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USA
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Posted: 9/29/2021 8:58:07 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Trollslayer]
My existing Leupold will only focus down to 50 yards, so I'm looking around for a new scope to put on my rimfire rifle.
I want one that focuses at a very close distance (~10 yd) but still has high magnification (~25X). I found a few but know nothing about their optical quality. Vortex Diamondback Tactical (25X) Leupold EFR (20X) Athlon Argos (24X) Are there others? Anyone know about their optical quality and repeatability of the turrets? ETA - I'm going to summarize my requirements here - Good-great glass – flat field, no chromatic aberration, high resolution, ~10-15 yard minimum parallax Simple reticle MOA adjustments ~20X upper magnification (15X seems too low) 30 mm tube preferred (have the rings - $100) Price <$1k (but flexible) Lifetime warranty Excellent, reliable tracking Light weight (<~24 ounces) Availability - I can't buy something that is not available due to these "supply chain issues". <-- I never expected this to be an issue. |
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Posted: 9/29/2021 9:10:55 PM EDT
[#1]
Leupold used to sell an adapter that would allow focus down to 10 yards........I THINK it would fit any scope with an adjustable objective.......
The adapter worked well enough but did affect light transmission and clarity to some degree.I used one for 50' smallbore shooting years ago. |
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Posted: 9/29/2021 9:29:46 PM EDT
[#2]
What’s your price range? You want ffp or sfp? Reticle?
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USA
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Posted: 9/29/2021 10:39:14 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Trollslayer]
[#3]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Rob01: What’s your price range? You want ffp or sfp? Reticle? For now, those are secondary to me, especially the FFP/SFP feature. If I had to guess, I'd probably say some sort of fine cross hair in the SFP (reticle size does not change with zoom). Heck, I'm not even sure this needs to be a zoom. |
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USA
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Posted: 9/29/2021 10:41:20 PM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By DanaHillen: Leupold used to sell an adapter that would allow focus down to 10 yards........I THINK it would fit any scope with an adjustable objective....... The adapter worked well enough but did affect light transmission and clarity to some degree.I used one for 50' smallbore shooting years ago. I went to Leupold first because I know of their EFR scopes. I did not find any adapter. The disappointing thing is, even their 20X EFR's are discontinued. |
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Posted: 9/29/2021 10:56:42 PM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Trollslayer: For now, those are secondary to me, especially the FFP/SFP feature. If I had to guess, I'd probably say some sort of fine cross hair in the SFP (reticle size does not change with zoom). Heck, I'm not even sure this needs to be a zoom. Actually they all are pretty important. Not going to recommend a $3000 scope if you only want to spend $500 and vice versa. So you won’t be using the reticle for holds? What will you be doing with the rifle and scope specifically? |
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USA
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Posted: 9/30/2021 2:27:58 AM EDT
[Last Edit: Trollslayer]
[#6]
I use the dials for distance and nominal wind. I don't typically hold off/over.
The scope is for use on a "Precision Rifle". It might see use at the local friendly competitions which are unlikely to ever go beyond 200 yards. Of course, it might just be me shooting the 1 MOA Challenge at 25 yards (something my existing scope cannot do). I think $1k is a good nominal budget. $3k seems too much (Night Force, etc). I'm concerned $300 (Diamondback Tactical) is not be enough to get the optical performance and mechanical reliability I want. I thought I'd try to tap into the knowledge of "the hive". What scope are you using and what do you use it for? |
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USA
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Posted: 9/30/2021 2:38:36 AM EDT
[Last Edit: Trollslayer]
[#7]
Moved this to a later post.
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Posted: 9/30/2021 9:57:12 AM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Trollslayer: I use the dials for distance and nominal wind. I don't typically hold off/over. The scope is for use on a "Precision Rifle". It might see use at the local friendly competitions which are unlikely to ever go beyond 200 yards. Of course, it might just be me shooting the 1 MOA Challenge at 25 yards (something my existing scope cannot do). I think $1k is a good nominal budget. $3k seems too much (Night Force, etc). I'm concerned $300 (Diamondback Tactical) is not be enough to get the optical performance and mechanical reliability I want. I thought I'd try to tap into the knowledge of "the hive". What scope are you using and what do you use it for? What type of competitions? BR? NRL type? That kind of steers the choice also as different comps use different scopes. I have used multiple scopes on my Vudoo. I have used Razor II 3-18 and 4.5-27, Golden Eagle 15-60 and a Strike Eagle 5-25. All worked for their purpose. Looks like we have a price range though which is good. |
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TX, USA
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Posted: 9/30/2021 3:29:33 PM EDT
[#9]
well below your price range.
