80% of Cash-For-Clunkers payouts are for new FOREIGN CARS.........WTF?! - Page 2

[ARCHIVED THREAD] - 80% of Cash-For-Clunkers payouts are for new FOREIGN CARS.........WTF?! (Page 2 of 2)

Posted: 8/4/2009 6:25:33 PM EDT

[#1]

Quoted:
I once owned a Ford Pinto. The engine was made in Brazil and the car was assembled in Canada. It require BOTH metric and SAE wrenches to work on it, and required work often. Crappy foreign car. Now I own a good, American-made Toyota.

We don't make Pintos any more.

Posted: 8/4/2009 6:28:34 PM EDT

[#2]

I'm ready.................

Posted: 8/4/2009 6:32:22 PM EDT

[#3]

Quoted:

Quoted:
Cash for Clunkers

4 out of 5 new cars obtained through the Cash for Clunkers program are foreign cars? I mean.......What the fuck?! What has happened to my country?!

Aren't you the one who has a Mercedes SLK in the driveway...?

In the Dentist thread it was a Bentley and an SL, IIRC.

I'm not saying to buy American. I'm not saying American cars are worth a shit. I'm saying if you are going to shakedown the American taxpayer, and make him pay for this shit......at least keep the fucking dollars circulating in AMERICA!

Posted: 8/4/2009 6:33:51 PM EDT

[#4]

Quoted:
What's wrong with foreign cars exactly?

There is NOTHING wrong with them......damn. I failed at making my point on this thread.........sorry!

Posted: 8/4/2009 6:34:34 PM EDT

[#5]

Quoted:

Quoted:

well, if you want to buy a quality car you sure as hell don't buy an 'American" car.

This

Bullshit.

Someone work for the UAW?

Posted: 8/4/2009 6:35:05 PM EDT

[#6]

Quoted:

Quoted:

Aren't most "Foreign" cars actually made in the USA?

A long time ago , US cars stopped being quality and started to become junk.

False. Some "foreign" cars are assembled here. And some of them are assembled from parts that are engineerd here. But most of them are engineered abroad.

When you buy a "domestic" you support a vast food chain. It isn't just about the UAW, it is about the engineers, accountants, and the restaurants and shops that are supported by them.

You are missing the entire point. The domestics (GM, Ford, and Chrysler) are pieces of shit compared to the other American made cars.

Not true. Look at Consumer Reports, J.D. Power, whatever. The new stuff, like the Ford Fusion, is kicking ass on quality.

J.D. Power, that is a fucking joke. "Initial Quality..." everyone loves their new car, ask them again in 150,000 miles.

From my experience, I agree, the new GM stuff is light years ahead of what it was, perhaps even on par with Japanese makes, but the big 3 have been spouting that same mantra for 15 years and have not lived up to it yet. I had a VERY nice Impala rental with 600 miles on it. I couldn't even fit a fist between the body panels, it had OK leather, remote start, non horrible gauges, and decent gas mileage. When those cars are 10 years old and have 200,000 miles on them with a track record of reliability, I, and everyone else, will start buying them.

Posted: 8/4/2009 6:35:45 PM EDT

[#7]

Quoted:

Quoted:
well, if you want to buy a quality car you sure as hell don't buy an 'American" car.

This

Bullshit.

Someone work for the UAW?

I'm an engineer.

Posted: 8/4/2009 6:37:18 PM EDT

[#8]

As a smart consumer, I am looking for the best quality I can afford regardless of place of origin. If American companies can't compete they better get their act together or get out of the way. That's capitalism, not arbitrarily supporting one brand because it may have been mostly made in America at one point.

Posted: 8/4/2009 6:37:36 PM EDT

[#9]

Quoted:

Quoted:
Aren't most "Foreign" cars actually made in the USA?

A long time ago , US cars stopped being quality and started to become junk.

False. Some "foreign" cars are assembled here. And some of them are assembled from parts that are engineerd here. But most of them are engineered abroad.

When you buy a "domestic" you support a vast food chain. It isn't just about the UAW, it is about the engineers, accountants, and the restaurants and shops that are supported by them.

You are missing the entire point. The domestics (GM, Ford, and Chrysler) are pieces of shit compared to the other American made cars.

Not true. Look at Consumer Reports, J.D. Power, whatever. The new stuff, like the Ford Fusion, is kicking ass on quality.

