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Posted: 8/15/2016 2:20:45 PM EDT
[#1]
man, what's SHE want?
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Posted: 8/15/2016 4:23:19 PM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
man, what's SHE want? that is a good point. learned that one the expensive way with her handgun. (the double action trigger of a revolver was just to much for her and she actually liked a semi better) truth be told if I let her use her 22 she would grab it first. weight is a big issue with her especially nose heavy, followed by recoil, noise she's gotten used to. she's very confident with her 22. If money were no object i'd love to get her a PS90 and sbr it, but thats more than i'm looking to spend. I could start by building her an upper and put it on my sbr lower. and gas to the face with the suppressor is not happening with her, thats why i'd have to do a piston setup. I've even considered trying to see if someone would build a .221 fireball barrel but that could be a whole different set of problems (feeding, enough gas, ect...) |
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Posted: 8/15/2016 9:13:38 PM EDT
[#3]
5.56 out of a 7 inch barrel is sufficient for defensive shooting under 50 yards, but even with a suppressor it will be really loud.
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Posted: 8/15/2016 10:19:34 PM EDT
[#4]
Doesn't fit your barrel length requirement, but women seem to like the Beretta CX4 Storm. Short, light, low-maintenance, very reliable and will accept factory 20 and 30 round mags (9mm).
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Posted: 8/16/2016 9:14:24 AM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Doesn't fit your barrel length requirement, but women seem to like the Beretta CX4 Storm. Short, light, low-maintenance, very reliable and will accept factory 20 and 30 round mags (9mm). did a bunch of reading last night and the black hills 50gr tsx sounds like the ticket in a shorty 5.56. I read that the commercial offering of the 50tsx bullet is not the same as black hills. has anyone tested the 45gr tsx in a sbr? |
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Posted: 8/16/2016 9:45:12 AM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted: that is a good point. learned that one the expensive way with her handgun. (the double action trigger of a revolver was just to much for her and she actually liked a semi better) truth be told if I let her use her 22 she would grab it first. weight is a big issue with her especially nose heavy, followed by recoil, noise she's gotten used to. she's very confident with her 22. If money were no object i'd love to get her a PS90 and sbr it, but thats more than i'm looking to spend. I could start by building her an upper and put it on my sbr lower. and gas to the face with the suppressor is not happening with her, thats why i'd have to do a piston setup. I've even considered trying to see if someone would build a .221 fireball barrel but that could be a whole different set of problems (feeding, enough gas, ect...) Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: man, what's SHE want? that is a good point. learned that one the expensive way with her handgun. (the double action trigger of a revolver was just to much for her and she actually liked a semi better) truth be told if I let her use her 22 she would grab it first. weight is a big issue with her especially nose heavy, followed by recoil, noise she's gotten used to. she's very confident with her 22. If money were no object i'd love to get her a PS90 and sbr it, but thats more than i'm looking to spend. I could start by building her an upper and put it on my sbr lower. and gas to the face with the suppressor is not happening with her, thats why i'd have to do a piston setup. I've even considered trying to see if someone would build a .221 fireball barrel but that could be a whole different set of problems (feeding, enough gas, ect...) PCC using Glock fun-sticks is the way I would go - either a 9mm AR or something like a Keltec Sub2k. Second choice would be a 300blk SBR shooting subs with a can. Piston or not up to you. I think if you modded the CH or used a dustbuster CH it should mitigate most of the DI gas blowback. Could use a forward-assist vent as well. What suppressor are you planning for? |
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Posted: 8/16/2016 10:18:25 AM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
PCC using Glock fun-sticks is the way I would go - either a 9mm AR or something like a Keltec Sub2k. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
man, what's SHE want? that is a good point. learned that one the expensive way with her handgun. (the double action trigger of a revolver was just to much for her and she actually liked a semi better) truth be told if I let her use her 22 she would grab it first. weight is a big issue with her especially nose heavy, followed by recoil, noise she's gotten used to. she's very confident with her 22. If money were no object i'd love to get her a PS90 and sbr it, but thats more than i'm looking to spend. I could start by building her an upper and put it on my sbr lower. and gas to the face with the suppressor is not happening with her, thats why i'd have to do a piston setup. I've even considered trying to see if someone would build a .221 fireball barrel but that could be a whole different set of problems (feeding, enough gas, ect...) PCC using Glock fun-sticks is the way I would go - either a 9mm AR or something like a Keltec Sub2k. This. Mine is light and very ergonomic and keeps 10 shots in a palm size group at 40 yards.  " />
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Posted: 8/16/2016 10:20:16 AM EDT
[#8]
In 9mm Zeneth MP5K with mico dot sight. My wife loves mine, specially suppressed. Very low recoil. Cheap to shoot, which means more practice time, which equals more quality hits on target.
