User Panel
Posted: 9/29/2005 5:53:59 PM EDT
I just read this in Gun Tests
Since reconvening in late august, the california legislature is still considering several anti-gun measures. AB 352 expands the definition of "unsafe handguns" to include semi-automatic pistols that are not designed and equipped with an array of microscopic characters which identify the make, model, and serial number of the pistol by imprinting the characters on each cartridge case when the firearm is discharged. |
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California is full of BS. Almost as much BS as the UK.
I'd be particularly wary of the word "unsafe" being used in legal circles, as "unsafe" normally means something that is dangerously prone to deadly malfunction, and inherantly not a safe thing to be around. |
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Hmmm. I might indeed be trying to get people upset here, but I don't see a better alternative other then whining like many people do. Sooo...how long is it gonna take you subjects of the PRK to do something to stop this madness? Waiting til you have only got your airsoft commando gear? This legislation is gonna keep getting worse. -Ben |
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There's nothing they can do, as long as the 2nd ammendment is not seen as an incorporated right, protected at the individual level. They will keep getting worse and worse laws, as politicans make gun control a pet issue that resonates with the majority of approving voters. CA gun owners are completely overwhelmed, and thus can't do much. |
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You don't know what you're talking about. In the UK, it is OK for kids to swear at their teachers. In the UK, firearms are almost completely banned. This doesn't happen in the PRK. |
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Your kidding, right? -Ben |
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Yes he is. For one, if I were to have swore at my teachers I'd have been expelled. Furthermore there are some classes of firearms that are kosher to own. |
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Im glad I escaped that fuck-hole.
Do they HONESTLY think that this shit will STOP crime... |
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I've heard about that. The kids get a ration of swear words for each day. What...can they say 'fuck' 5 times a day or something? |
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This is like arguing whos gulag is worse - both's gunlaws suck. |
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Hate to burst anyone's bubble, but this proposed law is dead. It was pulled by the bill author due to lack of support.
Old news. |
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Oh man that is so true. |
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Certianly not when I was at school. Then again, I'm Scottish. (we have a slightly different education system to the English) Untill recently "the belt" was employed in Scottish schools (SMACK!) |
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Somebody want to lend us a couple of fairly large nukes, 3 ought to fix what's wrong with California. |
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Old news until it is re-introduced every year over and over again until it passes. Remember, they only have to win once, we have to win every time. |
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If you're from Minnesota you might not really pay enough attention to the thousand or more laws that are proposed each year in California. See we have 35 MILLION people here and another half a million are coming here each year each trying to make this state as screwed up as the state that they left to come here. 35 MILLION people means a whole lot of politicians each trying to do something, anything to get their name in the papers. That's why all the most whacko stuff comes from California because unless your insane you don't get the press - you don't get seperated from the other ten thousand professional law makers we have here. Not too many laws make it out of committe, of those that do about 95% don't get put into law. Even the other politicians know that the bill is just for show and they don't really vote to pass most of them.
A few whacked ones pass every year (without a doubt) but at least we can still buy beer on Sundays. |
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Of course not. It isn't really even about guns per se though everyone seems convinced of it around here. Thusly the question should be: Why do they want so badly to disarm law abiding Americans? I keep asking that but no one even seems to notice. |
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Well, at least I didn't miss yet another opportunity to say:
CALIFORNIA SUCKS |
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Fixed it for ya. |
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How does the marking make the gun safer? kinda like saying surveillance cameras are for your safety - how is that? will they intervene with a criminal and stop him?
