Bump.  Keep hammering it, guys!

I know that this law will only apply to Michigan, but it effects are eventually going to be felt through out the nation. The las thing we need is ANOTHER state with an AWB, and this is the most intrusive and terrible ban proposed yet! Now that the Federal AWB has sunset, Michigan needs the help of the ENTIRE gun community to fight this abomination!

Is there anyway we can get this thread tacked? I know it is a "hometown" thing, but let's face facts, not everyone checks the hometown forums. General Discussion gets ALOT more traffic!

Quoted: Wow! Thats worse than Calis ban. It would even ban the M1A, M1Garand, M1 Carbine, SKS, ect. I hope it doesnt pass.

Actually, SKS's would probably be safe, as would Saiga's and SL8's. The key to this whole ban is the first line:

A semiautomatic pistol or semiautomatic or pump-action rifle that is capable of accepting a detachable magazine that holds more than 10 rounds of ammunition and that has any of the following features

So, since an SKS has a fixed magazine, it would be safe. Also, since Saiga's and HK SL8-1's can only accecpt 10 round magazines, they are also safe. What I am wondering is if you "only" have 10 round detachable mags for your AR, will it be safe as well or does the fact that you can use a 20 or 30 round mag in it make it an assault weapon.

I'm not saying that I would even come close to accecpting this law! Not at all! For me, it would probably be the straw that broke the camel's back in Michigan and I would most likely leave the state. However, if it works out that not owning any high cap mags, and only have the 10 round mag that came with my AR will be enough to sheild me from this AWB (should it pass), then that would give me enough leeway to make a planned withdrawl from the state of Michigan.

For me, you can just add this stupid worthless bill to the list!

www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=1&f=5&t=272403

Emails sent to Rep. Stahl and Sen. Gilbert.

Quoted: I believe these Sen's that introduced this are Detroit Dems. .

Gilda Z. Jacobs  Huntington Woods District 14 Democrat
Liz Brater  Ann Arbor  District 18 Democrat

Huntington Woods and A2 are just as bad as Detroit.

Here is the GOA's response to my e-mail. It appears that they knew nothing about it.  I'm going to call the NRA-ILA and make sure that they are aware of this too!

Gun Owners of America wrote: Dear Motown_steve, Thanks for the heads up on SB1381 and I will pass the info on to my supervisor. -- Sincerely, Frank Pejack Public Liaison, Gun Owners of America

Quoted: Here is my letter to the GOA: My name is Motown_steve. I am a life member of the GOA, and I am a legal resident of the State of Michigan. I must say that I am elated over the sunset of the 1994 Federal Assault Weapons Ban. However, my joy is tempered with sorrow and determination as a new fight is now looming! Recently, 2 State Senators submitted a bill that would create a seperate Assault Weapons Ban for the State of Michigan. This bill would make any rifle with the ability to accecpt a magazine of more than 10 rounds and either a pistol grip, folding/telescoping stock, "barrel shroud", or COMPENSATOR of muzzel brake an illegal assault weapon. All sales of assault weapons would be prohibited. Anyone owning an "assault weapon" would have to: 1. Register their assault weapon with the State Police 2. Store the assault weapon in accordance with regulations created by the state police AND SUBMIT TO ANNUAL STORAGE INSPECTIONS 3. Renew their assault weapons registration annually 4. Posses their assault weapon only on their own property or at an approved shooting rangs The penalty for violation is felony with a sentence of 4 years imprisonment and/or $2,100.00. This is clearly the most intrusive draconian gun controll law to date! The people of the State of Michigan need the help of the GOA in making sure that this law never reaches a vote. Please let me know what the GOA can do to help fight this horrendous violation of our right to keep and bear arms (protected by the Second Amendment and the constitution of the State of Michigan). I have already begun alerting friends, family members and fellow gun enthusiasts to contact their legsilators. I have contacted all of my State legislators as well. With Regards, Motown_steve

I just got this from the Senate Majority Leader:

Dear Eric:

Thank you for writing to share your thoughts about Senator Gilda
Jacobs' proposal to implement a state "Assault Weapons Ban."  

