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Posted: 10/31/2018 1:25:28 PM EDT
I had a Franklin 50 delivered and installed today, my first gun safe / RSC. Upon completion, I started toying with it and configuring the interior, during which I realized that end-users cannot change the combination to the mechanical lock. WTF..?

The installers handed me an already-open envelope that included the factory combination. I have no idea how many people have had access to that envelope since the safe was manufactured and delivered. Given that the lock's warranty requires a locksmith to change the combination, I've purchased a relatively expensive safe for which there's no way for only me or parties whom I choose to have access.

I've owned a few cheaper safes and a couple of ATMs in the past, all which had combination locks I could change. This seems like a relatively big hole in Liberty's business model. Thoughts?

I'm open to changing it myself and voiding the lock warranty, but so far haven't found instructions online. I guess the key for the dial is simply to lock the dial?
Link Posted: 10/31/2018 1:38:37 PM EDT
[#1]
Here are the instructions

you will need to order a change key off amazon, also you will have to remove the drywall from the back of the door.

I would suggest writing down the combo, as well as calling liberty to have them record the serial number and combo that you set.....  ymmv

5 min job, have fun & good luck
Link Posted: 10/31/2018 1:45:30 PM EDT
[#2]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Here are the instructions

you will need to order a change key off amazon, also you will have to remove the drywall from the back of the door.

I would suggest writing down the combo, as well as calling liberty to have them record the serial number and combo that you set.....  ymmv

5 min job, have fun & good luck
View Quote
Awesome, thanks so much! So the key that came with the safe, and goes in the mechanical lock on the front, is only for locking the dial, correct?
Link Posted: 10/31/2018 1:50:58 PM EDT
[#3]
correct, just a dial lock.

you can lock the dial open on 87 if you wish (day use feature)
Link Posted: 10/31/2018 1:53:40 PM EDT
[#4]
combo change key/tool

this is what you need to change the combo, you can probably make one at home, but I always tape one inside the safe beside the lock.  It is silly that they advertise using a locksmith for this......
Link Posted: 10/31/2018 2:24:09 PM EDT
[#5]
  It is silly that they advertise using a locksmith for this.....  
View Quote
There's a reason changing it yourself voids the warranty.  So simple, yet so many people screw it up and lock themselves out of their safes.  The factory even has a tough time getting it done right, which is why they generally don't want people who have never done it doing it themselves.

But it can be done, by yourself, with internet sourced knowledge and equipment.  Just be aware that it will indeed void the warranty.  I have been called out on warranty jobs where the failure was due to the end user, and was the first to notify the manufacturer to let them decide how they wished to proceed.
Link Posted: 10/31/2018 2:26:57 PM EDT
[#6]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:

There's a reason changing it yourself voids the warranty.  So simple, yet so many people screw it up and lock themselves out of their safes.  The factory even has a tough time getting it done right, which is why they generally don't want people who have never done it doing it themselves.

But it can be done, by yourself, with internet sourced knowledge and equipment.  Just be aware that it will indeed void the warranty.  I have been called out on warranty jobs where the failure was due to the end user, and was the first to notify the manufacturer to let them decide how they wished to proceed.
View Quote
I've changed it enough times in my ATMs to see why they don't want end users messing with it. Still seems like a failure to sell such an important security product with such an obvious access issue. Why haven't mechanical locks like these been redesigned over the past 30 years or so to allow for consumers to actually control access to the expensive safe they've purchased?
Link Posted: 10/31/2018 3:02:24 PM EDT
[#7]
 Why haven't mechanical locks like these been redesigned over the past 30 years or so to allow for consumers to actually control access to the expensive safe they've purchased?    
View Quote
The same reason almost all other consumer goods are not self-serviceable.  The average person would do more harm than good.  A good percentage of my openings are user induced lockouts.
Link Posted: 11/2/2018 6:41:59 AM EDT
[#8]
I would gamble that if you called Liberty and explained your concerns politely they may cover the cost of a lock smith.

But in reality you are over reacting. Those guys probably deliver safes all day long and couldn't care less what your combination is only that the safe opened and was delivered without damage.
Link Posted: 11/2/2018 11:31:08 AM EDT
[#9]
This is one of the dangers in the "safe" business.  All sorts of people sell gun safes, and these people may or may not really be in the security business.  They may be in states that require licensing, but as a "retailer" are exempt.  They may employ who knows who with little regard paid their backgrounds.  We often find people doing delivery work for these retailers who also lack the proper licensing and insurance.

Compare that to most real safe and vault companies that are properly licensed, insured, and have well vetted and trained employees.

You roll the dice, you take your chances.

The OP appears to be in Virginia, and that is a state that licenses locksmiths:

 A locksmith is any individual who performs locksmith services, or advertises or represents to the general public that the individual is a locksmith even if the specific term locksmith is substituted with any other term by which a reasonable person could construe that the individual possesses special skills relating to locks or locking devices. This includes words such as lock technician, lockman, safe technician, safeman, boxman, unlocking technician, lock installer, lock opener, physical security technician, or similar descriptions.    
View Quote
You are required to possess 18 hours of training, will be fingerprinted and background checked, and must be bonded and insured.  If you question the legitimacy of whomever delivered your safe call them and ask for their license number.  If they can't provide that, then there's your answer as to whether or not you should be concerned.
Link Posted: 11/3/2018 10:42:14 PM EDT
[#10]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
I would gamble that if you called Liberty and explained your concerns politely they may cover the cost of a lock smith.

But in reality you are over reacting. Those guys probably deliver safes all day long and couldn't care less what your combination is only that the safe opened and was delivered without damage.
View Quote
I worked in IT for 20 years, much of it securing networks and Unix/Linux systems. I've also been a home security and automation hobbyist for years.

Security is achieved in layers; controlling access is a basic foundation. Not caring about this simple best practice is an under reaction, and if you met the guys who delivered the safe with an open envelope containing the combo, you'd probably reconsider.
Link Posted: 11/3/2018 10:43:32 PM EDT
[#11]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
This is one of the dangers in the "safe" business.  All sorts of people sell gun safes, and these people may or may not really be in the security business.  They may be in states that require licensing, but as a "retailer" are exempt.  They may employ who knows who with little regard paid their backgrounds.  We often find people doing delivery work for these retailers who also lack the proper licensing and insurance.

Compare that to most real safe and vault companies that are properly licensed, insured, and have well vetted and trained employees.

You roll the dice, you take your chances.

The OP appears to be in Virginia, and that is a state that licenses locksmiths:

You are required to possess 18 hours of training, will be fingerprinted and background checked, and must be bonded and insured.  If you question the legitimacy of whomever delivered your safe call them and ask for their license number.  If they can't provide that, then there's your answer as to whether or not you should be concerned.
View Quote
These were "safe delivery guys" working girls the largest locksmith in the mid-Atlantic. I'd be shocked if either had any locksmith certifications.
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