In 5.56, any decent 10.5inch or 11.5 inch AR will work. Specially with a Bravo light weight barrel. |
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Posted: 8/16/2016 11:31:08 AM EDT
[#9]
7.5" 5.56 AR's Suck... Poor ballistics, loud, and gassy
If you want to go that short in a AR platform I would build a 9mm --- My recommendation would be a Zenith MP5K clone or a CZ Scorpion EVO |
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Posted: 8/16/2016 12:10:29 PM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
PCC using Glock fun-sticks is the way I would go - either a 9mm AR or something like a Keltec Sub2k. Second choice would be a 300blk SBR shooting subs with a can. Piston or not up to you. I think if you modded the CH or used a dustbuster CH it should mitigate most of the DI gas blowback. Could use a forward-assist vent as well. What suppressor are you planning for? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
man, what's SHE want? that is a good point. learned that one the expensive way with her handgun. (the double action trigger of a revolver was just to much for her and she actually liked a semi better) truth be told if I let her use her 22 she would grab it first. weight is a big issue with her especially nose heavy, followed by recoil, noise she's gotten used to. she's very confident with her 22. If money were no object i'd love to get her a PS90 and sbr it, but thats more than i'm looking to spend. I could start by building her an upper and put it on my sbr lower. and gas to the face with the suppressor is not happening with her, thats why i'd have to do a piston setup. I've even considered trying to see if someone would build a .221 fireball barrel but that could be a whole different set of problems (feeding, enough gas, ect...) PCC using Glock fun-sticks is the way I would go - either a 9mm AR or something like a Keltec Sub2k. Second choice would be a 300blk SBR shooting subs with a can. Piston or not up to you. I think if you modded the CH or used a dustbuster CH it should mitigate most of the DI gas blowback. Could use a forward-assist vent as well. What suppressor are you planning for? I'm building two form 1's when my stamps come back. 1 is a 1.5x7" 30 cal can debating between titanium or chromoly. will have an inconel blast baffle (will be used for 5.56 and .308 for now) the second will be a titanium 1.18"x8" 9mm can which i'll use on 22lr, and 9mm. the 30 will be 60' clipped cones and spacers, the 9mm modified K's. looks like a PCC in 9mm is the general concensus. I have considered this and it doesn't sound like a bad idea. gives me an excuse to try one of the glock mag lowers too. would simplify the ammo situation and be crazy quiet. I load her mouse fart loads with 158gr bullets for her 9mm. got it where its just reliable. I need to chrono them I bet there doing under 800ft/sec. they have considerably less blast than my 124's I load at 1150. |
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Posted: 8/16/2016 12:31:19 PM EDT
[#11]
Get a scorpion evo
or an AR style PCC if shes mor familiar with the stoner platform |
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Posted: 8/18/2016 12:26:56 PM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Get a scorpion evo or an AR style PCC if shes mor familiar with the stoner platform +1, Scorpion Evo or a Beretta Storm. With Hornaday Critical Defense or Critical Duty. JMHO Doc |
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Posted: 8/18/2016 3:28:32 PM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
With Hornaday Critical Defense or Critical Duty. JMHO Doc Defense is for sub/compact barrels under 3 inches. Duty is for full size barrels 4 inches or longer. Both have mediocre performance. Federal HST and Winchester Ranger T are better. |
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Posted: 8/18/2016 3:37:32 PM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
+1, Scorpion Evo Scorpion Evo is an stellar option. Small, light, and extremely handy. I love mine. |
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Posted: 8/18/2016 3:43:11 PM EDT
[#15]
I would either go 9mm w/subs or 300BLK subs.
My preference 
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Posted: 8/18/2016 4:22:26 PM EDT
[#16]
Scorpion EVO or something using Glock mags
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Posted: 8/18/2016 6:15:52 PM EDT
[#17]
I would go 9mm in something reliable, and in a platform whose controls she will practice with and master. A short AR is very loud and will probably drive her away from wanting to shoot it, unless she's one of those women who really enjoys guns. Decent 9mm rounds that she can place well trump 5.56 that she can't shoot worth a damn.
