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Posted: 9/4/2013 10:45:02 AM EDT
[#1]
Don't sell your mineral rights for any amount. If they want to drill you stand to make much more. Today when you buy a property it is nearly impossible to get the minerals.
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Posted: 9/4/2013 11:03:36 AM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Don't sell your mineral rights for any amount. If they want to drill you stand to make much more. Today when you buy a property it is nearly impossible to get the minerals. Mineral rights are like a distant memory for most people in Oklahoma, so few people own their own properties mineral rights, and its almost unknown for them to be available when you buy property. My family has been in Oklahoma far longer than its been Oklahoma, we have been here since Indian Territory in 1889-1890, my Great Grandfather probably owned his own mineral rights and sold them, nobody else in the family has ever owned mineral rights. |
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Posted: 9/4/2013 12:21:31 PM EDT
[#3]
Don't Sell... You can sell the land, just don't sell the mineral rights.
A buddy had to sell 80 acres of land to pay legal fees (long story) but he retained the mineral rights. He is now earning money on those mineral rights because they drilled. Some months are better than others.. but he has gotten $350-$1200 month for the last 5 years the well has been there. |
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Posted: 9/4/2013 1:50:03 PM EDT
[#4]
My first reaction to the unsolicited offer is - NO - and it must be worth more than $450 an acre if that's their first offer. I know the land has a lease going right now, but I'm not 100% clear on the details and revenue. I know the lease isn't paying much at all.
The property is held in a trust passed down to my mom who is 78. She wants me to handle the details and help her decide what to do. She doesn't need the money, I don't need the money, but my siblings and their kids could benefit from future revenue.
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Posted: 9/4/2013 2:50:39 PM EDT
[#5]
I agree, don't sell. As, Wingie said, very few people anymore have mineral rights and a most of them probably wish they did.
My families home was bought but, as usual, was sold without mineral rights. One day my mom was cleaning house and mopping the kitchen floor but every time she cleaned it this one spot on floor would start to discolor around the tile. Finally she pulled that section of tile up and found the concrete underneath was this weird dark color. She had someone come a look at it and finally they figured out that the house had been built on a really old oil well that had been capped long ago. I don't t know if they pumped it dry and capped it and moved on and it slowly refilled from surrounding oil pockets or what but it really didn't matter since our family didn't own the rights. I don't remember how it was resolved but I do know that had we owned the mineral rights there would have been a pumpjack in the backyard lol. As of right now whoever does own the mineral rights has no idea they have oil so they're not getting anything either. |
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Posted: 9/4/2013 3:13:43 PM EDT
[#6]
I'd sell the mineral rights if they gave me $450,000 per net acre.
I've worked in Oil/Gas. The industry isn't picking up pennies on the sidewalk. |
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Posted: 9/4/2013 3:27:27 PM EDT
[#7]
I was doing land man work until the tornadoes hit.
DO NOT SELL mineral rights, lease them for three years with the 2 year option. Get at least 3/16 interest in the mineral production. |
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Posted: 9/4/2013 3:46:17 PM EDT
[#8]
Do not sell unless reallllllllllly good price.
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Posted: 9/4/2013 5:48:27 PM EDT
[#9]
Bassman2 got the same offer. But the last lease was for $300.00 per acre, so I have ignored it. I would set tight, for that amount they can sweat it. Just does not sound good to me and they evan sent a letter out on some land that is under production it does not make much but it makes more than $450.00. They didn't run production on their letters just blanketed a area and fishing for people who might need money.
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Posted: 9/5/2013 5:45:29 AM EDT
[#10]
I just love how everyone who has mineral rights (or even those who don't but just "know" alot about them) thinks that it is an automatic income stream. More often than not, no money will ever be made from mineral rights. And everyone values their mineral rights at tens of thousands of dollars per acre when in reality, $450/ac may actually be the market price and fair price for them.