Because of the recent expiration of the federal "Assault Weapons
Ban," Senator Jacobs has introduced Senate Bill 1381.  The intent of
this bill is to ban all assault weapons in the state of Michigan, which
the bill defines as any semi-automatic pistol or rifle that is able to
accept a magazine with more than 10 rounds and has certain cosmetic
appearances, such as a pistol grip or shoulder stock.  

Senate Bill 1381 was recently referred to the Senate Judiciary
Committee, of which Senator Alan Cropsey is chairman.  In response to
your letter, I have spoken with Senator Cropsey.  Although he has
informed me that it is unlikely the committee will be reviewing this
bill, please know that if I do have the opportunity to vote on the
proposal, I am not inclined to support it.  

Again, thank you for writing.  If I can be of further assistance in
this or any other matter, please contact my office at any time.

Respectfully yours,

Ken Sikkema
Senate Majority Leader
www.sikkema.org

ejd

Just got a reply from the Senate Majority Leader:

Dear Echap:

Thank you for writing to share your thoughts about Senator Gilda Jacobs' proposal to implement a state "Assault Weapons Ban."  

Because of the recent expiration of the federal "Assault Weapons Ban," Senator Jacobs has introduced Senate Bill 1381.  The intent of this bill is to ban all assault weapons in the state of Michigan, which the bill defines as any semi-automatic pistol or rifle that is able to accept a magazine with more than 10 rounds and has certain cosmetic appearances, such as a pistol grip or shoulder stock.  

Senate Bill 1381 was recently referred to the Senate Judiciary
Committee, of which Senator Alan Cropsey [email protected]
is chairman.  In response to your letter, I have spoken with Senator Cropsey.  Although he has  informed me that it is unlikely the committee will be reviewing this bill, please know that if I do have the opportunity to vote on the proposal, I am not inclined to support it.  

Again, thank you for writing.  If I can be of further assistance in this or any other matter, please contact my office at any time.  
Respectfully yours,

Ken Sikkema
Senate Majority Leader
www.sikkema.org

ejd

Quoted: Thank you for writing to share your thoughts about Senator Gilda Jacobs' proposal to implement a state "Assault Weapons Ban."   Because of the recent expiration of the federal "Assault Weapons Ban," Senator Jacobs has introduced Senate Bill 1381.  The intent of this bill is to ban all assault weapons in the state of Michigan, which the bill defines as any semi-automatic pistol or rifle that is able to accept a magazine with more than 10 rounds and has certain cosmetic appearances, such as a pistol grip or shoulder stock.   Senate Bill 1381 was recently referred to the Senate Judiciary Committee, of which Senator Alan Cropsey is chairman.  In response to your letter, I have spoken with Senator Cropsey.  Although he has informed me that it is unlikely the committee will be reviewing this bill, please know that if I do have the opportunity to vote on the proposal, I am not inclined to support it.   Again, thank you for writing.  If I can be of further assistance in this or any other matter, please contact my office at any time. Respectfully yours, Ken Sikkema Senate Majority Leader Thank you for contacting my office regarding Senate Bill 1381, which as introduced would prohibit in Michigan under certain circumstances the "manufacture, transfer, or possession of assault weapons, assault weapon conversion kits, and detachable magazines." SB 1381 is modeled after federal legislation, the Violent Crime Control and Law Enforcement Act of 1994, commonly referred to as the Federal Assault Weapons Ban.  The Act, which expired Monday, prohibited the "manufacture, sale and importation of certain military-style, semi-automatic assault weapons and ammunition magazines that hold more than ten rounds."  Proponents have argued in favor of renewing the Act due to its effect in reducing gun violence stemming from reductions in the number of assault weapons on the street.  Opponents of the ban have argued that the legislation has had no effect on gun violence as it merely affected cosmetic features of semi-automatic firearms. Additionally, opponents have noted that fully automatic weapons are already illegal under federal law and have been for many years. I declined an opportunity to co-sponsor this legislation, as I am concerned that it could possibly be misconstrued to affect or possibly ban numerous legal firearms currently used by sportsmen in the U.P.  I am proud of my record in support of second amendment issues, and will take your comments into serious consideration should this legislation come before the full Senate for debate this fall, which is highly unlikely. Again, thank you for writing.  Please do not hesitate to contact me further regarding this or any other state issue of your concern if I can be of assistance. Sincerely, MICHAEL A. PRUSI State Senator 38th District   Thank you for contacting me regarding Senate Bills 1381 and 1382 which would restrict the use and possession of assault weapons.  I appreciate the time you have taken to contact me. SB 1381 and 1382, sponsored by Senator Gilda Jacobs, were introduced on September 9, 2004.  The legislation is awaiting consideration before the Senate Committee on the Judiciary.  A hearing on this matter has not been scheduled at this time.  If you would like more information about legislation that has been introduced in Michigan, please visit www.michiganlegislature.org. As legislation often changes drastically during the legislative process, I appreciate your input on this issue.  As a lifelong supporter of our constitutional right to keep and bear arms, you can be assured that I will keep your comments in mind, should this legislation be passed out of committee and be brought before me for consideration.   Thank you again for writing.  Please do not hesitate to contact me in the future if I can be of assistance regarding state government. Best Wishes, Jason Allen State Senator 37th District

