User Panel
User Panel
User Panel
|
Posted: 7/25/2011 8:47:25 AM EDT
[#1]
I have a 12 gauge stoger I bought in college about 20 years ago for about $200.00. It has held up for thousands of rounds of trap, dropped a deer with a slug, and a bunch of other animals after the chickens or in the garden. It is hanging on the wall not six feet away, and it will go to one of the boys when I die.
It is easy for my wife or children to use if I am not at home, and it is easy to determine if it is loaded or not, even in complete darkness. I like the gun, and I often take it for a walk with me (or a 223 or a 22) depending on what I think I might see. Mine is not set up like yours, but for the money, it is a good shooting side by side that I am not afraid I might damage by using. |
|
|
|
Posted: 7/25/2011 9:08:22 AM EDT
[#2]
Movies with big firefights in the hallways always make me wonder why someone does not start shooting through the walls. At least in the tv terminator show they talked about kevlar in the back of the recliner, I don't have the money for it but it is one reason why concealment might equal cover. A couple shots down the hallways to make em hide and then some shots through the wall is what I figure most home invasions or something of that sort should wind up turning into. The walls in my house are decent but not something that will really stop 00 buck or decent rifle rounds. I just don't like some of the really frangable stuff since it sometimes disintegrates upon initial impact with something kind of hard. On my 590, no bayo lug or heat sheild on mine, I don't like the weight of shells in the strap when swinging it. I have a poncho villa chest strap but for around the property a few shells in a pocket or pouch on the belt works fine. But it comes down to what people prefer and I readily admit to having little time behind the shotgun compared to most of my other stuff. I know for around here the actual use of the 590 could have been done fine with a single shot shotgun. Had a couple wild stray dogs that needed to be put down. Because of buildings and livestock I took one shot at a time and had to move 50 yards to line up the next one to be as safe as I wanted to be. One person out this weekend had a video of reactive target shooting with his saiga 12 gauge and I figure that is the one for one end of the spectrum. I don't know if I want a single shot just because I like a quick 2nd follow up shot. I can see where 2 barrels would be nice and I know there would be no issues with the tube magazine spring getting weak like what my 590 did a while back. Actually it has done it in the past, guess I should see if they make a better spring that I won't have to restretch now and then. On ammo I stock the walmart target packs, have 1k rds of that I guess. Got it back when it was cheap and I was considering doing some redneck clay throwing and shooting. Maybe 500 rds of 00 buck, most of it 2.5 inch because I can fit more rds in the 590 that way. But some 3 inch is around but only about 50 rds of that maybe. Got some slugs, probably 100 rds of it but even those are not all the same so if looking for hunting I would have to shoot a few to make sure I knew where they would hit. Got some various other odds and ends but for me the 00 buck is what I use on anything considered varmint, it may destroy what it hits or it may just put it down right there but it does the job and does it well. No worries on my end since it is what I use about all the time I actually get the shotgun out. I have a lot of the wally world bulk pack 00 buckshot, tjs 00 sounds better but I have issues with today's ammo prices. |
|
|
|
Posted: 7/25/2011 12:10:55 PM EDT
[#3]
Got a story for you Zach.
For a while, my 590 was a designated go to home defense weapon so I loaded it with 3" Winchester 14 pellet Magnums. I had it with a single handgrip at that time. I got tired of it being in the way in the closet so pulled it out, put it in a safe, and then forgot about it. Quite a while later, I'm going to a shooting with some of the guys, see it in the safe and drag it along. We get to doing mag dumps so I mag dump the 590. Yep, 3" magnums from the hip with nothing but my handgrip.  I had forgotten all about those Winchester monsters being in there.
That cured me. I put the original speedloader stock back on that gun and haven't bought a monster shell since. 
