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Posted: 2/20/2006 5:58:34 AM EDT

When I go to the gun show chances are I have a little trading bate and during the last few shows I have been “accosted” by people who don’t speak more than a few words of English. Now I have noting but respect for my Mexican neighbors. They have worked hard to become Americans and I am proud to call them my friends.

Maybe it’s the way these guys handle themselves.

“you sell gun?”,
me… yes it’s for sale.
“bottom price”?
250.00
“no, bottom price”
250.00 it’s a good deal…
“no, bottom price”
how much will you give me for it?
“bottom price how much?”
how much you got?
“bottom price how much?”
forget it. No sale…
they walk off mad. But catch me on the next isle with “bottom price”?
Link Posted: 2/20/2006 6:06:42 AM EDT
sounds like you need to start at a higher price if you know they are going to ask for 'bottom price'
Link Posted: 2/20/2006 6:11:29 AM EDT
Link Posted: 2/20/2006 6:53:22 AM EDT
"let" mexicans non-English-speaking persons buy my guns???

I'd sell to them, if they could prove they were state residents with a valid Texas ID, or having an FFL do the transfer at the show to CYA.

Being that they don't speak "good" english (LMAO) that would raise a red flag...
Link Posted: 2/20/2006 6:54:52 AM EDT

Originally Posted By hk940:

“you sell gun?”,
me… yes it’s for sale.
“bottom price”?
250.00
“no, bottom price”
250.00 it’s a good deal…
“no, bottom price”
how much will you give me for it?
“bottom price how much?”
how much you got?
“bottom price how much?”
forget it. No sale…
they walk off mad. But catch me on the next isle with “bottom price”?



And on the next isle, you should have said $300...
Link Posted: 2/20/2006 7:08:02 AM EDT
Link Posted: 2/20/2006 8:09:32 AM EDT
Link Posted: 2/20/2006 8:10:02 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/20/2006 8:12:33 AM EDT by FALARAK]
I have a few basic rules when selling ANY gun. It doesnt matter the buyers skin color, language, etc... but those can be factors.

1. I dont sell if I get an impression from their behavior that they are koo-koo for cocoa puffs.

2. I dont sell if i get an impression from their behavior that they are intoxicated or under the influence.

3. I dont sell if I get an impression from their behavior that they are a felon or desire weapons for criminal intent.

4. I dont sell if I get an impression from their behavior that they are not legal US and Texas residents. I will ask for a Texas DL if I am concerned (never have had to do that). I will use their skin color and language as factors to make presumptions here... it is called "profiling" and it is wise.

5. Last, and most important... I dont sell to individuals walking around gunshows. If you want to be left alone, you just give them a ridiculous "bottom line price" immediately. If they are still interested, then it is either an illegal transaction, or a sting, and you tell them to fuck off.

Looking back.... I dont think I have ever stopped a sale of a firearm for any of the above reasons...... All of my transactions have been with very favorable people. I typically like to sell/trade in the EE here, and just require a FTF deal.... always been smooth.
Link Posted: 2/20/2006 8:19:39 AM EDT
Link Posted: 2/20/2006 8:42:35 AM EDT

Originally Posted By TheRedGoat:
Neww chair for me, yh\r\thin waoons wiht mgear gets it bad 10 fold.
Lots goodied oanedd, And since TRT\G won;r there, mre for thr nr members,;

TRG



Exactly.
Link Posted: 2/20/2006 8:52:27 AM EDT
Link Posted: 2/20/2006 10:24:17 AM EDT
I think another criteria for not selling an individual a gun is if there are great gold shapes on their front teeth...
Link Posted: 2/20/2006 10:44:17 AM EDT

Originally Posted By SilentRun:
I think another criteria for not selling an individual a gun is if there are great gold shapes on their front teeth...