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Okay[sigh], I'll say it again: Of course not. It isn't really even about guns per se though everyone seems convinced of it around here. Thusly the question should be: Why do they want so badly to disarm law abiding Americans? |
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I've said it 100 times before ... are you new here? Liberals need victims - of all sorts. Look at the response to the hurricane in New Orleans. The liberals who had homes, food, and medical care provided for them by the government also expected that same government to save them. The conservatives in Texas took care of themselves as they always have been doing. Old stuff but worth repeating: From an American’s First Freedom article: “Strap an electric collar onto a dog. Shock him when he doesn’t obey, then shock him again when he does obey. If you teach him that the rules are ever-changing and that punishment comes without cause, you’ll get one of two outcomes: Either he’ll surrender to punishment as the inescapable outcome, with downturned head and withers trembling – or he’ll rebel against that authority, hackles raises and snarling and disobey every rule.” The state of California has been for more than ten years constantly changing the rules obviously in outright violation of the Constitution’s Bill of Right’s Second Amendment which clearly prohibits States from infringing on the right of the people to keep and bear arms. Those rights in the US Constitution are reserved for the federal government; those not enunciated are free for the states to populate. If the state of California passed a law that suddenly allowed the US Army to quarter it’s troops in your home this would be declared un-Constitutional and overthrown by the US Supreme Court. Yet in California handguns are banned because they are too small, not expensive enough, or have their magazine in the politically incorrect position. Purchases of handguns are rationed to one per month. Rifles are banned by looks, use of detachable magazines, pistol grips, muzzle devices and a dozen other bizarre and seemingly random characteristics. Even toy guns are now regulated by color. The US Supreme Court will step in and overturn these Constitutional violations sooner or later, I just hope it occurs before firearms owners have their forearms tattooed. I have been shooting and collecting various firearms for many years and at the same time have been studying the recent movement to prohibit law-abiding citizens from ownership of them. The politicians who press though each knee-jerk restriction to the latest workplace or schoolyard shooting know perfectly well that the additional regulation will have no effect on the criminal behavior. What bigger taboo is there in today’s society than the taking of another’s life? Very few indeed. So they are trying to legislate a behavior to someone who has already decided to murder one or more humans. Do you honestly think that the killer is going to be slowed down for one second by a regulation prohibiting the use of a rifle with a pistol grip that protrudes below the trigger? It has been long said that you cannot legislate morality yet this is exactly what the liberals are attempting to do. Firearms in the hands of law-abiding citizens are a clear deterrent against crime. When criminals are polled in prison they state that residents with firearms are a bigger crime deterrent than the police. Also according to statistics, police shoot the wrong person more often than the common citizen with a firearm. If you haven’t sat down and figured it out yet the police respond to crime rather than actively prevent crime. They will come to your home after the murder, rape or robbery to attempt to find the criminal afterwards. I don’t plan on waiting to be murdered, have my wife raped or get robbed too many times without taking my own protection into my own hands. And that’s what the politicians want to prevent. When three large men are beating at your door threatening to do harm to your family would you rather have a telephone or a rifle in your hand? A murder takes place in seconds, police response time in measured in tens of minutes. Certainly call the police but until they arrive your protection is in your hands. The same politicians that pass laws that make it impossible to legally carry a concealed weapon have their own tax dollar paid for armed security guards and sleep in a state guarded mansion with a comprehensive security system. What makes them think for one tiny slice of a single second that their life is anymore valuable that mine or yours? They may think that their elected office makes them special but the laws apply to them as well, or does it? Have they made themselves a secret handshake society above us lowly subjects? Why are they taking the proven best tool for our own protection away from us? Remember that the armed criminal is bothered less with getting arrested killing, raping or in an armed robbery then running into an armed victim. Then why are politicians so busy making us into victims? This bothered me for years and years, what was the motive? Not being of the victim mindset I found it nearly impossible to think like one. Until just recently I couldn’t find insight into the thinking of the liberal right-restricting politicians. Until I looked at what makes politicians into politicians: the use of other people’s money and the power it brings them. By catering to the “sheep”, those citizens who choose to be victims, the politicians gain their votes and with it the power to tax and take our life energy for their own use. Those ”sheep” have an irrational rage against those who choose not to be victims. The “sheep” feel that they are too weak to survive without assistance from an all-knowing, all-powerful central government. They raise the professional politician to the level of a flawless king who can do no harm – look at what former President Clinton got away with as an example of a man that is worshiped by the “sheep”. Clinton was a man with hypocrisy seemingly without limit. The “sheep” raise their chosen leader to a God-like status and worship him or her asking them for protection, prosperity and wisdom to solve their mere human problems. Sorry, if you haven’t noticed the Savior hasn’t made himself visible to us yet and I doubt that he’ll choose to do it as a womanizing