That damn thing liked to take my hand off. That light shotgun's recoil put a .44 magnum handgun to shame. 
|
|
|
|
Posted: 7/25/2011 12:15:51 PM EDT
[#4]
Nice. A lot of folks don't realize how short and handy a double or single can be versus a pump or auto with a long receiver and bolt. |
|
|
|
Posted: 7/25/2011 1:28:00 PM EDT
[#5]
Quoted:
http://www.ar15armory.com/forums/uploads/1309968497/gallery_7_13_70226.jpg Stoeger Double Defense Shurefire 6p Blackhawk Shotgun Sling Despite having a bunch of pumps, over and unders, and yes a Mossberg 590 complete with give a liberal a heart attack bayonet lug, I like this gun. Its small in size, two very fast shots, handles magnum shells, ported so to keep the barrel down, and slings over your back so the shells cross your chest like a Poncho Villa movie. The light is side mounted so both an easy simple left hand index finger to activate and a comfortable riding position when back slung. I have a whopping a little over $500 in the gun, $439 tax and background on the actual shotty and picked up the Shurefire LED for $54 on Amazon. The rounds pictured are the Italain Buckshot Law Enforcement which is 1290 fps, 12 pellet, 00. This will stop a bad guy and will stop a bird. Tj TJ be careful with that type of sling. They had been used with law enforcement guns in the past. The ammo being right there was a great advantage, until one incident where a LEO was covering a suspect with a shotgun with that type of sling. Someone came up behind a the cop to see what was going on. The cop swung around to see who was coming up behind him, the weight of the ammo swinging forward as he turned caused caused the gun to move forward which having his finger on the trigger caused the gun to discharged. He killed a women if I remember right. Trigger control was lacking here but it all the same it happened. You won't find those type ammo/slings in LEO circles anymore. |
|
|
|
Posted: 7/25/2011 1:41:46 PM EDT
[#6]
Quoted:
Quoted:
http://www.ar15armory.com/forums/uploads/1309968497/gallery_7_13_70226.jpg Stoeger Double Defense Shurefire 6p Blackhawk Shotgun Sling Despite having a bunch of pumps, over and unders, and yes a Mossberg 590 complete with give a liberal a heart attack bayonet lug, I like this gun. Its small in size, two very fast shots, handles magnum shells, ported so to keep the barrel down, and slings over your back so the shells cross your chest like a Poncho Villa movie. The light is side mounted so both an easy simple left hand index finger to activate and a comfortable riding position when back slung. I have a whopping a little over $500 in the gun, $439 tax and background on the actual shotty and picked up the Shurefire LED for $54 on Amazon. The rounds pictured are the Italain Buckshot Law Enforcement which is 1290 fps, 12 pellet, 00. This will stop a bad guy and will stop a bird. Tj TJ be careful with that type of sling. They had been used with law enforcement guns in the past. The ammo being right there was a great advantage, until one incident where a LEO was covering a suspect with a shotgun with that type of sling. Someone came up behind a the cop to see what was going on. The cop swung around to see who was coming up behind him, the weight of the ammo swinging forward as he turned caused caused the gun to move forward which having his finger on the trigger caused the gun to discharged. He killed a women if I remember right. Trigger control was lacking here but it all the same it happened. You won't find those type ammo/slings in LEO circles anymore. Thanks but I'm pretty good about not having my finger on any trigger till its ready to go boom. It doesn't take a sling, all it takes is a slap on the back or a good sneeze. I have quite a few hair triggers in my collection, it would take way less than that. |
|
|
|
Posted: 7/25/2011 4:51:09 PM EDT
[#7]
Quoted:
LOL, you need to retake the pic- your toes aren't in it! Have a fondness/weakness for doubles. Into double digits.  , but many were inherited.
So maybe I have a genetic predisposition towrds them. Sterlingworths in 12,16,and 20 too. My brother picked up a NIB Stoeger Coach gun 20+ years ago for cheap. Being younger and foolisher(?), we tried both barrels at once, starting with low brass # 8s,working up to slugs. It held. I'm with you buddy! I don't really collect guns. They are tools. some for harvesting hogs and dear, some for killing rodents, some for practice and fun, most for defense. but i collect old sxs like they are going out of style. I've done good to. I've picked up over 14 of them over the last couple of years (under the hoax i'm going to fix them up and sell them...) and instead have left them all be. they sit teastaments to lives lived. Old guns with character beat into the wood and steel. it doesn't hurt that i've nave paid more than $80 bucks for one either.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 7/25/2011 7:14:03 PM EDT
[#8]
I never installed the pistol grip that came with my 590 but I never sold it either.