Braces? Why not sell to people with "golden braces"
Link Posted: 2/20/2006 10:47:37 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/20/2006 10:48:40 AM EDT by COZ_45]
Link Posted: 2/20/2006 10:58:10 AM EDT
never had a problem with it since i dont sell my guns
Link Posted: 2/20/2006 11:29:44 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Cold:

Originally Posted By SilentRun:
I think another criteria for not selling an individual a gun is if there are great gold shapes on their front teeth...




Braces? Why not sell to people with "golden braces"



I was NOT refering to braces.....
Link Posted: 2/20/2006 12:28:37 PM EDT
Originally Posted By TheRedGoat:
Originally Posted By FALARAK:
If they are still interested, then it is either an illegal transaction, or a sting, and you tell them to fuck off.

I'm admittedly ignorant here. Do you a duty under the law in a FTF transfer to ensure that the buyer is not a felon or otherwise prohibited from purchasing a firearm.

Just curious what the "sting" aspect is???
Link Posted: 2/20/2006 1:00:41 PM EDT

Originally Posted By avslash:
I'm admittedly ignorant here. Do you a duty under the law in a FTF transfer to ensure that the buyer is not a felon or otherwise prohibited from purchasing a firearm.

Just curious what the "sting" aspect is???



No. However, if you sell to someone you *know* is a felon or otherwise prohibited from purchasing.... then you ARE breaking the law. You are NOT required to investigate or collect any informations.

That being said.... it is prudent of you to at least casually observe someone you are doing a business transaction with, and if their behavior leads you to believe they are under the influence, nutzo, agitated, or is a felon.... then you shouldnt go through with it.

I havent heard of it happening under the ATF with individuals.... but without question the ATF and other law enforcement entities have tried to "test" dealers at shows with illegal sales. They could do the same to indivuduals. How they could make charges stick or not, I dont know. It just pays to use your brain.
Link Posted: 2/20/2006 1:58:40 PM EDT

Originally Posted By avslash:
Just curious what the "sting" aspect is???



The sting could work like this. You're a private seller at the gun show. Someone (undercover ATF) walks up to you, chit chats a bit about your gun, haggles hard on the price, seems like a nice guy, and asks if you need to do paperwork for the sale. You say "no, it'll be a private sale", he says "That's cool, I can't really buy from the dealers that want paperwork..." If you still go through with the sale, you'll now commited a felony.

I know that there was a guy in Austin who was busted on this particular sting (though he was selling guns through ads in the classifieds rather than at a gun show). My understanding is that the ATF was on to him after two of his customers were arrested for weapons violations and told the ATF where they had bought their guns.
Link Posted: 2/20/2006 4:13:54 PM EDT

Originally Posted By lordtrader:
Hey that was me!!! So what is your bottom price?!?!?




LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL
Link Posted: 2/20/2006 4:16:55 PM EDT
Link Posted: 2/20/2006 4:18:42 PM EDT

Originally Posted By ilikelegs:

Originally Posted By EnergizerFALARAK:

Originally Posted By TheRedGoat:
Neww chair for me, yh\r\thin waoons wiht mgear gets it bad 10 fold.
Lots goodied oanedd, And since TRT\G won;r there, mre for thr nr members,;

TRG



Your CoC violations are mounting.






WTF?
Link Posted: 2/20/2006 7:31:16 PM EDT
mexicans tried to buy my T/A the other day for $5k....and I told them hell no.....and they were mad....I sold it for $8k shortly afterward to army guy who appreciates the car and will not put stupid rims and shit on it...
Link Posted: 2/20/2006 8:07:44 PM EDT

Originally Posted By eklikwhoa:
never had a problem with it since i dont sell my guns



not all of us can afford a new build/AR every month.
Link Posted: 2/20/2006 8:33:59 PM EDT

Originally Posted By SilentRun:

Originally Posted By Cold:

Originally Posted By SilentRun:
I think another criteria for not selling an individual a gun is if there are great gold shapes on their front teeth...




Braces? Why not sell to people with "golden braces"



I was NOT refering to braces.....



He wuz referring to some Phat Grillz, yo.