https://www.bushnell.com/riflescopes/match-pro/match-pro-6-24x50-riflescope/BU-MP6245BF2.html specifically for the nrl-22 matches. if you have .mil you can get a discount as well. I went with the athlon. Argos BTR GEN2 both go down to 10 yards. |
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USA
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Posted: 9/30/2021 8:34:37 PM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Rob01: What type of competitions? General paper punching and/or NRA small bore rifle. No hunting. No NRL. |
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USA
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Posted: 9/30/2021 8:43:03 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Trollslayer]
[#11]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Andrewh: https://www.bushnell.com/riflescopes/match-pro/match-pro-6-24x50-riflescope/BU-MP6245BF2.html I went with the athlon Argos BTR GEN2 Both are excellent suggestions. Thank you. That 10 yard minimum focus distance appeals greatly. Do you know, does that apply at max magnification or only at the low mag setting? |
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USA
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Posted: 9/30/2021 9:01:05 PM EDT
[#12]
Some more searching and a forum or two lead to this - https://www.swampfoxoptics.com/warhawk-precision-series
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Posted: 9/30/2021 9:03:52 PM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Trollslayer: General paper punching and/or NRA small bore rifle. No hunting. No NRL. How about the Vortex Golden Eagle? Basically what you want but parallax is down to 20 yards and not 10 yards. SFP, 15-60x 1/8 moa adjustments and choice of fine cross hair or dot style reticle. I have the ECR reticle with the dot and love it. The dot is .095 moa at 40x. Plenty small enough for your use but the standard reticle is there too. What you think of it? https://vortexoptics.com/riflescopes/golden-eagle-hd/vortex-golden-eagle-hd.html |
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Posted: 9/30/2021 9:08:02 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Rob01]
[#14]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Trollslayer: Some more searching and a forum or two lead to this - https://www.swampfoxoptics.com/warhawk-precision-series A ffp scope with a Christmas tree reticle? Pretty much what you didn’t want. If you are looking at that then look at both the Vortex Venom and Strike Eagle 5-25. They parallax free to 15 yards and have a lot of elevation especially the SE. The dot in the 7C is .14 moa so plenty fine enough for precision 1 moa at 25 yard shots. |
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USA
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Posted: 10/1/2021 2:00:17 AM EDT
[Last Edit: Trollslayer]
[#15]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Rob01: A ffp scope with a Christmas tree reticle? Pretty much what you didn’t want. If you are looking at that then look at both the Vortex Venom and Strike Eagle 5-25. They parallax free to 15 yards and have a lot of elevation especially the SE. The dot in the 7C is .14 moa so plenty fine enough for precision 1 moa at 25 yard shots. A very busy reticle, for sure, but one of the few scopes that goes down to 10 yards. For now, I'm window shopping (collecting candidates). Selection comes later. I wish this industry would adopt some standards for describing their transmission and resolution (line pairs per millimeter). The military does this. Are they just hiding their specs? |
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Posted: 10/1/2021 2:05:07 AM EDT
[Last Edit: WWoodworth]
[#16]
For bench work? Find a Weaver T36.