While I love the scorpion, the stock small charging handle and stiff springs will be tough for many women to operate. At the very least, I'd install one of the aftermarket handles. |
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Posted: 8/18/2016 7:45:43 PM EDT
[#18]
Concur with all the 9mm glock mag AR recommendations.
The only downside is gas to the face with dirty ammo. So use clean ammo. No Freedom munitions or steel case. IMO. |
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Posted: 8/18/2016 7:48:40 PM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I would either go 9mm w/subs or 300BLK subs. My preference https://s26.postimg.org/5zl6zu5m1/IMG_5848.jpg are you running a hahn mag block or something similar? i'm really leaning towards this route for her. if she likes it i'll look into a dedicated lower and sbr it. |
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Posted: 8/18/2016 7:52:31 PM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Defense is for sub/compact barrels under 3 inches. Duty is for full size barrels 4 inches or longer. Both have mediocre performance. Federal HST and Winchester Ranger T are better. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
With Hornaday Critical Defense or Critical Duty. JMHO Doc Defense is for sub/compact barrels under 3 inches. Duty is for full size barrels 4 inches or longer. Both have mediocre performance. Federal HST and Winchester Ranger T are better. This is what I keep on hand. 147 HST's and 147 Ranger Talon's. I'm thinking of trying 124 +p+ gold dots from underwood |
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Posted: 8/18/2016 8:53:19 PM EDT
[#21]
Since the sbr would be ~ 9 months out, I would say get her a carbine, M1, Beretta, kel tec. LOTS OF FUN NOW. Pretty handy around the house too.
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Posted: 8/19/2016 10:27:00 AM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
of the factory PCC's i've always liked the beretta best, however the lh rifling is a no no for my suppressor and if I did a PCC i'd probably lean towards one of the glock mag lowers available as i'm pretty well equiped with 9mm glock mags. did a bunch of reading last night and the black hills 50gr tsx sounds like the ticket in a shorty 5.56. I read that the commercial offering of the 50tsx bullet is not the same as black hills. has anyone tested the 45gr tsx in a sbr? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Doesn't fit your barrel length requirement, but women seem to like the Beretta CX4 Storm. Short, light, low-maintenance, very reliable and will accept factory 20 and 30 round mags (9mm). did a bunch of reading last night and the black hills 50gr tsx sounds like the ticket in a shorty 5.56. I read that the commercial offering of the 50tsx bullet is not the same as black hills. has anyone tested the 45gr tsx in a sbr? SBR a CX4 Storm. Citadel / Chiappa 9mm M1 Carbine. |
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Posted: 8/19/2016 11:54:35 AM EDT
[#23]
If she likes .22, why not a S&W M&P 15 with a red dot and weapon light. It is light, easy to shoot and the magazine holds a bunch of rounds. It is also fairly inexpensive. |
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Posted: 8/19/2016 11:56:43 AM EDT
[#24]
Maybe something like this?
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Posted: 8/19/2016 12:24:31 PM EDT
[#25]
9mm over 300blk because of huge difference in ammo cost and no kaboom worries.
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Posted: 8/19/2016 4:00:54 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
SBR a CX4 Storm. Citadel / Chiappa 9mm M1 Carbine. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Doesn't fit your barrel length requirement, but women seem to like the Beretta CX4 Storm. Short, light, low-maintenance, very reliable and will accept factory 20 and 30 round mags (9mm). did a bunch of reading last night and the black hills 50gr tsx sounds like the ticket in a shorty 5.56. I read that the commercial offering of the 50tsx bullet is not the same as black hills. has anyone tested the 45gr tsx in a sbr? SBR a CX4 Storm. Citadel / Chiappa 9mm M1 Carbine. Those guys don't seem to have the best record. I think I would spend a bit more. Doc |
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Posted: 8/19/2016 4:35:10 PM EDT
[#27]
For a barrel that short I would go 9mm or .300 for sure, 5.56 would be loud and not ideal ballistically either I'm sure.