Sent out 38 letters last night and these 3 are the only real response's so far. I will keep hammering away....

Anyone know where the MCRGO is on this.  Their input would be key...


I have written to everyone I know who cares about the issue and emailed ALL the REPS.  Tonight I shall draft a letter.

This gives me something to do instead of brooding over my impending deployment!

Virtually the same bill was proposed in mid-March 2004 in Pennsylvania...House Bill No. 2451 -containing the same registration language.  The bill was referred to the State's House Judiciary Committee with a number of "gun stupid" sponsors. So far, thie PA bill has gone nowhere.


PRINTER'S NO. 3471



                                       THE GENERAL ASSEMBLY OF PENNSYLVANIA



                                                HOUSE BILL

                                               No. 2451 Session of 2004


       INTRODUCED BY FRANKEL, THOMAS, BISHOP, COHEN, CURRY, D. EVANS,
          HORSEY, JAMES, JOSEPHS, KIRKLAND, LEACH, MELIO, PISTELLA,
          ROEBUCK, ROONEY, STETLER, STURLA, WASHINGTON, WATERS, WEBER,
          WHEATLEY, WILLIAMS AND YOUNGBLOOD, MARCH 17, 2004



       REFERRED TO COMMITTEE ON JUDICIARY, MARCH 17, 2004

                                    AN ACT

    1  Amending Title 18 (Crimes and Offenses) of the Pennsylvania
    2     Consolidated Statutes, providing for prohibition and
    3     registration of certain assault weapons; and imposing
    4     penalties.

    5     The General Assembly of the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania
    6  hereby enacts as follows:
    7     Section 1.  Chapter 61 of Title 18 of the Pennsylvania
    8  Consolidated Statutes is amended by adding a subchapter to read:
    9                           SUBCHAPTER B.1
   10                        ASSAULT WEAPONS BAN
   11  Sec.
   12  6151.  Definitions.
   13  6152.  Manufacture, possession and transfer of assault
   14         weapons.
   15  6153.  Possession of assault weapon components.
   16  6154.  Registration of assault weapons.
   17  6155.  Fees.
   18  § 6151.  Definitions.

    1     The following words and phrases when used in this subchapter
    2  shall have the meanings given to them in this section unless the
    3  context clearly indicates otherwise:
    4     "Assault weapon."  The term includes the following:
    5         (1)  Any semiautomatic pistol or semiautomatic or pump-
    6     action rifle that is capable of accepting a detachable
    7     magazine and that also possesses any of the following:
    8             (i)  If the firearm is a rifle, a pistol grip located
    9         at the rear of the trigger.
   10             (ii)  If the firearm is a rifle, a stock in any
   11         configuration, including, but not limited to, a thumbhole
   12         stock, a folding stock or a telescoping stock, that
   13         allows the bearer of the firearm to grasp the firearm
   14         with the trigger hand such that the web of the trigger
   15         hand, between the thumb and forefinger, can be placed
   16         below the top of the external portion of the trigger
   17         during firing.
   18             (iii)  If the firearm is a pistol, a shoulder stock
   19         of any type or configuration, including, but not limited
   20         to, a folding stock or a telescoping stock.
   21             (iv)  A barrel shroud.
   22             (v)  A muzzle break or muzzle compensator.
   23             (vi)  Any feature capable of functioning as a
   24         protruding grip that can be held by the hand that is not
   25         the trigger hand.
   26         (2)  Any pistol that is capable of accepting a detachable
   27     magazine at any location outside of the pistol grip.
   28         (3)  Any semiautomatic pistol or any semiautomatic,
   29     center-fire rifle with a fixed magazine that has the capacity
   30     to accept more than ten rounds of ammunition.
   20040H2451B3471                  - 2 -    

