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Link Posted: 11/3/2009 1:53:22 PM EDT
[#1]



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I don't think things would get as bad now as they did then.



We had too high a percentage of people in farming and manufacturing jobs.



Diversification helps us to avoid major catastrophes.
Yes, the unemployed McDonald's fry station workers, Starbuck's baristas, welfare program data entry clerks, and JC Penny's cashiers will surely make for a  diverse and skillful workforce capable of bootstrapping us out of an economic collapse...
So you think that things would be better if we all had similar and low skill oriented jobs?

 
The skills involved in the jobs I just mentioned are nearly useless in a non-consumer services, non-welfare state economy.  If the economy tanks, which it very well might, whatever is left definitely won't be consumer services based and probably won't be welfare state based (I hope), as neither would be remotely sustainable.  Yes, in a Depression it would be better if Joe Average knew more about farming and small engine repair than he does about Big Mac assembly and fry-timing.


But better than that would be the ability to invent, design, and produce new technology.

That is an area that we are now far ahead of where we were in the 1930s.



 
Link Posted: 11/3/2009 3:07:07 PM EDT
[#2]
Quoted:

We have less manufacturing capacity (adjusted for population) than we did in the 20's.


What is your source for this claim?

This was the article that prompted this thread.  http://www.economyincrisis.org/articles/issues?i=The+New+Depression


Many economic observers have justifiably stated that the U.S. is in the midst of the greatest recession facing the nation since the Great Depression. In December of 2008, the National Bureau of Economic Research - the department responsible for categorizing our economic condition - finally acknowledged what most of Americans had known for some time: that the U.S. is officially in a deep and painful recession. It should be noted that no matter how bad things get NEBR refuses to use the term “depression.”

As the Treasury and Federal Reserve began pouring hundreds of billions of dollars into the financial market in the final quarter of 2008, there were many who worried these actions would result in inflation – prices rise as the purchasing power of each dollar falls.

At the same time, analysts worried that during and after the holiday shopping season deflation would plunge the U.S. economy deeper into turmoil as more and more consumers put off purchases waiting for even cheaper prices or perhaps better economic times. Their fears were met when the 2008 holiday season went on record as being the weakest shopping season in decades.

Other signs of economic despair - manufacturing at its lowest level in 26 years, 120,000 jobs being shed a month, the volatility on Wall Street, home price plummeting - suggest that the bottom may be a long way off.

When prices drop across the board companies are forced to lay off workers, lay offs lead to decreases in disposable income which in turn lead to decreased consumption. In order to bring in customers companies must drop prices further, thus setting off another cycle. If this spirals out of control we see massive joblessness, falling personal income, and prices so low companies cannot afford to produce or sell goods.

The U.S. now seems primed for an economy bust far beyond what is normally associated with natural economic principles. The only real comparison between our current state and any other historical perspective is the Depression era and Hoover administration.

The prosperity enjoyed by previous generations has been sapped dry over the past decade, leaving us with nothing but debt to build upon for the future. We are now destined to watch the housing market decline and unemployment skyrocket, hoping that at some point the government comes to our rescue.

In a desperate attempt to rescue liquidity, the Federal Reserve dropped key interest rates to a 50-year low in the last quarter of 2008. These rate cuts by the Fed did nothing to stop our economic crisis from deepening.

Unfortunately few, if any, are willing to place the blame of our current economic state where it belongs: on the job-killing “free trade” agreements and the push toward globalization. Both practices have decimated America’s manufacturing base and destroyed its ability to create wealth or compete in the modern world economy.

Ben Bernanke, the world’s foremost expert on the Great Depression, should have seen this coming. He, like the rest of those in government, was blinded by the money available to people in his position and balked at the notion of regulating trade.

During the Great Depression we had the capacity to innovate, manufacture and otherwise create wealth that could drag us out of the hole we were in. Today, we no longer have that capability. We have forfeited that ability through disastrous trade policies that have shipped the majority of America’s manufacturing prowess across the border and overseas. Without the capability to manufacture and create wealth, the U.S. will never truly recover.

