User Panel
Posted: 4/13/2017 12:45:46 PM EDT
U.S. Air Force Authorizes Extended Service Life for F-16 New flight hour limit supports F-16 operational life to 2048 and beyond
FORT WORTH, Texas, April 12, 2017 /PRNewswire/ — The U.S. Air Force authorized extending the service life of the Lockheed Martin F-16’s designed service life to 12,000 Equivalent Flight Hours — far beyond the aircraft’s original design service life of 8,000 hours. Following F-16 Service Life Extension Program structural modifications, the U.S. Air Force could safely operate Block 40-52 aircraft to 2048 and beyond. The Air Force and Lockheed Martin also reduced projected service life costs for the Block 40-52 fleet, paving the way for safe, cost-effective F-16 flight operations decades into the future. “This accomplishment is the result of more than seven years of test, development, design, analysis, and partnership between the U.S. Air Force and Lockheed Martin,” said Susan Ouzts, vice president of Lockheed Martin’s F-16 program. “Combined with F-16 avionics modernization programs like the F-16V, SLEP modifications demonstrate that the Fighting Falcon remains a highly-capable and affordable 4th-Generation option for the U.S. Air Force and international F-16 customers.” Validation of the extended flight hour limit directly supports the SLEP goal of extending the service life of up to 300 F-16C/D Block 40-52 aircraft. SLEP and related avionics upgrades to the Air Force’s F-16C/D fleet can safely and effectively augment the current fighter force structure as U.S. and allied combat air fleets recapitalize with F-35 Lightning IIs. A second phase, or Part II, of the F-16 SLEP airworthiness process continues with the request for Military Type Certificate (MTC), which will be submitted to the Air Force’s Technical Airworthiness Authority in the coming months. Part II seeks to validate further extending the F-16’s operational life based on final service life analysis from extended durability testing. About the F-16 Fighting Falcon The F-16 continues to prove itself as the world’s most successful, combat-proven, multi-role fighter aircraft, having served with 28 customers around the world. The F-16V, the latest F-16 avionics upgrade configuration, includes numerous enhancements designed to keep the F-16 at the forefront of international security. The F-16 Block 70/72, the newest and most advanced F-16 production configuration, combines capability and structural upgrades into the most advanced F-16 production aircraft ever offered. For additional information, visit our website: www.lockheedmartin.com/f16 About Lockheed Martin Headquartered in Bethesda, Maryland, Lockheed Martin is a global security and aerospace company that employs approximately 97,000 people worldwide and is principally engaged in the research, design, development, manufacture, integration, and sustainment of advanced technology systems, products, and services. SOURCE: Lockheed Martin Aeronautics Company Website: http://www.lockheedmartin.com |
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Guess they didn't save a bunch of money cutting F-22 production after all.
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http://www.defensenews.com/articles/lockheed-says-it-can-double-f-16s-service-life-but-will-have-to-compete-for-opportunity
F-16 manufacturer Lockheed Martin announced early Wednesday that the Air Force had authorized service life extension work, which could keep the fighter jets flying past 2048. The service life extension program (SLEP) will encompass lengthening the lifespan of up to 300 F-16C/D Block 40-52 aircraft from 8,000 to 12,000 flight hours. |
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Since wehave not been in a war with a major advisory since North Vietnam the arms race has really slowed.
Technically the First Gulf War does not count as most of the equipment we use today was just off the assembly line. Still, flying aircraft for almost 80 years (BUFFs) is amazing. We'll scramble and be caught off guard in the next major war. |
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The Navy is using Service Life Modification now; SLEP is out, SLM is in. Good luck purging years of habit.
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Since wehave not been in a war with a major advisory since North Vietnam the arms race has really slowed. Technically the First Gulf War does not count as most of the equipment we use today was just off the assembly line. Still, flying aircraft for almost 80 years (BUFFs) is amazing. We'll scramble and be caught off guard in the next major war. View Quote |
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Its a shame we just don't buy brand new Vipers and Strike Eagles since the lines are still open.
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A few super stealthy, super expensive, fifth generation planes and a whole lot of less expensive but extremely capable fourth generation planes makes a lot of sense.
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The F16 is just a badass plane. Our enemies have been and are still scared shitless by it.