lying politician when he does. The “sheep” need to wake up and take responsibility for their own lives. They need to make their own decisions and live with the self-esteem that comes from making success from standing up on their own two feet rather than supported and coddled from the cradle to the grave. I am afraid that the independent spirit that gave our forefathers the strength to throw off the burden of the King of England is gone. Rather they actually seek the comfort of an all giving government. Those people in this republic of states that want a strong central federal government are in the majority. The “sheep” are actively are seeking to overthrow our Constitutional form of government by centralizing all power into the Administrative branch and therefore removing the effective system of checks and balances that had been the law as set down in the US Constitution and it’s Bill of Rights. Key to seizing this power is the disarming of the population as a whole. Our Founding Fathers knew of the danger of a strong central government and gave us citizens the means to equalize the equation. Look at their writings yourself if you doubt me. Removing firearms using the “death by a hundred cuts method” will allow the central federal government to seize unlimited power. For a people without the means to protect themselves both from the government and from each other will have to seek protection from those with the means. Unarmed people are always the victims. It’s has happened time and time in this world where a powerful government as killed off some portion of it’s unarmed population. Rather than a power that is derived from the consent of the governed we will have to trust that the absolute power given to the government’s Administrative branch will not corrupt absolutely. I am not a very trusting person and refuse to surrender my responsibilities for any reason, let alone an un-Constitutional law to an out-of-control State government. Words mean something and despite the best efforts of some the meaning of the words “A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed” has not changed. These old words still mean that we, as law-abiding citizens, have a God given right and responsibility to own firearms – firearms with detachable magazines, pistol grips, bayonet lugs and flash suppressors. I am one dog who is rebelling against the authority and will continue to snarl and keep my hackle raised. My spirit will not be soon broken. America’s Revolutionary War did not begin over taxation without representation, high tariffs, corrupt British judges, or even quartering troops among the colonists. Although all of these (and more) are enumerated in our Declaration of Independence among the many grievances against the British Crown, it was not these abuses that triggered that “shot heard ‘round the world.” The Revolutionary War began when British troops were sent to Lexington and Concord to confiscate the Americans’ firearms. Gun confiscation was the match that lit our War for Independence. Do our representatives in Washington DC think that the same people who fought in the freezing cold mountains of Korea, the steaming hot rice patties of Viet Nam or the burning desert tundra of Desert Storm will not react as they did some 230 years ago? Maybe not. The American people have sat by as the former Clinton administration led us though the theft of hundreds of FBI files, sexual scandals in the White House, fund raising violations, lost nuclear secrets, sold missile secrets to the Chinese and blatant outright infringements on the people’s Second Amendment rights. The Republicans virtually sat on their hands as the Clinton administration was brought to impeachment. These politicians may be right in thinking that they can do whatever they feel is best, Constitution be damned, the people’s will be damned too. Or they may be wrong. Are we so ignorant not to know that in every instance where gun registration has been enacted, gun confiscation soon followed? Will we peacefully surrender that which our forefathers sacrificed their lives and fortunes to secure? These questions nag at the patriotic feelings inside of thousands of good honest, law abiding and hardworking men and women in this country. People vilified by the popular media as right wing wackos, patriots and extremist. I suppose an earlier press was saying the same thing about that small minority rich white land and slave owners - men like Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Paine, John Adams, George Washington and Benjamin Franklin who were discontent with similar issues to those we face today from a government. A morally corrupt government which fails to be “of the people, for the people and by the people”. I am convinced that the fundamental freedoms that we now enjoy the last tastes of will have disappeared within the next American generation. Do children raised by the state even know of or have read the Constitution or Bill of Rights? Words mean something. What to the words “A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.” mean to you? If you’re Congresswoman Diane Finestein (D) from California it means that she is free to “well regulate” your rights. She fails to even complete the whole sentence to read the final clause “shall not be infringed”. They are her rights and she is free to meter them out to you subjects as she feels free to do so at the time. These are not stupid people. They read well. They have read both the Constitution and Bill of Rights yet they continuously and actively conspire against our freedoms and liberties. They mask their true intentions behind feelings and cries that “it’s for the children”. Our children deserve the rights guaranteed in our Constitution more than life itself. To paraphrase the patriot Patrick Henry “Give them liberty or you are surely giving them death.” Paul (from two published papers I wrote back in 2001) |
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What about the bullet, brass, and box serialization bill (I think it was AB357)? That didn't seem to go anywhere for a while and I haven't checked myself. This was the "backup" to the bill that was mentioned. If the gun isn't going to leave a serial number on the bullet and brass, then we'll just serialize the ammo! |
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Why, yes I am. You know I was born just yesterday.