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Posted: 8/19/2016 9:46:42 PM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
9mm over 300blk because of huge difference in ammo cost and no kaboom worries. This is the exact reason I veered away from 300 blackout. love the cartridge but the risk is too high. and if my kids/wife got hurt by grabbing the wrong ammo/mag i'd never forgive myself well you all have sold me on the 9mm ar for her. going to try the mag adapter route with a 16" upper until my sbr stamp clears then i'll chuck the barrel in the lathe and take it down to 5-7.5" and my 9mm suppressor should clear around the same time. |
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Posted: 8/21/2016 7:39:07 PM EDT
[#30]
If you are worried about wrong mags, use colored furniture to match the mags. Kinda like the carpet matching the drapes. Girls get that.
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Posted: 8/21/2016 9:40:43 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
If you are worried about wrong mags, use colored furniture to match the mags. Kinda like the carpet matching the drapes. Girls get that. i've considered that. building a tan rifle with tan hex mags then a all black with black pmags. still murphy likes to visit me frequently which is fine but I don't want that happening to my children. |
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Posted: 8/22/2016 10:49:18 AM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
This is the exact reason I veered away from 300 blackout. love the cartridge but the risk is too high. and if my kids/wife got hurt by grabbing the wrong ammo/mag i'd never forgive myself well you all have sold me on the 9mm ar for her. going to try the mag adapter route with a 16" upper until my sbr stamp clears then i'll chuck the barrel in the lathe and take it down to 5-7.5" and my 9mm suppressor should clear around the same time. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
9mm over 300blk because of huge difference in ammo cost and no kaboom worries. This is the exact reason I veered away from 300 blackout. love the cartridge but the risk is too high. and if my kids/wife got hurt by grabbing the wrong ammo/mag i'd never forgive myself well you all have sold me on the 9mm ar for her. going to try the mag adapter route with a 16" upper until my sbr stamp clears then i'll chuck the barrel in the lathe and take it down to 5-7.5" and my 9mm suppressor should clear around the same time. I'm running two dedicated lowers with Hahn mag adaptors for a 4" 9mm and 10.5" and have had zero issues. If you can score a quarter circle 10 dedicated lower for the colt/glock mags that would be good as well. The glock mags are easier to load and have a proven track record. You could also SBR a glock, throw it in a chassis, or stock/optic it up. I've got a 19 and 17L SBRed and they are light weight and very portable. Ergonomics are a downside in comparison to the AR platform. 
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Posted: 8/23/2016 5:38:17 AM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
that is a good point. learned that one the expensive way with her handgun. (the double action trigger of a revolver was just to much for her and she actually liked a semi better) truth be told if I let her use her 22 she would grab it first. weight is a big issue with her especially nose heavy, followed by recoil, noise she's gotten used to. she's very confident with her 22. If money were no object i'd love to get her a PS90 and sbr it, but thats more than i'm looking to spend. I could start by building her an upper and put it on my sbr lower. and gas to the face with the suppressor is not happening with her, thats why i'd have to do a piston setup. I've even considered trying to see if someone would build a .221 fireball barrel but that could be a whole different set of problems (feeding, enough gas, ect...) Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
man, what's SHE want? that is a good point. learned that one the expensive way with her handgun. (the double action trigger of a revolver was just to much for her and she actually liked a semi better) truth be told if I let her use her 22 she would grab it first. weight is a big issue with her especially nose heavy, followed by recoil, noise she's gotten used to. she's very confident with her 22. If money were no object i'd love to get her a PS90 and sbr it, but thats more than i'm looking to spend. I could start by building her an upper and put it on my sbr lower. and gas to the face with the suppressor is not happening with her, thats why i'd have to do a piston setup. I've even considered trying to see if someone would build a .221 fireball barrel but that could be a whole different set of problems (feeding, enough gas, ect...) You never answered the question.....What does she want? Then you stated...."if I let her use".....let her? So I will ask.... Why dont you just leave her to make her own choices? |
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Posted: 8/23/2016 10:09:52 AM EDT
[#34]
I'd recommend 9mm. Very short barrel 5.56 will rattle your fillings loose. Generally humans (women especially) don't enjoy this.