But I'm old school. |
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Posted: 10/1/2021 8:50:02 AM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Trollslayer: A very busy reticle, for sure, but one of the few scopes that goes down to 10 yards. For now, I'm window shopping (collecting candidates). Selection comes later. I wish this industry would adopt some standards for describing their transmission and resolution (line pairs per millimeter). The military does this. Are they just hiding their specs? Do you shoot at 10 yards a lot? If it’s not 80% of your shooting you are limiting yourself for no reason. Even a 15 yard parallax scope can have the power turned down some and work at 10 yards. And not sure about industry standards. Not sure there is any regulations saying they need to do it and don’t know if they want to go through the work if they don’t have to do it. |
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TX, USA
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Posted: 10/1/2021 9:16:15 AM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Trollslayer: Both are excellent suggestions. Thank you. That 10 yard minimum focus distance appeals greatly. Do you know, does that apply at max magnification or only at the low mag setting? I can't say for the bushnell, but for the argos, I just tried it to be sure and yes you can. got clear focus at about 10 yards. Actually think it was slightly less than 10 yards, but I didn't break out a measuring tape to be sure. |
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USA
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Posted: 10/1/2021 12:30:19 PM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By WWoodworth: For bench work? Find a Weaver T36. But I'm old school. Bench and prone. Weaver T-36, I like the idea. |
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USA
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Posted: 10/1/2021 12:37:57 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Trollslayer]
[#20]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Rob01: Do you shoot at 10 yards a lot? If it’s not 80% of your shooting you are limiting yourself for no reason. Even a 15 yard parallax scope can have the power turned down some and work at 10 yards. And not sure about industry standards. Not sure there is any regulations saying they need to do it and don’t know if they want to go through the work if they don’t have to do it. I'm not suggesting industry regulations be put in place requiring testing and publication - good grief, no! It's just that resolution is a key performance parameter and cost factor in optical systems. The thing is, no one reports their numbers. You all know hi res when you see it and notice when it isn't there, too. I'd bet they already have the info, somewhere. If not, you could test an entire line of products in a single day. Ridiculously expensive to do for a consumer, easy as pie for a manufacturer. You can download the target for free. You just have to have the scopes on hand. Regarding the close focus requirement - my current Leupold only goes down to ~50 yards. I have bumped my had on that limit too many times and am looking for closer focusing. 10-15 yards minimum seems about right in part because that is what is offered. Also, my local indoor range is 50 feet (13 yards), max, so it works there. I mentioned 10 yards only because that is what is advertised as their capability. It is not my requirement. This kind of misinterpretation happens a lot in online discussions. I do think 25 yards is not close enough. I want this scope to handle the 80% but also to plug the gap I have covering the other 20%. I want a scope that handles 100% of my rimfire rifle shooting. |
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Posted: 10/1/2021 4:10:41 PM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Trollslayer: I'm not suggesting industry regulations be put in place requiring testing and publication - good grief, no! It's just that resolution is a key performance parameter and cost factor in optical systems. The thing is, no one reports their numbers. You all know hi res when you see it and notice when it isn't there, too. I'd bet they already have the info, somewhere. If not, you could test an entire line of products in a single day. Ridiculously expensive to do for a consumer, easy as pie for a manufacturer. You can download the target for free. You just have to have the scopes on hand. Regarding the close focus requirement - my current Leupold only goes down to ~50 yards. I have bumped my had on that limit too many times and am looking for closer focusing. 10-15 yards minimum seems about right in part because that is what is offered. Also, my local indoor range is 50 feet (13 yards), max, so it works there. I mentioned 10 yards only because that is what is advertised as their capability. It is not my requirement. This kind of misinterpretation happens a lot in online discussions. I do think 25 yards is not close enough. I want this scope to handle the 80% but also to plug the gap I have covering the other 20%. I want a scope that handles 100% of my rimfire rifle shooting. The problem with posting a spec is that they may change slightly. Just like factory ammo listing their load used. Slight changes in glass can be there even with expensive companies. I had S&B 5-25s built different years and there were slight differences. So even if they did list a number it wouldn't be something you could check first off and it might change slightly. Just is what it is. Misinterpretations is why I am asking questions and when you say in one posts you want a fine cross hair and SFP and then another you are looking at Christmas tree reticles in a FFP scope I am just trying to figure what you want but if you don't know yourself then I guess it would be hard to tell us. LOL If you can look and get more specific specs you want then we could help a little more. Any of the 10-15 yard parallax scopes will handle the uses you have even down to 13 yards so that's a set area. Now is 25x enough for you? It should be for the 1 MOA at 25 yards match you mentioned. I shoot .25" KYL targets at 50 yards with all the optics I mentioned above. The small dot actually helps a lot with that. FFP and SFP is something you need to figure out. If you will be using 10x and up most all the time then a FFP wouldn't be a problem. If you would be dialing down to 5x for some reason then probably not. Thoughts? |
