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Posted: 8/9/2015 4:30:36 PM EDT
[#1]
MSAR is gonna get right on that, just two more weeks...
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Posted: 8/9/2015 4:57:43 PM EDT
[#2]
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MSAR is gonna get right on that, just two more weeks... http://i624.photobucket.com/albums/tt322/kkep524/0114091920.jpg LOL. 
Nothing available to the public yet. I suspect we might see some things next year. 
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Posted: 8/10/2015 1:54:48 AM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
LOL.
Nothing available to the public yet. I suspect we might see some things next year. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
MSAR is gonna get right on that, just two more weeks... http://i624.photobucket.com/albums/tt322/kkep524/0114091920.jpg LOL.
Nothing available to the public yet. I suspect we might see some things next year. is MSAR still in business? So, would this be for a TAVOR or AUG?????? |
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Posted: 8/10/2015 2:39:21 AM EDT
[#4]
OP is a Genius!
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Posted: 8/10/2015 10:20:46 AM EDT
[#5]
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is MSAR still in business? So, would this be for a TAVOR or AUG?????? Quote HistoryQuoted:
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MSAR is gonna get right on that, just two more weeks... http://i624.photobucket.com/albums/tt322/kkep524/0114091920.jpg LOL.
Nothing available to the public yet. I suspect we might see some things next year. is MSAR still in business? So, would this be for a TAVOR or AUG?????? Msar is no longer in business. Actually the MCS in the above picture was a rapid prototype and never developed to thr point of a working gun. Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile |
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Posted: 8/10/2015 10:46:09 AM EDT
[#6]
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Msar is no longer in business. Actually the MCS in the above picture was a rapid prototype and never developed to thr point of a working gun. Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile Kinda like the rest of their stuff 
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Posted: 8/10/2015 10:47:13 AM EDT
[#7]
Quoted:
if not then... whyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy Because the increased barrel length of a bullpup for a given package size has no real velocity advantage for most pistol cartridges. If you're going to be under 26", you're into SBR territory and you've got tons of SBR options that don't give up much velocity. |
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Posted: 8/10/2015 11:22:56 AM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Actually the MCS in the above picture was a rapid prototype and never developed to thr point of a working gun.
Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile Did you just say that beautiful PCC was 3-D printed?
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Posted: 8/10/2015 11:34:14 AM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
MSAR is gonna get right on that, just two more weeks... http://i624.photobucket.com/albums/tt322/kkep524/0114091920.jpg The fact that this never made it to market makes puppies cry. |
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Posted: 8/10/2015 11:35:49 AM EDT
[#10]
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Because the increased barrel length of a bullpup for a given package size has no real velocity advantage for most pistol cartridges. If you're going to be under 26", you're into SBR territory and you've got tons of SBR options that don't give up much velocity. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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if not then... whyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy Because the increased barrel length of a bullpup for a given package size has no real velocity advantage for most pistol cartridges. If you're going to be under 26", you're into SBR territory and you've got tons of SBR options that don't give up much velocity. And yet a short barrel rifle can be even shorter in a bullpup configuration. There are also a shitload of people who don't have the ability to go the SBR route. There are tons of reasons for a PCC bullpup. |
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Posted: 8/10/2015 12:03:34 PM EDT
[#11]
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And yet a short barrel rifle can be even shorter in a bullpup configuration. There are also a shitload of people who don't have the ability to go the SBR route. There are tons of reasons for a PCC bullpup. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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if not then... whyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy Because the increased barrel length of a bullpup for a given package size has no real velocity advantage for most pistol cartridges. If you're going to be under 26", you're into SBR territory and you've got tons of SBR options that don't give up much velocity. And yet a short barrel rifle can be even shorter in a bullpup configuration. There are also a shitload of people who don't have the ability to go the SBR route. There are tons of reasons for a PCC bullpup. I don't know about 'tons'... Now I HAVE played with the design of a super short pistol caliber bullpup with a dedicated suppressor inside the body. |
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Posted: 8/10/2015 12:33:35 PM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Now I HAVE played with the design of a super short pistol caliber bullpup with a dedicated suppressor inside the body. Pics, man, pics!