Link Posted: 2/20/2006 10:12:01 PM EDT
Most of the hispanics I see look like ranch workers that just need a gun for varments 'N such and legit workers that just want some self defense, others, however are just gangbanging POS.
Link Posted: 2/21/2006 3:07:52 AM EDT
You got it alll wrong. He thought you were cute and wanted to know the price to get your bottom.
Link Posted: 2/21/2006 11:20:32 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/21/2006 11:25:53 AM EDT by op_rod]

Originally Posted By Melvinator2k0:
Most of the hispanics I see look like ranch workers that just need a gun for varments 'N such and legit workers that just want some self defense, others, however are just gangbanging POS.



That's funny. I have seen that a few times. Older Mexican, not much English, buying a used .22 or .30-30 that shoots well (and very specific about that) for $125 after 45 minutes of debate (wanting to pay only $120) turning around and buying a nice $450 scope for it and good rings. That is getting to be common around here and I think that it is pretty smart, personally. They obviously want a truck gun. I had a fellow a few weeks ago ask me while we were both buying some Hoppes if I knew of any table with "booler crik" things -- he wanted Butler Creek covers for his scope but it took me a second. He had bought a "varee exx tree" and was very pleased with it. Sensing a gentleman of similar tastes, I walked him back to the last table I saw them at and we chatted a while. he had a Marlin that he had had rebarreled and reloaded for accuracy.

In my experience, the old guys immediately produce a driver's licence or a green card so you know that they are legal.
Link Posted: 2/21/2006 11:46:31 AM EDT
someone can purchase a firearm with a green card?
Link Posted: 2/21/2006 12:03:30 PM EDT

Originally Posted By MauserMark:
someone can purchase a firearm with a green card?



As far as I know, yes. If you are a resident alien on most other visas you can if you buy a hunting license.
Link Posted: 2/21/2006 12:12:54 PM EDT

Originally Posted By MauserMark:
someone can purchase a firearm with a green card?



not from me..
Link Posted: 2/21/2006 12:21:49 PM EDT
Right on ADDICTED......Don't sell either, ever the real rough peices of kaka.....Why they make good training aids for me to take apart and redo.................hahaha
Link Posted: 2/21/2006 4:37:36 PM EDT

Originally Posted By MauserMark:
someone can purchase a firearm with a green card?



Yep all day long from any gunshop.
Link Posted: 2/21/2006 10:23:10 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/21/2006 10:26:54 PM EDT by Stryker]
Hate to tell this to you guys but..

Im a surgeon and most of the trash that walks through my office front doors is white trash. The majority of "Mexicans" as you all like to call them are honest hard working people who actually try to pay their bills. The majority of people who run on their A/R are the pices of crap white trash I see who play the system and are on welfare/disability....
Im sorry they dont speak perfect English but for those of you who have actually lived in Europe/Asia/Latin America the first price is never the final price. There are different cultures in this world. Im a little embarassed that this thread is even in the Texas forums. I hope each one of you who responded to this thread takes a moment to read what you wrote and thinks about it. I spent 9 years in San Antonio and have nothing but respect for 99.9% of the "Mexicans" that I met.
Link Posted: 2/22/2006 5:19:11 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Stryker:
Hate to tell this to you guys but..

Im a surgeon and most of the trash that walks through my office front doors is white trash. The majority of "Mexicans" as you all like to call them are honest hard working people who actually try to pay their bills. The majority of people who run on their A/R are the pices of crap white trash I see who play the system and are on welfare/disability....
Im sorry they dont speak perfect English but for those of you who have actually lived in Europe/Asia/Latin America the first price is never the final price. There are different cultures in this world. Im a little embarassed that this thread is even in the Texas forums. I hope each one of you who responded to this thread takes a moment to read what you wrote and thinks about it. I spent 9 years in San Antonio and have nothing but respect for 99.9% of the "Mexicans" that I met.



Please re-read the thread and think about what you said.