J.D. Power, that is a fucking joke. "Initial Quality..." everyone loves their new car, ask them again in 150,000 miles.

From my experience, I agree, the new GM stuff is light years ahead of what it was, perhaps even on par with Japanese makes, but the big 3 have been spouting that same mantra for 15 years and have not lived up to it yet. I had a VERY nice Impala rental with 600 miles on it. I couldn't even fit a fist between the body panels, it had OK leather, remote start, non horrible gauges, and decent gas mileage. When those cars are 10 years old and have 200,000 miles on them with a track record of reliability, I, and everyone else, will start buying them.

J.D. Power doesn't just look at initial quality, there are other metrics. "Built right" is important, and so is "lasts long". Our 3YIS numbers are doing very well.

Posted: 8/4/2009 6:37:48 PM EDT

[#10]

Quoted:

Quoted:

Cash for Clunkers

4 out of 5 new cars obtained through the Cash for Clunkers program are foreign cars? I mean.......What the fuck?! What has happened to my country?!

Aren't you the one who has a Mercedes SLK in the driveway...?

In the Dentist thread it was a Bentley and an SL, IIRC.

I'm not saying to buy American. I'm not saying American cars are worth a shit. I'm saying if you are going to shakedown the American taxpayer, and make him pay for this shit......at least keep the fucking dollars circulating in AMERICA!

But the buyers are not the ones shaking down the tax payers, it is the administration that is doing so.

You can't blame the recipients of ill gotten funds for choosing the best value for their (other's) dollars.

Posted: 8/4/2009 6:39:42 PM EDT

[#11]

Quoted:

Quoted:
I once owned a Ford Pinto. The engine was made in Brazil and the car was assembled in Canada. It require BOTH metric and SAE wrenches to work on it, and required work often. Crappy foreign car. Now I own a good, American-made Toyota.

We don't make Pintos any more.

Correct. Neither do we make Vegas anymore. But my '73 Chevy was the last new GM product I owned. I bought some Chryslers. I'll never do that again. Fords weren't two bad but they were flimsy and too many things went wrong.

I grew up believing that Americans wouldn't build bad products and then sell them to Americans. The idea that Americans would build crap was beyond my comprehension. It hurts to realize that Americans....UAW members...knowingly built crap. America was Number One.

I'll never buy UAW again.

Posted: 8/4/2009 6:45:44 PM EDT

[#12]

Heh.. People won't even buy that shit with someone else's money

Reminds me of a girl I knew and a buddy who, "wouldn't fuck her with someone else's dick".

Posted: 8/4/2009 6:46:13 PM EDT

[#13]

Quoted:

Quoted:

Cash for Clunkers
4 out of 5 new cars obtained through the Cash for Clunkers program are foreign cars? I mean.......What the fuck?! What has happened to my country?!

Aren't you the one who has a Mercedes SLK in the driveway...?

In the Dentist thread it was a Bentley and an SL, IIRC.

I'm not saying to buy American. I'm not saying American cars are worth a shit. I'm saying if you are going to shakedown the American taxpayer, and make him pay for this shit......at least keep the fucking dollars circulating in AMERICA!

So the Hyundai dealer down the road from you doesn't employ Americans? They're all Koreans working there?
The sales tax on that Nissan doesn't go to your county and state?
Are you aware that many Toyotas are more American than many Chevy/Chrysler/Ford products?

For
minivan shoppers, the Toyota Sienna is as All-American as it gets,
despite its Japanese roots: the Sienna is assembled in the US, and 83
percent of its parts come from US or Canada.
The next closest minivan
is the Dodge Caravan/Grand Caravan or Chrysler Town and Country: the
popular “Stow and Go” models are built in Canada, they have a slightly
smaller parts percentage, and headquarters is in Germany.
For
non-luxury sedan shoppers, they can start with the Ford Five Hundred,
Chevrolet Malibu, or the Toyota Camry. All are built here, with 80
percent US/Canada parts, but the Camry sends at least some of its
profit to Tokyo.
Given fuel prices and the proven quality of the Camry,
it would seem that smart shoppers would discount the profit/name
penalty, and be glad that the sedan they’re buying is made and marketed
here in the US.
Small car searchers with an All-American mandate can
choose between the Chevrolet Cobalt and the Toyota Corolla (75
percent). If you think that a tiny percentage difference is a bit
silly, add the Honda Civic to your list, at 70 percent.

