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Posted: 4/20/2014 1:37:57 PM EDT
[#1]
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Of all the retards to get those cars. That show is is the Sons of Guns of the car shows. It would have been better if Wayne Carini or Peter Klutt or Chip Foose had found those cars. Chip Foose NOT, he does way more harm than good. Foose would not know what a properly restored car was if it drove over the top of him. He "customizes" cars , thats not the way we do it with rare pony and muscle cars. |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 1:40:11 PM EDT
[#2]
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Seems like he is all business. With the proliferation of idiots in the car game, I probably wouldn't be mister super friendly either. Then again, with the exception of his giant wheel fetish, Foose is widely thought of as "the man" in classic car circles. I have spoken to a few people that know Chip and they say he is the real deal. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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They say Carini is less than a personable sort of guy in person. I can see that. Might be presumptuous to label him a prick, but he gives off a stand-offish personality vibe on the show. Might be the greatest guy in the world to those in his circle, but I don't get the feeling that he runs around looking to make new friends. Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile Seems like he is all business. With the proliferation of idiots in the car game, I probably wouldn't be mister super friendly either. Then again, with the exception of his giant wheel fetish, Foose is widely thought of as "the man" in classic car circles. I have spoken to a few people that know Chip and they say he is the real deal. Foose is a hotrodder/customizer, so for someone looking to maintain 100% authentic original restoration, I'm not sure he's the guy. His skill set is making it awesomer. Come up with his own curves and features, etc. Foose is the bomb at what he does, but he doesn't "return classic automobiles to factory new." Two different disciplines. Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 1:40:12 PM EDT
[#3]
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Holy grail hardly, Hemi Cuda, GTO Judge, LS5 SS Chevelle, any of the Yenko's these are Holy grail cars. None of what you mentioned are #1 and #2 pre production cars. Rawlings found beyond rare.......... ETA..LS6 would be more desireable. |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 1:40:22 PM EDT
[#4]
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Holy grail hardly, Hemi Cuda, GTO Judge, LS5 SS Chevelle, any of the Yenko's these are Holy grail cars. Why not the LS6 Chevelle? |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 1:41:52 PM EDT
[#5]
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None of what you mentioned are #1 and #2 pre production cars. Rawlings found beyond rare.......... ETA..LS6 would be more desireable. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Holy grail hardly, Hemi Cuda, GTO Judge, LS5 SS Chevelle, any of the Yenko's these are Holy grail cars. None of what you mentioned are #1 and #2 pre production cars. Rawlings found beyond rare.......... ETA..LS6 would be more desireable. He didn't find them, he answered the phone when the owner came looking for someone who could fix them and make them famous at the same time. Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 1:46:18 PM EDT
[#6]
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Foose would not know what a properly restored car was if it drove over the top of him. He "customizes" cars , thats not the way we do it with rare pony and muscle cars. I'm gonna call BS. He's a car guy, he knows. It's just not what he does. If you brought him a rare numbers matching all original something or other, he'd tell you to sell it and chop up a less valuable version. Not every car is deserving of a meticulous concourse restoration. Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 1:51:22 PM EDT
[#7]
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If they found a long lost '64 Pontiac Banshee that would be more notable. Hubba hubba! 
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Posted: 4/20/2014 1:57:37 PM EDT
[#8]
FIFY
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Holy grail hardly, Hemi Cuda, GTO Judge, LS56 SS Chevelle, any of the Yenko's these are Holy grail cars. |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 2:00:39 PM EDT
[#9]
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I'm sorry, but the holy grail of muscle cars would be the 1 remaining Boss 429 1970 Cougar Eliminater. Only 2 ever made and 1 went to the crusher in the 70's and nobody knows where the other 1 is. In a back field with .22 holes peppering it. |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 2:01:22 PM EDT
[#10]
A pontiac? Lmao. Did it come w a mullet and a single wide?
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Posted: 4/20/2014 2:03:32 PM EDT
[#11]
I love that show. Can't wait to see the episode.