Nobody is bashing Hispanics. We are talking about legalities of selling to *potential* illegal aliens. I will admit, the title is misleading.
Link Posted: 2/22/2006 6:00:56 AM EDT

Originally Posted By FALARAK:
/snip

5. Last, and most important... I dont sell to individuals walking around gunshows.

/snip

I typically like to sell/trade in the EE here, and just require a FTF deal.... always been smooth.



What's the difference between doing a FTF deal with some schmoe walking the gun show and doing a FTF deal with some schmoe off the Arfcom EE?

I've dealt with each scenario a few times, and to be honest, I get better vibes from the gun show schmoes.
Link Posted: 2/22/2006 7:04:48 AM EDT
Being of Hispanic heritage (3d generation, born/raised in Dallas), let me just start off by saying that I don't personally take offense to the euphamisms and other references to "Mexicans". I can certainly understand where a lot the sentiment comes from. Case in point: at Big Town this past weekend, I had made my way thru, and ended up near the Bachmann tables back in the corner. There were some empty tables at the far corner, when a lone guy came along with a pisol case and whatever else, sat on one of the empty tables. He was soon surrounded by a group of 7-8 "Mexicans", who start haggling with this poor guy over what he wanted for his pistol. This went on for a short while. I have no idea if he sold his piece or not, perhaps they pooled their $$ together for it, perhaps not. I think I remember seeing a blue pistol case.

Nevertheless, as I frequent the shows, I see this type of behaviour often. To be honest with you, it kinda sickens me, and pisses me off at the same time. I feel like this type of pack mentality gives a collective impression of "guilt by association". I don't like the whole "bottom dollar" syndrome that some people are notorious for, but I think I understand why (limited disposable funds). We had a group yard sale a few years ago, and when we were still setting up (7:00am), this bitch comes along and tries low-balling me on a few different items. I'm like, "come back at 3:00, then we'll talk about bottom dollar". Sighs... I like to think that I spend a little more supporting vendors, when I know I can get it cheaper elsewhere (2nd case in point: I bought a used YH quad rail from SOG that day, and about 10 minutes later, I saw a few new ones at the Delta Force tables, cheaper than the used one at SOG. FUCK!).

Nevertheless, it still looks good on my RR A4...

Sorry about the stream of consciousness, am still working on this cup of coffee.....
Link Posted: 2/22/2006 7:19:05 AM EDT
This thread reminds me of a song...

"Out in the west Texas Town of El Paso........"
Link Posted: 2/22/2006 1:41:17 PM EDT


I would rather deal with gun show schmoes, myself, as I'm one of 'em. I've never had a bad experience on EE (the few I've done) but with all the gun shows we have around DFW there's just no point in doing EE, even one that results in a FTF which like FALARAK I also prefer. Plus I can see the person I want to buy from or might sell to and walk if I don't like the vibes.

And on the original thread, I wouldn't sell a gun to anyone--"Mexican" "Anglo" "Middle Eastern" "Russian" or otherwise if I didn't like the person's looks and thought I might someday see the gun again, in their hand, loaded and pointing at me.

Link Posted: 2/23/2006 1:16:07 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Stryker:
Hate to tell this to you guys but..

Im a surgeon and most of the trash that walks through my office front doors is white trash. The majority of "Mexicans" as you all like to call them are honest hard working people who actually try to pay their bills. The majority of people who run on their A/R are the pices of crap white trash I see who play the system and are on welfare/disability....
Im sorry they dont speak perfect English but for those of you who have actually lived in Europe/Asia/Latin America the first price is never the final price. There are different cultures in this world. Im a little embarassed that this thread is even in the Texas forums. I hope each one of you who responded to this thread takes a moment to read what you wrote and thinks about it. I spent 9 years in San Antonio and have nothing but respect for 99.9% of the "Mexicans" that I met.



