Check out www.nraila.org/ for more.

IBTNB - In Before The NRA Bashers

Quoted: Check out www.nraila.org/ for more.

Interestingly enough, the 'spam firewall' at work blocks that site.


Hmm.....

I didn't read the link, but I am an avid supporter of the NRA. The day for this suit, was the day NO started trying this shit. Not a few weeks later.

WoW !! a lawsuit !! that for certain will stop the gun confiscation  !!

NOT !!!!!!

Quoted: I didn't read the link, but I am an avid supporter of the NRA. The day for this suit, was the day NO started trying this shit. Not a few weeks later.

Wouldn't you rather they do a little discovery and research before they went in there pell-mell? I would. If it was just an errant media report based on that one woman who didn't want to leave or give up her dog and had her gun taken away because she brandished it at the po-po (she was a nutbar), they'd just look stupid.

Oh well. They're the best we have and I firmly believe every gun owner should donate to the cause - whether it's the NRA or some other rights group. Just owning a gun isn't good enough.

I'm sorry but what other pro 2nd groups are doing this besides the NRA????



ok so STFU about it being late. These are not things you can just throw together.

Quoted: Quoted: I didn't read the link, but I am an avid supporter of the NRA. The day for this suit, was the day NO started trying this shit. Not a few weeks later. Wouldn't you rather they do a little discovery and research before they went in there pell-mell? I would. If it was just an errant media report based on that one woman who didn't want to leave or give up her dog and had her gun taken away because she brandished it at the po-po (she was a nutbar), they'd just look stupid. Oh well. They're the best we have and I firmly believe every gun owner should donate to the cause - whether it's the NRA or some other rights group. Just owning a gun isn't good enough.

How much discovery and research was done by the authorities before they decided to stomp on the Constitution?

The NRA should have had a Federal Judge sign a restraining order blocking them from any kind of confiscation. It should have been done that Friday....

JMHO

Quoted: I'm sorry but what other pro 2nd groups are doing this besides the NRA???? ok so STFU about it being late. These are not things you can just throw together.

Unfortunetly, P-man, reason will never have any affect upon the thinking of the NRA bashers.  They want to see the NRA storm into town with weapons drawn, force the NO police department to cease and desisit, drop their weapons and "UP AGAINST THE WALL!"

The fact that the NRA is not a law enforcement organization means nothing to these folks.  It is reactive only.  It's only power is to initiate a legal action and then marshal NRA members to pony up the necessary funds to successfully prosecute that action to (hopefully) a winning conclusion.  Before any of this can happen some basic facts have to be conclusively determined.

But why am I wasting my breath?

Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: I didn't read the link, but I am an avid supporter of the NRA. The day for this suit, was the day NO started trying this shit. Not a few weeks later. Wouldn't you rather they do a little discovery and research before they went in there pell-mell? I would. If it was just an errant media report based on that one woman who didn't want to leave or give up her dog and had her gun taken away because she brandished it at the po-po (she was a nutbar), they'd just look stupid. Oh well. They're the best we have and I firmly believe every gun owner should donate to the cause - whether it's the NRA or some other rights group. Just owning a gun isn't good enough. How much discovery and research was done by the authorities before they decided to stomp on the Constitution? The NRA should have had a Federal Judge sign a restraining order blocking them from any kind of confiscation. It should have been done that Friday.... JMHO

They had to get the next batch of solicitations out the door first.

Quoted: Quoted: I'm sorry but what other pro 2nd groups are doing this besides the NRA???? ok so STFU about it being late. These are not things you can just throw together. Unfortunetly, P-man, reason will never have any affect upon the thinking of the NRA bashers.  They want to see the NRA storm into town with weapons drawn, force the NO police department to cease and desisit, drop their weapons and "UP AGAINST THE WALL!" The fact that the NRA is not a law enforcement organization means nothing to these folks.  It is reactive only.  It's only power is to initiate a legal action and then marshal NRA members to pony up the necessary funds to successfully prosecute that action to (hopefully) a winning conclusion.  Before any of this can happen some basic facts have to be conclusively determined. But why am I wasting my breath?