    1         (4)  Any shotgun capable of accepting a detachable
    2     magazine.
    3         (5)  Any shotgun with a revolving cylinder.
    4         (6)  Any conversion kit or other combination of parts
    5     from which a firearm described in paragraphs 1 through 5, can
    6     be assembled if the parts are in the possession or under the
    7     control of any person.
    8     "Barrel shroud."  A covering, other than a slide, that is
    9  attached to or that substantially or completely encircles the
   10  barrel of a firearm and that allows the bearer of the firearm to
   11  hold the barrel with the nonshooting hand while firing the
   12  firearm, without burning that hand. The term does not include an
   13  extension of the stock along the bottom of the barrel that does
   14  not substantially or completely encircle the barrel.
   15     Commissioner."  The Commissioner of the Pennsylvania State
   16  Police.
   17     "Conversion kit."  Any part or combination of parts designed
   18  and intended for use in converting a firearm into an assault
   19  weapon.
   20     "Detachable magazine."  A magazine the function of which is
   21  to deliver one or more ammunition cartridges into the firing
   22  chamber of a firearm and which can be removed from the firearm
   23  without the use of any tool, including a bullet or ammunition
   24  cartridge.
   25     "Muzzle brake."  A device attached to the muzzle of a weapon
   26  that utilizes escaping gas to reduce recoil.
   27     "Muzzle compensator."  A device attached to the muzzle of a
   28  weapon that utilizes escaping gas to control muzzle movement.
   29  § 6152.  Manufacture, possession and transfer of assault
   30         weapons.
   20040H2451B3471                  - 3 -    

    1     (a)  Offense defined.--No person shall manufacture, possess,
    2  purchase, sell or otherwise transfer any assault weapon, or any
    3  assault weapon conversion kit, except as provided under
    4  subsection (b).
    5     (b)  Exceptions.--Subsection (a) shall not apply to any of
    6  the following:
    7         (1)  The possession of an unloaded assault weapon for the
    8     purpose of permanently relinquishing it to a law enforcement
    9     agency in this Commonwealth pursuant to regulations adopted
   10     for such purpose by the commissioner. Any assault weapon
   11     relinquished pursuant to this subsection shall be destroyed.
   12         (2)  The transfer of any assault weapon by a licensed
   13     manufacturer or dealer to a law enforcement agency in this
   14     Commonwealth for use by that agency or its employees for law
   15     enforcement purposes.
   16         (3)  The possession of an assault weapon that was legally
   17     possessed on the effective date of this act, if the person
   18     legally possessing the assault weapon has complied with all
   19     of the requirements of section 6154 (relating to registration
   20     of assault weapons).
   21         (4)  The possession of an assault weapon that has been
   22     permanently disabled so that it is incapable of discharging a
   23     projectile.
   24     (c)  Public nuisance.--Any assault weapon or assault weapon
   25  conversion kit, the manufacture, possession, purchase, sale or
   26  other transfer of which is prohibited under subsection (a), is a
   27  public nuisance.
   28     (d)  Penalty.--Any person who violates subsection (a) commits
   29  a felony of the first degree.
   30  § 6153.  Possession of assault weapon components.
   20040H2451B3471                  - 4 -    