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Posted: 8/10/2015 12:36:19 PM EDT
[#13]
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Pics, man, pics! Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted: Now I HAVE played with the design of a super short pistol caliber bullpup with a dedicated suppressor inside the body. Pics, man, pics! Nothing worth showing, too many other projects / ideas
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Posted: 8/10/2015 12:51:08 PM EDT
[#14]
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Nothing worth showing, too many other projects / ideas Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Quoted: Now I HAVE played with the design of a super short pistol caliber bullpup with a dedicated suppressor inside the body. Pics, man, pics! Nothing worth showing, too many other projects / ideas I beg to differ with you, good sir. Your own dog recognizes your genius, as displayed in your avatar. Surely you can @ least give us some screen shots from CAD, or some iPotato photos from your junk bin? Now, if you were going to patent it and shop it around for production, we understand fully... |
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Posted: 8/10/2015 1:24:58 PM EDT
[#15]
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I beg to differ with you, good sir. Your own dog recognizes your genius, as displayed in your avatar. Surely you can @ least give us some screen shots from CAD, or some iPotato photos from your junk bin? Now, if you were going to patent it and shop it around for production, we understand fully... Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Quoted: Now I HAVE played with the design of a super short pistol caliber bullpup with a dedicated suppressor inside the body. Pics, man, pics! Nothing worth showing, too many other projects / ideas I beg to differ with you, good sir. Your own dog recognizes your genius, as displayed in your avatar. Surely you can @ least give us some screen shots from CAD, or some iPotato photos from your junk bin? Now, if you were going to patent it and shop it around for production, we understand fully... It was just rough sketches looking at packaging, and maybe a little super long GG / Colt stick mag wizardry with a HK G11-style rotating loading block...
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Posted: 8/10/2015 11:55:32 PM EDT
[#16]
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LOL.
Nothing available to the public yet. I suspect we might see some things next year. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
MSAR is gonna get right on that, just two more weeks... http://i624.photobucket.com/albums/tt322/kkep524/0114091920.jpg LOL.
Nothing available to the public yet. I suspect we might see some things next year. I understand Ratworx has a waiting list...  
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Posted: 8/11/2015 12:12:47 AM EDT
[#17]
I would definitely be interested in a 9mm PCC bull pup that took Glock mags,
26" over all. 16" barrel Preferably with a rail of a height appropriate to allow use of readily existing AR optics and mounts. |
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Posted: 8/11/2015 1:36:02 AM EDT
[#18]
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... I don't know about 'tons'... Now I HAVE played with the design of a super short pistol caliber bullpup with a dedicated suppressor inside the body. chub mode engaged seriously though, I would be interested in a SBR bullpup 9mm. Even w/ a longish 9mm barrel it would be shourter than a conventional lay out and be quiter for all the extra barrel length. |
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Posted: 8/11/2015 9:54:25 AM EDT
[#19]
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chub mode engaged seriously though, I would be interested in a SBR bullpup 9mm. Even w/ a longish 9mm barrel it would be shourter than a conventional lay out and be quiter for all the extra barrel length. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
... I don't know about 'tons'... Now I HAVE played with the design of a super short pistol caliber bullpup with a dedicated suppressor inside the body. chub mode engaged seriously though, I would be interested in a SBR bullpup 9mm. Even w/ a longish 9mm barrel it would be shourter than a conventional lay out and be quiter for all the extra barrel length. This meets almost every requirement of yours. You really can't get shorter. Ever shot a skorpian? My SOT has an original pre sample, beside being a fountain of tiny brass, the stock truly is too short to shoulder. You get too short of a package and ergonomics go out the wndow... Forgot the picture. 
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Posted: 8/11/2015 10:14:17 AM EDT
[#20]
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I understand Ratworx has a waiting list... Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Quoted:
MSAR is gonna get right on that, just two more weeks... http://i624.photobucket.com/albums/tt322/kkep524/0114091920.jpg LOL.
Nothing available to the public yet. I suspect we might see some things next year. I understand Ratworx has a waiting list... 
First I laughed. Then I remembered that I was on that list. 