Because you care and because you speak logically.

Listen, I was pissed off about the confiscations but how was me yelling "Stop it" going to help?

The NRA needed someone to represent in a lawsuit, and since I am in PA and not in LA I can't be the guy they represent.  They also needed to get good first hand information from those affected.  Sure the videos were distrubing if not downright sickening but do they tell the whole story?

Now that they have their info and shit together they've taken action.  We'll see if this even gets any public press.

Quoted: *Snip* How much discovery and research was done by the authorities before they decided to stomp on the Constitution? The NRA should have had a Federal Judge sign a restraining order blocking them from any kind of confiscation. It should have been done that Friday.... JMHO

Coulda-shoulda-woulda

Frankly, I have no idea how the process works- would it even have been possible to do that?

Let's face it, NRA bashers - you need to think about it a bit: If the .gov confiscates everyone's guns (fiction - but you guys seem to think the NRA would allow it), there is no reason for the NRA to be around anymore. Understand? THEY WOULD HAVE NO REASON TO EXIST. This is not a way to grow ranks, raise money, or otherwise stay in business.

Quoted: I'm sorry but what other pro 2nd groups are doing this besides the NRA???? ok so STFU about it being late. These are not things you can just throw together.

I thought the NRA and GOA where teaming up on this. At least that's what I read a few days ago when the topic was posted here.

to little to late.  like everyone has said before

The NRA has been ineffective since the AWB was passed, and we all had to suffer because our weapons looked evil. Oddly enough thats the same time I canceld my membership.

I can get more accomplished by making sure the right people are elected, then I can by supporting an organization that has become just another part of the beltway gang.

Look I am not bashing the NRA, I love the NRA. I just disagree with the way this was handled.

I have supported the NRA all my life and they with that support have promised to protect my RTKBA.

My opinion is they dropped the ball this time.

I fully expect to support them now and in the future.......but I damned sure have the right to disagree with the way they handled this.

They are racists, took them to long to react.

Cool.  I think it is couragous of the NRA to make this stand amidst all of the Hurricane hysteria.

Quoted: Look I am not bashing the NRA, I love the NRA. I just disagree with the way this was handled. I have supported the NRA all my life and they with that support have promised to protect my RTKBA. My opinion is they dropped the ball this time. I fully expect to support them now and in the future.......but I damned sure have the right to disagree with the way they handled this.

Of course you do - and I personally don't think they're perfect either, but they're the biggest and IMHO the best we have.

We'll just have to agree to disagree - you think they should have para-jumped a team of saboteur lawyers/shooters in, and I think they should have done the discovery and found out what the ground-truth was first, with first-hand accounts from credible sources.

Those who were going to join or quit the nra based on their new orleans actions have now been given an answer.

In at least a couple of the nra threads, bashing or otherwise, I posted examples of the nra hamstringing the local efforts to pass gun laws.

Basically the nra came in and got out of state ccws honored for 60 days or so.  The locals were happy with how their bill for no restriction was going and the nra came in without being asked for help and got a bill with a 60 day restriction passed.

I dislike the nra because stuff like my above example is either politics or the nra working for gun control.

Run a search on vin suprynowicz and you will find the example from Utah I think it is.  Claire wolfe has an example in one of here books about shooting the bastards, I don't know if it is the first or 2nd one since I have not dug out my books yet.

So for those who say the nra is the best we have, I say great because we seem to have an organization that is either into grandstanding or wants some measure of gun control beyond what the locals were working towards.

My overall opinion I put in one of the other threads is that the nra is the least restrictive gun control organization and for right now they seem to be working towards loosening the current regulations.

But they don't seem to want to loosen them enogh, and that comes from the nra-ila faw section where they talk about how they are in favor of some gun laws.

