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Posted: 9/22/2005 12:37:01 AM EDT
[#1]
Yes they can be beat. Everytime you answer squeeze your arse cheeks
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Posted: 9/22/2005 12:43:56 AM EDT
[#2]
That won't work. It will trigger the sensor on the probe. (Lie detectors have become quite sophisticated.  )
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Posted: 9/22/2005 1:13:11 AM EDT
[#3]
If you read up on polygraphs, you'll understand why in most (if not all, IANAL) cases they are very much so inadmissable as evidence in court.
The fact that they still use them in employment screening is, IMO, bullshit. They are a scare tactic that can dissuade otherwise qualified people from applying to jobs if they know they will be polygraphed, or, if taken seriously by the employer, could potentially disqualify somebody falsely. IIRC companies/organizations that polygraph as part of their hiring process have no less theft, fraud, dishonesty, etc than those that do not. So it's a lot of effort for no tangible benefit whatsoever. IMO it's a pseudo-science that relies on psychological manipulation and intimidation, both of which are not any way to start an employer-employee relationship (but, incidentally, is a good way to end one). The only thing they're really good for is for interrogating someone. They add a not insignificant amount of pressure on someone to fess up. Interrogating job candidates, however, is bullshit. |
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Posted: 9/22/2005 1:33:50 AM EDT
[#4]
I recalled reading an article on this subject so I did a
little Googling on what I remembered . Some drugs , like the Beta Blocker propranolol along Valium and Ritalin can be used in combination to defeat polygraphs and other forms of stress response testing . There are also non drug techniques like training with a bio feedback device or using thought disassociation , where you think of random objects and places while answering questions . These techniques often result in an inconclusive results , instead of passing results like the can drugs produce . |
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Posted: 9/22/2005 1:36:04 AM EDT
[#5]
A polygrapher from Tempe PD told me he thought I was trying to beat the test by controlling my breathing. I said I was trying to relax. He asked why. DUH, Im taking a fucking polygraph.
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Posted: 9/22/2005 1:37:15 AM EDT
[#6]
I know....... I was being stupid
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Posted: 9/22/2005 1:53:49 AM EDT
[#7]
A buddy of mine is a cop now. That's all the proof I need that the poly can be beaten.
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Posted: 9/22/2005 2:00:14 AM EDT
[#8]
Other than cost, I wonder why they don't use the voice stress analysis machines instead of "lie" detectors. Probably be alot more accurate and harder to beat.
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Posted: 9/22/2005 2:12:30 AM EDT
[#9]
It's only a lie if you believe it's a lie. If you truely believe every answer you give they will all be truths.
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Posted: 9/22/2005 3:17:33 AM EDT
[#10]
I know someone that beat it. Or at least I know he passed it and I'm 99% sure he lied doing it. Of course this man is a very good liar.
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Posted: 9/22/2005 11:26:01 AM EDT
[#11]
four tricks to being a good liar:
1. convince yourself that your lie is true. 2. remember, don't invent. 3. don't fear the interrogator. a polygraph is only as effective as the examinee thinks it is. all it detects is physical signs of stress--it can't get inside your head. 4. smile. it sounds absurd, but it works. |
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Posted: 9/22/2005 3:49:37 PM EDT
[#12]
In a way, you were trying to beat it. They don't want you to relax. They want to fucking interrogate you. |
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Posted: 9/22/2005 3:56:50 PM EDT
[#13]
The best way to beat them is to refuse to take them. There isn't a shred of evidence that any of these "lie-detecting" techniques are really able to detect lies. They are complete bullshit.
Several years ago a news show did a test. They had one of their employees take a camera from the office. Then they hired four different lie detector "experts" and brought them in to test all the employees and find the one that had "stolen" the camera. They missed the correct person in every case. In every case, they picked the person that they had been told was the prime suspect. It is pseduo-science, just like quack medicine. If somebody asks you to take one, tell them you want an attorney first. |
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Posted: 9/22/2005 3:57:00 PM EDT
[#14]
If you believe the Polygraph works, do you believe in Pinocchio too? Aldrich Ames didn't, that is why he passed both the PGs he took after he was selling secrets to the USSR.