I think the posters are talking about illegal aliens, not Americans of Hispanic descent-there's a difference you know.
Sorry you have such a distaste for whites/
Link Posted: 2/23/2006 5:08:35 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/23/2006 5:15:02 PM EDT by op_rod]

Originally Posted By Stryker:
Hate to tell this to you guys but..

Im a surgeon and most of the trash that walks through my office front doors is white trash. The majority of "Mexicans" as you all like to call them are honest hard working people who actually try to pay their bills. The majority of people who run on their A/R are the pices of crap white trash I see who play the system and are on welfare/disability....
Im sorry they dont speak perfect English but for those of you who have actually lived in Europe/Asia/Latin America the first price is never the final price. There are different cultures in this world. Im a little embarassed that this thread is even in the Texas forums. I hope each one of you who responded to this thread takes a moment to read what you wrote and thinks about it. I spent 9 years in San Antonio and have nothing but respect for 99.9% of the "Mexicans" that I met.



Umm ... I was actually talking about people from Mexico, where, ahem, I grew up.

You aren't supposed to sell a gun to a foreign national without a green card or a hunting licence in the case of some visas. That is kind of a big deal.

And furthermore, I think that a lot of the older men haggle as a passtime. I have seen them do it when there was no reason to haggle whatsoever. Sure, it's a money thing (sometimes, again I have seen a lot of folk putting nice glass on truck guns), but also customary. The original poster should have responded to the "bottom price" offer by saying that it should really be $300 and he could hardly bear to part with it. The fellow would have then said "$300! That's crazy! I am sorry for the hardship that forces you to part with [whatever]! How about $220?" and so on. Spend ten minutes, have fun, and sell it for $250.
Link Posted: 2/23/2006 6:09:58 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Stryker:
Hate to tell this to you guys but..

Im a surgeon and most of the trash that walks through my office front doors is white trash. The majority of "Mexicans" as you all like to call them are honest hard working people who actually try to pay their bills. The majority of people who run on their A/R are the pices of crap white trash I see who play the system and are on welfare/disability....
Im sorry they dont speak perfect English but for those of you who have actually lived in Europe/Asia/Latin America the first price is never the final price. There are different cultures in this world. Im a little embarassed that this thread is even in the Texas forums. I hope each one of you who responded to this thread takes a moment to read what you wrote and thinks about it. I spent 9 years in San Antonio and have nothing but respect for 99.9% of the "Mexicans" that I met.






We don't like you either, cracker.
Link Posted: 2/24/2006 2:00:05 PM EDT

Originally Posted By wingo:

Originally Posted By Stryker:
Hate to tell this to you guys but..

Im a surgeon and most of the trash that walks through my office front doors is white trash. .






We don't like you either, cracker.



Hey, cool out. There's all kinds of trash and white can be just as trashy as anybody else. BTW I'm as white as they come and I'm not offended. Why are you??



Link Posted: 2/24/2006 4:30:14 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/24/2006 4:32:35 PM EDT by wingo]

Originally Posted By imcoltsguy:

Originally Posted By wingo:

Originally Posted By Stryker:
Hate to tell this to you guys but..

Im a surgeon and most of the trash that walks through my office front doors is white trash. .






We don't like you either, cracker.



Hey, cool out. There's all kinds of trash and white can be just as trashy as anybody else. BTW I'm as white as they come and I'm not offended. Why are you??








It's just a joke. I'm not offended.Just pointing out that it seems kinda funny to use a racial slur to defend another ethnicity.
Link Posted: 2/25/2006 11:49:06 AM EDT

Originally Posted By op_rod:
In my experience, the old guys immediately produce a driver's licence or a green card so you know that they are legal.



A TX DL is absolutely NO indication of legal immigration status!
Link Posted: 2/25/2006 4:26:36 PM EDT
If i'm not shipping the gun to an FFL then I want to see a CHL. I dont care about your race, religion, etc...
Link Posted: 2/25/2006 7:41:13 PM EDT
I work as a procurement director so I haggle for the fun of it. While I am not from a culture that haggles I enjoy it non the less and it makes the sale more interesting sometimes.
There is a huge difference from low-balling (which BTW is not haggling and IS offensive).
There is no harm asking for the lowest price...You would be suprised the things you can save $$$ on just by asking.
Link Posted: 2/25/2006 10:29:38 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Stryker:
Hate to tell this to you guys but..