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Its a shame we just don't buy brand new Vipers and Strike Eagles since the lines are still open. View Quote To me it's like buying a new truck: Oh, you don't want power bluetooth integrated big brother electronic everything? Well too bad, fuck you, because that's all we're making. |
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Also a shame that the currently produced 15s and 16s (and 18s for that matter) have become so damn expensive. Maybe it's an economy of scale thing? Is it possible to have adequate (not necessarily the most cutting-edge) technology (radar, commo, ECM, datalink) in the 15 and 16 and 18 platforms without driving the costs through the roof? To me it's like buying a new truck: Oh, you don't want power bluetooth integrated big brother electronic everything? Well too bad, fuck you, because that's all we're making. View Quote |
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Since wehave not been in a war with a major advisory since North Vietnam the arms race has really slowed. Technically the First Gulf War does not count as most of the equipment we use today was just off the assembly line. Still, flying aircraft for almost 80 years (BUFFs) is amazing. We'll scramble and be caught off guard in the next major war. View Quote |
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Even "cheap" planes built with mostly off the shelf parts cost about the same. The example I'm thinking of is the textron scorpion vs new production F-16's. The cost savings are supposed to be in operational costs. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
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Also a shame that the currently produced 15s and 16s (and 18s for that matter) have become so damn expensive. Maybe it's an economy of scale thing? Is it possible to have adequate (not necessarily the most cutting-edge) technology (radar, commo, ECM, datalink) in the 15 and 16 and 18 platforms without driving the costs through the roof? To me it's like buying a new truck: Oh, you don't want power bluetooth integrated big brother electronic everything? Well too bad, fuck you, because that's all we're making. Everyone gets to lug the same requirements. Besides that, the Textron airplane is not a fighter, it's not even an adequate trainer. Plus it's just plain not relevant, just a minor distraction. |
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A Scorpion in acceptable trim for US production will have the same engineering and production costs as a competitor. Everyone gets to lug the same requirements. Besides that, the Textron airplane is not a fighter, it's not even an adequate trainer. Plus it's just plain not relevant, just a minor distraction. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
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Also a shame that the currently produced 15s and 16s (and 18s for that matter) have become so damn expensive. Maybe it's an economy of scale thing? Is it possible to have adequate (not necessarily the most cutting-edge) technology (radar, commo, ECM, datalink) in the 15 and 16 and 18 platforms without driving the costs through the roof? To me it's like buying a new truck: Oh, you don't want power bluetooth integrated big brother electronic everything? Well too bad, fuck you, because that's all we're making. Everyone gets to lug the same requirements. Besides that, the Textron airplane is not a fighter, it's not even an adequate trainer. Plus it's just plain not relevant, just a minor distraction. |
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The first USAF F-16 squadron became operational in October, 1980. If the F-16 flies until 2048, that means it'll have a service life of 68 years!
That'd be like the air force still flying P-51s into 2010. |
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U.S. Air Force Authorizes Extended Service Life for F-16 New flight hour limit supports F-16 operational life to 2048 and beyond FORT WORTH, Texas, April 12, 2017 /PRNewswire/ — The U.S. Air Force authorized extending the service life of the Lockheed Martin F-16’s designed service life to 12,000 Equivalent Flight Hours — far beyond the aircraft’s original design service life of 8,000 hours. Following F-16 Service Life Extension Program structural modifications, the U.S. Air Force could safely operate Block 40-52 aircraft to 2048 and beyond. The Air Force and Lockheed Martin also reduced projected service life costs for the Block 40-52 fleet, paving the way for safe, cost-effective F-16 flight operations decades into the future. “This accomplishment is the result of more than seven years of test, development, design, analysis, and partnership between the U.S. Air Force and Lockheed Martin,” said Susan Ouzts, vice president of Lockheed Martin’s F-16 program. “Combined with F-16 avionics modernization programs like the F-16V, SLEP modifications demonstrate that the Fighting Falcon remains a highly-capable and affordable 4th-Generation option for the U.S. Air Force and international F-16 customers.” Validation of the extended flight hour limit directly supports the SLEP goal of extending the service life of up to 300 F-16C/D Block 40-52 aircraft. SLEP and related avionics upgrades to the Air Force’s F-16C/D fleet can safely and effectively augment the current fighter force structure as U.S. and allied combat air fleets recapitalize with F-35 Lightning IIs. A second phase, or Part II, of the F-16 SLEP airworthiness process continues with the request for Military Type Certificate (MTC), which will be submitted to the Air Force’s Technical Airworthiness Authority in the coming months. Part II seeks to validate further extending the F-16’s operational life based on final service life analysis