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Posted: 9/22/2005 3:57:23 PM EDT
[#15]
I had the same problem with the same polygrapher. |
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Posted: 9/22/2005 4:01:39 PM EDT
[#16]
In the words of George Costanza... "It's not a lie if you believe it!"
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Posted: 9/22/2005 4:04:29 PM EDT
[#17]
lumpy, you are the last man here I thought would consent to a polygraph in the first place. it's all their fucking game. you always lose their game
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Posted: 9/22/2005 4:09:26 PM EDT
[#18]
I know people that have lied their way thru and people who've failed with nothing to hide. Poly's are bullshit. If you ever meet a polygrapher, ask him how effective it was in catching Aldrich Ames or Robert Hansen.
I know I've got one coming up. I don't have anything to lie about, but I also know an ex-Marine buddy of mine, devout Christian, straight as an arrow, who failed the poly for two different .gov agencies and is now going back to college to so he can find a new career. Pisses me off just thinking about it-like being forced to play Russian roulette with your dreams. |
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Posted: 9/22/2005 4:10:04 PM EDT
[#19]
They can certainly be beat. I should know.
 I also know that they can give false positives also.
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Posted: 9/22/2005 4:12:25 PM EDT
[#20]
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Posted: 9/22/2005 4:16:26 PM EDT
[#21]
That's why I refuse to play. It's not worth my time or effort to get flagged and shit on because John Travolta's E-meter lit up on me - fuck 'em and their stupid toys. |
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Posted: 9/22/2005 4:20:32 PM EDT
[#22]
Probably as part of the hiring process. I hated the one I took for Mesa PD. Bunch of fuckin' nonsensical neo-voodoo. |
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Posted: 9/22/2005 4:21:37 PM EDT
[#23]
Yeah, but unfortunately if you want to go to work in certain fields, you gotta. |
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Posted: 9/22/2005 4:59:57 PM EDT
[#24]
Applied for a job. |
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Posted: 9/22/2005 5:05:25 PM EDT
[#25]
Same here. The guy with the salt and pepper hair helmet and the black wingtips?
Maybe
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Posted: 9/22/2005 5:06:41 PM EDT
[#26]
I have been curious, what effect does someone with a heart condition have on the test.
Like atrial fibulation and a wildly fluctuating blood pressure? |
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Posted: 9/22/2005 5:10:28 PM EDT
[#27]
Aldrich Ames and John Walker Jr both beat polygraph tests designed to catch spies, Ames more than once. IIRC he had asked russian handlers for a sure fire method or substance to defeat the polygraph and thier only advice was "relax" ,or in effect, dont get worked up over it and repeat the probable questions and your responses over and over agian in your head to yourself until you are completely comfortable with the questions and answers. Worked for him --even after he was caught polygraph tests were inconclusive at best on Ames.
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Posted: 9/24/2005 8:34:41 AM EDT
[#28]
Same here. The guy with the salt and pepper hair helmet and the black wingtips? yep. you know what was funny about it? I forgot to turn off my cell phone before the test. It was set to vibrate and ring. One of my friends called me during the test and ... well ... my phone rang ... and vibrated. The test equipment is very sensitive. That tester was not very happy at me. We had to start all over because he said the readings went off the chart. 
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Posted: 9/24/2005 8:38:03 AM EDT
[#29]
Yep. I think I had the same guy rake me over the coals. Bastard. |
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Posted: 9/24/2005 8:42:25 AM EDT
[#30]
Have several drinks before taking the test...Seriously. |
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Posted: 9/24/2005 8:45:18 AM EDT
[#31]
Place a small stone in your shoe, press down on it while they are calibrating the polygraph, they will take the increased 'stress' from the pain the stone is causing you as the baseline, when they start the questions stop pressing down on the stone… simple really, and the reason no one else uses them.
