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Posted: 10/14/2022 5:45:33 PM EDT
Been trying to print ABS and I keep having an issue. The first couple of millimeters are full of bubbles and blobs. Then, like you hit a switch, the print is clean. You matter what print setting I change it never changes. What do I need to do here? I’m totally out of ideas. So far I’ve messed with flow rate, line width, line height, z offset, hot end temp, bed temp, brand of filament, color of filament and part cooling. One thing that is weird is when the offset skirt prints it is clean and perfect. When the part starts printing, you can tell on the first perimeter of the first layer that the setting changes are not doing anything.
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Posted: 10/14/2022 5:57:01 PM EDT
[#1]
Looks to me like too much heat in the first few layers. Print improves as the print speed speeds up, and fan gets turned on (usually it's off for the first few layers).
Looking to see what other ideas others may have... |
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Posted: 10/14/2022 7:48:34 PM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Looks to me like too much heat in the first few layers. Print improves as the print speed speeds up, and fan gets turned on (usually it's off for the first few layers). Looking to see what other ideas others may have... Agreed, I'm also at too much heat *build up. Not that the bed or nozzle are too high, but too much heat is building up into the part. |
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Posted: 10/14/2022 7:52:07 PM EDT
[#3]
How can it be to much heat build up if it starts when the print starts but the offset skirt is fine?
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Posted: 10/14/2022 8:11:30 PM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted: How can it be to much heat build up if it starts when the print starts but the offset skirt is fine? Skirts don't retain heat due to surface area to volume ratio. You can try to slow the print speed down some, to increase later time, or adjust the temp down for the first ten layers (or roundabouts depending on layer height). |
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Posted: 10/14/2022 9:29:39 PM EDT
[#5]
Looks like it may be a gantry sagging issue. Does your printer have 2 z screws? If you grab and hold one side of the gantry can you move the other side up and down by hand? My guess is the side with the z screw moves up a couple layers while the side without lags behind until it gets pulled up. I had a similar first few layers issue on my ender 3 pro and adjusting my x gantry fixed it.
If you have dual z screws then disregard lol. |
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Posted: 10/14/2022 10:18:07 PM EDT
[#6]
Heat or Z axis binding first few layers.
Went through this with my Ender 3 Pro. Had to put a dual Z on it. Printer thought it was moving up by say 0.28mm, but it gantry was actually moving up 0.15mm instead. |
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Posted: 10/15/2022 11:34:45 AM EDT
[#7]
My Ender is dual z.
I can say with certainty that it’s not hot end or bed temp related. I played around with heat settings last and managed to get a good test cube. Feeling confident I did a longer print overnight. This morning it was done and looked nice. I sliced up some small parts a printed them out. The problem returned. Right now as a test I’m printing the small parts again with a PLA profile. Temps adjusted for abs. Recommend hotend temp is 235-255. Im printing at 240. For bed temp I’m set at 105. At 100 parts have trouble sticking to the bed. Lower than than and they won’t stick at all. |
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Posted: 10/15/2022 2:42:53 PM EDT
[#8]
Part cooling fan running 100% accomplished nothing.
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Posted: 10/15/2022 5:25:09 PM EDT
[#9]
Check your flow rate. I had similar problems, and the flow was too high.
For the first few layers, the high flow would cause the innards to bunch up and look like your photos. Gayer that, there was extra room to allow the pressure to be relieved in the interior of the print. |
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Posted: 10/15/2022 5:33:27 PM EDT
[#10]
What's your extrusion multiplier at? Also why are you not using your Voron mister???
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Posted: 10/15/2022 6:01:11 PM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Check your flow rate. I had similar problems, and the flow was too high. For the first few layers, the high flow would cause the innards to bunch up and look like your photos. Gayer that, there was extra room to allow the pressure to be relieved in the interior of the print. I've done many flow rate calibration prints. this problem starts immediately on the first perimeter of the first layer. The offset skirt always looks perfect. |
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Posted: 10/15/2022 6:03:47 PM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted: What's your extrusion multiplier at? Also why are you not using your Voron mister??? currently it's at 0.97. 0.98 actually looks better. Vorons are fake. 10 months working on this piece of shit and it still doesn't work. I've spent enough money on this thing to buy two Prusas  
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Posted: 10/16/2022 2:04:50 PM EDT
[#13]
Which slicer are you using? I know prusaslicer/superslicer there are various settings to adjust flow depending on layer.
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Posted: 10/16/2022 2:48:10 PM EDT
[#14]
First layer could be to low
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Posted: 10/16/2022 5:07:48 PM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted: First layer could be to low I’ve tried different Z offsets. It has no effect other than first layer quality |
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Posted: 10/16/2022 7:08:45 PM EDT
[#16]
Another question is the issue always happening the same layers? Or does it change between prints?
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Posted: 10/16/2022 9:11:59 PM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Another question is the issue always happening the same layers? Or does it change between prints? It’s always in the first few mm’s of the print then at some point it changes to being perfect. Not gradually, the change is instant from one layer to the next. |
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Posted: 10/16/2022 9:23:00 PM EDT
[#18]
Always the same layer or random?
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Posted: 10/16/2022 9:26:32 PM EDT
[#19]
Sometimes higher sometimes lower but always starts immediately on the first layer.
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Posted: 10/16/2022 9:44:01 PM EDT
[#20]
So if you print the same gcode, the layer where it starts printing properly will change, or the layer that starts behaving changes on each print?