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USA
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Posted: 10/1/2021 11:27:13 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Trollslayer]
[#22]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Rob01: The problem with posting a spec is that they may change slightly. Just like factory ammo listing their load used. Slight changes in glass can be there even with expensive companies. I had S&B 5-25s built different years and there were slight differences. So even if they did list a number it wouldn't be something you could check first off and it might change slightly. Just is what it is. I would still like to see a number, even if just for reference, and it can change over time. I saw some photos taken through a Diamondback Tactical and some other Vortex scope. The lower/poor of resolution in the Diamondback has probably dissuaded me from buying one. Misinterpretations is why I am asking questions and when you say in one posts you want a fine cross hair and SFP and then another you are looking at Christmas tree reticles in a FFP scope I am just trying to figure what you want but if you don't know yourself then I guess it would be hard to tell us. LOL! Yep, got it. To clarify, right now, I am looking at everything that can focus down to ~10-15 yards. Amazon is working on mind reading over the internet. ;-) LOL If you can look and get more specific specs you want then we could help a little more. Any of the 10-15 yard parallax scopes will handle the uses you have even down to 13 yards so that's a set area. Now is 25x enough for you? It should be for the 1 MOA at 25 yards match you mentioned. I shoot .25" KYL targets at 50 yards with all the optics I mentioned above. The small dot actually helps a lot with that. I do think 25X is enough but higher could be ok. I shot a clean today using a 12X Lyman SuperTarget Spot. It is the clarity and crisp reticle that is most important. Because I was using a simple crosshair, I would quarter the white dot with it. High resolution is important for doing that. A target dot is/was very common and preferred but seemingly out of favor now. FFP and SFP is something you need to figure out. If you will be using 10x and up most all the time then a FFP wouldn't be a problem. If you would be dialing down to 5x for some reason then probably not. Thoughts? I do use high magnification most of the time, as I am trying for precision shooting from prone. Target identification (glassing) is not in my requirements. Sometimes I dial it down to read the wind (wider field of view). When mirage is super-bad I find it is sometimes easier to aim/shoot at lower mag. I dialed down my scope to 8.5X but still could not get it to focus at 25 yards. It was not even close to being focused. It was so blurry, I gave up on it and put it aside. |
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Posted: 10/2/2021 8:10:57 AM EDT
[Last Edit: Rob01]
[#23]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Trollslayer: I dialed down my scope to 8.5X but still could not get it to focus at 25 yards. It was not even close to being focused. It was so blurry, I gave up on it and put it aside. Yes with a scope with a 50 yard minimum it would be but when you get down to 15 minimum and want to be at 13 it works better. My 4.5-27 is minimum at 32 yards but I can dial down and shoot at 25 yards. Have done it many time in matches. But also comes down to the percentages again. If you will mostly be shooting at the 50 foot range, which is 16.6 yards, then you would want a scope that will do that all the time. Something in the 10-15 yard minimum range. Plenty of options there and also can be used for farther ranges as well if you get out there. |
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USA
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Posted: 10/2/2021 6:24:31 PM EDT
[#24]
I have the vortex diamondback 6x24x50 on my CZ FFP that I shoot at 25 &100 yrds. I like the exposed turrets, parallax adjustment. Glass is OK until you get up to max magnification. What I don't like is the mushy clicks on the turrets. Imalso don't feel like it tracks perfectly. It's built pretty beefy.
If I had to do it all over I would have lumped up and gotten the PST 5x25x50. Points were made about the reticle. Really fine duplex reticle might be fine for SFP or they may be to big. At lower magnifications they have less clutter. FFP recticles often have .25 dot or gap at the center which means for me a better sense of being exactly centered on the .25 bullseye targets I am using. I wouldn't put a FFP on a hunting rimfire and wouldn't prefer a typical SSF on a bench gun unless it was super fine. |
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USA
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Posted: 10/3/2021 12:41:59 AM EDT
[Last Edit: Trollslayer]
[#25]
I checked. The PST only goes down to 25 yards.