Quoted: Quoted: Look I am not bashing the NRA, I love the NRA. I just disagree with the way this was handled. I have supported the NRA all my life and they with that support have promised to protect my RTKBA. My opinion is they dropped the ball this time. I fully expect to support them now and in the future.......but I damned sure have the right to disagree with the way they handled this. Of course you do - and I personally don't think they're perfect either, but they're the biggest and IMHO the best we have. We'll just have to agree to disagree - you think they should have para-jumped a team of saboteur lawyers/shooters in, and I think they should have done the discovery and found out what the ground-truth was first, with first-hand accounts from credible sources.

I think they should have had a lawyer walk into a Federal Courthouse in Washinton and sign an order precluding any suspending of the rights of lawabiding citizens from losing their guns.

We are not talking about their cars or tv's. We are talking about Constitutional rights.....we should never delay when it come to situations like this.

I'm sorry for any of y'all that fail to see this as clearly as I do.

I am and have been an NRA member.  My read of this action is that they moved too late to have any effect on New Orleans.  Whether they could have moved earlier to secure a restraining order will be debated for some time.  I expect that New Orleans will become a disposable "lesson learned" and the NRA's actions primarily focused upon building case law for future emergencies.

I believe that there is an issue that hasn't received much discussion.  In a major national emergency when regional law enforcement cannot respond at the necessary scale or time - and outside state, local and federal law enforcement move into the area is a fairly loose confederation that draws up its own rules until some government entity asserts effective control, policy and communications -- its kinf of a "Wild West" scenario for law enforcement - probably with different teams operating with different attitudes, policies and probably not aware of policy statements or legal guidance due to degraded/non-existant communication.  Its during this period that rights are most succeptable to violation.  Little or no record keeping, deputized teams from everywhere and a lot of civil unrest.

I'll be interested to see what federal plans and policies are made for future regional disasters where civil unrest is an issue.

CWO

Ok, NRA bashers who claim the NRA should have filed a lawsuit the first day...please explain why GOA, the only "no compromise" organization didn't do exactly what you asked?  Do they not view gun confiscation as a major issue?  Are they so disorganized that they are incapable of filing a lawsuit?  What gives?

In the first days of the rumors of this the NRA bashers were screaming because GOA issued a statement condemning it and said the NRA was doing nothing.  Those of us who know how the NRA works said, give them a couple days as they get they verify the facts first.  A couple days later the NRA issued a statement condemning it and said they would keep an eye on things and take any legal action if needed.  Even though the NRA did exactly what GOA had done, this wasn't good enough for them and they blasted the NRA for not immediately filling a lawsuit.  Again those of us who know how the system works said the NRA needs someone who had their firearms confiscated to be named in a lawsuit before one could be filed, give them time to get the facts rights.  A couple days later the NRA and SAF said they were looking for people who had firearms confiscated.  But yet again this wasn't good enough for the NRA bashers, they wanted a lawsuit immediately even though they had no clue what they were talking about.  Now the NRA has gotten everything in order, has found real individuals in the area to be named in the lawsuit and has filed a lawsuit.  But again, this isn't enough for the NRA bashers.


So what exactly has GOA done?  Obviously a "no compromise" group would take this type of infringement seriously and would be leading the pack when it comes to lawsuits and stopping this unconstitutional behavior.  So what has GOA done?  They created a web page talking about the illegal confiscations.  Wow, now that is being effective is it.  

Why hasn't GOA filed a lawsuit:  (from their website)

In addition to the educational efforts mentioned above, GOA will be pursuing any and all legal and judicial avenues that are available. GOA does not have standing to sue in the courts. However, we can help a member who has had his or her guns illegally confiscated. We already know of one person in Louisiana who is planning to bring a suit, and we will be prepared to spend money to advance cases like this one.

