order. Regular order. The CHAIRMAN. The gentleman will state his unanimous-consent re- quest. Mr. HUGHES. Mr. Chairman, my unanimous request is that I have 5 minutes to explain this vote on ma- chinegun bans. The CHAIRMAN. Is there objection to the request of the gentleman from New Jersey? Mr. McCOLLUM. Reserving the right to object, Mr. Chairman, would the gentleman explain why he wants that 5 minutes? Mr. HUGHES. So we can explain what is pending before the House. Mr. McCOLLUM. Mr. Chairman, I withdraw my reservation of objection. The CHAIRMAN. Is there objection to the request of the gentleman from New Jersey [Mr. HUGHES]? Mr. SENSENBRENNER. Mr. Chair- man, I object. The CHAIRMAN. Objection is heard. Because he framed it as a unanimous consent, a simple objection overrules the request by Hughes for more time The question is on the amendment offered by the gentleman from New Jersey [Mr. HUGHES] to the amend- ment, as amended, offered by the gen- tleman from Missouri [Mr. VOLKMER] as a substitute for the Judiciary Com- mittee amendment in the nature of a substitute, as amended. This is where the voice vote is supposed to have occurred The amendment to the amendment, as amended, offered as a substitute for the Judiciary Committee amendment in the nature of a substitute, as amended, was agreed to. So, no record of the vote is made, no objections are made to the declaration (BY Charlie Rangel) that it passed... kind of strange, considering he's been 100% wrong all day in calling these things... Everyone apparently is getting ready for the ultimate vote on the bill which is up next. The CHAIRMAN. The question is on the amendment, as amended, offered by the gentleman from Missouri [Mr. VOLKMER], as a substitute for the Judi- ciary Committee amendment in the nature of a substitute, as amended. The question was taken; and the Chairman announced that the noes appeared to have it. Well, wouldn't you know it Charlie Rangel calls it for his team AGAIN... April 10, 1986 RECORDED VOTE Mr. VOLKMER. Mr. Chairman, I demand a recorded vote. A recorded vote was ordered. The vote was taken by electronic device, and there were-ayes 286, noes 136, not voting 12, as follows: Once again, Rangel is wrong, 286 apparently is bigger than 136 and the FOPA passes. And thats how it happened. |
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Posted: 11/22/2010 3:31:06 PM EDT
[#17]
In light of the recent censuring of that corrupt cocksucker rangel are the things passed by him as acting speaker null and void?
One does not magically become corrupted overnight but is a LONG time coming esp. one shitbag as crooked corrupt and dishonest as rangel. |
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Posted: 11/22/2010 4:12:46 PM EDT
[#18]
Quoted:
In light of the recent censuring of that corrupt cocksucker rangel are the things passed by him as acting speaker null and void? Uh, no! Nor should they be. That is the kind of thing that would haunt minority parties forever. |
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Posted: 11/29/2010 11:10:34 AM EDT
[#19]
I hope this is ok to post, I'm not sure what the policy is regarding soliciting for donations.
The price quote is here, Looks like I need to find $391.25 to get the full two reels that will cover the initial vote, shenanigans, and the FOPA passage. I currently have a zero balance in my paypal account so I can use that to collect contributions, with everything that shows up being put towards this project. If you'd like to kick in a few bucks towards the project, my paypal address is EDITED PENDING APPROVAL BY STAFF and yes, I know paypal sucks, but it is what I've got already in place that can be used immediately to make this happen. I'll keep this thread posted with updates and totals, Please include a note if you would like your contribution to remain anonymous. |
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Posted: 11/29/2010 11:38:17 AM EDT
[#20]
Donations Received so far: (as of 12:14pm 11/29/210)
Dr Rockso––––––––––––––$20 (calguns) Nick––––––––––––––––––-$100 (calguns) |
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Posted: 11/29/2010 11:45:41 AM EDT
[#21]
Quoted:
My offer still stands if somebody finds the tape. There is one change. It is no longer a 'pay for the cost of', it is a reward. $100, through paypal or gun pal, to whomever finds this tape and gets it up. From PM: If I can find it, what kind of format do you want?...
