http://thehill.com/blogs/pundits-blog/energy-environment/252384-cecil-act-is-first-step-toward-ending-trophy-hunting

CECIL Act

So we're going to let the Chinese drive all of Africa's major predators extinct, then?  

Idiots.

This seems to be the plan. Its for the good of the animals.

...  thread

Apparently these feel gooders don't understand how it works over there.

One of the main ways that these animals are conserved is by allowing people with deep pockets to go there and trophy hunt a few a year.
Stop the trophy hunting, and you take away any reason for the local savages not to wipe out everything they can kill.


The stupidity amazes me sometimes.

Democrats hate everything especially humans and themselves.  

Hate is the biggest Liberal core value.  

Humanists hate humans.  Their level of cognitive dissonance is off the charts high.

Remember Liberal = sociopath.

I am no fan of trophy hunting but this bill is stupid.

Stupidity is killing something in order to save it.

If people care so much about conservation, simply give the money to the people responsible for protecting those animals.

By that logic, you would have all hunting here in the states banned..

No.  Trophy hunting is different than hunting to eat.  Trophy hunting serves zero legitimate purpose.

It's fun, hunting is fun. Do you not understand that without the prospect of hunting there is little reason for most people to care if these animals are wiped out?

Expecting and demanding charity as a matter of course is fucking delusional. People do what is in their own self interest.

Fees from hunting in the U.S. go mainly towards game and land management...(i.e. conservation), and yes, there is plenty of trophy hunting that occurs here in the states.  I know of guys who hunt that are mainly out for a trophy, the meat is secondary to them.

In any case, one deals with the realities available to them, and the reality here is that more income is probably generated by these trophy hunters than they would ever get through donations.  If thats what it takes to save the species I am good with that, though I myself would never partake in a trophy hunt.

Unless you include giving actual value to the species in question which prevents their eradication by locals.  Other than that, you nailed it

No.  I never even considered that people pay a lot of money to kill animals in order to save the animals so that they may be killed by someone else.

Pretty fucking sad to be honest.

There's got to be a better way for people to enjoy animals.  Alive.

There isn't, the real world isn't a Disney movie.

There most certainly are better ways.  Fund people who hunt poachers.  It has seen some success in the past.

Football serves zero legitimate purpose, yet the NFL is a hojillion dollar business.

Let people do what they want.  If some African shit hole funds its conservation program by allowing limited hunting and it works for that situation then let the hunt continue.

You realize that "trophy" hunting does not mean that the meat is left to rot?

Trophy hunting is the most ethical form of hunting.  The animals taken are specifically selected as the oldest, having passed maturity and approaching old age (death).  Those animals have already passed on their genes and played their part in the circle of life (disney is awesome...not).  Specific sexes are selected (male) ass opposed to meat hunting where they shoot whatever they see regardless

Trophy hunts literally provide the only income in some remote areas.  Photo safaris don't go into truly remote areas where roads are bad.  Those rural areas are totally reliant on the income from the safari industry.  They count on the meat from the animals and money from the outfitters.  They protect the land and the animals as it is their only source of income.  

Without that, they have no incentive to protect the land or the animals.  The locals then kill all the lions as nuisance animals because they no longer have value.

If you want to protect the species, encourage safaris.

"I only hunt the most dangerous game.

"MAN."

Fund them with what?  

Safaris are a business that generates revenue and creates jobs.  What business will fund your program?

Charities.  TV spots.  NRA raffles.  Donated time.  Fund raisers.  Hell, kick starter.  Has anyone actually tried it?  Seems there's a lot of interest in stopping the legal and illegal killing of those animals.

Wow, dude.  I am not a big fan either, but you are projecting like a liberal.  And marginalizing others you disagree with, like a liberal. You are ignoring facts and acting on feels.

I haven't marginalized a single person.  I am not projecting anything.  I'm stating my own opinion and nothing more.

I don't like "arguing about arguing", however 'pretty fucking sad' can be seen as impugning those who do support it as you seeing them as pitiable for their actions.   Also, your opinion is that you don't like it and you want everyone to acquiesce to your wishes.

I have had bosses that too their whole families on safari and trophy hunts. Hundreds of thousands over the years.  I have never donated a dime to African animal conservation.  I don't have enough income to warrant it.  Big game hunters pay my share.  It is not the best way to do it, but it IS working.

LOL.  There's a lot of small minds with big mouths that think a pound sign campaign is all they have to do to change the world.  Ain't no one got time or money to be just giving it away.

Exactly. "CAUSE JUNKIES".  A million causes that they post about supporting with hashtags and Facebook, but when it comes to actually putting money.......the kids have soccer, the Volvo needs gas, the solar panels on the roof need cleaning and those biodegradable cleaning products at Whole Foods don't buy themselves...

but they have a STICKER on the window of the XC90!!!!!

QFT

The fact is people who complain about trophy hunting and say they want to save the lions don't put their money where their mouth is. Their interest is about as deep as a hash tag.

 

My cousin in Minnesota went to some Cecil event where an artist from Los Angeles came to town, go everyone to line up in an outline of a lion, and they all stood up and roared as a helicopter flew over to take a picture. Not a word about conservation or taking donations, just feel-good bullshit.

What a bunch of stupid bullshit, this is how people spend their time.

Sounds like a bunch of furries just hanging out, doing furrie stuff.