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Posted: 10/16/2022 9:58:40 PM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted: So if you print the same gcode, the layer where it starts printing properly will change, or the layer that starts behaving changes on each print? If it’s the same code it happens at the same layer. If it’s really bad I’ll make a slicer change and try again. If it’s minor I’ll take a file to it and move on. Randomly it seems that I’ll make a change and get a good print then on the next print it’s back. |
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Posted: 10/16/2022 11:34:29 PM EDT
[#22]
Still sounds like a heat buildup or cooling issue. The remaining question is it settings or mechanical.
Make sure your fans are operating normally. They can have issues where they will run at higher speeds, but not at lower speeds (or too slow but still spinning) due to contamination (hair, lint, etc), lube issues on the bushing, or just worn out. |
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Posted: 10/17/2022 12:18:44 AM EDT
[#23]
The standard setting for abs in Prusa slicer is 0-20% fan. I’ve run the fans at various speeds all the way up to 100% speed 100% of the time. The faster the fans go the lower the probability of the part sticking. Other than than it had no effect on the issue. Right now I’m set to the lowest bed temp that I can get away with and the hot end is set to the lower end of the temperature range. I don’t think it a temp issue. Like I said the problem is visible immediately when the print starts but the skirt looks perfect. There is only a fraction of a second of time between the end of the skirt and the start of the print.
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Posted: 10/17/2022 12:29:30 AM EDT
[#24]
Start a print (that you know will give you this issue), then turn the speed down to 50% on the printer. Report back what that does.
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Posted: 10/17/2022 11:01:26 AM EDT
[#25]
If you are using Cura check your "Top/Bottom" Flow settings under "Material", check to see if it is a higher value than your normal flow settings.
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Posted: 10/31/2022 9:10:06 PM EDT
[#26]
I haven’t printed in a bit. I’ve been working on getting my old Dodge Durango driving again so that I can get rid of it. Printed a couple of small things yesterday evening that turned out well. Today I loaded up a few more small parts and the issue returned. This time the issue is reversed. The first few millimeters look perfect then it gets all bubbly.
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Posted: 10/31/2022 9:20:28 PM EDT
[#27]
I saw a video a while back that said the power recovery setting can cause this issue.
Basically, the printer writes the current status of the print to the SD card and when the buffer is full it temporarily pauses the print because it can't read the gcode and write the print status to the SD card at the same time. It just happens for a fraction of a second, but it's enough to cause bubbles/globs. If all the ideas above don't work, might want to try disabling that setting. Edit: heres the video  3D Printer Blobs: a mysterious problem you won't guess how to fix ?? |
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Posted: 11/2/2022 9:09:58 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I saw a video a while back that said the power recovery setting can cause this issue. Basically, the printer writes the current status of the print to the SD card and when the buffer is full it temporarily pauses the print because it can't read the gcode and write the print status to the SD card at the same time. It just happens for a fraction of a second, but it's enough to cause bubbles/globs. If all the ideas above don't work, might want to try disabling that setting. Edit: heres the video  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZM1MYbsC5AwI don’t have power loss recovery but I added a line to disable it in my start gcode anyway. I turned down my extrusion multiplier to 0.95 and my sidewalls are a lot better. What really looks bad still is when it does a solid layer. Really looks like it is over extruding. I recalibrated my e-steps just to be safe and it was spot on. |
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Posted: 11/3/2022 12:51:50 AM EDT
[#29]
Is it possible your Z axis is screwed up and not moving in full layer heights? That would cause the issues on solid layers when your extrusion rate is proper.
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Posted: 11/3/2022 6:05:39 AM EDT
[#30]
Do an EM test. Possible that the esteps are right and the filament just needs a slightly different EM.
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Posted: 11/3/2022 10:35:31 AM EDT
[#31]
Are you printing in an enclosure? What layer is the Part Cooling fan turning on? Is the defect only on one side? I suspect it's the part cooling fan kicking on causing a shock to the layers below.
I usually don't print ABS or ASA in the open air or with a part cooling fan on. |
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Posted: 11/3/2022 6:05:54 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Do an EM test. Possible that the esteps are right and the filament just needs a slightly different EM. I’ve done that several times. The math always says 0.98 is the place to be. My prints say otherwise. Right now I’m at 0.95. I might go 0.94 just see what happens. |
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Posted: 11/3/2022 6:09:22 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Are you printing in an enclosure? What layer is the Part Cooling fan turning on? Is the defect only on one side? I suspect it's the part cooling fan kicking on causing a shock to the layers below. I usually don't print ABS or ASA in the open air or with a part cooling fan on. Yes, I have an enclosure. I tried turning the cooling fan on on various layers. Never seemed to make a difference. Right now the fan is set to the Prusa Slicer abs default setting of only coming on if the layer time is less than 20 seconds. |
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Posted: 11/3/2022 6:26:07 PM EDT
[#34]
Have you watched it to actually see what it's doing when it makes those artifacts?
I had something come up very similar and I ultimately tracked it down to excessive retraction sucking air into the nozzle, and then the bubble popping on deretraction, spewing a small, quick mess of filament. Is this happening shortly after a retraction/deretraction cycle? |
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Posted: 11/11/2022 12:36:09 AM EDT
[#35]
Got all your bolts tight on the Voron?
Think there was a guide that showed how they had to leave it warmed up for about 20-30 minutes to get the metal parts heat soaked where they would settle out. Like if you started cold and had the proper Z offset, when the printer heated up that changed your Z offset. https://www.reddit.com/r/VORONDesign/comments/tc3139/how_are_you_determining_heatsoak_duration_and_for/ Have you gone through this tuning guide? https://github.com/AndrewEllis93/Print-Tuning-Guide |
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