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Posted: 4/20/2014 2:33:30 PM EDT
[#12]
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Of all the retards to get those cars. That show is is the Sons of Guns of the car shows. It would have been better if Wayne Carini or Peter Klutt or Chip Foose had found those cars. not foose !!! he would have scraped the Pontiac engines and put small blocks in them ..... he does that shit all the time on his show and as a poncho lover I fucking hate it,,,,, |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 2:36:08 PM EDT
[#13]
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Firebirds were NEVER considered a Muscle Car. Biggest factory motor for a Firebird was a 350. The muscle cars for Pontiac were the GTO and Trans Am. what !!!! the the biggest engines in 67/69 firebirds was a 400 ci Pontiac in one of its many forms . the trans am is a firebird ..... |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 2:42:52 PM EDT
[#14]
I don't know about you guys, but this would be my holy grail barn find
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Posted: 4/20/2014 2:47:14 PM EDT
[#15]
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Holy grail hardly, Hemi Cuda, GTO Judge, LS5 SS Chevelle, any of the Yenko's these are Holy grail cars. don't forget the Royal Bobcat Pontiacs ...... |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 2:49:57 PM EDT
[#16]
As far as Chickens go, I'd rather find a '69 1/2.
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Posted: 4/20/2014 2:51:16 PM EDT
[#17]
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Of all the retards to get those cars. That show is is the Sons of Guns of the car shows. It would have been better if Wayne Carini or Peter Klutt or Chip Foose had found those cars. How so? They don't blow tempter tantrums like 5 year olds. They put out decent products. The show is entertaining and not an embarrassment to the community or men. |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 2:52:07 PM EDT
[#18]
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Firebirds were NEVER considered a Muscle Car. Biggest factory motor for a Firebird was a 350. The muscle cars for Pontiac were the GTO and Trans Am. No 350 offered. 326 and a 400, making 325hp. |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 2:53:37 PM EDT
[#19]
Am I the only one on ARFCOM who thought of this? Cant believe I'm the first:
"Down in his barn My uncle preserved for me an old machine For fifty-odd years; To keep it as new has been his dearest dream. I strip away the old debris That hides the shining car: A brilliant red Barchetta from a better, vanished time. .." |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 2:55:43 PM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted: nice find, but I consider this the "Holy Grail" of muscle cars https://encrypted-tbn1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQFDP_XOeqNGdWwfVb6Afjsu5ehV-u7SAT2hhycletzJ7u-RZ1B I'll be in my bunk |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 2:56:09 PM EDT
[#21]
There were a few other good suggestions in this thread but I would have picked a Cuda convertible as my Holy Grail of muscle cars.
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Posted: 4/20/2014 2:56:34 PM EDT
[#22]
If you're a firebird lover then yes, these are the holy grails. One's a drop top and the other looks to be a hard top.
Pretty cool to be able to say you own both first. |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 3:02:08 PM EDT
[#23]
The only value these have are to boomers reliving the glory days of their youth. They are just old, junky cars.
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Posted: 4/20/2014 3:04:24 PM EDT
[#24]
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Holy Grail? Not really. Great find though. |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 3:07:23 PM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I don't know about you guys, but this would be my holy grail barn find http://www.ferrarilife.com/forums/attachments/pre-69-212-250/6849d1191449988-identify-ferrari-250gto.jpg But it is worth exponentially more than the two Firebirds and is way sexier. Hell, the restoration would cost more than the restored Firebirds are worth.
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Posted: 4/20/2014 3:18:26 PM EDT
[#26]
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How much will he and his team fuck them up before selling them? A bunch. |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 3:27:34 PM EDT
[#27]
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Holy grail hardly, Hemi Cuda, GTO Judge, LS5 SS Chevelle, any of the Yenko's these are Holy grail cars. Hemi Cuda was the first thing that came to my mind. I love the old firebirds though. I don't recall what year, but the model with the two hood scoops on the front of the hood is my dream muscle car. |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 3:27:48 PM EDT
[#28]
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Firebirds were NEVER considered a Muscle Car. Biggest factory motor for a Firebird was a 350. The muscle cars for Pontiac were the GTO and Trans Am. A stock '69 Grand Prix SJ with the HO428 would smoke most Ram Air 4 cars, and SD455's......... Holy Grail Firebird is a '68 with the "Royal Bobcat" kit....428HO 4spd...kinda like the Yenko of Pontiacs........ List Price (base) $2,781.00 Price as tested (list – includes 428 conversion) $5,149.74 Weight 3,300 pounds 0 to 30 mph – 3.0 seconds 0 to 60 mph – 4.9 seconds Standing start, 1/4 mile 12.55 seconds Miles per hour, 1/4 mile 110 mph Economy 6 – 13 mpg 
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Posted: 4/20/2014 3:39:53 PM EDT
[#29]
Though I agree they are not an automotive holy grail its a rare find. As others have said a 400 was available 67-69 birds. Pontiac though gone now began the muscle car era with the 64 gto and ended it with the last 400 trans am's @1979. I define a muscle car as a body smaller than a full size sedan with a large cube motor but still having a back seat. By @1979 the mustang as it was known was gone, so was the chevelle, and dodges. The anemic 305 z/28 was a distant second. We owe gratitude to Pontiac for the cars of that era.