Seriously, they should allow managed cropping of elephants to sell the ivory on a legit market. The locals would stop the poachers with the amount of money on the line.

Well managed conservation programs produce healthier, more abundant game. Who gives a rat fuck if the meat is eaten if your goal is to preserve the species?  It seems to me that a licensed, guided hunt that produces lots of revenue for the local economy is indeed a legitimate reason for trophy hunting. Otherwise, they will be cropped by game wardens, overpopulate till food becomes scarce and disease runs rampant, or the locals start eradicating.

But hey, who cares as long as feels, right?

Bro, you're doing it wrong. This isn't about results, this is about intentions!

The left (and most of the right, really) truly seems to believe the maxim "The duty is ours, the results are God's."

Sorry, most people are simply not that altruistic. Hunters want to conserve wildlife because they want something to hunt, not out of the kindness of their hearts.

There is no difference between "regular" hunting and trophy hunting. NOBODY in the United States needs to hunt to eat. You can ALWAYS buy meat more cheaply at the store. What you call "trophy" hunting is exactly what most people who go out on public land seeking whitetails would do if they had more money and time off.

If the repub majorities do their job this shit sandwich won't see the light of day.

So what's stopping you from starting a fundraiser or kickstarter?

Lol

 So, the desired effect is produced but is not legit because of the hunter's motivation?  That sounds like typical liberal bullshit.  Who cares if something gets done as long as somebody feels better?  Those greedy capitalist made me work for money instead or voluntarily re-distributing it.  Muh feels.

 Here's a participation trophy for you, go hug a tree. .

Other than the truckloads of crocodile tears and cardboard signs. Beyond the blubbering housewives driving their Escalades and XC-60s to a Cecil the lion solidarity protest, what are all of you hash tag warriors doing to protect african game? All the hurt feelings and the shrieks of "we have to do something" over one, past his prime lion. Time to put up or shut up sugar britches. All of the angry tweets and little stuffed Cecil the lion plush toys don't do shit towards conservation. You want to get rid of trophy hunting, then supplant all of the funding that places that SCI and the Dallas Safari Club and other game conservation organizations provide. A little hint, you will need to raise a few millions of dollars, every year, in perpetuity.

....Well we're waiting........yeah, I didn't think so.

The "ban trophy hunting" crowd has no more attention span than the next news cycle, or the next social warrior cause.

Let's take a specific example shall we?
The scimitar horned orix

It is completely extinct in the wild...has been since 2000. Between local hunting pressure, (local native hunters BTW), habitat loss, war, etc... they are gone in Africa.
Now some hunters/conservationists/ranchers in Texas saw the writing on the wall and brought some of these animals to the US. They have spent considerable time and resources to grow the herds and produce genetically diverse and healthy populations. In 1979 there were less than 39 of these animals in Texas. In 2012 their herds exceeded 11,000. Seems like a pretty good conservation effort dontcha think? All funded through, yup you guessed it, hunting.

Well now some bleeding heart, all feels, no contribution, animal rights organization lobbies the federal government to revoke these ranchers ability to offer hunts for these animals. This would essentially remove the steady source of income that has allowed them to provide habitat and the environment for this species to literally be brought back from the edge of extinction.

The people who scream most violently about animal rights would prefer to see the entire species go extinct than allow a few hunters to take a few animals to ensure the species survival.

Now that they have pretty much ensured the source of funding for conservation efforts has been cut off, where are they? Have they decided to kick in the hundreds of thousands of dollars to ensure the continuation of the species and successful breeding programs.....nope. Have they mounted a huge campaign to generate grass roots funding to maintain habitat for the animals....nope. They are off on to their next feel good cause and have turned their back on the animals that they "claimed" they were trying to protect.

Between the time that the hunting exemption was removed (2012) banning hunting of these species, and 2014, the herd sizes have dropped by 50%.........In just 2 years that is the death of over 5000 animals. This is the legacy of animal rights groups and the anit-trophy hunting crowd. This is not a hypothetical or academic discussion, this is real world, cold hard facts.

By supporting these groups and supporting the banning of managed trophy hunts, this will be your legacy. YOU own this. YOU will be responsible for the eradication of countless species in the wild.

There are more Axis deer in Texas than in India

Yet, it works.

Nobody is writing a check for $50K for a stupid ass lion, A hunter will write that check, take a lion, and the country will guarantee there will be hunting as that actually brings in money.

You think WWF/PETA/Greenpeace actually sends that whole donation to the wildlife instead of lining it's leadership pockets?

Why use logic when you can do EVERYTHING with emotion.

It is impossible (and pointless) to define "trophy hunting".  It's a meaningless phrase and one that does nothing to assist with conservation.

Apparently we can't import African lions, but importing lyin' Africans is OK.

The stupid in this thread is amazing... the only reason there are sustainable populations of animals in many parts of Africa is because of trophy hunting.  This isn't some fairy tale. It takes large amounts of money to sustain these populations, without trophy hunting there would be no reason for locals to put up with the wildlife competing with their herds. All the large carnivores would be extinct.  The locals would kill everything and raise goats and cattle. Not many people are going to spend thousands of dollars to protect these animals and get nothing out of it. Not to mention the loss of jobs and free meat to the locals. It's to bad so many people think with their feelings and can't understand how the rally world is.