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Posted: 8/23/2016 11:06:24 AM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You never answered the question.....What does she want? Then you stated...."if I let her use".....let her? So I will ask.... Why dont you just leave her to make her own choices? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
man, what's SHE want? that is a good point. learned that one the expensive way with her handgun. (the double action trigger of a revolver was just to much for her and she actually liked a semi better) truth be told if I let her use her 22 she would grab it first. weight is a big issue with her especially nose heavy, followed by recoil, noise she's gotten used to. she's very confident with her 22. If money were no object i'd love to get her a PS90 and sbr it, but thats more than i'm looking to spend. I could start by building her an upper and put it on my sbr lower. and gas to the face with the suppressor is not happening with her, thats why i'd have to do a piston setup. I've even considered trying to see if someone would build a .221 fireball barrel but that could be a whole different set of problems (feeding, enough gas, ect...) You never answered the question.....What does she want? Then you stated...."if I let her use".....let her? So I will ask.... Why dont you just leave her to make her own choices? She's new to shooting. actually when we first met 7 years ago she was deathly afraid of guns. she hasn't shown interest untill about the last 2-3 years. I can see you have taken offence to my if I let her use her 22 comment. I do appoligize if thats the case. My wife has very little interest in ballistics or the weapon system for that matter. thats where I come in and have to take an educated guess and with experience trial and error on what to get her. started her on a revolver which she picked by the way. it was to much for her (the double action trigger was hard and since it was a snubby it recoiled pretty good) one day I was shooting one of my carry guns a kahr ct9. she asked to shoot it and after she was done she claimed it as hers. lol I know recoil is an issue with her so have to keep it modest and she doesn't like alot of blast. thats why I will try a 9mm ar and see if I picked right or try again later. |
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Posted: 8/23/2016 11:47:39 AM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
This is what I keep on hand. 147 HST's and 147 Ranger Talon's. I'm thinking of trying 124 +p+ gold dots from underwood Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Quoted:
With Hornaday Critical Defense or Critical Duty. JMHO Doc Defense is for sub/compact barrels under 3 inches. Duty is for full size barrels 4 inches or longer. Both have mediocre performance. Federal HST and Winchester Ranger T are better. This is what I keep on hand. 147 HST's and 147 Ranger Talon's. I'm thinking of trying 124 +p+ gold dots from underwood Kind of a tangent, but does anyone think it is practical to pay twice per round what speer gold dot +p 124/147gr's or HST +p's cost? For HD/SD, specifically? I can understand buying a box of 44mag from them if I'm pistol hunting in grizzly territory. But against 2-legged humans? I don't think an extra 50 fps is particularly meaningful. I believe standard pressure HST's outperform +p in some tests; the bullet has a velocity envelope where expansion is maximized. [Shot placement > expansion > penetration] against attackers. HST+p or especially Speer Gold dot +p 124 are screamers, as is. And I've never had a misfire or malfunction of any kind with gold dots or hst's. 50cpr> $1pr, Particularly in a 9mm AR. You're going to want to run a decent amount of rounds to ensure feeding. Moreso than with, say, a Glock. Underwood certainly has some other niche rounds that should be better for penetration while hunting, like 9mm +p+ 147gr FN-FMJ at 1200fps, 10mm harcast, etc. Or even for SD; the +p+ .380 FMJ 95gr @ 1200fps would be a nice carry round with excellent penetration against 2-legged's. A concern with many other commercial 380 loadings. Those rounds are really expensive, though. $1.50 and up, per. But for HD/SD against bad guys? I'd rather be loading those stick mags with 50cpr. Considering reliability tests and loaded mags, that could be a couple hundred bucks savings... or in my case twice as much ammofort.  
Am I missing something? |
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Posted: 8/23/2016 12:01:57 PM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
If you are worried about wrong mags, use colored furniture to match the mags. Kinda like the carpet matching the drapes. Girls get that. Nah, it's too often night time when bad things happen. I've been shooting in the dark a bit recently and it's challenging to deal with mag changes if you're not wearing a PC, even if the situation allows for you to use a flashlight. I'm not saying people shouldn't own 300blk, but keeping a 5.56 and 300blk for defense in the same household is a heinous idea, imo. |
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Posted: 8/23/2016 12:20:34 PM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Kind of a tangent, but does anyone think it is practical to pay twice per round what speer gold dot +p 124/147gr's or HST +p's cost? For HD/SD, specifically? I can understand buying a box of 44mag from them if I'm pistol hunting in grizzly territory. But against 2-legged humans? I don't think an extra 50 fps is particularly meaningful. I believe standard pressure HST's outperform +p in some tests; the bullet has a velocity envelope where expansion is maximized. [Shot placement > expansion > penetration] against attackers. HST+p or especially Speer Gold dot +p 124 are screamers, as is. And I've never had a misfire or malfunction of any kind with gold dots or hst's. 50cpr> $1pr, Particularly in a 9mm AR. You're going to want to run a decent amount of rounds to ensure feeding. Moreso than with, say, a Glock. Underwood certainly has some other niche rounds that should be better for penetration while hunting, like 9mm +p+ 147gr FN-FMJ at 1200fps, 10mm harcast, etc. Or even for SD; the +p+ .380 FMJ 95gr @ 1200fps would be a nice carry round with excellent penetration against 2-legged's. A concern with many other commercial 380 loadings. Those rounds are really expensive, though. $1.50 and up, per. But for HD/SD against bad guys? I'd rather be loading those stick mags with 50cpr. Considering reliability tests and loaded mags, that could be a couple hundred bucks savings... or in my case twice as much ammofort.