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Posted: 4/20/2014 4:42:25 PM EDT
[#30]
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I would consider the Bullet Mustang a more Holy Grail car than a Firebird I am aware the real Holy Grail car, a 1965 Shelby GT350-R Mustang with full SCCA documentation of the original owner's racing career during his college years. After college he was commissioned into the Army and sent to Viet Nam. He was KIA and his father has kept the Mustang in his barn ever since. The Shelby owners club has been hunting for this car and nobody knows what happened to the car after 1968. All that is known is that it raced in 1968 and ended the season in running condition. I have a buddy who is into Shelbys and he got wind of the car and found it. The father will not part with it before he dies, although he's into his 90s. My buddy is working on getting first right of refusal on the car. Hopefully when the estate is being settled he will be able to buy the car. Otherwise it's going to be a very interesting estate auction when that car comes up for bid. |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 4:42:35 PM EDT
[#31]
recovered? I hope that means paid the rightful owners a fair price. Just because an old vehicle is in a barn does NOT mean it is fair play for anyone to go out and grab (there was a dumbass in Southern AB who got in trouble pulling an old 40s truck out of a farmer's back field without permission)
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Posted: 4/20/2014 4:44:44 PM EDT
[#32]
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Of all the retards to get those cars. That show is is the Sons of Guns of the car shows. It would have been better if Wayne Carini or Peter Klutt or Chip Foose had found those cars. FIFY |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 4:46:33 PM EDT
[#33]
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nice find, but I consider this the "Holy Grail" of muscle cars https://encrypted-tbn1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQFDP_XOeqNGdWwfVb6Afjsu5ehV-u7SAT2hhycletzJ7u-RZ1B My man! |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 4:48:32 PM EDT
[#34]
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I don't know about you guys, but this would be my holy grail barn find
http://www.ferrarilife.com/forums/attachments/pre-69-212-250/6849d1191449988-identify-ferrari-250gto.jpg Or the Shelby Cobra Daytona barn find that's tied up in an ownership lawsuit out in California. |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 5:03:29 PM EDT
[#35]
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How much will he and his team fuck them up before selling them? Probably a lot. Fuck that whole crew, bunch of wannabe hacks. They didn't start the real gas monkey garage and even got caught selling other people's cars as their own. Car flip shows are the worst and as a Pontiac fan I'm pretty pissed they have these. http://spankmymarketer.com/summary.html |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 5:05:10 PM EDT
[#36]
a thunderchicken convertible isn't anywhere near close to a "holy grail" musclecar
it would be worth restoring but probably any original hemi mopar would be worth more money I'm trying to picture what "the first two ever made" would add to the value of the cars it's a distinction but it's a distinction of a common car, they made 82,000 firebirds in 1967 that's a lot I'm definitely not feeling the "grail" aspects of these cars |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 5:09:36 PM EDT
[#37]
Finding the #1 & 2 Firebirds ever made would be an exceptional score.
They are technically PONY CARS. Holy Grail is too far-fetched as there could be a good many cars considered for that moniker. Still, as much as I don't care for THAT show...they made a GREAT FIND! I love Pontiacs. Hope they do right by the ones they found. |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 5:19:16 PM EDT
[#38]
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I can see that. Might be presumptuous to label him a prick, but he gives off a stand-offish personality vibe on the show. Might be the greatest guy in the world to those in his circle, but I don't get the feeling that he runs around looking to make new friends. Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile Quote HistoryQuoted:
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They say Carini is less than a personable sort of guy in person. I can see that. Might be presumptuous to label him a prick, but he gives off a stand-offish personality vibe on the show. Might be the greatest guy in the world to those in his circle, but I don't get the feeling that he runs around looking to make new friends. Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile Consider that he has a showroom full of 100k plus classics and tire kickers with 30k of credit wanting to look at them 24/7. |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 5:25:05 PM EDT
[#39]
Don't know what all the hate is about
I would like to have them. Sure there may be some I would like better but I would be content with them. 