    1     (a)  Offense defined.--No person shall possess or have under
    2  the person's control both of the following at the same time,
    3  except as provided under subsection (b):
    4         (1)  a semiautomatic or pump-action rifle or
    5     semiautomatic pistol capable of accepting a detachable
    6     magazine; and
    7         (2)  any magazine capable of use with that firearm that
    8     contains more than ten rounds of ammunition.
    9     (b)  Exceptions.--Subsection (a) shall not apply to any
   10  person while lawfully doing either of the following:
   11         (1)  engaging in shooting at a duly licensed, lawfully
   12     operated shooting range; or
   13         (2)  participating in a sporting event officially
   14     sanctioned by a club or organization established in whole or
   15     in part for the purpose of sponsoring sport shooting events.
   16     (c)  Penalty.--Any person who violates subsection (a) commits
   17  a felony of the first degree.
   18  § 6154.  Registration of assault weapons.
   19    (a)  Grandfathered assault weapons.--A person may continue to
   20  possess an assault weapon that the person legally possessed on
   21  the effective date of this subchapter, if the person does all of
   22  the following:
   23         (1)  Within 90 days following the effective date of this
   24     subchapter, submits to a background check identical to the
   25     background check conducted in connection with the purchase of
   26     a firearm from a licensed gun dealer.
   27         (2)  Unless the person is prohibited by law from
   28     possessing a firearm, immediately registers the assault
   29     weapon with the Pennsylvania State Police pursuant to
   30     regulations adopted for such purpose by the commissioner.
   20040H2451B3471                  - 5 -    

    1         (3)  Safely and securely stores the assault weapon
    2     pursuant to regulations adopted for such purpose by the
    3     commissioner.
    4         (4)  Annually renews both the registration and the
    5     background check.
    6         (5)  Possesses the assault weapon only on property owned
    7     or immediately controlled by the person, while engaged in the
    8     legal use of the assault weapon at a duly licensed firing
    9     range or while traveling to or from either of these locations
   10     for the purpose of engaging in the legal use of the assault
   11     weapon, provided that the assault weapon is stored unloaded
   12     and in a separate locked container during transport.
   13     (b)  Inherited assault weapons.--Notwithstanding any other
   14  provision of this subchapter, any person who, after the
   15  effective date of this subchapter, acquires title to an assault
   16  weapon by inheritance, bequest or succession shall, within 30
   17  days of acquiring title, do one of the following:
   18         (1)  comply with all of the requirements of subsection
   19     (a);
   20         (2)  dispose of the assault weapon pursuant to section
   21     6152(b)(1) (relating to manufacture, possession and transfer
   22     of assault weapons); or
   23         (3)  permanently disable the assault weapon so that it is
   24     incapable of discharging a projectile.
   25     (c)  Compliance check.--The Pennsylvania State Police may, no
   26  more than once per year, conduct an inspection to ensure
   27  compliance with this subsection.
   28     (d)  Penalty.--Any person who violates subsection (a) or (b)
   29  commits a felony of the third degree.  
   30  § 6155.  Fees.
   20040H2451B3471                  - 6 -    

    1     The Pennsylvania State Police may charge a fee for each
    2  registration and for each registration renewal under section
    3  6154 (relating to registration of assault weapons). Such fee
    4  shall not exceed the costs incurred by the Pennsylvania State
    5  Police in administering the registration program established
    6  under section 6154.
    7     Section 2.  This act shall take effect in 60 days.

1. In March, a convicted felon and drug dealer shot up a house occupied by 4 rival drug dealers with an AK-47 that was banned under the 1994 Assault Weapons Ban. 3 people were killed, and 1 person was injured. When the suspect was arrested in Minnesota, it was discovered that he was also a convicted felon, ineligible to own firearms under Federal law.

Sound like some "good riddance".  

Quoted: This gives me something to do instead of brooding over my impending deployment!

God be with you Bro!

I know this is not about the Michigan AWB, but it is still Michigan related.

I sent a letter to this jerk telling him I wanted the ban to sunset and to stop voting for laws like
it.  Look at the response I got from (that Feinstenin loving Asshat) Senator Levin!

Dear Mr. Ripcode:

     Thank you for contacting me about the reauthorization of the
federal assault weapons ban.  I appreciate hearing your views on this matter.