Youtube would be best. Anything that can easily be spread far and wide will do. I'll make good on my offer shortly. |
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Posted: 11/29/2010 11:45:56 AM EDT
[#22]
Quoted: pinned announcement on donation policyI hope this is ok to post, I'm not sure what the policy is regarding soliciting for donations. |
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Posted: 11/29/2010 11:47:36 AM EDT
[#23]
Quoted:
I hope this is ok to post, I'm not sure what the policy is regarding soliciting for donations. The price quote is here, Looks like I need to find $391.25 to get the full two reels that will cover the initial vote, shenanigans, and the FOPA passage. I currently have a zero balance in my paypal account so I can use that to collect contributions, with everything that shows up being put towards this project. If you'd like to kick in a few bucks towards the project, my paypal address is edited pending approval of staff and yes, I know paypal sucks, but it is what I've got already in place that can be used immediately to make this happen. I'll keep this thread posted with updates and totals, Please include a note if you would like your contribution to remain anonymous. How long until we see it on youtube or other similar widely spread video format? |
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Posted: 11/29/2010 11:49:23 AM EDT
[#24]
In for the interest. Give me a few days and I might have something I can cough up in Paypal. No guarantees but I'll take a look.
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Posted: 11/29/2010 11:54:12 AM EDT
[#25]
Quoted:
Quoted:
pinned announcement on donation policy
I hope this is ok to post, I'm not sure what the policy is regarding soliciting for donations. I've sent a PM to Striker, I apologize for not getting approval ahead of time... I was just very excited about the looming success of the project. Marc |
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Posted: 11/29/2010 11:57:06 AM EDT
[#26]
Quoted:
Quoted:
I hope this is ok to post, I'm not sure what the policy is regarding soliciting for donations. The price quote is here, Looks like I need to find $391.25 to get the full two reels that will cover the initial vote, shenanigans, and the FOPA passage. I currently have a zero balance in my paypal account so I can use that to collect contributions, with everything that shows up being put towards this project. If you'd like to kick in a few bucks towards the project, my paypal address is edited pending approval of staff and yes, I know paypal sucks, but it is what I've got already in place that can be used immediately to make this happen. I'll keep this thread posted with updates and totals, Please include a note if you would like your contribution to remain anonymous. How long until we see it on youtube or other similar widely spread video format? The official quote from the Library of Congress is 4-9 weeks, I'll have the raw footage uploaded within 24 hours of receiving it, and should hopefully have something more polished put together within a week of receiving it (other than 2a rights masochists like myself I doubt many will want to watch the full 3 hours) |
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Posted: 11/29/2010 11:59:22 AM EDT
[#27]
Exactly what are film reels? Are we talking old 16mm stuff or what? Is the LOC going to send you copies on reels, or do they transfer them to DVD or something? If DVD, we need some kind of distribution system in place so multiple members can get their hands on the copies to upload them to Youtube or something similar.
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Posted: 11/29/2010 12:15:17 PM EDT
[#28]
Quoted:
Exactly what are film reels? Are we talking old 16mm stuff or what? Is the LOC going to send you copies on reels, or do they transfer them to DVD or something? If DVD, we need some kind of distribution system in place so multiple members can get their hands on the copies to upload them to Youtube or something similar. I believe the footage is on a 16mm (1/2 inch) master (I have the info in my notes, but I'm not sitting in front of them right now, just updating this from a school computer lab) The footage is being transferred onto DVD's A number of gunners have offered to help me with distribution of the DVD footage, but It will probably be faster just for me to upload it straight to youtube. I will make copies available to people wanting to duplicate/distribute hard copies for research/archival purposes as well, but as I have never duplicated a DVD before, I may take a little longer doing it, and have to get some help from a local buddy who owns a film studio. Just a quick note, I can't charge any money for copies (no commercial use), and I can't use them for 'political purposes' (according to the LOC duplication agreements). And I believe that would also bind anyone who I gave the copies of the footage to... |
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Posted: 11/29/2010 12:18:10 PM EDT
[#29]
tag
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Posted: 11/29/2010 12:20:58 PM EDT
[#30]
I'll chip in later today when I'm back home. How does pay pal work? I don't have an account do I need one?
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Posted: 11/29/2010 12:22:44 PM EDT
[#31]
Hang on a minute then. Does the quote include licensing for public
performance, or are those even available? Look, I know copies of dvd's may be made for some folks here...hell it happens all over the world every damn day. No big deal. But once you upload that stuff to Youtube then it's open-season and the .gov could conceivably have it removed. Check and re-check if you have to. Hell email a couple of news stations like CNN or Fox and ask them "What do I have to ask the Library of Congress for if I want footage of the House/Senate and wanted to broadcast it?" Then you should be good to go. |
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Posted: 11/29/2010 12:26:57 PM EDT
[#32]
You might want to cross post this on some other forums, especially those dealing with Class 3.