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Posted: 8/11/2015 12:45:01 PM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
This meets almost every requirement of yours. You really can't get shorter. Ever shot a skorpian? My SOT has an original pre sample, beside being a fountain of tiny brass, the stock truly is too short to shoulder. You get too short of a package and ergonomics go out the wndow... Forgot the picture. http://www.airsoftparts.ca/store2/images/roni-g1-g18c-kit_5.jpg Quote HistoryQuoted:
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... I don't know about 'tons'... Now I HAVE played with the design of a super short pistol caliber bullpup with a dedicated suppressor inside the body. chub mode engaged seriously though, I would be interested in a SBR bullpup 9mm. Even w/ a longish 9mm barrel it would be shourter than a conventional lay out and be quiter for all the extra barrel length. This meets almost every requirement of yours. You really can't get shorter. Ever shot a skorpian? My SOT has an original pre sample, beside being a fountain of tiny brass, the stock truly is too short to shoulder. You get too short of a package and ergonomics go out the wndow... Forgot the picture. http://www.airsoftparts.ca/store2/images/roni-g1-g18c-kit_5.jpg is that a 17 or a 19 in there? Gen 3 or 4? That enclosure doesn't seem to induce any stoppages? |
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Posted: 8/11/2015 8:18:59 PM EDT
[#22]
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is that a 17 or a 19 in there? Gen 3 or 4? That enclosure doesn't seem to induce any stoppages? Looks like a gem 3 G19, but is probably airsoft. There is an airlsoft version of blocks, and the RONI stock, so it's entirely probable given that the picture I found on google comes from an airsoft site. Toys aside, the firearm version is supposed to work pretty good. I'd like to get one, but can't see the benefit of a SBR block pistol... |
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Posted: 8/11/2015 9:36:05 PM EDT
[#23]
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First I laughed. Then I remembered that I was on that list.
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MSAR is gonna get right on that, just two more weeks... http://i624.photobucket.com/albums/tt322/kkep524/0114091920.jpg LOL.
Nothing available to the public yet. I suspect we might see some things next year. I understand Ratworx has a waiting list...
First I laughed. Then I remembered that I was on that list.
Yup...I think I was number 47 or something like that. |
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Posted: 8/11/2015 9:36:50 PM EDT
[#24]
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I would definitely be interested in a 9mm PCC bull pup that took Glock mags, 26" over all. 16" barrel Preferably with a rail of a height appropriate to allow use of readily existing AR optics and mounts. It's on Desert Tech's to-do list for the MDR. |
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Posted: 8/11/2015 11:56:16 PM EDT
[#25]
Just to clarify, I did not mean we will see the MCS from MSAR next year, but rather we might see some Glock mag fed bullpups appear from other sources next year.
Sorry if my comments led to any confusion!
Sven Manticore Arms |
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Posted: 8/13/2015 2:29:15 AM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Just to clarify, I did not mean we will see the MCS from MSAR next year, but rather we might see some Glock mag fed bullpups appear from other sources next year. Sorry if my comments led to any confusion!
Sven Manticore Arms Cant get a tavor to run 9mm from glock mags? |
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Posted: 8/14/2015 2:54:01 AM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Just to clarify, I did not mean we will see the MCS from MSAR next year, but rather we might see some Glock mag fed bullpups appear from other sources next year. Sorry if my comments led to any confusion!
Sven Manticore Arms please clarify. Are you talking about a totally new bullpup hat uses glock mags? OR, are you talking about a kit or whagever to allow glock mags to feed ammo into an existing bullpup platform? If the latter, which one? Aug or Tavor? |
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Posted: 8/14/2015 2:15:03 PM EDT
[#28]
GK Tactical has had a Glock-mag bullpup in development for a while, and they were aiming to have it at the bullpup shoot in the fall. I don't know if they're on track for that, but they're still going at it last I checked.
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Posted: 8/14/2015 2:41:52 PM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
GK Tactical has had a Glock-mag bullpup in development for a while, and they were aiming to have it at the bullpup shoot in the fall. I don't know if they're on track for that, but they're still going at it last I checked. We emailed them about Bullpup Shoot some time ago, but haven't heard back from them, so I do not know what is going on with their project. |
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Posted: 8/14/2015 2:44:54 PM EDT
[#30]
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please clarify. Are you talking about a totally new bullpup hat uses glock mags? OR, are you talking about a kit or whagever to allow glock mags to feed ammo into an existing bullpup platform? If the latter, which one? Aug or Tavor? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Just to clarify, I did not mean we will see the MCS from MSAR next year, but rather we might see some Glock mag fed bullpups appear from other sources next year. Sorry if my comments led to any confusion!