So GOA will "pursue any legal avenues"... the exact same thing the NRA said 2 weeks ago and was blasted for it.  GOA has not filed a lawsuit because "they do not have any standing in the court" the same thing that was preventing the NRA from filing a suit until they found someone down there to be named.  Now the NRA has found someone and filed suit.  GOA has found someone but is just going to "send money" to help them.  Wow, what an awesome response from the most hardcore, no compromise group...here is some money.  Until the NRA bashers show a group that is doing more and is more effective than the NRA, STFU!

A day late and a dollar short.

They should have had lawyers down there waiting IMO.

The party is over and now they show up in force?

I wonder how many citizens were robbed, raped and hurt because they were forcefully disarmed?

Again, a day late and a dollar short.



<< ------- Not renewing his NRA membership.  

Hurray for the NRA getting off its ass a few weeks later.






Too little too late.  Still not getting any of my money, and I let 'em know it.

Dollar short, day late.

Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Look I am not bashing the NRA, I love the NRA. I just disagree with the way this was handled. I have supported the NRA all my life and they with that support have promised to protect my RTKBA. My opinion is they dropped the ball this time. I fully expect to support them now and in the future.......but I damned sure have the right to disagree with the way they handled this. Of course you do - and I personally don't think they're perfect either, but they're the biggest and IMHO the best we have. We'll just have to agree to disagree - you think they should have para-jumped a team of saboteur lawyers/shooters in, and I think they should have done the discovery and found out what the ground-truth was first, with first-hand accounts from credible sources. I think they should have had a lawyer walk into a Federal Courthouse in Washinton and sign an order precluding any suspending of the rights of lawabiding citizens from losing their guns. We are not talking about their cars or tv's. We are talking about Constitutional rights.....we should never delay when it come to situations like this. I'm sorry for any of y'all that fail to see this as clearly as I do.

It takes time to make sure what is happeneing IS really happeneing. They have to know for sure of the problem and have accurate info. You can't just walk into a court and say hey were suing on these grounds. What happens if the little ol lady shouldn' t have legaly had the gun, or if she threatened the cops with it first? there is a lot that was not known. If you throw a LS together without doing the research and finding out what really happened you run the very large risk of causing more harm then good. You simply can't rush into it,  without being properly prepared it doesn't help. It's that simple.

Stop being all emotional about shit folks and think it through. Yes I agree it would have been the shit if they would have slapped this lawsuit down the day it happened, but in reality doing that would have done no good without propper evidence and good solid research and good solid examples of it it happening. Getting that takes a little time.

Quoted: Hurray for the NRA getting off its ass a few weeks later. Too little too late.  Still not getting any of my money, and I let 'em know it.

Vote for Hillary in the next election too while you're in the mood to shaft our gun rights.