Am I missing something? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
With Hornaday Critical Defense or Critical Duty. JMHO Doc Defense is for sub/compact barrels under 3 inches. Duty is for full size barrels 4 inches or longer. Both have mediocre performance. Federal HST and Winchester Ranger T are better. This is what I keep on hand. 147 HST's and 147 Ranger Talon's. I'm thinking of trying 124 +p+ gold dots from underwood Kind of a tangent, but does anyone think it is practical to pay twice per round what speer gold dot +p 124/147gr's or HST +p's cost? For HD/SD, specifically? I can understand buying a box of 44mag from them if I'm pistol hunting in grizzly territory. But against 2-legged humans? I don't think an extra 50 fps is particularly meaningful. I believe standard pressure HST's outperform +p in some tests; the bullet has a velocity envelope where expansion is maximized. [Shot placement > expansion > penetration] against attackers. HST+p or especially Speer Gold dot +p 124 are screamers, as is. And I've never had a misfire or malfunction of any kind with gold dots or hst's. 50cpr> $1pr, Particularly in a 9mm AR. You're going to want to run a decent amount of rounds to ensure feeding. Moreso than with, say, a Glock. Underwood certainly has some other niche rounds that should be better for penetration while hunting, like 9mm +p+ 147gr FN-FMJ at 1200fps, 10mm harcast, etc. Or even for SD; the +p+ .380 FMJ 95gr @ 1200fps would be a nice carry round with excellent penetration against 2-legged's. A concern with many other commercial 380 loadings. Those rounds are really expensive, though. $1.50 and up, per. But for HD/SD against bad guys? I'd rather be loading those stick mags with 50cpr. Considering reliability tests and loaded mags, that could be a couple hundred bucks savings... or in my case twice as much ammofort.
Am I missing something? good advice. I guess I haven't checked underwoods prices since he started. I seem to remember them being cheaper than the other manufactuer's offerings with the same bullet (ie. 124gold dot +p+) I see now they don't even offer 50 round boxes. they used to be $25-27 per 50 if my memory serves me right. |
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Posted: 8/23/2016 3:06:27 PM EDT
[#39]
My wife is a novice shooter as well. She's shot my AR's both suppressed and un-suppressed, my AR-9mm suppressed, glock 17, 43, 42, 10/22, 22/45, and an MP-5 +MP-5k. Of everything she has shot, her favorite was the standard MP-5. I'd look in that direction too if you haven't already. Maybe go to a rental range and try one.
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Posted: 8/23/2016 6:30:39 PM EDT
[#40]
An AR15 lower.
Have her do all of her practice and fun shooting with a .22 upper. Then when it's time to put the gun in the closet to wait for the SHTF, put an identically set up 5.56 upper on it that you have tested and zeroed. Maybe have her shoot the 5.56 to get a feel for it, or not. |
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Posted: 8/23/2016 10:23:12 PM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
An AR15 lower. Have her do all of her practice and fun shooting with a .22 upper. Then when it's time to put the gun in the closet to wait for the SHTF, put an identically set up 5.56 upper on it that you have tested and zeroed. Maybe have her shoot the 5.56 to get a feel for it, or not. once I get my stamps for my suppressors I think the 5.56 will be fine for her. 22lr 8 years ago would have sounded great but after the great famine of 22lr going on what 3 years now? I have a bad taste in my mouth for the cartridge. they stole a precious past time...plinking I still have an adequate supply of 22lr but it has been shrinking over the years. I had over 15k rounds at one time but now i'd be surprised if I had over 3K. I used to shoot a brick a weekend and not bat an eye. now I allocate it for my kids savage rascals. now that I cast I can load 9mm for less than 22lr. and I have a hard time paying current prices for 22lr. I havent seen a single box of 22lr at walmart in years. what I do find is at gun shops, bass pro, ect.. and 10 cents a round. which I will not buy! it's the principle of the matter. |
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Posted: 8/24/2016 1:18:10 PM EDT
[#42]
I have numerous SBR's including a 7.5" AR chambered in 6.8 SPC, but out of all of them for HD work I like my UZI Pro the best. With stock folded it measures only 9" long, with a T1 Micro accurate shots under stress are easy, 9mm ammo is cheap, there are excellent HD rounds available, 32 round mags are only $20, it's balance and ergos are perfect, & when I run my suppressor on it with 147r sub-sonics it is hearing safe indoors.