     As you know, in 1994, President Bill Clinton signed the Assault
Weapons Ban into law.  This law banned 19 specific weapons, as well as
a number of other weapons incorporating certain design characteristics,
including pistol grips, folding stocks, bayonet mounts, and flash
suppressors.  The law also prohibited the manufacture of semiautomatic
weapons that incorporate at least two of these military features and
accept a detachable magazine.  Unfortunately, this law is expired on September
13, 2004.

     I am a cosponsor of the Assault Weapons Ban Reauthorization Act
(S.1034), introduced by Senator Feinstein (D-CA) on May 8, 2003.  This
bill would reauthorize this critical piece of gun safety legislation.  If
the law is not reauthorized, the production of assault weapons in the U.S.
could legally resume.  Restarting the production of these weapons will
increase their number and availability, and I believe lead to an
increase in gun crimes committed with assault weapons.  Despite both the support
of President Bush and a bipartisan majority of the Senate, the House has
not yet taken any action to reauthorize the assault weapons ban.

     Thank you again for writing.


Sincerely,
Carl Levin

-------------------

Argh!!!   Who votes for this guy??????

Detroit votes for Levin.  THAT MAN IS A COMMUNIST!  To me he is as bad as Teddy boy!

Hope you guys in MI fare better than us in the PRK. I have said it before and will say it again. Moronic gunlaws passed in my state quickly spread to others. Don't take for granted that it will never happen in your state.

I know about the Michigan AWB proposal submitted by Sen. Gilda Jacobs.  Have emailed all relevant Rep.'s and Senators.  One guy that hasn't been mentioned is Rick Johnson, Speaker of the House of Rep's in Michigan.  He should be emailed also.  Don't forget Governor Granholm either.

Just to let you know - Gilda Jacobs is a RABID left-winger.  She supports partial birth abortions, did not support CCW, supports non-smoking bans in all public places, supporter of the Million Moms March organization and on, and on and on...  If she had her way ALL firearms would be illegal.  IMHO she's basically a communist in her philosophies.

She is a VERY dangerous person when it comes to individual rights.

Please guys, help us out here!  Email Michigan politicians even though you don't live in Michigan.  They still listen.

Tag, and I know Uncle Ted will have something to say!

Quoted: I know about the Michigan AWB proposal submitted by Sen. Gilda Jacobs.  Have emailed all relevant Rep.'s and Senators.  One guy that hasn't been mentioned is Rick Johnson, Speaker of the House of Rep's in Michigan.  He should be emailed also.  Don't forget Governor Granholm either. Just to let you know - Gilda Jacobs is a RABID left-winger.  She supports partial birth abortions, did not support CCW, supports non-smoking bans in all public places, supporter of the Million Moms March organization and on, and on and on...  If she had her way ALL firearms would be illegal.  IMHO she's basically a communist in her philosophies. She is a VERY dangerous person when it comes to individual rights. Please guys, help us out here!  Email Michigan politicians even though you don't live in Michigan.  They still listen.

                                     Johnson is out after the election due to term limits.

I just moved to Southfield permanently a few months ago and was doing some looking around in regards to local politics.  Come to find out, Gilda Jacobs is my district's Senator.  Being a constituant, I might have to give her a call.

So where's the flock of motherfuckers who always say "Move!" when the state is CA?


Fight on, Sons and Daughters of Michigan. Stop this crap before it takes hold.

Quoted: I just moved to Southfield permanently a few months ago and was doing some looking around in regards to local politics.  Come to find out, Gilda Jacobs is my district's Senator.  Being a constituant, I might have to give her a call.

CALL HER!

Quoted: So where's the flock of motherfuckers who always say "Move!" when the state is CA? Fight on, Sons and Daughters of Michigan. Stop this crap before it takes hold.

If this becomes law my wife and I will move.  

This is some scary shit. You better hope to Christ it doesn't go further than it already has. I'd be all over this...

Agreed. You MI types better stomp the living shit out of this thing. Talk about blatant disregard for the Constitution.

I hope that you guys in MI can stomp this down NOW. Before it ever gets out of committee.

Anyone heard anything more on this thing lately?