I'm going to park these here, so pay them no mind.  $450; 30 ounces; 3.74" eye relief; 10 yards https://www.bushnell.com/riflescopes/match-pro/match-pro-6-24x50-riflescope/BU-MP6245BF2.html  $450; 30 ounces; 3.3" eye relief https://athlonoptics.com/product/argos-btr-gen2-6-24x50-aplr2-ffp-ir-moa/  $560; 37 ounce; 3.5" eye relief https://www.swampfoxoptics.com/warhawk-precision-series  $850; 18 ounces' 3.6" eye relief https://www.leupold.com/vx-3hd-6-5-20x40-efr-cds-tzl2-fine-duplex  $400; 12 ounces; 3" eye relief https://www.leupold.com/vx-freedom-3-9x33-efr-airgun-fine-duplex-riflescope  $500 https://vortexoptics.com/vortex-diamondback-tactical-6-24x50-ffp-riflescope.html  $3000 https://www.opticsplanet.com/nightforce-atacr-4-20x50-f1-riflescope.html  $800 https://vortexoptics.com/vortex-strike-eagle-5-25x56-ffp.html  $700 https://vortexoptics.com/venom-5-25x56-ffp-riflescope.html  $1200; 37 ounces; 10 mm eye relief;10 meters https://www.eurooptic.com/Bushnell-Forge-3-24x56mm-Black-CM-Exposed-Locking-Turrets-w-Zero-Stop-Riflescope.aspx  $ LGS has a very good price; 24 ounces; 3.5" eye relief; 10 yards https://www.zeiss.com/consumer-products/int/hunting/riflescopes/conquest-v4/conquest-v4-6-24x50.html#features  $350 (street); 21 ounces; 3.6" eye relief; 10 yards https://www.meoptasportsoptics.eu/en/produkt/optika5-2-10x42-16163/  Sidewinder 30 SF 6.5-20x44 $639; 24 ounces; 4" eye relief; 10 yards https://us.hawkeoptics.com/sidewinder-30-sf-65-20x44-20x-half-mil.html  Mueller 8-32X44mm Target Dot $269; 26 ounces; 4" eye relief; 10 yards https://muelleroptics.com/products/mueller-8-32x44-side-focus-target-dot/  Trijicon 4-16X 50mm CREDO (also available with a 44mm objective) ~$1k; 26 ounces; 10yards https://www.eurooptic.com/Trijicon-Credo-4-16x50-SFP-w-Green-MRAD-Center-Dot-30mm-Matte-Black-Riflescope-2.aspx |
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Posted: 10/3/2021 1:12:43 AM EDT
[#26]
I have a diamondback 6-24x50 on a cz 457 in mil, a Leupold VX freedom EFR on a browning T bolt, an old Leupold EFR on a savage mark II and a Nikon pro staff 22lr on a ruger 10/22
The diamondback is HEAVY, goes down to 10 yards. The glass seems hazy to me. I run in the 6-15 range. It’s ok. Has the mil reticle… Love the Leupolds… sharp glass. It’s my favorite. Both have a fine duplex. I do not spin dials… just Kentucky windage. The Nikon is ok. Has hold overs built in but I have not calibrated to my subsonic ammo. I prefer a bolt gun over a semi. |
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USA
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Posted: 10/3/2021 1:29:38 AM EDT
[Last Edit: Trollslayer]
[#27]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By TODD-67: Glass is OK until you get up to max magnification. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By TODD-67: Glass is OK until you get up to max magnification. Originally Posted By Mfinaustin: The glass seems hazy to me. This confirms what I saw in the images taken thru the scope - the fine detail vanished. |
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USA
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Posted: 10/3/2021 3:00:27 AM EDT
[Last Edit: Trollslayer]
[#28]
Looking at the above models, so far, Leupold seems to be the leading candidate. NightForce is probably better but is more than 3X the price.
Are there any other close focusing models out there? If Leupold is #1 on performance/price,... Who is #2? |
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Posted: 10/3/2021 9:19:42 AM EDT
[#29]
Did you look at the Vortex Venom and Strike Eagle 5-25? Both go down to 15 yards and in the same price range as above. Also are better glass than the Diamondback Tactical’s.