Not every acre of the US is the next Marcellus or Barnet or Eagleford or Bakken. A large percentage of mineral rights is nothing more than some writing on paper in someones filling cabinet. You say that the land is already leased and producing but it doesn't make much $$, which means it doesn't make much production, which means it will more than likely make even less as the years go by. I'm not saying you should sell them, just making an observation. I know some people will probably disagree with me, and that's fine. Im just adding my two cents. |
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Posted: 9/5/2013 8:13:34 AM EDT
[#11]
Don't sell for any price. You own the mineral rights. That's not to common these days. They may not be looking for oil. They may know where water is. I'd offer to lease them the mineral rights for the price they offered per year for a 3 year contract.
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Posted: 9/5/2013 8:29:14 AM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Don't sell for any price. You own the mineral rights. That's not to common these days. They may not be looking for oil. They may know where water is. I'd offer to lease them the mineral rights for the price they offered per year for a 3 year contract. $450/ac per year for 3 years?! Good luck!! Hardly any leases are paid on a per year basis anymore, most are "paid-up" leases... meaning a bonus amount is paid once in full for the entire 3 year period. And depending on the area, I'd say $450/ac would probably be the going rate for a 3 year lease. |
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Posted: 9/5/2013 10:28:24 AM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I just love how everyone who has mineral rights (or even those who don't but just "know" alot about them) thinks that it is an automatic income stream. More often than not, no money will ever be made from mineral rights. And everyone values their mineral rights at tens of thousands of dollars per acre when in reality, $450/ac may actually be the market price and fair price for them. Not every acre of the US is the next Marcellus or Barnet or Eagleford or Bakken. A large percentage of mineral rights is nothing more than some writing on paper in someones filling cabinet. You say that the land is already leased and producing but it doesn't make much $$, which means it doesn't make much production, which means it will more than likely make even less as the years go by. I'm not saying you should sell them, just making an observation. I know some people will probably disagree with me, and that's fine. Im just adding my two cents. Depends on the area ours under production but we still have a depth claus. So we can still lease again. I have bought minerals from $150.00 to $500.00 per acre. So evan though I only make about $200.00 a year If we release they will still make more than selling them just use your best judgement. My point is the people did not take time to evan see who was under production and who was not. That was poor business they have insulted several mineral owners in leflore and latimer Co. |
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Posted: 9/5/2013 12:37:28 PM EDT
[#14]
I assume they were offering to lease, not buy...
Talk to other mineral owners in the area to see what they're being offered/getting. I know of leases in western OK that leased for $1250/n.a. Where the initial offer was around the $450 mark. Obviously YMMV. |
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Posted: 9/5/2013 12:49:24 PM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I assume they were offering to lease, not buy... Talk to other mineral owners in the area to see what they're being offered/getting. I know of leases in western OK that leased for $1250/n.a. Where the initial offer was around the $450 mark. Obviously YMMV. N/G does not bring that much here. The best we have gotten for a lease is $350.00/A with 3/16'th plus depth clause. I would lease for that 
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Posted: 9/5/2013 12:53:16 PM EDT
[#16]
Grandad told me to NEVER sell you minerals, period. It might not pay much right now, but 10 years from now, it could be a different story.
Family has been, one way or another, landman, cosultant, geologist, for the past 88 years. Me, for 38 years. Don't sell your minerals Don't give a 2 year extention either, and watch out for a "free gas" clause in the lease. companies are using gas to drill the wells in some places. Saves them lots of $$. They won't give you anything for free, don't give it to them. |
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Posted: 9/5/2013 3:53:02 PM EDT
[#17]
The way I see it if someone wants to buy your mineral rights then they have value. If they don't have any value you couldn't sell them if you wanted to. I say keep them no matter what and if someone wants them bad enough they'll do what you want and not what they want. I suppose if so many of these companies hadn't screwed so many people over the years landowners wouldn't need to be quite so tight with their property. What comes around goes around.
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Posted: 9/5/2013 4:39:09 PM EDT
[#18]
They can force pool you if you don't sell. When they serve you notice of the hearing at the Corpoation Commission, tell them you are protesting it because they have not been dealing in good faith with you. They will come back with a higher offer.
You want their entire bank roll, they want to give you nothing. The word is NEGOTIATE. Be knowledgeable and not obstinate and you can get the maximum you can. |
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Posted: 9/5/2013 6:32:16 PM EDT
[#19]
Do Not Sell.!!