Our country currently operates on foreign loans because our government constantly spends beyond its budget. With a lower credit rating, the government would find it more difficult to procure loans and eventually may be frozen out (just as “subprime” borrowers are today) of its needed credit lines. When that happens, the end will have officially arrived and the United States will without a doubt be in, possibly this nation’s worst depression. The question is no longer whether or not this is possible, the question is when this possibility will materialize.
Link Posted: 11/3/2009 3:16:13 PM EDT
[#3]
Quoted:
3. Argentina seized every civilian's retirement account, en masse. One day you had it, the next day the government had it and the banks were closed.


They also seized private checking accounts, IIRC, to prevent everybody from converting into foreign currency.  You could withdraw only a certain small amount per day, and that amount quickly became less useful as inflation hammered their currency.  Eventually the daily withdrawal limit was roughly equal to the bus fare it would cost to get to the bank.
Link Posted: 11/3/2009 3:24:28 PM EDT
[#4]
Quoted:
Back then, most people were looking for employment. Today, most people will be looking for an "entitlement". When they don't get it, they'll take whatever it is they feel entitled to. Cities will burn. Picture the Rodney King riots and post-Katrina New Orleans in every major city.


Pretty much this. Ours is a very different country than the one that went through the great depression.

Link Posted: 11/3/2009 3:26:39 PM EDT
[#5]
The day that the there is another depression like the great depression is the day that everything we stand for as americans will be taken away.
Link Posted: 11/3/2009 3:27:25 PM EDT
[#6]
We depend more on others, which you need cash. Nobody today knows how to grow crops or kill and slice up meat to eat.  If you have no cash, you go begging. If the government cant pay you (because they are going bankrupt from all the debt, your f@#cked!!!!)
Link Posted: 11/3/2009 3:30:58 PM EDT
[#7]
Quoted:
tag

Half of the country would sit on their ass with their hand out.

Wait...


The other half would be busy trying to rob you of all your shit. It's easier than preparing, being civil or helping a neighbor or community get through a rough time. Even outside of the big cities extending out into the burbs. Any moment could be fo time as people get more desperate.

Remember..."earning it is for suckas!"
Link Posted: 11/3/2009 3:34:07 PM EDT
[#8]
Most people in the 20's lived a much, MUCH simpler life than we do now. Many, if not most, knew how to garden, how to can, and how to be mostly self sufficient. We are a nation of soft, doughy, spoiled whiners. If things go bad, I won't be surprised if they go VERY bad.
Link Posted: 11/3/2009 3:36:59 PM EDT
[#9]
Many people don't have the basic skills they did in the 1920s.

Lots of people would starve to death or get killed trying to still food.
Very few would go out and work the land to grow food like they do back then.
And even fewer would have the skills to find work someplace else.

80-90% of us have to buy everything we need from somebody else and don't have the ability to take care of our selves.

Link Posted: 11/3/2009 3:41:26 PM EDT
[#10]
Quoted:
Many people don't have the basic skills they did in the 1920s.

Lots of people would starve to death or get killed trying to still food.
Very few would go out and work the land to grow food like they do back then.
And even fewer would have the skills to find work someplace else.

80-90% of us have to buy everything we need from somebody else and don't have the ability to take care of our selves.



You mean we've been dumbed down and must rely on others now?
Link Posted: 11/3/2009 3:43:46 PM EDT
[#11]



Quoted:



Quoted:

Many people don't have the basic skills they did in the 1920s.



Lots of people would starve to death or get killed trying to still food.

Very few would go out and work the land to grow food like they do back then.

And even fewer would have the skills to find work someplace else.



80-90% of us have to buy everything we need from somebody else and don't have the ability to take care of our selves.

You mean we've been dumbed down and must rely on others now?


We now have a much more advanced lifestyle where people must

SPECIALIZE in the skills that they chose to develop.



This is the basis of a modern market based economy.



 
Link Posted: 11/3/2009 3:46:11 PM EDT
[#12]
Quoted:

Quoted:
Quoted:
Many people don't have the basic skills they did in the 1920s.

Lots of people would starve to death or get killed trying to still food.
Very few would go out and work the land to grow food like they do back then.
And even fewer would have the skills to find work someplace else.

80-90% of us have to buy everything we need from somebody else and don't have the ability to take care of our selves.
You mean we've been dumbed down and must rely on others now?

We now have a much more advanced lifestyle where people must
SPECIALIZE in the skills that they chose to develop.

This is the basis of a modern market based economy.
 