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TX, USA
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Posted: 10/3/2021 11:33:53 AM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Trollslayer: Looking at the above models, so far, Leupold seems to be the leading candidate. NightForce is probably better but is more than 3X the price. Are there any other close focusing models out there? If Leupold is #1 on performance/price,... Who is #2? I have the Leupold VX Freedom 3x9x33 that you have pictured above. I have only had it about 3 months but very happy with it so far. I have it mounted on a CZ 452 .22 by the way. |
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USA
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Posted: 10/3/2021 1:22:24 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Trollslayer]
[#31]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Rob01: Did you look at the Vortex Venom and Strike Eagle 5-25? Both go down to 15 yards and in the same price range as above. Also are better glass than the Diamondback Tactical’s. Added to the list, thank you. I could annotate the post with reticle type, weight, size, etc. However, with any optical performance metrics, there remains no way to decide which I would prefer. Perhaps I should buy them all. Then, I could check all the optics in a side-by-side test and return all but one. |
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USA
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Posted: 10/3/2021 1:33:05 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By thebert: I have the Leupold VX Freedom 3x9x33 that you have pictured above. I have only had it about 3 months but very happy with it so far. I have it mounted on a CZ 452 .22 by the way. Cool! Thank for the input. It is relatively inexpensive, simple reticle, lifetime warranty and light in weight (12 ounces versus 35 ounces for Vortex). The adjustable objective is not a negative in my book. When in a sling, I find them almost as easy to operate as reaching over and around to get to the side focus. I have long arms.  I was thinking of the VX-3HD as the leader right now. |
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Posted: 10/3/2021 2:05:58 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Rob01]
[#33]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Trollslayer: Added to the list, thank you. I could annotate the post with reticle type, weight, size, etc. However, with any optical performance metrics, there remains no way to decide which I would prefer. Perhaps I should buy them all. Then, I could check all the optics in a side-by-side test and return all but one. No there isn’t a 100% way but knowing what you want for reticle, parallax, power range, focal plane and end use you can make that determination fairly easy. Problem is you don’t have any set parameters yourself. You are shooting .22 from that 50 foot area(16.6 yards) to 100 on targets. I wouldn’t get anything under 25x myself. A reticle with a small dot or thin crosshair that can sub tend on the .25” target at 25 yards and can parallax down to 10-15 yards. As for focal plane, either will work for your use as you will be using the scope on the upper portion of its power range so the ffp staying in relation to power would not be an issue. And price needs to be semi set also so you can look at scopes in that range. You don’t have to buy them all to test them. Also your prices are wrong. The Strike Eagle is $699 and the Venom is $499. The site prices are MSRP. Not street prices. |
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CA, USA
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Posted: 10/4/2021 11:21:38 AM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By WWoodworth: For bench work? Find a Weaver T36. But I'm old school. I'm glad I bought a fine crosshair T36 back in the early 2000's. Great scope for bench shooting and it wasn't expensive at all ( ~$500 or so). |
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USA
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Posted: 10/4/2021 7:36:25 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Trollslayer]
[#35]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Rob01: Also your prices are wrong. The Strike Eagle is $699 and the Venom is $499. The site prices are MSRP. Not street prices. All the prices I listed are MSRP. |
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Posted: 10/4/2021 8:41:27 PM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Trollslayer: All the prices I listed are MSRP. That’s fine but I like to know what it actually costs me as some are closer to MSRP than others. Street price is a better judge. |
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USA
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Posted: 10/5/2021 12:53:06 AM EDT
[Last Edit: Trollslayer]
[#37]
Price may eventually factor in, Rob01, but for now, I am most interested in optical performance. Reticle and features are also factors.
Price will be the final consideration. $3k for the NightForce and others in that rarefied price range are unlikely to win the down-select unless they win in every other category and do so by a wide margin. One factor that I had not appreciated was the weight - many weigh over two pounds, the Leupolds only 12/18 ounces. When shooting from a sling, I bet that is a noticeable difference. Anyone know how important that is? |
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Posted: 10/5/2021 9:00:48 AM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Trollslayer: Price may eventually factor in, Rob01, but for now, I am most interested in optical performance. Reticle and features are also factors. Price will be the final consideration. $3k for the NightForce and others in that rarefied price range are unlikely to win the down-select unless they win in every other category and do so by a wide margin. One factor that I had not appreciated was the weight - many weigh over two pounds, the Leupolds only 12/18 ounces. When shooting from a sling, I bet that is a noticeable difference. Anyone know how important that is? The optical performance of any of those will be fine for your needs. Out to 200 yards is close and you will be able to see the targets fine. You want the highest optical performance then plan to pay highest prices. The 3-9x optic shouldn't even be in there as you don't want a low power optic. So you will be slung up now? Do you shoot slung now? Weight is not usually an issue as it helps settle the rifle in when either in position on props or slung. In prone, sitting and kneeling the weight is supported and the only place the weight might come in is in offhand but then it comes down to your personal abilities. I run a 48 ounce scope on my .22 now and no problems slinging up with it when needed at matches. Only you can really answer if you need super light or you can use a 30-35 ounce optic. |
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UT, USA
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Posted: 10/7/2021 3:23:42 AM EDT
[#39]
Athlon midas TAC 5X25 FFP
great scope. Very close to my Nightforce in functionality at a third the price |
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Posted: 10/7/2021 6:13:23 AM EDT
[#40]
My buddy recommended a swampfox patriot for my savage 22, he shoots a lot of rimfire matches. Under your budget and seems well built, I think swampfox is China though so ymmv.