How many acres are you talking about..? What section are you in..? Since it is currently leased you do not have to worry about being pooled. Do some research and find out if there are additional wells planed that involve you or if they may be going to a new zone and fracking. There are many forums for mineral rights owners.. http://www.mineralrightsforum.com/forum/topic/listForTag?tag=Oklahoma If someone if offering to buy, something is up.. They know something you do not. Do Not Sell !! Do Not Sell !! |
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Posted: 9/5/2013 8:05:17 PM EDT
[#20]
I just spoke with my Mom tonight and we are not selling. We'll re-lease the rights but no go on a sale at this point. Currently we have a lease with Chesapeake. I'm getting the details on that, as I suspect its expired. I have a feeling that I may be cleaning up a lot of property and inheritance issues for my folks.
Originally I thought the property in question was the original homestead the family had - and still has a 180 acres of... but that's not in Latimer County I just realized!. That property an hour out of Altus or it felt like an hour the only time I visited the farm.  I'm more familiar with the history of that property and we have mineral rights there too! We also have an old government pre-war survey of the property looking for "space age" materials... or titanium sands. It was a pretty interesting document.The property in question is only 40 acres  and located in S:24 T:6N R:19EThanks for all the input here guys! I appreciate it. |
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Posted: 9/6/2013 2:20:11 AM EDT
[#21]
If they found something, 40 acres can end up being more than you would think..
If you end up re-leasing it come back and tell us.. There are a whole lot a things to consider.. New lease = LEASE BONUS BABY!!! YA!! |
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Posted: 9/6/2013 6:48:07 AM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
They can force pool you if you don't sell. When they serve you notice of the hearing at the Corpoation Commission, tell them you are protesting it because they have not been dealing in good faith with you. They will come back with a higher offer. You want their entire bank roll, they want to give you nothing. The word is NEGOTIATE. Be knowledgeable and not obstinate and you can get the maximum you can. They are trying to BUY the mineral rights... the OP said nothing about leasing them. I think you are confusing Oklahoma Force Pooling statutes with just the common sale of mineral rights. Force pooling only applies if they have gotten approved for a spacing unit by the Corporation Commission, they are trying to lease that spacing unit, and they have over 63% already leased. In this case, the OP said a company, Cambria Energy, is trying to buy the mineral rights, not lease them. Force Pooling will not apply here. Also, I am confused as to how Cambria Energy has not been dealing in good faith with him?  They offered him $450/ac which is how much they put an initial value on the mineral rights at. Mineral rights value is completely subjective. So, mcant20, when you sell a house, and a potential buyer submits an offer that is less than what you have it listed at, do you immediately say they are not dealing in good faith as well?? 
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Posted: 9/6/2013 10:43:34 AM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
They are trying to BUY the mineral rights... the OP said nothing about leasing them. That is usually done because there is drilling in the area. If there is a well to be put on the section they are on, it will be forced pool. I think you are confusing Oklahoma Force Pooling statutes with just the common sale of mineral rights. Force pooling only applies if they have gotten approved for a spacing unit by the Corporation Commission, they are trying to lease that spacing unit, and they have over 63% already leased. In this case, the OP said a company, Cambria Energy, is trying to buy the mineral rights, not lease them. Force Pooling will not apply here. That will come if he holds out. Read my first post in this thread. Also, I am confused as to how Cambria Energy has not been dealing in good faith with him? They offered him $450/ac which is how much they put an initial value on the mineral rights at. Mineral rights value is completely subjective. So, mcant20, when you sell a house, and a potential buyer submits an offer that is less than what you have it listed at, do you immediately say they are not dealing in good faith as well??