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Posted: 11/29/2010 12:34:37 PM EDT
[#33]
Quoted:
Hang on a minute then. Does the quote include licensing for publicperformance, or are those even available? Look, I know copies of dvd'smay be made for some folks here...hell it happens all over the worldevery damn day. No big deal. But once you upload that stuff toYoutube then it's open-season and the .gov could conceivably have itremoved. Check and re-check if you have to. Hell email a couple ofnews stations like CNN or Fox and ask them "What do I have to ask theLibrary of Congress for if I want footage of the House/Senate andwanted to broadcast it?" Then you should be good to go. ANY video or film produced or made by the US government, in any capacity, is 100% in the PUBLIC DOMAIN. The footage can be reproduced and distributed free of charge to ANYONE at ANYTIME for ANY PURPOSE. The fees ($300 or whatever) are simply processing/DVD transferring fees. ETA: And if we determine this machine gun ban vote is null and void, once the media gets a hold of this, won't there will be a new machine gun ban bill passed within days? What am I missing here? What would be the implications/impacts? |
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Posted: 11/29/2010 12:35:17 PM EDT
[#34]
Quoted:
Hang on a minute then. Does the quote include licensing for publicperformance, or are those even available? Look, I know copies of dvd'smay be made for some folks here...hell it happens all over the worldevery damn day. No big deal. But once you upload that stuff toYoutube then it's open-season and the .gov could conceivably have itremoved. Check and re-check if you have to. Hell email a couple ofnews stations like CNN or Fox and ask them "What do I have to ask theLibrary of Congress for if I want footage of the House/Senate andwanted to broadcast it?" Then you should be good to go. My understanding is that disseminating this footage for informational purposes is allowed under fair use. My objective is to get the footage, and to pass it along to other researchers for non commercial use. As long as no one is making money off of the footage or using it to endorse political candidates we should be ok. |
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Posted: 11/29/2010 12:38:31 PM EDT
[#35]
Quoted: ANY video or film produced or made by the US government, in any capacity, is 100% in the PUBLIC DOMAIN. The footage can be reproduced and distributed free of charge to ANYONE and ANYTIME for ANY PURPOSE. The fees ($300 or whatever) are simply processing/DVD transferring fees. Quoted: My understanding is that disseminating this footage for informational purposes is allowed under fair use. My objective is to get the footage, and to pass it along to other researchers for non commercial use. As long as no one is making money off of the footage or using it to endorse political candidates we should be ok. Ok then. I just wanted to be absolutely sure the licensing in this order doesn't say anything along the lines of "for private viewing only" or similar. |
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Posted: 11/29/2010 12:49:12 PM EDT
[#37]
Quoted: Quoted: Well, for the real tin foil inclined, I would have someone innocently go directly to the LOC and get the tape and film it, before some dork sees what it is and it gets "lost" I'd be more than willing to do it, but the time/money involved in the trip to DC is more than I can swing at the moment. If anyone is in the DC metro area it wouldn't be a bad idea.. I'm at Georgetown Univ. I could get it if need be. |
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Posted: 11/29/2010 12:56:45 PM EDT
[#38]
Poor man's tag.
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Posted: 11/29/2010 1:01:02 PM EDT
[#39]
I hope that this means something...