From:
Made in America:

The grille says USA, but that car is an import. Or is it?
ETA: And why would anyone want to support oblama and the UAW, anyways?

Posted: 8/4/2009 6:46:59 PM EDT

[#14]

Quoted:

Quoted:
I once owned a Ford Pinto. The engine was made in Brazil and the car was assembled in Canada. It require BOTH metric and SAE wrenches to work on it, and required work often. Crappy foreign car. Now I own a good, American-made Toyota.

We don't make Pintos any more.

Correct. Neither do we make Vegas anymore. But my '73 Chevy was the last new GM product I owned. I bought some Chryslers. I'll never do that again. Fords weren't two bad but they were flimsy and too many things went wrong.

I grew up believing that Americans wouldn't build bad products and then sell them to Americans. The idea that Americans would build crap was beyond my comprehension. It hurts to realize that Americans....UAW members...knowingly built crap. America was Number One.

I'll never buy UAW again.

UAW didn't help, but to be honest, all they do is screw the shit together. If the car was poorly designed, that was not the UAW's fault.
The current "American" automotive industry (GM and Ford in particular) are LIGHT YEARS ahead of where they were even 10 years ago. Cars are better designed, and better assembled. The UAW has given up a lot of their goodies––they are going to be competitive with the transplants on costs.

Posted: 8/4/2009 6:47:26 PM EDT

[#15]

Quoted:

Quoted:

Aren't most "Foreign" cars actually made in the USA?

A long time ago , US cars stopped being quality and started to become junk.

False. Some "foreign" cars are assembled here. And some of them are assembled from parts that are engineerd here. But most of them are engineered abroad.

When you buy a "domestic" you support a vast food chain. It isn't just about the UAW, it is about the engineers, accountants, and the restaurants and shops that are supported by them.

You are missing the entire point. The domestics (GM, Ford, and Chrysler) are pieces of shit compared to the other American made cars.

Not true. Look at Consumer Reports, J.D. Power, whatever. The new stuff, like the Ford Fusion, is kicking ass on quality.

J.D. Power, that is a fucking joke. "Initial Quality..." everyone loves their new car, ask them again in 150,000 miles.

From my experience, I agree, the new GM stuff is light years ahead of what it was, perhaps even on par with Japanese makes, but the big 3 have been spouting that same mantra for 15 years and have not lived up to it yet. I had a VERY nice Impala rental with 600 miles on it. I couldn't even fit a fist between the body panels, it had OK leather, remote start, non horrible gauges, and decent gas mileage. When those cars are 10 years old and have 200,000 miles on them with a track record of reliability, I, and everyone else, will start buying them.

J.D. Power doesn't just look at initial quality, there are other metrics. "Built right" is important, and so is "lasts long". Our 3YIS numbers are doing very well.

J.D. Power initial Quality has been the domestic brand metric of marketing choice for over a decade, as they produced horrendous crap.

What is 3YIS numbers?

Perhaps the current product is great (quite possible), but you have to build up a decade or more of a track record before you earn brandrecognition.

Posted: 8/4/2009 7:01:08 PM EDT

[#16]

Quoted:

Quoted:
I once owned a Ford Pinto. The engine was made in Brazil and the car was assembled in Canada. It require BOTH metric and SAE wrenches to work on it, and required work often. Crappy foreign car. Now I own a good, American-made Toyota.

We don't make Pintos any more.

No, but the guy who was replaced by the guy you replaced designed a car that left a bad taste in my mouth for the Ford brand. It's a shame because you sound like you take pride in your work. It sucks, but some guy several decades ago made your job harder. Good luck, and don't repeat that asshole's mistake.

ETA: It might not have been the engineer's fault. You've got to deal with the budget parameters you're given. Were they reasonable parameters, or did someone else piss away money irresponsibly or choose bad strategies, painting the engineers into a corner? There are probably entire books on that.

Posted: 8/4/2009 7:07:10 PM EDT

[#17]

Quoted:

Quoted:
I once owned a Ford Pinto. The engine was made in Brazil and the car was assembled in Canada. It require BOTH metric and SAE wrenches to work on it, and required work often. Crappy foreign car. Now I own a good, American-made Toyota.

We don't make Pintos any more.

No, but the guy who was replaced by the guy you replaced designed a car that left a bad taste in my mouth for the Ford brand. It's a shame because you sound like you take pride in your work. It sucks, but some guy several decades ago made your job harder. Good luck, and don't repeat that asshole's mistake.