At work we train to shoot from the shoulder and shoot from the hip and I like a shoulder stock to put on my shoulder or trap against my hip. Pistol grips look nice but I just never got to where I felt I wanted to mess with. Part of why my handguns stop at 44mag is because the stout 44 mag loads are enough for me to be comfy with saying I have had enough recoil for today. I like the little coach guns, just never spent the money on one. |
|
|
|
Posted: 7/26/2011 1:56:14 AM EDT
[#9]
The lack of ejectors isn't a big deal at all. Watch some of the cowboy action guys some time - they push the lever, and point the barrels at the sky with one hand while grabbing 2 more shells with the other. The shells just drop out. I've sen some that had faster stages with a double than the guys shooting 1897 pumps.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 7/26/2011 3:56:33 AM EDT
[#10]
Quoted:
The lack of ejectors isn't a big deal at all. Watch some of the cowboy action guys some time - they push the lever, and point the barrels at the sky with one hand while grabbing 2 more shells with the other. The shells just drop out. I've sen some that had faster stages with a double than the guys shooting 1897 pumps. there's a Thunder Ranch video where Clint breaks the action and shakes the gun, the empties pop right out. |
|
|
|
Posted: 7/26/2011 4:48:09 AM EDT
[#11]
Funny My 15 yo Son is screamin' to get one of those!
|
|
|
|
Posted: 7/26/2011 8:12:33 AM EDT
[#12]
One caution TJ watch that light when you shoot at night. I had one on my 870 that I actuated with my weak side thumb. Shot a opossum 2 years ago and my thumb is still sore, I don't think it will ever be right.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 7/26/2011 10:59:54 AM EDT
[#13]
Quoted:
One caution TJ watch that light when you shoot at night. I had one on my 870 that I actuated with my weak side thumb. Shot a opossum 2 years ago and my thumb is still sore, I don't think it will ever be right. Yikes! I hadn't thought of that one.
I will need to address that. |
|
|
|
Posted: 7/26/2011 4:15:18 PM EDT
[#14]
TJ for the flashlight get a model that can use a pressure pad. Also you can get the gun slicked out to make the empties fall out quicker. They make a recoil system for the cowboy stoegers that may be adapted to your shotgun.
Goatneck clem gunsmith |
|
|
|
Posted: 7/26/2011 5:15:52 PM EDT
[#15]
Quoted:
That light shotgun's recoil put a .44 magnum handgun to shame. Weight makes ALL the difference! Went from shooting a friend's Kassner 10 ga SxS (not too bad, it was heavy) to a pre-patent Ithica 20 ga SxS that was BRUTAL! First, it was like 5 1/4lbs, and secondly, it was stocked to fit my wife's Grandpa who was MAYBE 5'4"! Light,poor fitting guncan HURT you! Course an hour ago, saw a 3", 12 ga Stoeger Coach gun on local e-classifieds for $300, "as new". Seller stressed it had "two triggers and can fire both barrells at ONCE!" I'd better go back and check the phone number: sounds like one of my brothers!
|
|
|
|
Posted: 7/27/2011 9:35:58 PM EDT
[#16]
you should ditch the sling and just get a bandoleer or one of the stock mounted shell carriers. Having a pound of weight hanging off a 6# gun kind of screws up the point-ability.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 7/28/2011 4:39:35 AM EDT
[#17]
Quoted:
you should ditch the sling and just get a bandoleer or one of the stock mounted shell carriers. Having a pound of weight hanging off a 6# gun kind of screws up the point-ability. Thanks for your advice..........BUT..........this is not my first shotgun. Let me explain. That sling drops of with the snap of two buttons. I have both a 10 round stock sock round holder that fits on any of shotguns as well as a few bandolier belts. I can interchange any of those with other guns. Same goes for other slings, I can snap on a plain Jane sling. Seeing there's only one of me, I'm almost sling poor really. I tend to want one for every gun but then opt which ones I use or none at all depending on what I'm doing. BTW, If I'm going hunting during the day, that light bolts right off too.