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Posted: 11/29/2010 1:19:32 PM EDT
[#40]
Quoted:
Hang on a minute then. Does the quote include licensing for publicperformance, or are those even available? Look, I know copies of dvd'smay be made for some folks here...hell it happens all over the worldevery damn day. No big deal. But once you upload that stuff toYoutube then it's open-season and the .gov could conceivably have itremoved. Check and re-check if you have to. Hell email a couple ofnews stations like CNN or Fox and ask them "What do I have to ask theLibrary of Congress for if I want footage of the House/Senate andwanted to broadcast it?" Then you should be good to go. There should be *no* licensing whatsoever. These films are squarely in the public domain, not covered by any copyright. I doubt the LOC even has the right to ask for any restriction on their distribution or use whatsoever. http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/17/105.html |
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Posted: 11/29/2010 1:19:46 PM EDT
[#41]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Hang on a minute then. Does the quote include licensing for publicperformance, or are those even available? Look, I know copies of dvd'smay be made for some folks here...hell it happens all over the worldevery damn day. No big deal. But once you upload that stuff toYoutube then it's open-season and the .gov could conceivably have itremoved. Check and re-check if you have to. Hell email a couple ofnews stations like CNN or Fox and ask them "What do I have to ask theLibrary of Congress for if I want footage of the House/Senate andwanted to broadcast it?" Then you should be good to go. My understanding is that disseminating this footage for informational purposes is allowed under fair use. My objective is to get the footage, and to pass it along to other researchers for non commercial use. As long as no one is making money off of the footage or using it to endorse political candidates we should be ok. There is no "fair use" on anything produced by the government. It's not protected by copyright. |
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Posted: 11/29/2010 1:21:19 PM EDT
[#42]
Quoted:
ETA: And if we determine this machine gun ban vote is null and void, once the media gets a hold of this, won't there will be a new machine gun ban bill passed within days? What am I missing here? What would be the implications/impacts? The bill won't automatically be invalidated, even though there may have been impropriety the judiciary will not rule on procedural matters of congress, (separation of powers) My hope is that bringing this issue to light (particularly since good ol Charlie Rangel is currently persona non grata) will educate, and outrage a generation of gunnies who didn't even know this happened. Having a video of a constitutionally protected right being stripped from the American public through outright deceit could be a huge motivator to get involved in the Pro 2A movement. If this were more widely known, (and peole had seen/hard it with themselves instead of just Internet rumor and hearsay) it could provide considerable pressure to reform the FOPA... After all the NRA did promise Regan that the Hughes amendment could be 'fixed later' when he asked if he should sign it.... methinks 25 years is plenty of time to acknowledge the inherent issues. |
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Posted: 11/29/2010 1:22:34 PM EDT
[#43]
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<...> The good ol library of congress has a film reel copy. The reel we need is: 17:24-18:56 (VTA 0234) http://lccn.loc.gov/91796846 <...> Shit just got real It is about to get reel. |
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Posted: 11/29/2010 1:25:15 PM EDT
[#44]
Tag (and awfully glad to see that it was my congresscritter giving Hughes and Rangle a hard time in 1986).
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Posted: 11/29/2010 1:31:39 PM EDT
[#45]
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There is no "fair use" on anything produced by the government. It's not protected by copyright. Upon closer examination I'm inclined to agree with you, I think the LOC disclaimer may be for archived footage which was not generated by government (i.e. copywriten material which later had copyright transfered to the LOC) This footage was generated by government employees as part of their regular work... so it should be public domain. In that regard, this footage is substantially more useful than the C-Span footage would have been. |
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Posted: 11/29/2010 1:36:48 PM EDT
[#46]
I like where this is going
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Posted: 11/29/2010 1:43:54 PM EDT
[#47]
Just to update everyone with regards to where we are at.
Donations Received so far: (as of 1:21pm 11/29/210) Total in hand ($210), total inbound $20, +$100 pending ar15.com admin aproval Dr Rockso––––––––––––––$20 (calguns) Nick––––––––––––––––––-$100 (calguns) PTK...........................$10 (thehighroad.org) Ravenslair..................$40 (calguns) tuolomejim.................$20 (calguns) inbound check SpringfieldEMP.............$20 (calguns) Jdude........................$100 (ar15.com) pending admin aproval for solicitation ––––- Total pledged/donated––––––––-$310 Total needed––––––––––––––––––-$391.25 Amount left––––––––––––––––––––$81.25 There is an amazing amount of interest in getting ahold of this footage. |
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Posted: 11/29/2010 2:03:30 PM EDT
[#48]
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I wonder, hypothetically, what would happen if someone could prove the amendment did not pass? What a can of worms that would open... Might be a novel argument for the defense in an illegal mg case. Is there a lawyer in the house? That's precisely what I was thinking. I'm sure it would have to go to SCOTUS though. It won't have any effect. The courts will not "look behind" the legilative process as a matter of separation of powers. Once the Vice President (or president pro tem) and the Speaker of the House certify that the respective bodies each passed a bill that's it. If the President then signs the bill it becomes law whether there was a procedural irregularity or not. Perhaps a minor irregularity but this is a Constitutional question, so I would be surprised if they did not take it. I would bet that they wouldn't take it. It would most likely fall under "political question doctrine" and would be avoided by the court. Furthermore is the court did take the case and found it to be a Constitutional violation it may undermine the legitimacy of the court in many eyes, so given that taking the case would be such a crap shoot with regard to both stare decisis and legitimancy I highy doubt the court would even accept the case let alone rule on it. |
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Posted: 11/29/2010 2:37:23 PM EDT
[#49]
I will donate the rest of the needed funds... I am mobile right now but will check back for payment info when I get home.
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Posted: 11/29/2010 2:45:52 PM EDT
[#50]
You think this is the only time this has happened?
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