Very true. I have looked at stuff from as recent as the late 90's and thought, "WTF, 10c more and this could have been good!".

Posted: 8/4/2009 7:11:59 PM EDT

[#18]

Hopefully the foreign manufacturers are non-union.

Posted: 8/4/2009 7:12:45 PM EDT

[#19]

Quoted:

Cash for Clunkers

4 out of 5 new cars obtained through the Cash for Clunkers program are foreign cars? I mean.......What the fuck?! What has happened to my country?!

If THAT is the only thing that pisses you off about the program... wake the fuck up.

Posted: 8/4/2009 7:14:34 PM EDT

[#20]

Quoted:

Quoted:
Aren't most "Foreign" cars actually made in the USA?

A long time ago , US cars stopped being quality and started to become junk.

False. Some "foreign" cars are assembled here. And some of them are assembled from parts that are engineerd here. But most of them are engineered abroad.

When you buy a "domestic" you support a vast food chain. It isn't just about the UAW, it is about the engineers, accountants, and the restaurants and shops that are supported by them.

You are missing the entire point. The domestics (GM, Ford, and Chrysler) are pieces of shit compared to the other American made cars.

Not true. Look at Consumer Reports, J.D. Power, whatever. The new stuff, like the Ford Fusion, is kicking ass on quality.

Ford has been kicking ass on quality for the past decade...

Posted: 8/4/2009 7:17:12 PM EDT

[#21]

Quoted:
Aren't most "Foreign" cars actually made in the USA?

A long time ago , US cars stopped being quality and started to become junk.

yeah that was called the early 70s btw.

i've had good luck with Fords but you have to research like mad to sort out the good ones from the bad ones.

Posted: 8/4/2009 7:17:27 PM EDT

[#22]

Quoted:
From what I could find, it looks like 7 of the 10 are assembled in the USA. Please correct if this information is wrong.

The Top Ten Cash for Clunkers New Cars:

1. Ford Focus (Wayne, MI)

2. Honda Civic (Greensburg, IN)

3. Toyota Corolla (Fremont, CA)

4. Toyota Prius (Japan)

5. Ford Escape (Claycomo, MO)

6. Toyota Camry (Georgetown, KY; Lafyette, IN)

7. Dodge Caliber (Belvidere, IL)

8. Hyundai Elantra (Korea)

9. Honda Fit (Japan)

10. Chevy Cobalt (Lordstown, OH)

Is Belvidere still open? Went by there about 6 weeks ago and the lot was pretty much empty.

Posted: 8/4/2009 7:19:22 PM EDT

[#23]

Quoted:
Hopefully the foreign manufacturers are non-union.

If you bought a car built in Canada, Germany, Japan, Korea, Italy, Belgium, Sweden, etc. (basically, a developed country) it was assembled by their local version of the UAW.
If you want a car built by non-union labor, you have to buy U.S. transplants, or Mexican.

Posted: 8/4/2009 7:20:14 PM EDT

[#24]

Quoted:

Quoted:
Aren't most "Foreign" cars actually made in the USA?

A long time ago , US cars stopped being quality and started to become junk.

Yeah, most foreign car companies manufacture vehicles inside the US.

US cars have seen a pretty significant increase in quality in the past few years. I have a Yukon Denali and it's a great rig. Well built, comfortable, roomy and safe. Quality hasn't been a concern for some years now...they don't make Corvairs, Vegas and Pintos anymore.

GMCs are built like brick shit houses. the Denali actually deprciates less than its sister the escalde.

Posted: 8/4/2009 7:23:34 PM EDT

[#25]

Quoted:

Quoted:
What's wrong with foreign cars exactly?

There is NOTHING wrong with them......damn. I failed at making my point on this thread.........sorry!

It's okay, without dentists I wouldn't have purdy teeth

Posted: 8/4/2009 7:26:33 PM EDT

[#26]

Quoted:
From what I could find, it looks like 7 of the 10 are assembled in the USA. Please correct if this information is wrong.