Tj |
|
|
|
Posted: 7/30/2011 7:03:59 AM EDT
[#18]
I could never get use to having the weight of shotshells mounted in a sling. When you move the weapon the inertia causes the sling to swing like a pendulum...very annoying.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 7/30/2011 7:10:12 AM EDT
[#19]
My wife has a Remington 870 Compact Junior...
http://www.remington.com/products/firearms/compact/shotguns/model-870/model-870-express-compact-jr.aspx 5.75 pound 20ga with an 18" vent-rib (Rem-Choke removable tubes) that is TINY. These make ideal survival shotguns IMHO, because they are so small / convenient. I do not, however, think a shotgun is good for a Bug-Out. The ammo weighs too much. However, for kicking around the homestead or for use as a BOV stowed weapon...they're great. As a side, my wife's primary Bug-Out rifle is a Ruger 10/22 stainless with Leupold VX2 scope and other upgrades. It weighs about the same as the Remington...and she has 1100rds of ammo in her kit. I carry another 1650rds in my kit. |
|
|
|
Posted: 7/30/2011 7:10:55 AM EDT
[#20]
Live Link...
Remington Compact Junior ETA: The website states they now have 20" barrels. My wife's model was bought 3 years ago and has an 18.75" barrel. More convenient. |
|
|
|
Posted: 7/30/2011 3:26:13 PM EDT
[#21]
The guy that taught me defensive shooting and started me with guns....longer than most of you have been alive...swore by a double shotgun....he knew his shit, was a Jackson white, carried a 1911 since he was 16 and since his family was here before the US was....just didn;t give a shit. Lived for a while on a mountain with his gf, on unemplyment....putting money in the bank and eating from the woods....
|
|
|
|
Posted: 7/31/2011 2:03:42 AM EDT
[#22]
I don't need a double barrel shotgun, but I have been looking at the Stogers for years and now I really want one!
The spring in my pump shotguns has always worried me. This would be a nice back up! A lot more along the lines of KISS. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/11/2011 9:53:09 AM EDT
[#23]
That is a great user friendly idea for a multi purpose scattergun, I like it!
|
|
|
|
Posted: 8/11/2011 11:29:23 PM EDT
[#24]
Quoted:
I'm going to go against the grain on this one, that would be at the back of the safe for a go-to gun. I'm sure it's a nice gun but it seems to have too many disadvantages to be a weapon I would choose if I had to. I think it's a cool weapon––I've got one beside my bed––but it would not be my goto SHTF gun, or even my goto SHTF shotgun. While it is years ahead of not having a gun at all, I don't see what it brings to the table when placed against an affordable pump 12g. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/11/2011 11:31:05 PM EDT
[#25]
Quoted:
I don't like the single trigger on this gun. Do both barrels go off simultaneously, or is two-stage or something? Also, I never liked that you have to click the Stoeger safety off every time you cock it. Other than that it's a decent gun. Easily remedied. Any SASS gunsmith will slick it up, remove the Stoeger auto-safety feature, and polish the chamber for around $100. I've had it done to mine––I hated that feature. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/11/2011 11:59:43 PM EDT
[#26]
Quoted:
Quoted:
TJ, I looked at one real close a few days ago. I didnt like the fac that the shells don't eject. You have to pull them out. Does this present a problem for you? What your take on it? Jim Kind of use to it from skeet guns, however this is different. That short barrel twists real easy and while broken open the shells drop right out. Right now, I'm pocketing the empties to reload so it saves bending over. No its not a storm the beach gun, but its pretty easy to nestle that stock in your arm pit, hang the break over your forearm, hold the sling with your right hand, pull the shells or twist it as you do the nestle over the arm so they drop, then pull the new rounds with you left and load with your left. Its just like what you do hunting or skeet shooting with a breakdown gun and pretty easy walking. No its not a run at a crowd shooting like crazy changing mags type gun, but then chucking 18-24 32 caliber bullets