Reading is fundamental. I said when they notify him of a scheduled hearing. There is a HUGE difference between selling and leasing. Especially a huge difference between a house and mineral rights. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
They can force pool you if you don't sell. When they serve you notice of the hearing at the Corpoation Commission, tell them you are protesting it because they have not been dealing in good faith with you. They will come back with a higher offer. You want their entire bank roll, they want to give you nothing. The word is NEGOTIATE. Be knowledgeable and not obstinate and you can get the maximum you can. They are trying to BUY the mineral rights... the OP said nothing about leasing them. That is usually done because there is drilling in the area. If there is a well to be put on the section they are on, it will be forced pool. I think you are confusing Oklahoma Force Pooling statutes with just the common sale of mineral rights. Force pooling only applies if they have gotten approved for a spacing unit by the Corporation Commission, they are trying to lease that spacing unit, and they have over 63% already leased. In this case, the OP said a company, Cambria Energy, is trying to buy the mineral rights, not lease them. Force Pooling will not apply here. That will come if he holds out. Read my first post in this thread. Also, I am confused as to how Cambria Energy has not been dealing in good faith with him? They offered him $450/ac which is how much they put an initial value on the mineral rights at. Mineral rights value is completely subjective. So, mcant20, when you sell a house, and a potential buyer submits an offer that is less than what you have it listed at, do you immediately say they are not dealing in good faith as well??
Reading is fundamental. I said when they notify him of a scheduled hearing. There is a HUGE difference between selling and leasing. Especially a huge difference between a house and mineral rights. The way most companies work is they make an offer and if you don't take it, they will try to force pool you. Especially if you tell them you want the favored nation clause put in the lease and the formation drilling limitation. They usually stop any negotiations right there. |
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Posted: 9/6/2013 11:05:14 AM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Again, not sure how they have acted not in good faith... All they did was extend an offer to buy mineral rights, nothing malicious there. The way most companies work is they make an offer and if you don't take it, they will try to force pool you. - This is true IF, and only IF, they are LEASING the mineral rights. NOT selling. Especially if you tell them you want the favored nation clause put in the lease and the formation drilling limitation. They usually stop any negotiations right there. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
They can force pool you if you don't sell INCORRECT... they can force pool him if he does not LEASE. FP does not apply to selling. When they serve you notice of the hearing at the Corpoation Commission CC is not involved in the sale of minerals, only drilling, tell them you are protesting it because they have not been dealing in good faith with you. They will come back with a higher offer. You want their entire bank roll, they want to give you nothing. The word is NEGOTIATE. Be knowledgeable and not obstinate and you can get the maximum you can. They are trying to BUY the mineral rights... the OP said nothing about leasing them. That is usually done because there is drilling in the area. If there is a well to be put on the section they are on, it will be forced pool. Again, this only applies to the leasing of mineral rights, not the sale. I think you are confusing Oklahoma Force Pooling statutes with just the common sale of mineral rights. Force pooling only applies if they have gotten approved for a spacing unit by the Corporation Commission, they are trying to lease that spacing unit, and they have over 63% already leased. In this case, the OP said a company, Cambria Energy, is trying to buy the mineral rights, not lease them. Force Pooling will not apply here. That will come if he holds out. Read my first post in this thread. IF he had gotten an offer to lease, you could be completely right, they could eventually look to force pool him if they could not agree on the terms of the lease. Also, I am confused as to how Cambria Energy has not been dealing in good faith with him? They offered him $450/ac which is how much they put an initial value on the mineral rights at. Mineral rights value is completely subjective. So, mcant20, when you sell a house, and a potential buyer submits an offer that is less than what you have it listed at, do you immediately say they are not dealing in good faith as well??