Sven Manticore Arms please clarify. Are you talking about a totally new bullpup hat uses glock mags? OR, are you talking about a kit or whagever to allow glock mags to feed ammo into an existing bullpup platform? If the latter, which one? Aug or Tavor? It is really not possible to make glock mags work in a magwell designed for a STANAG AR-15 magazine, at least not with an adapter. Ratworx spent quite a bit of time trying to make it work on the AUG (have handled the prototypes myself) and there is just not enough front-to-back room in the magwell to make is work well. You also run into the issue of 9mm AUG and 9mm Tavor bolts being designed for a double stack magazine while the Glock mags are single stack. One of those things where it is a good idea to adapt an existing gun, but the reality is a lot more difficult. |
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Posted: 8/15/2015 12:26:54 AM EDT
[#31]
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We emailed them about Bullpup Shoot some time ago, but haven't heard back from them, so I do not know what is going on with their project. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
GK Tactical has had a Glock-mag bullpup in development for a while, and they were aiming to have it at the bullpup shoot in the fall. I don't know if they're on track for that, but they're still going at it last I checked. We emailed them about Bullpup Shoot some time ago, but haven't heard back from them, so I do not know what is going on with their project. might that possibly be ambii? |
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Posted: 8/15/2015 5:59:55 PM EDT
[#32]
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Toys aside, the firearm version is supposed to work pretty good. I'd like to get one, but can't see the benefit of a SBR block pistol... Quote HistoryQuoted:
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is that a 17 or a 19 in there? Gen 3 or 4? That enclosure doesn't seem to induce any stoppages? Toys aside, the firearm version is supposed to work pretty good. I'd like to get one, but can't see the benefit of a SBR block pistol... If your EDC is a Glock, the Roni kit might be an interesting light-weight addition to a truck, camping or get home bag. Other than for shits and grins, that's all I've got on that one - wouldn't mind playing w/one, but the Roni setup is $$ + stamp, no? |
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Posted: 8/15/2015 7:35:53 PM EDT
[#33]
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If your EDC is a Glock, the Roni kit might be an interesting light-weight edition to a truck, camping or get home bag. Other than for shits and grins, that's all I've got on that one - wouldn't mind playing w/one, but the Roni setup is $$ + stamp, no? Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Quoted: is that a 17 or a 19 in there? Gen 3 or 4? That enclosure doesn't seem to induce any stoppages? Toys aside, the firearm version is supposed to work pretty good. I'd like to get one, but can't see the benefit of a SBR block pistol... If your EDC is a Glock, the Roni kit might be an interesting light-weight edition to a truck, camping or get home bag. Other than for shits and grins, that's all I've got on that one - wouldn't mind playing w/one, but the Roni setup is $$ + stamp, no? Yes. Roni & it's competitors are available for a number of different SBR'd pistols. However, before you SBR it, if it's made overseas, you now also have to comply w/ 922r.  Which makes it much cheaper to SBR US made pistols.
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Posted: 8/16/2015 6:38:58 PM EDT
[#34]
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Because the increased barrel length of a bullpup for a given package size has no real velocity advantage for most pistol cartridges. If you're going to be under 26", you're into SBR territory and you've got tons of SBR options that don't give up much velocity. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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if not then... whyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy Because the increased barrel length of a bullpup for a given package size has no real velocity advantage for most pistol cartridges. If you're going to be under 26", you're into SBR territory and you've got tons of SBR options that don't give up much velocity. I hear ya, but a hot 10mm would start making it interesting. Also surprised there isn't more in the 300BO. |
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Posted: 8/16/2015 10:12:56 PM EDT
[#35]
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It's on Desert Tech's to-do list for the MDR. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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I would definitely be interested in a 9mm PCC bull pup that took Glock mags, 26" over all. 16" barrel Preferably with a rail of a height appropriate to allow use of readily existing AR optics and mounts. It's on Desert Tech's to-do list for the MDR. I wish those boys would hurry up and just get the standard rifle version released already. I'm probably more excited about that rifle than I have been about any other rifle. |
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Posted: 8/16/2015 10:32:48 PM EDT
[#36]
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please clarify. Are you talking about a totally new bullpup hat uses glock mags? OR, are you talking about a kit or whagever to allow glock mags to feed ammo into an existing bullpup platform? If the latter, which one? Aug or Tavor? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Just to clarify, I did not mean we will see the MCS from MSAR next year, but rather we might see some Glock mag fed bullpups appear from other sources next year. Sorry if my comments led to any confusion!