with two trigger pulls that spreads like a Claymore isn't quite like a mag gun either. The problem is these doubles are damn popular, cost a tad more to make than over and unders, and the cost is through the roof. The Soeger is the low cost option. I wanted this one first mostly for the ported barrel and IC choke to run the bigger shells and slugs. I've shot the crap out of it already and like it so much, I think I'll buy the Coach Supreme next just to get the two triggers so I can loose both barrels at once. Throw some number 4 in there, that's 54 pellets about .22 caliber size all going out at one time and truly like setting off a mini-Claymore. That'll be a hoot. I can also use the Coach Supreme for Cowboy action. It'll be a nice match for my .44, handgun and lever action carbine. I plan to use this gun besides fun, for my wife home defense and me for some hunting. My nephews even talking about a night hog hunt, I may give this gun a try at. That Shurefire high visibility bead sight is a great night combination. Night, you're going to be pretty close anyway. My wife's always been partial to double barrels. The coach gun size suits her better and the idea of getting two off without having to pump appeals to her. (I don't know if I care to be first one out the door with your backup having a scatter gun. )
The Double Defense, the whole thing is geared towards night use. I like this thing. Tj I'm a fellow SASS guy myself. Tj, does your wife have any problem breaking/cocking your shotgun? My wife and teen daughter both struggle with mine, and my son (a small 11 year-old) can't do it at all without being dangerous. None of them have any trouble with the the Chinese copy, which has exposed hammers...since "cocking" is actually done by manually pulling the hammers back, and not by the "break" action. Just something to think about for those of you that are considering this for a HD gun––some people have a bit of trouble breakin' 'em open. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/12/2011 6:08:28 AM EDT
[#27]
I will soon be buying an NEF Single-shot 12 Gauge for a bug-home-gun.
I like the fast ejecting shell casings, the barrel and buttstock can be cut down to bare minimum legal lengths and overall length. They can be bought for dirt-cheap, are simmplicity in its finest, and can be often found used for $75. It can be fired somewhat quickly, can be broken down in an incredibly compact & quick-to-assemble package, and is so cheap you feel no guilt leaving it in your truck/car trunk for months with only periodic oiling. Mount a cheap Primary Arms red-dot and it'll have quick target acquisition and be nice & accurate with slugs, buckshot, or other shells, and can fire anything from slugs, shot, bird shot, flares, dragons-breath, and anything else you can feed it, and will kill anything in the lower-48 just fine with a range of ~200 yards. If I went with a double-barrel, I'd have to ensure that the shells eject quickly & easily, and that it has TWO triggers. The true advantage of a double-barrel shotty is that you can have one barrel with a slug, and one with buckshot, and can select which ammunition you want to fire first. Walking around with one slug and one buckshot, you can shoot buckshot at a close-range threat, or fire the slug at targets beyond 25 yards without worrying about how many lawyers are chasing your lead down range toward innocent bystanders in an urban environment. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/12/2011 6:45:11 AM EDT
[#28]
I like it TJ.
Somehow I dreamed of Bears attacking me last night and your shotty showed up in my hands. It worked well and I was the victor. 
|
|
|
|
Posted: 8/12/2011 9:48:06 AM EDT
[#29]
That is nice if your using buckshot but the Fed flight control well worth the money. It shoots nice and tight. That is a nice scatter gun I'd love to get one like that I have an old Stevens side by side 20ga that was my Grandfathers and since I got it I have wanted to make a combat side by side like yours.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 8/13/2011 11:49:57 AM EDT
[#30]
Quoted:
The Wal-Mart on the SW corner of Spring Creek & 75 in Plano, TX has them new for $117.