Reading is fundamental. you are so, so right I said when they notify him of a scheduled hearing. He won't be notified because there will be no hearing (see above, the CC does not have hearings for private sale of minerals. There is a HUGE difference between selling and leasing. Yes, you are right, and you are referring to leasing, OP is referring to selling. Especially a huge difference between a house and mineral rights. The way most companies work is they make an offer and if you don't take it, they will try to force pool you. - This is true IF, and only IF, they are LEASING the mineral rights. NOT selling. Especially if you tell them you want the favored nation clause put in the lease and the formation drilling limitation. They usually stop any negotiations right there. Selling IS NOT leasing. Even during Force Pooling, the company only gets to LEASE the rights. The DO NOT buy them. How many times can this be said. |
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Posted: 9/6/2013 12:36:02 PM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Selling IS NOT leasing. Even during Force Pooling, the company only gets to LEASE the rights. The DO NOT buy them. How many times can this be said. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
They can force pool you if you don't sell INCORRECT... they can force pool him if he does not LEASE. FP does not apply to selling. When they serve you notice of the hearing at the Corpoation Commission CC is not involved in the sale of minerals, only drilling, tell them you are protesting it because they have not been dealing in good faith with you. They will come back with a higher offer. You want their entire bank roll, they want to give you nothing. The word is NEGOTIATE. Be knowledgeable and not obstinate and you can get the maximum you can. They are trying to BUY the mineral rights... the OP said nothing about leasing them. That is usually done because there is drilling in the area. If there is a well to be put on the section they are on, it will be forced pool. Again, this only applies to the leasing of mineral rights, not the sale. I think you are confusing Oklahoma Force Pooling statutes with just the common sale of mineral rights. Force pooling only applies if they have gotten approved for a spacing unit by the Corporation Commission, they are trying to lease that spacing unit, and they have over 63% already leased. In this case, the OP said a company, Cambria Energy, is trying to buy the mineral rights, not lease them. Force Pooling will not apply here. That will come if he holds out. Read my first post in this thread. IF he had gotten an offer to lease, you could be completely right, they could eventually look to force pool him if they could not agree on the terms of the lease. Also, I am confused as to how Cambria Energy has not been dealing in good faith with him? They offered him $450/ac which is how much they put an initial value on the mineral rights at. Mineral rights value is completely subjective. So, mcant20, when you sell a house, and a potential buyer submits an offer that is less than what you have it listed at, do you immediately say they are not dealing in good faith as well??
Reading is fundamental. you are so, so right I said when they notify him of a scheduled hearing. He won't be notified because there will be no hearing (see above, the CC does not have hearings for private sale of minerals. There is a HUGE difference between selling and leasing. Yes, you are right, and you are referring to leasing, OP is referring to selling. Especially a huge difference between a house and mineral rights. The way most companies work is they make an offer and if you don't take it, they will try to force pool you. - This is true IF, and only IF, they are LEASING the mineral rights. NOT selling. Especially if you tell them you want the favored nation clause put in the lease and the formation drilling limitation. They usually stop any negotiations right there. Selling IS NOT leasing. Even during Force Pooling, the company only gets to LEASE the rights. The DO NOT buy them. How many times can this be said. Let me put up my first post in this thread. Obviously you didn't bother to read it. Quoted:
I was doing land man work until the tornadoes hit. DO NOT SELL mineral rights, lease them for three years with the 2 year option. Get at least 3/16 interest in the mineral production. Go pound sand. |
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Posted: 9/6/2013 6:32:48 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Let me put up my first post in this thread. Obviously you didn't bother to read it. Go pound sand. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Let me put up my first post in this thread. Obviously you didn't bother to read it. Quoted:
I was doing land man work until the tornadoes hit. DO NOT SELL mineral rights, lease them for three years with the 2 year option. Get at least 3/16 interest in the mineral production. Go pound sand. Go pound sand? No thanks. Ok, I understand that you were "doing land man work" in the past. That means nothing, there are ALOT of people who "do landman work.' Doesn't mean they are any good at it or that they know what they are talking about. I've been doing it for 7 years across Texas, Oklahoma, Arkansas, Kansas, Wyoming and Illinois, an active member of the AAPL and am in the process of getting my RPL. As far as your posts go, yes, I did read the first one you made. And I completely agree with it. BUT the first post has NOTHING to do with your second one, and nothing to do with the OP either. Your first post makes sense, your second post is wrong in all the ways I pointed out. IF they want to lease, yes, by all means accept a 3+2 and yes get 3/16 royalty, but if all they want to do is buy the mineral rights, then it is just strictly between the OP and Cambria Energy. Noone else will ever get involved, especially not the Corporation Commission. Oh, and just because they force pool you, it does not mean you will automatically get more money. You will more than likely just get what the CC determines if fair market value, which will basically be an average of what everyone else in the unit was paid. Sorry if I insulted you and caused you to tell me the forum way of F off, glad to know we are all mature adults. |
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Posted: 9/6/2013 10:15:32 PM EDT
[#27]
Damn. I'm glad to see the OK HTF is alive and kicking! I very much appreciate all of the help and insight here! If there is anything I can assist with in the WA or OR area, let me know.