Im a surgeon and most of the trash that walks through my office front doors is white trash. The majority of "Mexicans" as you all like to call them are honesthonest?? what's honest about breaking/disrespecting our laws, and milking our system for all it's worth while they put nothing INTO it in the way of taxes? They get paid in cash off the books and avoid taxes that way. Don't get me started! hard working people who actually try to pay their bills. The majority of people who run on their A/R are the pices of crap white trash I see who play the system and are on welfare/disability....
Im sorry they dont speak perfect English but for those of you who have actually lived in Europe/Asia/Latin America the first price is never the final price. There are different cultures in this world. Im a little embarassed that this thread is even in the Texas forums. I hope each one of you who responded to this thread takes a moment to read what you wrote and thinks about it. I spent 9 years in San Antonio and have nothing but respect for 99.9% of the "Mexicans" that I met.



they need to F-ing speak English. Yeah it's a big world and there are different cultures . . . mexico has it's "culture" and we have ours. If they come to the US, they shouldn't expect us to change OUR culture to suit them. I wouldn't move to Finland and expect ALL of them to adjust their culture to suit me or for ALL of them to learn MY language. And yet, for some reason I just can't understand, these Mexicans expect us to do that.

A lot of these people are illegal, as in breaking our laws. They don't pay taxes, they don't pay for social security, they don't pay FICA. They have ZERO respect for our culture or MANNERS.

As far as selling to them if they get a hunting license. That's some sorta exception they can get if they're just visiting the country, NOT if they're residents! It's for people who visit the country to hunt. They can get their hunting license and a gun to hunt with. If they are residents, but not citizens, they have to provide bills such as utility bills for the last three consecutive months to prove their residency.

From your post it seems to me like you're saying we're bad people 'cause we want people to speak English and obey our laws. They flout our laws. The FIRST thing they do when they come in is break our laws. They don't respect the sover . .. . . . . okay well this all belongs on a different thread doesn't it?

Do I sell to "Mexicans"? If I can communicate with them, if THEY are legal and the sale is legal, and the don't seem like gang banger punks, then Yes I sell to them. I've sold to some and I've turned some down.
Link Posted: 2/26/2006 1:26:04 PM EDT
I don't have anything with a rattlesnake skin forearm anyway.



Debo
Link Posted: 2/26/2006 2:55:20 PM EDT
QUE ??????????


Originally Posted By hk940:
When I go to the gun show chances are I have a little trading bate and during the last few shows I have been “accosted” by people who don’t speak more than a few words of English. Now I have noting but respect for my Mexican neighbors. They have worked hard to become Americans and I am proud to call them my friends.

Maybe it’s the way these guys handle themselves.

“you sell gun?”,
me… yes it’s for sale.
“bottom price”?
250.00
“no, bottom price”
250.00 it’s a good deal…
“no, bottom price”
how much will you give me for it?
“bottom price how much?”
how much you got?
“bottom price how much?”
forget it. No sale…
they walk off mad. But catch me on the next isle with “bottom price”?

Link Posted: 2/26/2006 3:37:30 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/26/2006 3:57:25 PM EDT by 0DDJ0B]
Well being the Mexican that I am, I have no problems selling guns to Good Ole Boys. The last two sales I've done were to white guys who both asked me asked me for a better deal and it didn't bother me a bit. I wonder if they had problems buying their guns from a Mexican...hmmm

I just used this as an example as I have no problems selling and buying guns to/from anyone. I think some of us are lacking a little on our social skills and are of a little narrower minds. It's free enterprise, you don't like the deal either selling or buying just walk away.

Can't please 100% of the people 100% of the time
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