I will soon be buying an NEF Single-shot 12 Gauge for a bug-home-gun. I like the fast ejecting shell casings, the barrel and buttstock can be cut down to bare minimum legal lengths and overall length. They can be bought for dirt-cheap, are simplicity in its finest, and can be often found used for $75. These need to have the barrel honing typically done by cowboy action shooters to help reduce the recoil. This is going to be my new trunk/Jeep gun. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/13/2011 12:31:37 PM EDT
[#31]
Quoted: "This little thing? It's for rabbits."Nice double. I picked up a Norinco last year. Exposed hammers and sling swivels. It sits next to my mom's bed, loaded with #4 buck I tried to give myself eight or ten reasons, but they all failed compared to the secret knowledge that I've wanted one since Burt Lancaster told the bad guy "Tell them Valdez is coming." |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/14/2011 7:48:52 AM EDT
[#32]
I love that movie
|
|
|
|
Posted: 8/14/2011 3:32:16 PM EDT
[#33]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
TJ, I looked at one real close a few days ago. I didnt like the fac that the shells don't eject. You have to pull them out. Does this present a problem for you? What your take on it? Jim Kind of use to it from skeet guns, however this is different. That short barrel twists real easy and while broken open the shells drop right out. Right now, I'm pocketing the empties to reload so it saves bending over. No its not a storm the beach gun, but its pretty easy to nestle that stock in your arm pit, hang the break over your forearm, hold the sling with your right hand, pull the shells or twist it as you do the nestle over the arm so they drop, then pull the new rounds with you left and load with your left. Its just like what you do hunting or skeet shooting with a breakdown gun and pretty easy walking. No its not a run at a crowd shooting like crazy changing mags type gun, but then chucking 18-24 32 caliber bullets with two trigger pulls that spreads like a Claymore isn't quite like a mag gun either. The problem is these doubles are damn popular, cost a tad more to make than over and unders, and the cost is through the roof. The Soeger is the low cost option. I wanted this one first mostly for the ported barrel and IC choke to run the bigger shells and slugs. I've shot the crap out of it already and like it so much, I think I'll buy the Coach Supreme next just to get the two triggers so I can loose both barrels at once. Throw some number 4 in there, that's 54 pellets about .22 caliber size all going out at one time and truly like setting off a mini-Claymore. That'll be a hoot. I can also use the Coach Supreme for Cowboy action. It'll be a nice match for my .44, handgun and lever action carbine. I plan to use this gun besides fun, for my wife home defense and me for some hunting. My nephews even talking about a night hog hunt, I may give this gun a try at. That Shurefire high visibility bead sight is a great night combination. Night, you're going to be pretty close anyway. My wife's always been partial to double barrels. The coach gun size suits her better and the idea of getting two off without having to pump appeals to her. (I don't know if I care to be first one out the door with your backup having a scatter gun. )
The Double Defense, the whole thing is geared towards night use. I like this thing. Tj I'm a fellow SASS guy myself. Tj, does your wife have any problem breaking/cocking your shotgun? My wife and teen daughter both struggle with mine, and my son (a small 11 year-old) can't do it at all without being dangerous. None of them have any trouble with the the Chinese copy, which has exposed hammers...since "cocking" is actually done by manually pulling the hammers back, and not by the "break" action. Just something to think about for those of you that are considering this for a HD gun––some people have a bit of trouble breakin' 'em open. I'm afraid my wife is Annie Oakley re-incarnated. I can still remember when dating the first time I took her shooting. I took her shooting cans at a strip mine. Here I was giving all this instruction careful as could be. I shoot a can and show her how its done. Her turn, she shoots the can then hits it twice more before hits ground. Some people are just a damn natural, a gun Mozart. It sometimes doesn't seem fair.
To answer your question, yes, opening a double barrel even an over under can be quite daunting without practice. You just practice that arm flip till its as natural as falling off a log. Tj |
|
|
Win a FREE Membership!
Sign up for the ARFCOM weekly newsletter and be entered to win a free ARFCOM membership. One new winner* is announced every week!
You will receive an email every Friday morning featuring the latest chatter from the hottest topics, breaking news surrounding legislation, as well as exclusive deals only available to ARFCOM email subscribers.
AR15.COM is the world's largest firearm community and is a gathering place for firearm enthusiasts of all types.
From hunters and military members, to competition shooters and general firearm enthusiasts, we welcome anyone who values and respects the way of the firearm.
Subscribe to our monthly Newsletter to receive firearm news, product discounts from your favorite Industry Partners, and more.
Copyright © 1996-2024 AR15.COM LLC. All Rights Reserved.
Any use of this content without express written consent is prohibited.
AR15.Com reserves the right to overwrite or replace any affiliate, commercial, or monetizable links, posted by users, with our own.