from extended durability testing. About the F-16 Fighting Falcon The F-16 continues to prove itself as the world’s most successful, combat-proven, multi-role fighter aircraft, having served with 28 customers around the world. The F-16V, the latest F-16 avionics upgrade configuration, includes numerous enhancements designed to keep the F-16 at the forefront of international security. The F-16 Block 70/72, the newest and most advanced F-16 production configuration, combines capability and structural upgrades into the most advanced F-16 production aircraft ever offered. For additional information, visit our website: www.lockheedmartin.com/f16 About Lockheed Martin Headquartered in Bethesda, Maryland, Lockheed Martin is a global security and aerospace company that employs approximately 97,000 people worldwide and is principally engaged in the research, design, development, manufacture, integration, and sustainment of advanced technology systems, products, and services. SOURCE: Lockheed Martin Aeronautics Company Website: http://www.lockheedmartin.com View Quote |
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The first USAF F-16 squadron became operational in October, 1980. If the F-16 flies until 2048, that means it'll have a service life of 68 years! That'd be like the air force still flying P-51s into 2010. View Quote |
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But I thought the F-35 was supposed to replace the F-16. View Quote http://www.usafe.af.mil/News/Article-Display/Article/1153203/f-35-deploys-to-europe-for-the-first-time/ An F-35A Lightning II from the 34th Fighter Squadron at Hill Air Force Base, Utah, lands at Royal Air Force Lakenheath, England, April 15, 2017. The aircraft arrival marks the first F-35A fighter training deployment to the U.S. European Command area of responsibility or any overseas location as a flying training deployment. (U.S. Air Force photo/Master Sgt. Eric Burks) RAMSTEIN AIR BASE, Germany -- F-35A Lightning IIs, Airmen and accompanying equipment arrived at Royal Air Force Lakenheath, England, today, marking the aircraft’s first overseas training deployment to Europe. The F-35As are from the 34th Fighter Squadron, 388th Fighter Wing and the Air Force Reserve’s 466th Fighter Squadron, 419th Fighter Wing, Hill Air Force Base, Utah, and will conduct air training over the next several weeks with other Europe-based aircraft in support of the European Reassurance Initiative. “This is an incredible opportunity for USAFE Airmen and our NATO allies to host this first overseas training deployment of the F-35A aircraft,” said Gen. Tod D. Wolters, U.S. Air Forces in Europe, Air Forces Africa commander. “As we and our joint F-35 partners bring this aircraft into our inventories, it’s important that we train together to integrate into a seamless team capable of defending the sovereignty of allied nations. As part of the natural progression of the F-35 program, an overseas training deployment has been part of the Air Force’s plan since the F-35A was declared combat capable last year. “RAF Lakenheath will be the first overseas beddown location for the F-35A, this deployment allows our pilots and maintainers to learn more about the European operating environment and will improve our interoperability with partners in the region” Wolters added. As part of the training deployment, the aircraft will forward deploy to NATO nations to maximize training opportunities, build partnerships with allied air forces and gain a broad familiarity of Europe’s diverse operating conditions. The introduction of the premier fifth-generation fighter to the European area of responsibility brings with it state-of-the-arts sensors, interoperability, and a broad array of advanced air-to-air and air-to-surface munitions that will help maintain the fundamental sovereignty rights of all nations. The transatlantic flight for this training deployment was supported by Air Mobility Command and the 100th Air Refueling Wing, RAF Mildenhall, England. Multiple air refueling aircraft from four different bases offloaded more than 400,000 pounds of fuel during the "tanker bridge" from the United States to Europe. Additionally, C-17 and C-5 aircraft moved airlift support, moving maintenance equipment and personnel. Photos and videos of the deployment are available at https://www.dvidshub.net/feature/usafef35a For more information, contact +49 (0) 6371-47-6558 or via e-mail at [email protected]. If after duty hours, please call +49 (0) 1624-25-5428 or send an e-mail to [email protected]. |
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Lockheed loves SLEP. They will milk that goose every chance they get. Doesn't matter if its air, land or sea.
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But I thought the F-35 was supposed to replace the F-16. View Quote ETA: The F-16s flying today are a far cry from the first F-16As delivered. The entire avionics suite (including the flight controls) are different, and even the airframe itself has changed significantly, if not in ways that are obvious. New engines, the capability to employ air-ground ordnance, new radar, new missiles, etc. The combined development costs on the upgrades probably exceed those for the original F-16A/B. Mike |
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I thought they had already started decommissioning most of the 16s and using them as target drones.
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In this thread 95% of the people commenting have no idea about DoD procurement, RDT&E, O&M, and SLEP programs. 2-3 people will try to be the lone voices of reason based off of years of industry experience and will be curb stomped into the ground by the ARFCOM army rabal rousing in their basement fortresses of masturbatory fantasy solitude.