ETA: You can see how small a package it is next to my VZ61 Skorpion. 
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Posted: 8/24/2016 7:07:27 PM EDT
[#43]
ooh I like both of those. I kick myself for not buying a skorpion pistol when they were easy to obtain
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Posted: 8/24/2016 8:35:30 PM EDT
[#44]
Does she want a PDW?
A 7.5" 5.56 will be fine for cqb velocity wise but will be super loud, you will need a suppressor. FWIW, you can still make a very short and light weight SBR with a 10.5" barrel. There a lot of light weight parts out there. Check out V7 and vertex ops. |
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Posted: 8/24/2016 8:57:25 PM EDT
[#45]
OP if she wants low recoil and you like the idea of a .22 caliber bullet you might also look at a Kel Tec CMR 30 in .22 WMR
30 round mags of some pretty pissed off bees. .22 WMR is a dirty mean nasty little round. 
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Posted: 8/25/2016 10:21:43 AM EDT
[#46]
The LGS got in one of those keltec carbines just recently and aside from it being 22 mag I liked it. but like many other kel tec products they can never keep up with the demand and getting one takes alot of waiting and/or paying a premium. The one he had was his personal one(he cut it back 6" put a suppressor on it then put a carbon fiber tube over the suppressor and barrel all the way to the handgaurds and cerekoted the carbine, looked very sharp). he also just got in the updated sub 2k but again that was still his personal. He said it took over a year to get both.
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Posted: 8/25/2016 10:31:35 AM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Does she want a PDW? A 7.5" 5.56 will be fine for cqb velocity wise but will be super loud, you will need a suppressor. FWIW, you can still make a very short and light weight SBR with a 10.5" barrel. There a lot of light weight parts out there. Check out V7 and vertex ops. not necessarly a PDW but yes needs to be light and as neutral balanced as possible. I figure the smaller it is the lighter it will be. I do own a lathe so I can also profile the barrel down to machine some weight off if need be. I also have to account for the weight of the suppressor in my plans. The quieter and lighter it is the greater chance I have of keeping her interested in it to get as much trigger time as possible. she'll shoot her 22 all day but her 9mm she gets tired of it after 20-30 rounds. so the more I get her to shoot is a double bonus for me. 1 she gains more proficency and 2nd I get more range time! 
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Posted: 8/25/2016 10:25:34 PM EDT
[#48]
to be fair, mine found the perceived recoil of the 556 and 9mm rifles to be comparable and opted for more horsepower. I built her a nice six pound lightweight purple rifle (16") for under a grand.