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Posted: 9/24/2005 8:49:21 AM EDT
[#32]
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Posted: 9/24/2005 8:52:08 AM EDT
[#33]
Beat me to it TBS. Excellent website. I went there a few times for...um....research.. 
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Posted: 9/24/2005 9:09:01 AM EDT
[#34]
hehehe yea sure you did.
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Posted: 9/24/2005 9:14:00 AM EDT
[#35]
+1 |
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Posted: 9/24/2005 9:53:52 AM EDT
[#36]
I saw two career criminals beat them. These fuckers were dirty, we knew it, they knew it, but they sure as hell passed with flying colors.
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Posted: 9/24/2005 10:02:25 AM EDT
[#37]
Tell the truth.
Works rvrey time. 
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Posted: 9/24/2005 10:02:57 AM EDT
[#38]
Tell the truth.
Works every time.
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Posted: 9/24/2005 10:16:04 AM EDT
[#39]
There is some Bs in these "lie-detectors." ONe guy I know was rejected by a local PD because he failed the lie-detector test. That is BS, because this guy is straight as an arrow.
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Posted: 9/24/2005 10:18:49 AM EDT
[#40]
I learned, unfortunately AFTER my CIA interview, that all you have to do is simply be consistent in your answers. Never deviate from your answers, regardless of whether you are telling the truth or not.
Simple. |
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Posted: 9/24/2005 11:27:28 AM EDT
[#41]
That guy was wound a liiiiiiiiittle too tight. |
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Posted: 9/24/2005 11:28:33 AM EDT
[#42]
Unfortunately, it doesn't. |
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Posted: 9/24/2005 11:32:53 AM EDT
[#43]
Practice lying all the time. To everyone. Get the lies so mixed up with the truth and half truths your body will always give out mixed signals. That will be your bodys normal result. And people who give the polygraph always think EVERYONE lies.
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Posted: 9/24/2005 11:36:57 AM EDT
[#44]
+1 I have also heard using a tack placed in the shoe under the big toe works if your REALLY guilty. |
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Posted: 9/24/2005 11:38:40 AM EDT
[#45]
in the criminal justice setting, the only thing the polygraph is good for is scaring the test subject into a post-polygraph confession. I've been told that by multiple polygraphers.
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Posted: 9/24/2005 1:50:57 PM EDT
[#46]
Check this out, and make up your own mind.
http://antipolygraph.org I've taken a couple of pre-employment polygraphs. They were run EXACTLY like the web site said they are. Same questions, and scare tactics. It's nothing more than a high stress interogation. The operator's goal is to make you admit to lying. That gives them a reason to disqualify you. The best way to beat the system is to avoid taking the "Test". |
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Posted: 9/24/2005 2:10:47 PM EDT
[#47]
Bullshit. If that were true, I wouldn't have any qualms with polys. But as I said, I know a guy, 8 years active duty Marines, got his degree while he was in, married, two kids, heavily involved in his church, Boy Scouts, hardly even drinks-straightest arrow in the quiver. He failed three different polys from PDs, two from one agency and one from another. Said he was a drug dealer and a thief. I know another guy who failed for a fire department who swears up and down he wasn't lying but I don't know him well enough to say for sure. I don't have any reason to disbelieve him, tho. 'Course I know a bunch of people that had nothing to hide and went thru just fine. But telling the truth doesn't work every time. Period. |
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Posted: 9/24/2005 2:28:06 PM EDT
[#48]
It's only a lie if you believe it's a lie.
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Posted: 9/24/2005 2:42:04 PM EDT
[#49]
Actually it's only a lie if your polygrapher believes it's a lie-based on his or her entirely subjective interpretation of certain physiological metrics which may or may not be related to your emotional state which, in turn, may or may not be related to whether or not you're telling the truth. |
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