Sven Manticore Arms please clarify. Are you talking about a totally new bullpup hat uses glock mags? OR, are you talking about a kit or whagever to allow glock mags to feed ammo into an existing bullpup platform? If the latter, which one? Aug or Tavor? I'd like to see a platform that is designed around the system. One of my objections to the 9mm Tavor, is that it is a heavy bitch for what it is. Something designed around the 9mm round could be a lot lighter. Whatever this mystery project is, I hope it is some sort of locked breach design, rather than blowback. Blowback is simple to design and cheaper to manufacture, but it sucks. The perceived recoil is more significant, and it blows for suppressor use. |
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Posted: 8/17/2015 2:15:55 AM EDT
[#37]
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One of my objections to the 9mm Tavor, is that it is a heavy bitch for what it is. Something designed around the 9mm round could be a lot lighter. Whatever this mystery project is, I hope it is some sort of locked breach design, rather than blowback. Blowback is simple to design and cheaper to manufacture, but it sucks. The perceived recoil is more significant, and it blows for suppressor use. amen I almost got one of those mech tech uppers but it turns out they kick a lot, are heavy as fuck, and they babalce horribly b/c of the super massive telescopic bolt. They do supposedly suppress well, in some chamberings though, as they have a super slow heavy bolt. But to your point, yes, some sort of locked breech is better and can be lighter over all weight as well as less reciprocationg mass and quieter. Would love something gas operated or delayed blowback/roller locker in a bullpup layout. |
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Posted: 8/18/2015 1:03:47 PM EDT
[#38]
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MSAR is gonna get right on that, just two more weeks... http://i624.photobucket.com/albums/tt322/kkep524/0114091920.jpg Hey, that's my pic! I remember Tony was kinda pissed when I posted that back when I worked there.
Still wish he kept the design a side eject rather than trying to make the bottom ejection work. Probably would have actually made it to production and would have sold thousands of them. |
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Posted: 8/18/2015 9:13:28 PM EDT
[#39]
actually, this is making me think about getting a Beretta storm carbine made to work w/ breretta 92 mags. Probalbl as close to a light bull pup locked breech 9mm as we are ever going to get...
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Posted: 8/18/2015 9:25:47 PM EDT
[#40]
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Hey, that's my pic! I remember Tony was kinda pissed when I posted that back when I worked there.
Still wish he kept the design a side eject rather than trying to make the bottom ejection work. Probably would have actually made it to production and would have sold thousands of them. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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MSAR is gonna get right on that, just two more weeks... http://i624.photobucket.com/albums/tt322/kkep524/0114091920.jpg Hey, that's my pic! I remember Tony was kinda pissed when I posted that back when I worked there.
Still wish he kept the design a side eject rather than trying to make the bottom ejection work. Probably would have actually made it to production and would have sold thousands of them. Google never forgets.
You're the second or third result for "MSAR glock", you're famous. I would have bought one, so would have many many others. Probably would have saved the company - or not, who knows... |
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Posted: 8/19/2015 6:46:30 AM EDT
[#41]
My dream is for Glock to make a Bullpup. Could you imagine a 10mm?
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Posted: 8/19/2015 7:37:41 AM EDT
[#42]
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My dream is for Glock to make a Bullpup. Could you imagine a 10mm? MSAR was going to make one of theirs in 10mm. Also 45 and 40. |
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Posted: 8/19/2015 8:44:15 PM EDT
[#43]
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MSAR was going to make one of theirs in 10mm. Also 45 and 40. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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My dream is for Glock to make a Bullpup. Could you imagine a 10mm? MSAR was going to make one of theirs in 10mm. Also 45 and 40. Even when they ere around I never considered anything from them. |
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Posted: 8/20/2015 3:57:36 PM EDT
[#44]
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Google never forgets.