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Posted: 8/26/2016 4:45:11 PM EDT
[#49]
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good advice. I guess I haven't checked underwoods prices since he started. I seem to remember them being cheaper than the other manufactuer's offerings with the same bullet (ie. 124gold dot +p+) I see now they don't even offer 50 round boxes. they used to be $25-27 per 50 if my memory serves me right. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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With Hornaday Critical Defense or Critical Duty. JMHO Doc Defense is for sub/compact barrels under 3 inches. Duty is for full size barrels 4 inches or longer. Both have mediocre performance. Federal HST and Winchester Ranger T are better. This is what I keep on hand. 147 HST's and 147 Ranger Talon's. I'm thinking of trying 124 +p+ gold dots from underwood Kind of a tangent, but does anyone think it is practical to pay twice per round what speer gold dot +p 124/147gr's or HST +p's cost? For HD/SD, specifically? I can understand buying a box of 44mag from them if I'm pistol hunting in grizzly territory. But against 2-legged humans? I don't think an extra 50 fps is particularly meaningful. I believe standard pressure HST's outperform +p in some tests; the bullet has a velocity envelope where expansion is maximized. [Shot placement > expansion > penetration] against attackers. HST+p or especially Speer Gold dot +p 124 are screamers, as is. And I've never had a misfire or malfunction of any kind with gold dots or hst's. 50cpr> $1pr, Particularly in a 9mm AR. You're going to want to run a decent amount of rounds to ensure feeding. Moreso than with, say, a Glock. Underwood certainly has some other niche rounds that should be better for penetration while hunting, like 9mm +p+ 147gr FN-FMJ at 1200fps, 10mm harcast, etc. Or even for SD; the +p+ .380 FMJ 95gr @ 1200fps would be a nice carry round with excellent penetration against 2-legged's. A concern with many other commercial 380 loadings. Those rounds are really expensive, though. $1.50 and up, per. But for HD/SD against bad guys? I'd rather be loading those stick mags with 50cpr. Considering reliability tests and loaded mags, that could be a couple hundred bucks savings... or in my case twice as much ammofort.
Am I missing something? good advice. I guess I haven't checked underwoods prices since he started. I seem to remember them being cheaper than the other manufactuer's offerings with the same bullet (ie. 124gold dot +p+) I see now they don't even offer 50 round boxes. they used to be $25-27 per 50 if my memory serves me right. 50 round boxes of gold dot/hst are all over the place for 25ish. Available 24/7. I just got some 147gr HST last week. I'm switching from 124+p gold dot to 147 HST's for carry. I have a huge soft spot for gold dots and love their zip, but HST consistently tests a tiny bit better. Both will kill you dead as hell, no doubt, and I would not want to stare down an angry woman with 33 rounds of GD/hst on tap in a shoulder-fired weapon. NopeNopeNope.gif Or did you mean underwood 50 round boxes? I haven't seen those, I don't think. But I only see underwood at gun stores and zip past it for the cheaper stuff. Then I see the process on that are 10cpr more than I get online with shipping, so I NopeNopeNope.gif out of there and get on the Internet.
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Posted: 8/26/2016 4:51:17 PM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
once I get my stamps for my suppressors I think the 5.56 will be fine for her. 22lr 8 years ago would have sounded great but after the great famine of 22lr going on what 3 years now? I have a bad taste in my mouth for the cartridge. they stole a precious past time...plinking I still have an adequate supply of 22lr but it has been shrinking over the years. I had over 15k rounds at one time but now i'd be surprised if I had over 3K. I used to shoot a brick a weekend and not bat an eye. now I allocate it for my kids savage rascals. now that I cast I can load 9mm for less than 22lr. and I have a hard time paying current prices for 22lr. I havent seen a single box of 22lr at walmart in years. what I do find is at gun shops, bass pro, ect.. and 10 cents a round. which I will not buy! it's the principle of the matter. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
An AR15 lower. Have her do all of her practice and fun shooting with a .22 upper. Then when it's time to put the gun in the closet to wait for the SHTF, put an identically set up 5.56 upper on it that you have tested and zeroed. Maybe have her shoot the 5.56 to get a feel for it, or not. once I get my stamps for my suppressors I think the 5.56 will be fine for her. 22lr 8 years ago would have sounded great but after the great famine of 22lr going on what 3 years now? I have a bad taste in my mouth for the cartridge. they stole a precious past time...plinking I still have an adequate supply of 22lr but it has been shrinking over the years. I had over 15k rounds at one time but now i'd be surprised if I had over 3K. I used to shoot a brick a weekend and not bat an eye. now I allocate it for my kids savage rascals. now that I cast I can load 9mm for less than 22lr. and I have a hard time paying current prices for 22lr. I havent seen a single box of 22lr at walmart in years. what I do find is at gun shops, bass pro, ect.. and 10 cents a round. which I will not buy! it's the principle of the matter. Yeah, I can buy Steelcase 9mm for 16cpr. I have ONE 325 round box of 22lr that I've been sitting on for like 3 years. I haven't shot a round of 22le in about 2 years, and it was someone else's. I can't believe I never neckbearded 22lr properly. I would just buy a box or two and shoot it and rebut later. 5-10 bux, no big deal, right? Then it was gone. |
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