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Posted: 10/7/2021 11:04:28 AM EDT
[#41]
A lot of scopes are made in China now days and harder to avoid.
I have not used the Swampfox Patriot, Kentucky Long, or Warhawk. I do have a couple of their LPVO scopes and like them. I have a couple of the Tomahawk scopes and one Arrowhead. I also have their Blade prism scope and at least one of every micro dot they make. I have been very pleased with them for the price. If their precision scopes are as good as their LPVO scopes, they should be good to go. I also have several Primary Arms scopes that have served me well. I just took the Primary Arms 4-14 MIL-DOT off one of my AR's and put it on my Savage MkII. The Swampfox Arrowhead 1-8 replaced the Primary Arms 4-14 on the AR. Yes there are better scopes available at higher prices but I have been happy with my PA and Swampfox scopes. |
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USA
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Posted: 10/7/2021 11:25:19 AM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By crashburnrepeat: Athlon midas TAC 5X25 FFP great scope. Very close to my Nightforce in functionality at a third the price Thanks for the suggestion but it has a 25 yards minimum focus distance. That's better than what I have right now but not what I am after in a scope for my rimfire rifle. |
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USA
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Posted: 10/8/2021 9:01:54 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Trollslayer]
[#43]
I spent some time studying the dizzy array of products available from ATHLON Optics.
This one seems decent - Helos BTR GEN2 4-20×50 APLR6 FFP IR MOA - focuses down to 10 yards; 28 ounces; $840 I am not yet ready to buy. I may go to the LGS and see what they have in stock. That way, I can look thru and touch before I buy. They usually have decent prices, too. It would be nice to find a Leupold EFR scope. 
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USA
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Posted: 10/9/2021 7:25:04 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Trollslayer]
[#44]
Are there any other brands or models I should consider?
20-25X typically; close focusing (10-15 yd); good quality optics;... As far as I can tell, the 6.5-20X40mm EFR Leupold (above) just isn't available anywhere. |
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USA
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Posted: 10/10/2021 2:04:29 AM EDT
[Last Edit: Trollslayer]
[#45]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By WWoodworth: For bench work? Find a Weaver T36. But I'm old school. The Weaver is no longer in production. I found this Sightron which seems to be a copy of the old Weaver scope. Know anything about it? Unlike the Leupold, this one is available for purchase right now.  $530; 15 yards; 17 ounces; 3.4" eye relief https://sightron.com/products/sii-target-36x42-brd |
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Posted: 10/10/2021 8:51:51 AM EDT
[#46]
Have you slung up behind a fixed 36x scope?
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Posted: 10/10/2021 10:34:05 AM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Trollslayer: Are there any other brands or models I should consider? 20-25X typically; close focusing (10-15 yd); good quality optics;... As far as I can tell, the 6.5-20X40mm EFR Leupold (above) just isn't available anywhere. EuroOptic has this Bushnell. Focus to 10M. Even on sale, it's pricier that what you've listed. I've never used it, don't know anything 1 way or the other. |
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USA
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Posted: 10/10/2021 12:26:47 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Trollslayer]
[#48]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Rob01: Have you slung up behind a fixed 36x scope? I've done it with my 25X, shooting slow prone matches at 600 yards. At this point, I am just surveying the market to understand my options for close focusing scopes. |
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USA
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Posted: 10/10/2021 12:42:31 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Trollslayer]
[#49]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By mi650: EuroOptic has this Bushnell. Focus to 10M. Even on sale, it's pricier that what you've listed. I've never used it, don't know anything 1 way or the other. Added above. It is not on the Bushnell web site, so may be either very new or older. Thanks for the help, guys. I've spent a lot of time scrounging over the last few days. Your efforts really help. |
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Posted: 10/10/2021 5:18:52 PM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Trollslayer: I've done it with my 25X, shooting slow prone matches at 600 yards. At this point, I am just surveying the market to understand my options for close focusing scopes. Might get away with it prone but move off the belly then 36x fixed is the wrong answer whether it adjust parallax down to 1 yard or not. |
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