You're the second or third result for "MSAR glock", you're famous. I would have bought one, so would have many many others. Probably would have saved the company - or not, who knows... Quote HistoryQuoted:
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MSAR is gonna get right on that, just two more weeks... http://i624.photobucket.com/albums/tt322/kkep524/0114091920.jpg Hey, that's my pic! I remember Tony was kinda pissed when I posted that back when I worked there.
Still wish he kept the design a side eject rather than trying to make the bottom ejection work. Probably would have actually made it to production and would have sold thousands of them. Google never forgets.
You're the second or third result for "MSAR glock", you're famous. I would have bought one, so would have many many others. Probably would have saved the company - or not, who knows... I had actually purchased a bunch of 30 rd Glock mags, and a spare MSAR integrated scope, hoping to use them on that. I wonder if the scope is worth anything now. |
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Posted: 8/20/2015 4:01:18 PM EDT
[#45]
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Even when they ere around I never considered anything from them. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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My dream is for Glock to make a Bullpup. Could you imagine a 10mm? MSAR was going to make one of theirs in 10mm. Also 45 and 40. Even when they ere around I never considered anything from them. meh. Tony was a shitbird. My MSAR was a great rifle though. Side by side, it's actually sexier than my Aug, the machining is cleaner, the flash suppressor and locknut are prettier, the fluted barrel improves the balance, and the integrated optic looks right. Even the new Aug has those clunky ass rails that look like shit on the optic. The only problem it ever gave me was the mag-release, which was fixed promptly. If Tony had made it 100% interchangeable with the Aug, and hadn't been a douche, they'd be going strong today. |
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Posted: 8/23/2015 3:11:13 PM EDT
[#46]
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I had actually purchased a bunch of 30 rd Glock mags, and a spare MSAR integrated scope, hoping to use them on that. I wonder if the scope is worth anything now. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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MSAR is gonna get right on that, just two more weeks... http://i624.photobucket.com/albums/tt322/kkep524/0114091920.jpg Hey, that's my pic! I remember Tony was kinda pissed when I posted that back when I worked there.
Still wish he kept the design a side eject rather than trying to make the bottom ejection work. Probably would have actually made it to production and would have sold thousands of them. Google never forgets.
You're the second or third result for "MSAR glock", you're famous. I would have bought one, so would have many many others. Probably would have saved the company - or not, who knows... I had actually purchased a bunch of 30 rd Glock mags, and a spare MSAR integrated scope, hoping to use them on that. I wonder if the scope is worth anything now. Probably be worth a bit if it holds zero..... |
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Posted: 8/26/2015 1:09:58 AM EDT
[#47]
Here's a bullpup SBR.
Put an ALG 6 second mount on it and you're set. 
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Posted: 8/26/2015 3:12:03 AM EDT
[#48]
yeah, I have one of htose endo tac stocks. I'm not crazy about it. It is solid but w/ the G21 I find myself wishing I had somewher out front to hold the muzzle down with my off hand.
Think I am going to order the KPOS enclosure. a few on htere have them and swear by their reliability. I hear the trick is to use full size frames and to use gen 3 glocks. |
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Posted: 8/26/2015 8:30:26 AM EDT
[#49]
I dunno if gen3 is super important, but I can confirm that I've never heard of a chassis setup running 100% on a semi-compact or compact frame Glock... guessing it's because the ejection port isn't positioned quite right.
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Posted: 8/27/2015 12:26:23 AM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
yeah, I have one of htose endo tac stocks. I'm not crazy about it. It is solid but w/ the G21 I find myself wishing I had somewher out front to hold the muzzle down with my off hand. Think I am going to order the KPOS enclosure. a few on htere have them and swear by their reliability. I hear the trick is to use full size frames and to use gen 3 glocks. I've always wondered about that. I've never handled and ENDO glock but it would definitely be odd to have both your hands gripping in the same spot. |
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