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Posted: 9/7/2013 12:44:16 AM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Go pound sand? No thanks. Ok, I understand that you were "doing land man work" in the past. That means nothing, there are ALOT of people who "do landman work.' Doesn't mean they are any good at it or that they know what they are talking about. I've been doing it for 7 years across Texas, Oklahoma, Arkansas, Kansas, Wyoming and Illinois, an active member of the AAPL and am in the process of getting my RPL. As far as your posts go, yes, I did read the first one you made. And I completely agree with it. BUT the first post has NOTHING to do with your second one, and nothing to do with the OP either. You are FOS, the second one was made in light of the first one. Your first post makes sense, your second post is wrong in all the ways I pointed out. IF they want to lease, yes, by all means accept a 3+2 and yes get 3/16 royalty, but if all they want to do is buy the mineral rights, then it is just strictly between the OP and Cambria Energy. Noone else will ever get involved, especially not the Corporation Commission. Oh, and just because they force pool you, it does not mean you will automatically get more money. You will more than likely just get what the CC determines if fair market value, which will basically be an average of what everyone else in the unit was paid. Sorry if I insulted you and caused you to tell me the forum way of F off, glad to know we are all mature adults. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Let me put up my first post in this thread. Obviously you didn't bother to read it. Quoted:
I was doing land man work until the tornadoes hit. DO NOT SELL mineral rights, lease them for three years with the 2 year option. Get at least 3/16 interest in the mineral production. Go pound sand. Go pound sand? No thanks. Ok, I understand that you were "doing land man work" in the past. That means nothing, there are ALOT of people who "do landman work.' Doesn't mean they are any good at it or that they know what they are talking about. I've been doing it for 7 years across Texas, Oklahoma, Arkansas, Kansas, Wyoming and Illinois, an active member of the AAPL and am in the process of getting my RPL. As far as your posts go, yes, I did read the first one you made. And I completely agree with it. BUT the first post has NOTHING to do with your second one, and nothing to do with the OP either. You are FOS, the second one was made in light of the first one. Your first post makes sense, your second post is wrong in all the ways I pointed out. IF they want to lease, yes, by all means accept a 3+2 and yes get 3/16 royalty, but if all they want to do is buy the mineral rights, then it is just strictly between the OP and Cambria Energy. Noone else will ever get involved, especially not the Corporation Commission. Oh, and just because they force pool you, it does not mean you will automatically get more money. You will more than likely just get what the CC determines if fair market value, which will basically be an average of what everyone else in the unit was paid. Sorry if I insulted you and caused you to tell me the forum way of F off, glad to know we are all mature adults. Get past your ego. He wants to get as much money as he can and he'll do that most likely by leasing and not selling. He doesn't want to average what everyone one else gets - he wants to be at the top. I told him how he can do that but nothing is certain. |
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Posted: 9/10/2013 1:52:05 AM EDT
[#29]
Do I have to own the mineral rights to drill a water well on my property?
How do I find out who owns my mineral rights? |
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Posted: 9/10/2013 3:35:30 AM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Do I have to own the mineral rights to drill a water well on my property? You should be able too because it is for domestic use and won't interfere with public use, whether you own your mineral rights or not. Call the Oklahoma Water Resources Board to be sure. There is a thing called riparian rights that can get pretty complicated. How do I find out who owns my mineral rights? It would show on your abstract. A title search at the county courthouse will also show if you own them or not. |
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Posted: 9/10/2013 11:19:44 AM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Do I have to own the mineral rights to drill a water well on my property? How do I find out who owns my mineral rights? For a water well in Oklahoma... Its easier to ask for forgiveness than for permission.. |
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Posted: 9/10/2013 11:40:41 AM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
For a water well in Oklahoma... Its easier to ask for forgiveness than for permission.. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Do I have to own the mineral rights to drill a water well on my property? How do I find out who owns my mineral rights? For a water well in Oklahoma... Its easier to ask for forgiveness than for permission.. True dat. 
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