The Top Ten Cash for Clunkers New Cars:

1. Ford Focus (Wayne, MI) OK car, I've ridden in one the interior is spacious

2. Honda Civic (Greensburg, IN) AWESOME SMALL CAR. I have an 01. LOVE IT. can't bielive I denied my self a Honda car for 15 years

3. Toyota Corolla (Fremont, CA) another great car

4. Toyota Prius (Japan) good but really really gay

5. Ford Escape (Claycomo, MO) junk.

6. Toyota Camry (Georgetown, KY; Lafyette, IN) good

7. Dodge Caliber (Belvidere, IL) makes the escape look good

8. Hyundai Elantra (Korea) one word: depreciation

9. Honda Fit (Japan) super car

10. Chevy Cobalt (Lordstown, OH)lotsof options. XFE gets killer milage and SS is blast to drive

Posted: 8/4/2009 7:34:17 PM EDT

[#27]

Quoted:

Quoted:
Aren't most "Foreign" cars actually made in the USA?

A long time ago , US cars stopped being quality and started to become junk.

False. Some "foreign" cars are assembled here. And some of them are assembled from parts that are engineerd here. But most of them are engineered abroad.

When you buy a "domestic" you support a vast food chain. It isn't just about the UAW, it is about the engineers, accountants, and the restaurants and shops that are supported by them.

You are missing the entire point. The domestics (GM, Ford, and Chrysler) are pieces of shit compared to the other American made cars.

Not true. Look at Consumer Reports, J.D. Power, whatever. The new stuff, like the Ford Fusion, is kicking ass on quality.

J.D. Power, that is a fucking joke. "Initial Quality..." everyone loves their new car, ask them again in 150,000 miles.

From my experience, I agree, the new GM stuff is light years ahead of what it was, perhaps even on par with Japanese makes, but the big 3 have been spouting that same mantra for 15 years and have not lived up to it yet. I had a VERY nice Impala rental with 600 miles on it. I couldn't even fit a fist between the body panels, it had OK leather, remote start, non horrible gauges, and decent gas mileage. When those cars are 10 years old and have 200,000 miles on them with a track record of reliability, I, and everyone else, will start buying them.

i had a rental buick for nearly a month once after my ranger got fubared by an f-350, I can't remember which model it was exactly but it was FWD with the 3.8 I actually liked that car. near the end of the situation I had a caviler. what a piece of shit. the check engine light came on on day 2. interior cheap as hell. that was back in 99.

but there in lies the problem many of those cars don't make it to 200k. freind of mine just shit canned his sons 95 olds because it had become a money sucker. kid got his avalon and he bought a solara

Posted: 8/4/2009 7:43:46 PM EDT

[#28]

My Accord sticker shows it has 80% domestic parts, and both the engine and transmission were made in the USA, the car was manufactured in Marysville OH to be specific. Honda is distributed by American Honda, which is an American chartered company, it was built by Honda of America Manufacturing, also an American chartered company, and both of those are on the stock market and the stocks are owned by people all over the world, just like General Motors and Ford.

Posted: 8/4/2009 9:18:46 PM EDT

[#29]

Quoted:

Quoted:
Aren't most "Foreign" cars actually made in the USA?

A long time ago , US cars stopped being quality and started to become junk.

False. Some "foreign" cars are assembled here. And some of them are assembled from parts that are engineerd here. But most of them are engineered abroad.

When you buy a "domestic" you support a vast food chain. It isn't just about the UAW, it is about the engineers, accountants, and the restaurants and shops that are supported by them.

You are missing the entire point. The domestics (GM, Ford, and Chrysler) are pieces of shit compared to the other American made cars.

Not true. Look at Consumer Reports, J.D. Power, whatever. The new stuff, like the Ford Fusion, is kicking ass on quality.

J.D. Power, that is a fucking joke. "Initial Quality..." everyone loves their new car, ask them again in 150,000 miles.

From my experience, I agree, the new GM stuff is light years ahead of what it was, perhaps even on par with Japanese makes, but the big 3 have been spouting that same mantra for 15 years and have not lived up to it yet. I had a VERY nice Impala rental with 600 miles on it. I couldn't even fit a fist between the body panels, it had OK leather, remote start, non horrible gauges, and decent gas mileage. When those cars are 10 years old and have 200,000 miles on them with a track record of reliability, I, and everyone else, will start buying them.

no kidding... some of the newer fords (and used to be chevys before becoming Odumbo Motors) look interesting, but excuse me if i take the sure bet of an accord or camry before i gamble $25k+ on a new domestic sedan... i will let everyone else test the water first.

lulz JD Power, what a joke. are you actually telling me that on the whole (not just some 3 months/3 years rating, the whole lifespan of the vehicle), consumer reports ranks a domestic sedan above accord and camry?