Quoted: Ok, NRA bashers who claim the NRA should have filed a lawsuit the first day...please explain why GOA, the only "no compromise" organization didn't do exactly what you asked?  Do they not view gun confiscation as a major issue?  Are they so disorganized that they are incapable of filing a lawsuit?  What gives? In the first days of the rumors of this the NRA bashers were screaming because GOA issued a statement condemning it and said the NRA was doing nothing.  Those of us who know how the NRA works said, give them a couple days as they get they verify the facts first.  A couple days later the NRA issued a statement condemning it and said they would keep an eye on things and take any legal action if needed.  Even though the NRA did exactly what GOA had done, this wasn't good enough for them and they blasted the NRA for not immediately filling a lawsuit.  Again those of us who know how the system works said the NRA needs someone who had their firearms confiscated to be named in a lawsuit before one could be filed, give them time to get the facts rights.  A couple days later the NRA and SAF said they were looking for people who had firearms confiscated.  But yet again this wasn't good enough for the NRA bashers, they wanted a lawsuit immediately even though they had no clue what they were talking about.  Now the NRA has gotten everything in order, has found real individuals in the area to be named in the lawsuit and has filed a lawsuit.  But again, this isn't enough for the NRA bashers. So what exactly has GOA done?  Obviously a "no compromise" group would take this type of infringement seriously and would be leading the pack when it comes to lawsuits and stopping this unconstitutional behavior.  So what has GOA done?  They created a web page talking about the illegal confiscations.  Wow, now that is being effective is it.   Why hasn't GOA filed a lawsuit:  (from their website) In addition to the educational efforts mentioned above, GOA will be pursuing any and all legal and judicial avenues that are available. GOA does not have standing to sue in the courts. However, we can help a member who has had his or her guns illegally confiscated. We already know of one person in Louisiana who is planning to bring a suit, and we will be prepared to spend money to advance cases like this one. So GOA will "pursue any legal avenues"... the exact same thing the NRA said 2 weeks ago and was blasted for it.  GOA has not filed a lawsuit because "they do not have any standing in the court" the same thing that was preventing the NRA from filing a suit until they found someone down there to be named.  Now the NRA has found someone and filed suit.  GOA has found someone but is just going to "send money" to help them.  Wow, what an awesome response from the most hardcore, no compromise group...here is some money.  Until the NRA bashers show a group that is doing more and is more effective than the NRA, STFU!

Since I am not a member of any other groups except the NRA.....I will have to reserve my comment to them.

I don't understand why if you disagree you are bashing.
I assume I have given the NRA alot more that most on this board.........appox $1000/ year every year. (depending on how drunk I get at the NRA banquet)
If you support them more than me......thanks.

But I said before......I think as soon as word came out that guns were being taken from LAWABIDING citizens they should have spung into action. Is that not why we are members????

The NRA is a day late and a dollar short.

Only reason they responded is because many members called and emailed and complained.

Stick up for them all you want, but the NRA is the worst club/ orginization I continue to be a member of.

I can afford the $35.00 a year or what ever it is and my club requires it.

Quoted: A day late and a dollar short. They should have had lawyers down there waiting IMO. The party is over and now they show up in force? I wonder how many citizens were robbed, raped and hurt because they were forcefully disarmed? Again, a day late and a dollar short. << ------- Not renewing his NRA membership.

OH! Now they should have had lawyers on the ground in anticipation of the unthinkable!

Geez.  

So they should have lawyers "on the ground" in anticipation of Rita? What about in Tornado Alley? Or all over California "in anticipation" of the big earthquake everyone is expecting? Or...

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IBTNB  

ok so STFU about it being late. These are not things you can just throw together.

Funny thing is the anti and the ACLU and others "throw this stuff together" all the time and force us to go on the defense and get back on our heels.

Nice try.

Quoted: The NRA has been ineffective since the AWB was passed, and we all had to suffer because our weapons looked evil. Oddly enough thats the same time I canceld my membership.

Bullshit.  You just proved beyond a reasonable doubt that you have no idea what you're talking about.

I'll be re-upping now.

The NRA and the SAF are the only ones doing anything about this and you still have people moaning. Maybe they were a little slow. I don't know what they could have done sooner but at least they are doing something now.

And maybe just maybe we can have this issue settled once and for all.

Give em hell NRA/SAF.

Quoted: Look I am not bashing the NRA, I love the NRA. I just disagree with the way this was handled. I have supported the NRA all my life and they with that support have promised to protect my RTKBA. My opinion is they dropped the ball this time. I fully expect to support them now and in the future.......but I damned sure have the right to disagree with the way they handled this.

Yes, this is America.  You have every right to be wrong.

Quoted: A day late and a dollar short. They should have had lawyers down there waiting IMO. The party is over and now they show up in force? I wonder how many citizens were robbed, raped and hurt because they were forcefully disarmed? Again, a day late and a dollar short. << ------- Not renewing his NRA membership.

And the cutting-off-his-nose-to-spite-his-face award goes to...

Quoted: Hurray for the NRA getting off its ass a few weeks later. Too little too late.  Still not getting any of my money, and I let 'em know it.