Precisely. Now that is the salient portion, as you also recognized by boldfacing it, so I have deleted the remainder of your paper. Excellent. It is about power and control. There is no way to exert full control over a free, note gunowning, society. It has nothing to do with crime, it has nothing to do with safety. Afterall, who really believes those in power give a tinker's damn about our safety? It is about cramming their socialist, neofascist, baby killing, faggot agenda right up our ass. Now some say that it will all be incremental, blah, blah, blah. And it may. But plenty of them have become quite impatient. They have been able to stack the courts to do their evil for years even if, and when, they lost political power, which they have. Still it is not enough, fast enough. Hence the need to disarm us. The bottom line is that it is ESSENTIAL that we recognize their effort for what it is, an attempt at enslavement. It will not be the enslavement of bonds and chains, whips, enforced labor. It would be the slavery of control by more subtle means which the People will fail to have the ability to repulse. It would be innocuous and most of the Sheep will not even recognize it is happening, just as they fail to do so now. The socialists will stop at nothing to promote their agenda of hate. Hatred for conservatism, God, life. They have and will continue to attempt to infiltrate every aspect of our lives and there is only one thing stopping them. |
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I'd be asking for seconds by 9 AM |
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Are sales over state lines permitted? Or do I need to send it to your local FFL? -Ben |
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New proposed gun control legislation in the PRK!
I for one, do not believe it!!!!!! |
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Naw. California sucks because it has, as academically documented, the worst fucking incumbent democrat favoring gerrymandering in the entire fucking country. Sacrametno doesn't represent anyone but the liberal power elites, and you fucksticks appear poised to vote down the ballot measures Ahnold is going to sacrifice reelection to get before you. Its your bed. Enjoy it. |
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FFL will work, I have one in San Francisco, Los Angeles and San Diego. Ship them COD please, thanks. |
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Nah, they'll ban that too since it's scary looking. |
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so are those considered handgun or longgun? |
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Might want to fix that, you put your reply in the middle.
Next day air I believe is required, sucks when a nuke gets put in one of those UPS guys pockets and he walks out with it. |
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You realize that mentioning that nasty incorporation subject is likely to get you flamed by all the idiots that don't understand it? I get flamed all the time over it. The last asshole that tried it apparently finally bothered to read the links I gave him because he tucked his tail between his legs and hasn't posted since, at least under that name. For those that don't understand "Incorporation" is the process whereby the restrictions on the Federal Government in the Bill of Rights get incorporated into applying to the states and lower governments also. It hasn't happened for all the Amendments yet, the Second being the one we care about. It is also a two edged sword because for us in the states that have no Second Amendment equivalent in their State Constitutions because it would shit can all the bad laws we have. For those that have the equivalent, it could potentially force them in to more restrictive Federal laws. |
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You know, it occurred to me, there are times, like the flooding in New Orleans, when FFL's should, for the safety of the people of the United States, not put their lives in danger by trying to rescue all those bound books and 4473's from being damaged beyond all readability.
San Francisco may be such a place soon. |
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