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Posted: 4/20/2014 5:29:54 PM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The only value these have are to boomers reliving the glory days of their youth. They are just old, junky cars.  |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 5:31:05 PM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Consider that he has a showroom full of 1500k plus classics and tire kickers with 30k of credit wanting to look at them 24/7. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: They say Carini is less than a personable sort of guy in person. I can see that. Might be presumptuous to label him a prick, but he gives off a stand-offish personality vibe on the show. Might be the greatest guy in the world to those in his circle, but I don't get the feeling that he runs around looking to make new friends. Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile Consider that he has a showroom full of 1500k plus classics and tire kickers with 30k of credit wanting to look at them 24/7. And I'd love to find where the last of the 8 1969 Trans Am convertibles is hiding |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 5:31:22 PM EDT
[#42]
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Posted: 4/20/2014 5:33:55 PM EDT
[#43]
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Now if they were Mustangs it would be a real find. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Lol...firebirds...holy grail...  Now if they were Mustangs it would be a real find. IIRC the first Mustang off the line on the first day of production is sitting in the Henry Ford Museum in Dearborn wearing Canadian plates . Just behind flat head serial number 1 when I was there 20 years ago. It was the very last line on the placard that had that fact. |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 5:35:07 PM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I would consider the Bullet Mustang a more Holy Grail car than a Firebird That's cool and all , and numbers 1 and 2 is even cooler , but the term 'Holy Grail' has been misused into the ground  |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 5:38:03 PM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryQuoted: nice find, but I consider this the "Holy Grail" of muscle cars https://encrypted-tbn1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQFDP_XOeqNGdWwfVb6Afjsu5ehV-u7SAT2hhycletzJ7u-RZ1B  ..which just so happens to be for sale , along with a few other gems .......... http://www.mecum.com/auctions/group_consignment_list.cfm?AUCTION_ID=CH1013&GROUP_ID=10138  |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 5:38:30 PM EDT
[#46]
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If I remember correctly, the 400 was reserved for the '69 Trans Am when it came out to give it something a little more potent over the Firebird to compete with the now more powerful Mustangs, Camaros, Mopars of that time. Of course there was also the optional Ram III and Ram IV system to boost even more power. edit: I have seen 400 Firebirds, which are a Gen1, but they weren't until 1969 when the T/A's had already come to market. I've never seen a '67 400 Firebird---that's what Fast n Loud has found. The 455SD's were only found in the (later) around 72 and 73 Trans Am's and I believe the LeMan Grand Am's that I've ever seen. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Firebirds were NEVER considered a Muscle Car. Biggest factory motor for a Firebird was a 350. The muscle cars for Pontiac were the GTO and Trans Am. No first gens could have up to a 400. If I remember correctly, the 400 was reserved for the '69 Trans Am when it came out to give it something a little more potent over the Firebird to compete with the now more powerful Mustangs, Camaros, Mopars of that time. Of course there was also the optional Ram III and Ram IV system to boost even more power. edit: I have seen 400 Firebirds, which are a Gen1, but they weren't until 1969 when the T/A's had already come to market. I've never seen a '67 400 Firebird---that's what Fast n Loud has found. The 455SD's were only found in the (later) around 72 and 73 Trans Am's and I believe the LeMan Grand Am's that I've ever seen. Couldn't you get a 455 in a 69-70 GTO Judge? |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 5:39:56 PM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I don't know about you guys, but this would be my holy grail barn find http://www.ferrarilife.com/forums/attachments/pre-69-212-250/6849d1191449988-identify-ferrari-250gto.jpg Proper GTO ? |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 5:40:51 PM EDT
[#48]
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Couldn't you get a 455 in a 69-70 GTO Judge? Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Firebirds were NEVER considered a Muscle Car. Biggest factory motor for a Firebird was a 350. The muscle cars for Pontiac were the GTO and Trans Am. No first gens could have up to a 400. If I remember correctly, the 400 was reserved for the '69 Trans Am when it came out to give it something a little more potent over the Firebird to compete with the now more powerful Mustangs, Camaros, Mopars of that time. Of course there was also the optional Ram III and Ram IV system to boost even more power. edit: I have seen 400 Firebirds, which are a Gen1, but they weren't until 1969 when the T/A's had already come to market. I've never seen a '67 400 Firebird---that's what Fast n Loud has found. The 455SD's were only found in the (later) around 72 and 73 Trans Am's and I believe the LeMan Grand Am's that I've ever seen. Couldn't you get a 455 in a 69-70 GTO Judge? First year 455 was '70......There were a few ram air 5 400's in '69......way rare though |
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Posted: 4/20/2014 5:42:29 PM EDT
[#49]
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Nice, but a couple of GT500s would tickle me more. This from a former '67 Firebird owner. Or just 1 original, parts matching Thunderbolt.
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Posted: 4/20/2014 5:47:08 PM EDT
[#50]
This is the 'HOLY GRAIL' of MUSCLE CARS :
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