And in a great depression the focus is on the basics of surviving, not inventing the next faster Pentium chip for a better gameboy.
The higher the technology the faster and harder is the fall.
Link Posted: 11/3/2009 3:47:27 PM EDT
[#13]
Could pass the time in the soup line listening to an ipod.
Link Posted: 11/3/2009 3:57:51 PM EDT
[#14]



Quoted:



Quoted:


Quoted:


Quoted:

Many people don't have the basic skills they did in the 1920s.



Lots of people would starve to death or get killed trying to still food.

Very few would go out and work the land to grow food like they do back then.

And even fewer would have the skills to find work someplace else.



80-90% of us have to buy everything we need from somebody else and don't have the ability to take care of our selves.

You mean we've been dumbed down and must rely on others now?
We now have a much more advanced lifestyle where people must

SPECIALIZE in the skills that they chose to develop.



This is the basis of a modern market based economy.

 
And in a great depression the focus is on the basics of surviving, not inventing the next faster Pentium chip for a better gameboy.

The higher the technology the faster and harder is the fall.


I don't agree. If you only focus on the 'basics' there will be no end to the depression. It will only get worse.

People need to focus on things that will increase employment, grow the gdp and END the depression.



 
Link Posted: 11/3/2009 4:05:28 PM EDT
[#15]
People riot and loot.  The entitlement class is large and the self-sufficiency and morals of Americans is a lot less than it was in 1930.  End result is totalitarian government.
Link Posted: 11/3/2009 4:15:44 PM EDT
[#16]
From what I recall In the 1920's something like 40 - 42% of the population were in the agricultural business, whereas there's something like 2% now. people back then knew how to grow their own food and were better at living off the land. Now all we have is a country of couch potatoes who wouldn't know what to do if they couldn't hit the McDonald's or Safeway for dinner.
Link Posted: 11/3/2009 4:16:12 PM EDT
[#17]
BTW, I suggest everybody go to the survival forum under outdoors and visit regularly
Learned a lot and cant stop learning.
Learn to farm/garden and provide for yourself. If the SHTF like I think and many other finance majors, the Great depression will look like a breeze!
Link Posted: 11/3/2009 4:18:18 PM EDT
[#18]
Quoted:
The Feds would keep handing out money rather than let unemployment or welfare benefits end. It may become more worthless money, but it will keep coming.


million dollar bills for everyone.......
Link Posted: 11/3/2009 5:02:27 PM EDT
[#19]
Quoted:

Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Many people don't have the basic skills they did in the 1920s.

Lots of people would starve to death or get killed trying to still food.
Very few would go out and work the land to grow food like they do back then.
And even fewer would have the skills to find work someplace else.

80-90% of us have to buy everything we need from somebody else and don't have the ability to take care of our selves.
You mean we've been dumbed down and must rely on others now?
We now have a much more advanced lifestyle where people must
SPECIALIZE in the skills that they chose to develop.

This is the basis of a modern market based economy.
 
And in a great depression the focus is on the basics of surviving, not inventing the next faster Pentium chip for a better gameboy.
The higher the technology the faster and harder is the fall.

I don't agree. If you only focus on the 'basics' there will be no end to the depression. It will only get worse.
People need to focus on things that will increase employment, grow the gdp and END the depression.
 




When you are up to your ass in alligators it is hard to remember your came to empty the swamp.
Recover comes after the fall, first you must survive the fall. Then you rebuild
Link Posted: 11/3/2009 5:19:57 PM EDT
[#20]



Quoted:


From what I recall In the 1920's something like 40 - 42% of the population were in the agricultural business, whereas there's something like 2% now. people back then knew how to grow their own food and were better at living off the land. Now all we have is a country of couch potatoes who wouldn't know what to do if they couldn't hit the McDonald's or Safeway for dinner.


One of the major problems in the GD was the Dust Bowl



Lots of farmers with un-farmable land, and no other way to make a living....



 
Link Posted: 11/3/2009 5:20:59 PM EDT
[#21]



Quoted:



Quoted:

Many people don't have the basic skills they did in the 1920s.



Lots of people would starve to death or get killed trying to still food.

Very few would go out and work the land to grow food like they do back then.

And even fewer would have the skills to find work someplace else.



80-90% of us have to buy everything we need from somebody else and don't have the ability to take care of our selves.







You mean we've been dumbed down and must rely on others now?


No, we have a much more efficient & advanced society, with a highly specialized division of labor...



Much, much better....



 
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