A FEW WEEKS LATER?  Good God...have you checked a fucking CALENDAR lately?  The amount of indiscriminate ignorance in this thread is truly frightening.

Quoted: Quoted: Look I am not bashing the NRA, I love the NRA. I just disagree with the way this was handled. I have supported the NRA all my life and they with that support have promised to protect my RTKBA. My opinion is they dropped the ball this time. I fully expect to support them now and in the future.......but I damned sure have the right to disagree with the way they handled this. Yes, this is America.  You have every right to be wrong.

Blind faith is ignorant.

Quoted: ok so STFU about it being late. These are not things you can just throw together. Funny thing is the anti and the ACLU and others "throw this stuff together" all the time and force us to go on the defense and get back on our heels. Nice try.

Their clients aren't in the middle of a disaster zone.  You have to FIND someone who had their guns taken before you can file suit.  

Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Look I am not bashing the NRA, I love the NRA. I just disagree with the way this was handled. I have supported the NRA all my life and they with that support have promised to protect my RTKBA. My opinion is they dropped the ball this time. I fully expect to support them now and in the future.......but I damned sure have the right to disagree with the way they handled this. Yes, this is America.  You have every right to be wrong. Blind faith is ignorant.

So is blind ignorance.   People like the NRA bashers in this thread make me tired.  They expect instant gratification and know next to nothing about the subject yet they've made an instant judgement and no facts will change their minds.

They  have 100% of my support now.
Our 800 lb Gorilla is back.

Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Look I am not bashing the NRA, I love the NRA. I just disagree with the way this was handled. I have supported the NRA all my life and they with that support have promised to protect my RTKBA. My opinion is they dropped the ball this time. I fully expect to support them now and in the future.......but I damned sure have the right to disagree with the way they handled this. Yes, this is America.  You have every right to be wrong. Blind faith is ignorant. So is blind ignorance.   People like the NRA bashers in this thread make me tired.  They expect instant gratification and know next to nothing about the subject yet they've made an instant judgement and no facts will change their minds.

How is this?

So is blind ignorance.   People like the NRA supporters in this site make me tired.  They expect no thoughts other than their own and know next to nothing about the subject yet they've made an instant judgement and no facts will change their minds.

Quoted: How is this?

Stupid, thoughtless and unimaginative.

Quoted: Quoted: How is this? Stupid, thoughtless and unimaginative.

Good, I was trying to copy your post bashing those who actually have the brain power to be criticle but still supportive, glad it worked.

Typical, drop the debate and go right into insults.

[NRAbasher]Blah, blah, blah, too late. Blah, blah, blah, not enough. Blah, blah, blah, I am an asshat. Blah, blah, blah.....[/NRAbasher]

I'm going to be a new member based on this thread:
link

My payment and paperwork is getting processed so I will have my card soon and be a member.

I used to bash a little.  I quit NRA back in the 90's because I thought they were too focused on hunting and compromised too much.

Any bashers that support other orgs ought to consider the deal in that thread I linked to.

Quoted: Typical, drop the debate and go right into insults.

You never debated, you simply parrotted.  You have presented no coherent argument to support your untenable position that the NRA should have jumped into this before finding out all the facts.  So far, the NRA-bashers have proven themselves to be nothing but armchair commandos.  Which is hardly surprising.

Quoted: [NRAbasher]Blah, blah, blah, too late. Blah, blah, blah, not enough. Blah, blah, blah, I am an asshat. Blah, blah, blah.....[/NRAbasher]

Exactly. Someone figured it out!

Quoted: I'm going to be a new member based on this thread: link My payment and paperwork is getting processed so I will have my card soon and be a member. I used to bash a little.  I quit NRA back in the 90's because I thought they were too focused on hunting and compromised too much. Any bashers that support other orgs ought to consider the deal in that thread I linked to.

Welcome back.