How did I do? |
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Also a shame that the currently produced 15s and 16s (and 18s for that matter) have become so damn expensive. Maybe it's an economy of scale thing? Is it possible to have adequate (not necessarily the most cutting-edge) technology (radar, commo, ECM, datalink) in the 15 and 16 and 18 platforms without driving the costs through the roof? View Quote Running a line at low rate that still requires expensive and skilled labor while managing all the logistics that go into a complex product must be a huge undertaking. Spinning up to a higher production rate would probably be quite the endeavor. It's no surprise that SLEPs seem to be all the rage. The DoD doesn't have to ask for money to buy new aircraft and the manufacturers don't have to invest in a product without a clear future customer base. Whether the end result is a long term cost effective measure is another question. |
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In its current role (bomber), its crap. Pathetic It makes me almost puke everytime I see one. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
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The F16 is just a badass plane. Our enemies have been and are still scared shitless by it. It makes me almost puke everytime I see one. Basically, the F-16 is today's F-4 Phantom. |
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A big cost for these aircraft are just how they're made. They require a lot of 'touch' labor and there's just no way around that. They were designed to be put together in the 1970s by the thousand and some stuff in manufacturing has changed in the meantime. Running a line at low rate that still requires expensive and skilled labor while managing all the logistics that go into a complex product must be a huge undertaking. Spinning up to a higher production rate would probably be quite the endeavor. It's no surprise that SLEPs seem to be all the rage. The DoD doesn't have to ask for money to buy new aircraft and the manufacturers don't have to invest in a product without a clear future customer base. Whether the end result is a long term cost effective measure is another question. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
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Also a shame that the currently produced 15s and 16s (and 18s for that matter) have become so damn expensive. Maybe it's an economy of scale thing? Is it possible to have adequate (not necessarily the most cutting-edge) technology (radar, commo, ECM, datalink) in the 15 and 16 and 18 platforms without driving the costs through the roof? Running a line at low rate that still requires expensive and skilled labor while managing all the logistics that go into a complex product must be a huge undertaking. Spinning up to a higher production rate would probably be quite the endeavor. It's no surprise that SLEPs seem to be all the rage. The DoD doesn't have to ask for money to buy new aircraft and the manufacturers don't have to invest in a product without a clear future customer base. Whether the end result is a long term cost effective measure is another question. |
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Lockheed can double the life, for a price. Boeing can make a twin tail with a RCS of a condo building into a sorta stealth...for a price. They can make a bunch more Growlers that cost as much as the new fighters they are supposed to growl for...for a price.
Everyone is cashing in on the F35 supposed failure, even tho it hasnt failed anything. It was the biggest aviation technological hurdle we had to over come since the B-29 and remember how many B-29s went down to tech failures? Hundreds. But it went on to be a war winner. We dont need more 4'th gen fighters. But I get the feel this is more for the current foreign Viper operators who want to say they have Gen 4 & 1/2 Vipers. There may very well be a market for it there tho I dont know how the avionics tech transfers would work out. Theres some sophisticated code in those upgrades. |
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Will the F-16 be the first aircraft we run out of model designation letters for.... we are up to F-16V ?
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This is what the USAF should invest in. https://theaviationist.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/05/F-16I-out-of-shelter.jpg View Quote |
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It still could. The modifications to the F-16 under the SLEP are structural mods to ensure that the aircraft can continue flying the projected number of hours/year up until 2048 without physically falling apart. That does not mean that the aircraft will have the required capabilities to carry out the mission, or even survive the threat, on a battlefield well before that time. Russia could export a lot of air defense equipment that may or may not make survival in an F-16 less than assured. ETA: The F-16s flying today are a far cry from the first F-16As delivered. The entire avionics suite (including the flight controls) are different, and even the airframe itself has changed significantly, if not in ways that are obvious. New engines, the capability to employ air-ground ordnance, new radar, new missiles, etc. The combined development costs on the upgrades probably exceed those for the original F-16A/B. Mike View Quote |
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Lockheed can double the life, for a price. Boeing can make a twin tail with a RCS of a condo building into a sorta stealth...for a price. They can make a bunch more Growlers that cost as much as the new fighters they are supposed to growl for...for a price. Everyone is cashing in on the F35 supposed failure, even tho it hasnt failed anything. It was the biggest aviation technological hurdle we had to over come since the B-29 and remember how many B-29s went down to tech failures? Hundreds. But it went on to be a war winner. We dont need more 4'th gen fighters. But I get the feel this is more for the current foreign Viper operators who want to say they have Gen 4 & 1/2 Vipers. There may very well be a market for it there tho I dont know how the avionics tech transfers would work out. Theres some sophisticated code in those upgrades. View Quote But I'm not sure why you think the F-35 is so important. What do you plan to do with it and against who, that requires 2,400 of them? |
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This is what the USAF should invest in. https://theaviationist.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/05/F-16I-out-of-shelter.jpg Block 70 |
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If you fly it less then it will last longer? View Quote So far I am not a fan, we aren't tearing airplanes down sufficiently far to really repair the structure, and the complications are legion. Repairs that include bad details for fatigue are bad parts, I don't give damn about the analysis, which after all the work and old tests, still requires a scatter factor of 4 in hopes it works out. |
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